Rafa 2009 V 2011 - Which season was better?

[Deleted member 77403]

All players have highs and lows, and for Nadal it does seem to hold merit. 2008 and 2010 were dream years for the Spanish Warrior, but both were followed by years that did not quite live up to the year proceeding it.

Question is, since both years are during Rafa's prime, which was the better season?

'09, Rafa won 1 slam, 3 Masters, a 500 series. He was the outright best player heading into the FO that year, despite the Madrid final blip to Roger. However after that, we all know what happened.

'11, Rafa won 1 slam, 1 Masters, a 500 series, two slam RUs. Heading into the year, he was again outright the worlds best, going for the Rafa slam. Things did not quite go his way due to the rise of a certain player in 11.

The question is, which of the two seasons was better? Rafa had a fantastic start in 09, the best of his career, but the wheels fell of dramatically at RG for the rest of the season. In 11, he won less titles, but was far more consistent, and reached the slam finals of all the slams he won the year before. His only problem was one man, however it cost him a lot of titles.

So which season was better? Or worse?

 

[nadalwon2012]

If Nadal plays the same level next year that he played in 2011, it may win him 3-4 slams, seeing as only Djokovic can beat him in the slams, barring injury. Nadal is just a confidence boost away from turning that around. His confidence seemed to get worse and worse as 2011 went on. Physically he has the tools to beat Djokovic.

2009 Nadal was so injury prone (the legs and the stomach), and also lacking in confidence, in fact even lower in confidence than 2011. Nadal was fully fit for the 2009 World Tour Finals and did not even win a set! So 2009 Nadal obviously a far far worse player than 2011 Nadal.

 

[pringles]

If Nadal plays the same level next year that he played in 2011, it may win him 3-4 slams

what?

I mean, WHAT?

 

[DRII]

All players have highs and lows, and for Nadal it does seem to hold merit. 2008 and 2010 were dream years for the Spanish Warrior, but both were followed by years that did not quite live up to the year proceeding it.

Question is, since both years are during Rafa's prime, which was the better season?

'09, Rafa won 1 slam, 3 Masters, a 500 series. He was the outright best player heading into the FO that year, despite the Madrid final blip to Roger. However after that, we all know what happened.

'11, Rafa won 1 slam, 1 Masters, a 500 series, two slam RUs. Heading into the year, he was again outright the worlds best, going for the Rafa slam. Things did not quite go his way due to the rise of a certain player in 11.

The question is, which of the two seasons was better? Rafa had a fantastic start in 09, the best of his career, but the wheels fell of dramatically at RG for the rest of the season. In 11, he won less titles, but was far more consistent, and reached the slam finals of all the slams he won the year before. His only problem was one man, however it cost him a lot of titles.

So which season was better? Or worse?

Very good question/topic. Even though I might disagree with some of your premises.

Quantitatively; most would say 2011 was the better year just based on results. I think it depends on how Nadal does at the WTF. If he wins it this year, then 2011 > 2009.

However qualitatively, both are relatively disappointing years with 2011 producing more of a mental burden that we don't know if he will overcome! We know what happened after 2009...

 

[OddJack]

lol@2011 season.

 

[CMM]

Is this a joke thread?
2009 was a disaster. 2011 is a good season and it's not over yet.

 

[Carsomyr]

If Nadal plays the same level next year that he played in 2011, it may win him 3-4 slams, seeing as only Djokovic can beat him in the slams, barring injury. Nadal is just a confidence boost away from turning that around. His confidence seemed to get worse and worse as 2011 went on. Physically he has the tools to beat Djokovic.

2009 Nadal was so injury prone (the legs and the stomach), and also lacking in confidence, in fact even lower in confidence than 2011. Nadal was fully fit for the 2009 World Tour Finals and did not even win a set! So 2009 Nadal obviously a far far worse player than 2011 Nadal.

:lol::lol::lol:

 

[Murrayfan31]

Nadal will never have a season again like 2010 due to his foot problem.

 

[TopFH]

2011 because of the results.

 

[TMF]

Is this a joke thread?
2009 was a disaster. 2011 is a good season and it's not over yet.

What are u talking about???

He won the AO and end the year at #2. Murray would take that any day.

 

[DjokovicForTheWin]

Nadal's highest level of play ever was in 2011. So definitely 2011.

 

[nadalwon2012]

Nadal will never have a season again like 2010 due to his foot problem.

That's ok, he'll still make US Open finals, as he just did...hence be able to win slams.

 

[Clarky21]

2009. He had an excuse(knee injury) that year for his lousy play. This year he doesn't. Plus,he won more titles in 2009,and actually won 2 titles off of clay.

 

[TopFH]

That's ok, he'll still make US Open finals, as he just did...hence be able to win slams.

You sure 'bout that?

 

[nadalwon2012]

Nadal was fully fit at the 2009 World Tour Finals, and did not win a set. It shows how messed up his mind was that year from the family problems I think.

 

[nadalwon2012]

You sure 'bout that?

Of course, if you make the slam final on your worst surface, you are playing well enough to win any slam. Nobody proved they could beat Nadal at a slam this year, apart from Djokovic (and Ferrer if we discount the Nadal torn muscle). Federer, Murray and Del Potro all had shots at Nadal in the slams, and all failed. Nadal only has to maintain his current level, and cash in on Djokovic's demise. Djokovic never should have played Nadal at the US Open.

 

[Mustard]

2009 was a disaster.

The first 5 months of 2009 saw Nadal dominate, winning the Australian Open, 3 masters series titles (Indian Wells, Monte Carlo, Rome) and the title in Barcelona. He also reached the final in Madrid and Rotterdam. His season was thrown off course after he lost to Soderling in the R16 of the French Open and then missed the grass-court season.

 

[Deleted member 77403]

The first 5 months of 2009 saw Nadal dominate, winning the Australian Open, 3 masters series titles (Indian Wells, Monte Carlo, Rome) and the title in Barcelona. He also reached the final in Madrid and Rotterdam. His season was thrown off course after he lost to Soderling in the R16 of the French Open and then missed the grass-court season.

Exactly, even Roger hasn't owned the tour for the first months, the way Rafa did in 09. Rafa had one more Masters title after Rome, compared to Roger in 06.

 

[veroniquem]

Is this a joke thread?
2009 was a disaster. 2011 is a good season and it's not over yet.

2009 was a disaster? I think emotionally for Rafa maybe but resultwise, I disagree. In 2009 Rafa won 1 slam and 3 masters (5 titles in all).
2011 was more consistent no doubt but 3 master titles are better than 1 and 5 overall titles are better than 3. Actually, in terms of titles, 2011 is Rafa's worst season since 2004. Winning WTF would change everything though. I know he can do it and I hope he does.

 

[Tammo]

I think after the 09' Match in madrid against Djokovic, Nadal's season went downward. 2011 was much better.

 

[veroniquem]

Sure but he didn't do badly in the fall of 2009 either with 2 semis and 1 final in Shanghai, which was pretty awesome by his standards in the fall season (I would have to doublecheck but I think it was his best fall season after 2005 and 2010).

 

[celoft]

In 2009 Rafa won 1 slam and 3 masters (5 titles in all).
2011 was more consistent no doubt but 3 master titles are better than 1 and 5 overall titles are better than 3. Actually, in terms of titles, 2011 is Rafa's worst season since 2004.

I concur..

 

[Towser83]

He's basically down 2 masters titles from 2009. In terms of ranking points though he actually has more at this point in the year than Federer had at this point in 2009 (and he was number 1) mainly thanks to 2 losing slam finals and finals at several masters.

 

[veroniquem]

That's why this is an awkward season to evaluate. It's probably one of the most consistent he's ever had (# of finals) but at the same time one of the least successful (# of finals lost).

 

[celoft]

That's why this is an awkward season to evaluate. It's probably one of the most consistent he's ever had (# of finals) but at the same time one of the least successful (# of finals lost).

Similar to Lendl's 1984. 3 titles and 7 runner-ups.

 

[veroniquem]

Similar to Lendl's 1984. 3 titles and 7 runner-ups.

Interesting. But 1984 was before Lendl's best years, before his 1st year at finishing #1 I think.

 

[celoft]

Interesting. But 1984 was before Lendl's best years, before his 1st year at finishing #1 I think.

And 2011 is Nadal's 7th year in a row winning slams. Borg, Sampras and Federer won slams for 8 years in a row. MOTWYW.

 

[Biscuitmcgriddleson]

Is this a joke thread?
2009 was a disaster. 2011 is a good season and it's not over yet.

Many players would kill for that disaster of a season.

 

[Eternity]

I say 2011 mostly because he didn't play Wimbledon in 09. If Spain somehow loses the DC final this year I might change my mind.

 

[MichaelNadal]

I sort of have to agree with Clarky. The ladder half of his 2009 was bad bc of injury. This year with the exception of the AO he has been fully fit, and not able to solve a problem that he had 6 chances to solve. The way he started 09 was amazing and his bad level of play was at least down to body/family factors more than whatever his problem has been this year. It's hard saying which season is better results wise though bc he couldn't compete at Wimbledon in 2009 and he was injured at the FO.

 

[TennisFan3]

Nadal's level of play in 2009 until the clay season was higher than it has been at ANY point in 2011 (except maybe Delpo R4 Wimb 2011).

I have never seen Nadal hitting his backhand better than he did in AO/IW etc. I was there in a IW 2009 match in stands, and Nadal hit a double handed backhand soo hard that the guy who was volleying almost dropped his racquet with the force of impact. Again Rotterdam final, second set against Murray (when Nadal was injured) is some of the most aggressive shotmaking I've ever seen from Nadal. Obviously the AO SF and Final matches from Nadal are also a highlight of his career. I would say that it was his backhand which won him the AO final in 2009.

By Miami 2009, Nadal's game started to taper off with injuries and family issues. By the clay season he was half injured. Yet, even though he lost RG in 2009, I would say his clay level in 2009 was better than in 2011. Soderling in F.O 2009 played some of the most aggressive clay court tennis, I've EVER seen anyone play. I doubt anyone could have beaten the Swede on that specific day. Even so, the Soderling-Nadal F.O match was close, with 3 of the 4 sets down to the wire.

W.r.t second half - post Wimbledon, Nadal of 2011 has had better results than Nadal of 2009. Still, I would say that Nadal had more fight in 2009. He was getting outclassed by people because his game wasn't fully back after injury, but his attitude on court was great. He was fighting as best he could with his limited weapons and hampered movement. It wasn't until he changed strings in 2010 and recovered from the knee issues that his level increased.

2011 in contrast has seen Nadal frustrated with negative body language and he's been constantly complaining. He doesn't fight on the court as he used to. The Nadal of 2009 would NEVER have lost a 6-0 set winning only 4 points.

 

[TMF]

Nadal's level of play in 2009 until the clay season was higher than it has been at ANY point in 2011 (except maybe Delpo R4 Wimb 2011).

I have never seen Nadal hitting his backhand better than he did in AO/IW etc. I was there in a IW 2009 match in stands, and Nadal hit a double handed backhand soo hard that the guy who was volleying almost dropped his racquet with the force of impact. Again Rotterdam final, second set against Murray (when Nadal was injured) is some of the most aggressive shotmaking I've ever seen from Nadal. Obviously the AO SF and Final matches from Nadal are also a highlight of his career. I would say that it was his backhand which won him the AO final in 2009.

By Miami 2009, Nadal's game started to taper off with injuries and family issues. By the clay season he was half injured. Yet, even though he lost RG in 2009, I would say his clay level in 2009 was better than in 2011. Soderling in F.O 2009 played some of the most aggressive clay court tennis, I've EVER seen anyone play. I doubt anyone could have beaten the Swede on that specific day. Even so, the Soderling-Nadal F.O match was close, with 3 of the 4 sets down to the wire.

W.r.t second half - post Wimbledon, Nadal of 2011 has had better results than Nadal of 2009. Still, I would say that Nadal had more fight in 2009. He was getting outclassed by people because his game wasn't fully back after injury, but his attitude on court was great. He was fighting as best he could with his limited weapons and hampered movement. It wasn't until he changed strings in 2009 and recovered from the knee issues that his level increased.

2011 in contrast has seen Nadal frustrated with negative body language and he's been constantly complaining. He doesn't fight on the court as he used to. The Nadal of 2009 would NEVER have lost a 6-0 set winning only 4 points.

Nadal lost 6-0(bagel) to Murray this year, but before the clay season started in 2009, Nadal lost 6-0 to the same player(Murray) !

 

[TennisFan3]

Nadal lost 6-0(bagel) to Murray this year, but before the clay season started in 2009, Nadal lost 6-0 to the same player(Murray) !

Did you see the Rotterdam 2009 Final between Murray and Nadal? Nadal was so badly injured that he was just standing on court without moving at all. He should have lost the match in straight sets.

In fact, it was strange that Nadal won the 2nd set in that match. He was just standing and hitting winners all over the place. Murray said that he lost a set to Rafa even when the latter was playing on one leg. It was great sportsmanship from Nadal that he didn't withdraw from the match.

In sharp contrast Tokyo 2011, Nadal was fully fit, but basically gave up and stopped fighting. So he lost 6-0 winning 4 points. I have NEVER seen Nadal having such an attitude on court. Even in his worst losses of the past (Tsonga 2008 AO and Delpo 2009 UsOpen), Nadal was always fighting on court and trying as much as he could. In Tokyo, he just said F*** it, I'm going home...

 

[MichaelNadal]

Did you see the Rotterdam 2009 Final between Murray and Nadal? Nadal was so badly injured that he was just standing on court without moving at all. He should have lost the match in straight sets.

In fact, it was strange that Nadal won the 2nd set in that match. He was just standing and hitting winners all over the place. Murray said that he lost a set to Rafa even when the latter was playing on one leg. It was great sportsmanship from Nadal that he didn't withdraw from the match.

In sharp contrast Tokyo 2011, Nadal was fully fit, but basically gave up and stopped fighting. So he lost 6-0 winning 4 points. I have NEVER seen Nadal having such an attitude on court. Even in his worst losses of the past (Tsonga 2008 AO and Delpo 2009 UsOpen), Nadal was always fighting on court and trying as much as he could. In Tokyo, he just said F*** it, I'm going home...

Very true man. I agree with everything you said. When I first read the title of the topic I said, pshhh, 2011 easily, but I quickly changed my mind, and my post says my feelings perfectly, and so do you.