reverse slice serve?

[hfmf]

I play with a bunch of old men on weekday mornings and there are a couple of em that can keep up pretty well. One of em hits a CRAZY reverse slice where when a person is returning on the ad side, it spins like he's left handed, even though he's right handed.

Do you guys know how to hit this serve? I asked the old man once, and he winked at me and said, "I don't want to show you kid, you'll hurt yourself."

They're funny. Anyways. Can you guys help me out with this serve?

Thanks!

 

[Don't Let It Bounce]

If you have tennis elbow already, he might be right: it's not the healthiest way to hit a ball.

That said, and assuming you're a righty, use a frying pan grip, toss the ball straight in front of you, and sweep the racquet across your body right to left while brushing the ball. The effect is like a lefty slice that's almost all spin and no pace. Recommended for sparing use in the ad court only!

P.S. The guy who taught me this serve years ago called it a "Wasselhoffer". We used to use it on match point as a way of demonstrating disdain for the soon-to-be-vanquished foe, and anyone observing the serve would shout out, "WAAAASSELHOFFER!" I recall feeling sort of foolish if I used it and lost the point, though.

 

[Jaewonnie]

I've hit this (accidently) with a continental grip at like 90mph...insane curve to the ad court.

I find the ball flies on me when using an eastern or even a western forehand grip. (By fly I mean like past the baseline...).

If you find this to happen to yourself too, try out the continental. But from what I know, western/eastern is the standard grip for reverse slices...

But a continental disguises the serve much better (same toss as a regular flat serve, same grip as a regular serve, same stance etc.)

 

[LeeD]

Again with the 3.5 serve?
DimitriTursunov must be amongst your playing partners!
It's good against the blind, the uninitiated, the slow learners, and the unawarers only.
Watch grip, if it's full western, be ready for the lefty spin.

 

[jrod]

^^^ I've never seen a 3.5 hit this serve....ever. I've been playing for a really long time too.

Nevertheless, I do agree with LeeD on it's effectiveness. Unless it's used sparingly, it can be returned without too much trouble. What is surprising about it is the balls flight path and action after the bounce. It's not something you would expect from a righty since the ball behaves as if a lefty hit it.

The other thing about this serve I've found is it is difficult (for me) to control the placement and as a result is not as reliable as a kicker or slice. I generally might use it once or twice in a match when I am up in the score. I never use it for a 2nd serve.

As for the Tursonov reference, there is a Youtube clip of Dmitry hitting this serve. If you search 'reverse slice' here you will find a URL.

 

[LeeD]

Just because YOU have never seen this serve at 3.5 levels doesn't mean it doesn't exist at that level.
I already mentioned my experience with it...TracyHouk's older brother.
If a tree falls in the forest without anyone hearing or seeing it, did it fall?

 

[jrod]

...If a tree falls in the forest without anyone hearing or seeing it, did it fall?

If LeeD says it did, then it must have. After all, he says he is an authority on many things. Who are we to question his apparent infinite wisdom?

 

[LeeD]

So I haven't PLAYED against a player who uses two forehands, but does that mean they don't exist?
I've been playing tennis since '74.
I haven't PLAYED against a player who uses 2hfh, but does that mean there are no 2hfh players?
Of course, I've practiced, rallied, and hit a few with both.

 

[Dave M]

DO you mean that they are hitting the serve with (in effect for a right hander) the back side of the strings?

 

[Old school Paul]

I have a guy on my mixed doubles team who uses this serve fairly effectively. It curves like a lefty, skids out like a slice, and seems to stay low. The problem is it is very low paced, but because he has other serves when the receiver is surprised it works. After seeing it a few times, and you can anticipate it coming because of the radical twisting of his arm it becomes less effective and at the 4.0 level and above it gets killed. It is a trick serve at its best.

 

[Steady Eddy]

Is that the same thing as the "reverse twist" serve? We discussed that in this thread.

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=207397&highlight=reverse+slice

 

[film1]

Are you talking about an american twist?

 

[hfmf]

For everyone who is saying that it's not an effective serve, I would beg to differ. I'm a pretty good 4.0, and his serve to the ad side (the side I normally play), is very tough. It's as fast as a normal hard slice would be, but he can locate it on the sidelines of the service box and make me return from the space between the courts. Even when I move up to take it early, I'm in the doubles alley. He can also serve flat up the t. Combine those two things with a pretty good set of hands at the net and he's a toughie, I promise.

 

[Jaewonnie]

Are you talking about an american twist?

reverse slice...as said in the title

 

[Jaewonnie]

DO you mean that they are hitting the serve with (in effect for a right hander) the back side of the strings?

yes, almost like a high forehand motion i think. But I use a continental grip for this so my swing path is totally different.

 

[Don't Let It Bounce]

DO you mean that they are hitting the serve with (in effect for a right hander) the back side of the strings?

The reverse slice described in post #2 (semi-western grip) is hit with the forehand side of the stringbed. (If you visualize it, you'll see it has to be that way.)

Also, when we (a bunch of young 4.5 to 5.0 coaches) were Wasslhoffering back in the day, it was used very rarely– as in, once per match at most. I have not shared the earlier poster's experience of this serve having the pace of a normal slice. My experience has been that if you know it's coming, you can eat it for lunch.

 

[whoopinstick]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9nkDYr9iZw

 

[Don't Let It Bounce]

Wow. Well, I couldn't eat that for lunch even if Tursunov gave me a week's notice it was coming.

 

[LeeD]

If any one of us played Tursunov, we'd lose zip zero over and over.
But when the pro men's play him, it's a different story.
Just the serve, by the time you get to a solid level, you've faced lefty slices, and it's just a strong lefty slice. Not talking Dim's, his is a PRO level lefty slice.

 

[kcjim]

I always thought it was called an australian twist, but whatever its called, it isn't that hard (or hard on your shoulder/arm) to hit. toss the ball 1 or 2 inches left of center (if the center line is at your nose), aim as though you are hitting to the deuce court, and come across the ball right to left. I hit this fairly consistently, and only as a body serve. Hitting at the backhand side of the returner and kicking left. I also only hit it hard, not like a slice, more like going for an ace up the t. I agree you could use it too much in a match, but it is difficult to deal with.