Safin and Henin elected to Hall of Fame
- Thread starter Mainad
- Start date
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Navdeep Srivastava
Guest
I think reason is political.
SoBad
G.O.A.T.
The mere fact that Kafelnikov and Safin are not yet in some Hall tells you all you need to know about that "Hall."
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Navdeep Srivastava
Guest
I always though betting is the reason, suspected match fixing, but seriously if ATP can't prove anything they need to put him in HOF , regardless of outside activities.
Capulin Zurdo
Hall of Fame
Not too familiar with Safin but great for both of them. I watched Henin's matches towards the end of her career, most notably the 2010 A.O., and looking back it seems she's had a fantastic career.
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Navdeep Srivastava
Guest
You should watch Safin vs Sampras us open 2000 , AO 2002, Vs Fed AO 2005 , and Ao2005 final.
NatF
Bionic Poster
I'd add to that his Paris 2002 match against Hewitt and his Paris 2000 match against Philippoussis. As well as his Madrid 2004 meeting with Agassi.
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Navdeep Srivastava
Guest
Thanks friend, I was adding his famous slam matches.
Btw I never saw his 2000 Paris match, how good that match is, worth enough to watch it tonight?
SoBad
G.O.A.T.
ATP and HOF are prime examples of corrupt institutions becoming irrelevant to the subject matter they are supposed to supervise.
NatF
Bionic Poster
Well it is an unknown classic and if you have time to watch all 5 sets I highly recommend it.
Here's a little overview of the match;
http://www.thenextpoint.com/2011/03/great-matches-youve-probably-never-heard-of-5/
It was high quality.
I do miss watching a prime Henin on the WTA tour, with her variety and athleticism. At her prime from 2003-2007, her forehand was the single best shot in women's tennis in my opinion, and her backhand was a delight to watch as well. Plus from her generation she had the best footwork by a considerable distance.
HipRotation
Hall of Fame
Add that Houston 2004 match to the Federer-Safin match list just for the ridiculous tiebreak. Also some peak tier backhands.
hoodjem
G.O.A.T.
Lock up your daughters. Marat's coming to town!
hoodjem
G.O.A.T.
mattosgrant
Banned
Kafelnikov didn't even win a Masters title. That is a major stain on his career. Considering that major blemish he is probably the weakest 2 slam winner (other than Kriek, but I don't even count Kriek a real 2 slam winner), and weaker than a lot of 1 slam winners.
On a more subjective note he was not feared by the top players of his era and generally had poor head to heads with a lot of people. 2-11 vs Sampras, 0-9 off of clay. Losing record to Johansson (considered one of the weakest 1 slam winners) including 8 losses in a row. 1-7 vs Hewitt. He didn't win his 2 slam with any big wins really. His French Open was won by beating Krajicek, Sampras, and Stich which looks more like a Wimbledon draw than a Roland Garros one. His Australian Open title was won beating Martin, 18 year old Haas, and Enqvist. Not his fault, you can only play who is in front of you but it is pretty surprising your biggest win for 2 slam titles is Sampras on clay or Todd Martin on hard courts.
That combined with his sour personality and lack of charisma, and he gets overlooked. He still might get in at some point. Pierce and Martinez are also still waiting, and I could see either getting in as well.
No, not for a grand slam winner.
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Navdeep Srivastava
Guest
But for hof his double career will also count and he is 4 slam winner and olympic champion, Davis cup winner also.
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mattosgrant
Banned
I think he will get in eventually. So will Pierce. Martinez not so sure.
RacquetAbuse101
Semi-Pro
LOL! Goran was up there with them. What a trio.
Absolutely. I believe you refered to it as a bazooka on another thread?
Good word for it.
I did because i never seen anything with such power and heavyness and depth and consistency
Even better than Djoker or Murray
The Green Mile
Bionic Poster
It's an awesome match. Definitely recommend it. 5 sets, full of quality and drama. Right up there with my favourite matches for me.
mattosgrant
Banned
Mainad
Bionic Poster
Kafelnikov and Pierce definitely. Not too sure about Martinez yet although I suspect if she were American she would already be in by now (has there ever been an American Grand Slam champion who was not quickly inducted into the HoF as soon as eligible?).
BTW, correct me if I'm wrong, but haven't both Kafelnikov and Pierce already been proposed for membership and been rejected?
mattosgrant
Banned
Pierce was once but it was a year there were better candidates than her, and they never induct more than 2 in the players category. I think she will get in the first year there isnt more than 1 better candidate. It is still early for her, I believe she hasnt been eligible long.
Kafelnikov likewise I think has always been stuck nominated in years with better candidates. Next year Clijsters is eligible and she is automatic and first priority. Maybe 1 of Pierce or Kafelnikov can get in with her.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
Doesn't Roddick become eligible next year? He will be a shoo-in.
mattosgrant
Banned
Yeah you are right. So I guess it is Clijsters and Roddick next year and the rest have to wait. FWIW I do agree with Roddick getting in before Kafelnikov despite 1 slam to 2. Roddick is far above Kafelnikov in many other ways- 5 Masters to 0, consistency, a YE#1, 4 Wimbledons and U.S Open finals vs 0. Not sure about Roddick before Pierce, that is a closer call.
mattosgrant
Banned
Nobody ever talked about her forehand which was in itself amazing.
Henin was the young phenom I was most excited following during the early 2000s. I remember when I first saw her play, I believe it was against Kournikova at her first US Open. I couldn't believe a short petite 16 year old could hit such a hard accurate one handed backhand. Then mix it up with beautiful slices and an attacking forehand with competence at the net. She was so silky smooth and great to watch.
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Navdeep Srivastava
Guest
Roddick as a single player > Rafter, Wawa, Kafelnikov but as I said above for HOF whole career is important.
Kaf has 53 titles( 26 singles, 27 doubles) vs Roddick 36 titles( 32 single, 4 doubles)
Kaf 6 slam( 2 single, 4 doubles) vs Roddick 1 single slam
Kaf has 1 OGM and is a Davis cup winner.
Kaf went into 1 wtf final and Roddick none
Only big thing Roddick has over Kaf is 5single masters and one year end 1.
For HOF Kaf should come before Roddick.
mattosgrant
Banned
I guess it depends how much you value doubles. I gives it some value, but you would need 7 or 8 doubles majors for it to be a big thing for me. JMO though.
Unless you have a legendary doubles career they tend to prioritize singles. Atlhough in Kafelnikov's case it is singles + doubles combined. With 2 singles majors to 1 for Roddick and 4 doubles majors, I guess there is a good case he had the better career depending how you value doubles.
Then there is Pierce. 2 slam singles titles but 6 finals. Many Premier Mandatory type titles IIRC. I think she has a couple doubles slams too, although I could be wrong. I do know she had some success in doubles, less than Kafelnikov, but more than Roddick.
Next year Clijsters is a lock, so only 1 of those at most can probably go in with her next year.
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Navdeep Srivastava
Guest
For me Pierce should go, you don't know I had a huge crush on her, she won RG both in singles and doubles in 2000.
Pierce was really unluck not to win 1 more final, I still remember loosing 1 final to henin then beating henin in next match very badly.
Pierce was really unluck not to win 1 more final, I still remember loosing 1 final to henin then beating henin in next match very badly.
