Short Hitting Video

[Ballinbob]

Hey all

Haven't been able to post regularly as I am slammed with school, but thought I'd post some highlights from my practice session today. Got a new phone and wanted to try it out (wide-angle lens coming soon).

Not much has changed with my strokes mechanics wise...haven't been able to reverse the bad muscle memory even with 3-4 lessons on my forehand. I do feel like I'm a lot more aggressive though from both sides and I push less in matches. Backhand is still my most consistent shot but I hit more winners with my forehand now.

The guy I'm playing with beat me in the finals of a 4.0 tournament last year. I just got his number after seeing him last month and beat him 6-4, 7-6 (0) when we played a practice match. He's a very tricky player

Tips/comments/stories welcome. Watch in 1080p for best results

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zSNsKl6cxY&feature=youtu.be


9-26.... Hitting with a 5.0 player:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbwGs47Em18

 

[Jim Lefty]

Nice vid. This is one of those classic strokes versus modern strokes moments.

What phone/camera are you using?

 

[Ballinbob]

Haha it is very much a classic vs modern moment. I'm using a Samsung Galaxy s5 (switched from an iPhone 5s). The vids turn out real nice with a wide angle lens, can't wait till mine comes in

 

[rkelley]

Nice hitting.

The player in blue has nice strokes, though I did see a few points with winners off the feed, which I'm not super keen on. Still, good strokes fh and bh, good consistency with some excellent winners.

 

[user92626]

Haha it is very much a classic vs modern moment. I'm using a Samsung Galaxy s5 (switched from an iPhone 5s). The vids turn out real nice with a wide angle lens, can't wait till mine comes in

Very nice. May I ask how many gigabytes does that 4.x minute clip take up on your phone?

And, which wide angle len are you getting? Link?

(ps. I'm surprised to hear pple getting the S5 at this time when iphone6 is just released. )

 

[directionals]

Did you use some kind of gorilla tripod to position the phone?

 

[Topspin Shot]

Good playing; you're hitting a significantly heavier ball. It seems like you're a little too aggressive though. You're getting away with it here because your opponent isn't quick enough to play much defense. A more athletic opponent could draw errors out of you.

 

[shindemac]

3000 posts! Congrats!

Forehand is looking better. Good mix of spin and pace now. You're still hitting off the back foot sometimes and backpedaling. Your opponent doesn't look like he's outhitting you, so you should be able to get to most of his shots comfortably. One easy fix is to stand further back behind the baseline. Notice your opponent stands further back than you.

 

[Ballinbob]

Nice hitting.

The player in blue has nice strokes, though I did see a few points with winners off the feed, which I'm not super keen on. Still, good strokes fh and bh, good consistency with some excellent winners.

Thanks rkelly. I'm the player in the blue, and you caught me red-handed regarding hitting winners of the feed haha. I just hit instinctively, don't really think about hitting winners

Very nice. May I ask how many gigabytes does that 4.x minute clip take up on your phone?

And, which wide angle len are you getting? Link?

(ps. I'm surprised to hear pple getting the S5 at this time when iphone6 is just released. )

It's 4:30am at the moment but if I remember right a 20 minute video was around the 4 gig mark. And there are tons and tons of wide angle lenses on **** for under $10 for the newer smartphones. As for the iPhone 6 versus S5...they're both really good phones. They get the job done well.

Did you use some kind of gorilla tripod to position the phone?

I did not use a gorilla tripod. I went to Home Depot and engineered myself a basket-velcro device. I basically hang a shower basket on the back fence, put my phone in the basket, then velcro strap my phone on the basket so it's secure. I have a picture of the setup which I will post when I get my coffee in me

Good playing; you're hitting a significantly heavier ball. It seems like you're a little too aggressive though. You're getting away with it here because your opponent isn't quick enough to play much defense. A more athletic opponent could draw errors out of you.

Thanks man. I'm hitting much more aggressively and yes I'm making many more errors. The vid posted is a highlight video and I definitely do make mistakes. Against better opponents I try and construct points a little better... Against this guy I can get away with simply hitting hard. Vs my better friends I have to place my shots better and keep the point going for longer.

I'd like to post some tiebreakers soon so I can get help with my serve toss. My serve still has the same weird mechanics but my toss is just....bad. Need to fix it

3000 posts! Congrats!

Forehand is looking better. Good mix of spin and pace now. You're still hitting off the back foot sometimes and backpedaling. Your opponent doesn't look like he's outhitting you, so you should be able to get to most of his shots comfortably. One easy fix is to stand further back behind the baseline. Notice your opponent stands further back than you.

Hey thanks! I know I'm still hitting off the back foot and all. Old habits die hard and I'm trying to make the most out of what I have. I've been going to the gym for the past few months which really helped with overall power but in terms of mechanics my strokes are pretty much the same.

As for standing behind the baseline... I don't know if I like that but I'll try it. I like to come in when possible and standing back makes that difficult.

 

[Ballinbob]

Here is the camera setup I use for anyone interested. It costs under $10 and with a wide angle lens takes so pretty gnarly vids

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showpost.php?p=8014091&postcount=15

 

[Ballinbob]

Bump...Finally had some time to sit back and watch this in slow mo. I have one question about the forehand and I'll let this thread rest.

Once you load your weight onto the right leg, you have your left arm stretched across your body and you have your hitting arm straight on the right side of you

It's at this point where you begin to pull forward towards the ball and have your butt cup point at the ball, correct? I already know my elbow is doing weird things and going behind me and all. Basically, I'm trying to find the root cause that makes my forehand turn into a UE machine at times. Is the contact point any better or is that still something that needs improving?

Thanks

 

[Topspin Shot]

Bump...Finally had some time to sit back and watch this in slow mo. I have one question about the forehand and I'll let this thread rest.

Once you load your weight onto the right leg, you have your left arm stretched across your body and you have your hitting arm straight on the right side of you

It's at this point where you begin to pull forward towards the ball and have your butt cup point at the ball, correct? I already know my elbow is doing weird things and going behind me and all. Basically, I'm trying to find the root cause that makes my forehand turn into a UE machine at times. Is the contact point any better or is that still something that needs improving?

Thanks

I made a video explaining what I see. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajxPm0aOGi4&list=UUuFVCRX5zNr10dxmbeM1B9Q

 

[movdqa]

Not sure that I'd call those classic strokes - more like strokes to minimize the effort and swing to get the ball back. His backhand prep was pretty late too.

You look like you're hitting fine but he was giving you a lot of pretty easy balls to hit. Looks like he's great for practicing your approach.

 

[Coolio]

I made a video explaining what I see. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajxPm0aOGi4&list=UUuFVCRX5zNr10dxmbeM1B9Q

How do you know you get more control of the racquet in the contact window with the ATP style forehand?

 

[Topspin Shot]

How do you know you get more control of the racquet in the contact window with the ATP style forehand?

I'm not saying ATP gives you more control than WTA or another style. I'm comparing ATP to what Bob's doing as he wants to go with the ATP style. He's keeping his racket closed for so long in the backswing that he has to open it too close to the contact point, and things can get messed up in there.

 

[Coolio]

I'm not saying ATP gives you more control than WTA or another style. I'm comparing ATP to what Bob's doing as he wants to go with the ATP style. He's keeping his racket closed for so long in the backswing that he has to open it too close to the contact point, and things can get messed up in there.

Have a look at this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4oIrtzDIcQ

Guy in white has a big loopy forehand backswing like Bob's. He was ATP 266 at his best.

 

[Topspin Shot]

Have a look at this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4oIrtzDIcQ

Guy in white has a big loopy forehand backswing like Bob's. He was ATP 266 at his best.

The guy in white doesn't have an ATP style forehand; instead, he has a loopier backswing, which is okay because the momentum of the loop stabilizes the contact zone. Bob doesn't have much of a loop in his swing though; he tries to pat the dog like he's hitting ATP style, but he drags the racket behind his back while he's in the pat the dog position.

 

[shindemac]

You're hugging the baseline too closely. If you want to stand so close, you need to take the ball on the rise. You don't have to stand as far back as your partner, try another foot back or two and see which one you prefer. FYI, it's easier to run forward; Running backwards is slower and harder. You should still be able to rush the net comfortably on short balls.

 

[Coolio]

The guy in white doesn't have an ATP style forehand; instead, he has a loopier backswing, which is okay because the momentum of the loop stabilizes the contact zone. Bob doesn't have much of a loop in his swing though; he tries to pat the dog like he's hitting ATP style, but he drags the racket behind his back while he's in the pat the dog position.

I have never heard of that. How exactly does the momentum of the loop stabilize the contact zone?
He doesn't have an ATP swing, but he does have an ATP ranking!
Bob does take his racquet back to what you call the "pat the dog" position.
Nothing wrong with doing that.

 

[FitzRoy]

The guy in white doesn't have an ATP style forehand; instead, he has a loopier backswing, which is okay because the momentum of the loop stabilizes the contact zone. Bob doesn't have much of a loop in his swing though; he tries to pat the dog like he's hitting ATP style, but he drags the racket behind his back while he's in the pat the dog position.

If I understand you correctly, you seem to be saying it's basically bad to mix these elements? I need to get myself on video (haven't done so in about 5 years) because I feel like I might also be dragging racket behind back while in the 'pat the dog' position (by the way, we need a new term for this, who reaches behind themselves to pat a dog?).

What would be the major downside to taking racket that far back while in that position?

 

[Coolio]

What would be the major downside to taking racket that far back while in that position?

Ask Jeremy Chardy!

 

[NLBwell]

Good luck Ballin Bob. I don't live near Denver any more. Sorry we didn't get to hit.

 

[Topspin Shot]

I have never heard of that. How exactly does the momentum of the loop stabilize the contact zone?
He doesn't have an ATP swing, but he does have an ATP ranking!
Bob does take his racquet back to what you call the "pat the dog" position.
Nothing wrong with doing that.

The loop offers a longer track so you don't have to flip the racket in the contact zone like Bob's doing. Not saying you need a big loop, but then the racket shouldn't go behind the back. A couple months ago, Bob was working on his forehand, and he was trying to model an ATP swing as he felt this would be best for him. He got most of the elements down except this last one. I wouldn't be talking to him about ATP if he wanted to go down another path. The pro in your video has a long backswing, which is an entirely different style of forehand.

If I understand you correctly, you seem to be saying it's basically bad to mix these elements? I need to get myself on video (haven't done so in about 5 years) because I feel like I might also be dragging racket behind back while in the 'pat the dog' position (by the way, we need a new term for this, who reaches behind themselves to pat a dog?).

What would be the major downside to taking racket that far back while in that position?

If you're doing an ATP swing, you have to flip the racket from the PTD to a position where the face is nearly vertical at contact. This is ideally done in the slot, before the contact window, so the plane can stay the same there. If you're flipping the face in the forward swing, your forehand can become erratic.

Ask Jeremy Chardy!

Chardy has a big loop. Different style of forehand.

 

[FitzRoy]

If you're doing an ATP swing, you have to flip the racket from the PTD to a position where the face is nearly vertical at contact. This is ideally done in the slot, before the contact window, so the plane can stay the same there. If you're flipping the face in the forward swing, your forehand can become erratic.

It does get erratic at times. Need to get it on video and post it, I think I have a solid understanding of the mechanics but you and a few others definitely seem to grasp the details better. Not to mention the fact that what I think I'm doing may be fairly different from what's actually happening

 

[Coolio]

Good points topspin, but remember everyone hits a forehand differently!

 

[FitzRoy]

^^^ Wow, that is...something

 

[Topspin Shot]

It does get erratic at times. Need to get it on video and post it, I think I have a solid understanding of the mechanics but you and a few others definitely seem to grasp the details better. Not to mention the fact that what I think I'm doing may be fairly different from what's actually happening

This is why I feel it's so important to see yourself on video. It's also a challenge to give tips on the forum because I can fail to explain something fully, and people will interpret it different ways.

 

[FitzRoy]

This is why I feel it's so important to see yourself on video. It's also a challenge to give tips on the forum because I can fail to explain something fully, and people will interpret it different ways.

It really is important. I'm happy that my video from 2008 or maybe 2009 (can't remember exactly) is no longer online, with how horrific my forehand looked on it. But seeing that back then was what allowed me to actually get on the path toward hitting a legit forehand. I think my forehand has improved dramatically since then, but it's long past time for me to see what's going on again. Especially with how I was hitting them in doubles sets a couple hours ago (ugh)

 

[Topspin Shot]

Good points topspin, but remember everyone hits a forehand differently!

Lol. I give up!

 

[FitzRoy]

I'm playing a couple singles sets tomorrow evening, gonna try to borrow my friend's iPod to record it (I don't have a smartphone. I know, I know). It'll be funny to see the reaction if I record and post, since the sets will likely be incredibly ugly. We both have pretty bad serves, both in terms of form and result, and that's one of main things people associate with playing level. This guy is the most relentless grinder I've ever played, and his technique can be uhhh...unique, let's say. But it's absolute fact that this guy is a computer rated 4.5, and there's no way anyone is going to believe that from what this video would look like

 

[FitzRoy]

Hey all

Haven't been able to post regularly as I am slammed with school, but thought I'd post some highlights from my practice session today. Got a new phone and wanted to try it out (wide-angle lens coming soon).

Not much has changed with my strokes mechanics wise...haven't been able to reverse the bad muscle memory even with 3-4 lessons on my forehand. I do feel like I'm a lot more aggressive though from both sides and I push less in matches. Backhand is still my most consistent shot but I hit more winners with my forehand now.

The guy I'm playing with beat me in the finals of a 4.0 tournament last year. I just got his number after seeing him last month and beat him 6-4, 7-6 (0) when we played a practice match. He's a very tricky player

Tips/comments/stories welcome. Watch in 1080p for best results

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zSNsKl6cxY&feature=youtu.be

Is this you guys playing practice points, or is this just how you hit in general? I like the vid, but if it's just hitting around, seems maybe a little aggressive with shot intent?

 

[Ballinbob]

Is this you guys playing practice points, or is this just how you hit in general? I like the vid, but if it's just hitting around, seems maybe a little aggressive with shot intent?

We were playing groundstroke games to 11, so they were meant to be competitive rallies. I definitely don't hit that hard when just hitting around or nobody would hit with me And I look forward to seeing you play Fitz

Topspin, thanks for the video. I will check it out in more detail tomorrow after work. I love learning about this stuff for some reason haha

And NLBWell, it just wasn't meant to be, no worries. I wish you the best wherever you are now

 

[FitzRoy]

We were playing groundstroke games to 11, so they were meant to be competitive rallies. I definitely don't hit that hard when just hitting around or nobody would hit with me

Hah, well I know a couple guys who would, cause that's just what they do. But yeah, knowing they were meant to be competitive, I like what I'm seeing. Groundstroke games are nice because when you take the serve out of the equation, you get some interesting results. Do you feel like you do better in sets or in groundstroke games to 11?

 

[Ballinbob]

I do better in sets... I have a pretty decent serve and have been involved in competitive sports all my life so I do well under pressure. I play groundstroke games with my 4.5 friends all the time and I almost always get outlasted. But when serving it's much easier for me to pounce on the first shot

 

[TennisCJC]

Good points topspin, but remember everyone hits a forehand differently!

Please don't hit that differently! One of those is enough.

 

[TennisCJC]

I do better in sets... I have a pretty decent serve and have been involved in competitive sports all my life so I do well under pressure. I play groundstroke games with my 4.5 friends all the time and I almost always get outlasted. But when serving it's much easier for me to pounce on the first shot

You look much better than the guy you were hitting against. My guess is plays you by changing speeds, slicing to your BH and coming to net. But, your technique is much better. You could improve your consistency a bit with just focus, footwork and lots of practice. Only tech thing I see is you have a bit of a big take back on the FH but not too bad a thing. I like the way you use 2 hands on the racket during the prep. Then you take it back quite a ways at times - this MIGHT be the cause of some of your FH issues that you cited. Macci talks about keeping the FH arm in sync with the body rotation in one of his video. I think your take back sometimes has a delay in the loop and swing to contact causing sync issues. By the way, I have the same problem at times. I have 2 HBH too which stays in sync more as I have to rotate core to pull 2 HBH arm structure into contact. But, on FH, I can get "dangle arm" at times where arm is not smoothly coordinated with core rotation.

 

[Tight Lines]

So, you played a slicer eh... Yep, these guys are tricky to play.

I played one of those guys only once. His strokes looked like crap because he was self-taught and a former squash player. I lost badly to him as I couldn't adjust to the low skidding balls.

You did much better than me although the opponent couldn't move very well

Harry

 

[Ballinbob]

Really good analysis topspin, and more importantly easy to understand. I remember Cheetah always saying how important a neutral wrist is in the forehand but I never thought to apply it to my game. Makes a lot of sense and I can see where some of my inconsistency comes from.

And tightlines, yeah he's a pretty good slicer. He has a very good record at 4.0 singles. I have to really whip up on the ball to keep the ball in

 

[Topspin Shot]

Really good analysis topspin, and more importantly easy to understand. I remember Cheetah always saying how important a neutral wrist is in the forehand but I never thought to apply it to my game. Makes a lot of sense and I can see where some of my inconsistency comes from.

And tightlines, yeah he's a pretty good slicer. He has a very good record at 4.0 singles. I have to really whip up on the ball to keep the ball in

Just to clarify: I said neutral wrist in the pat the dog position. Not neutral wrist in the slot. The wrist lays back in the slot.

 

[LeeD]

That guy you're hitting with looks old enough to be your granddad.
He must be 60+, if a day old.

 

[Ballinbob]

He is old, but he has a great record at 4.0.

I'm going out to play with some 4.5-5.0 guys now and will vid some groundstroke games and maybe a tiebreak with my 5.0 friend. He's a legit computer rated 5.0 too... Here are his resutls: http://tennislink.usta.com/Leagues/...r2=TRAN&par3=False#&&s=8||0||2005276109||2013

I usually only win a few points in the 11 point groundstroke game but at least now you'll see me getting jerked around the court this time He plays almost exactly like topspinshot haha

 

[Ballinbob]

Here are some short highlights from today, didnt feel like going through the 1hr of video I had. As you can see this guy is much better than the video posted in my OP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PbwGs47Em18&feature=youtu.be

 

[movdqa]

This guy moves and hits a lot better.

It sounded like you were playing during an earthquake - was something hitting the camera?

 

[Ballinbob]

Haha yeah I had friends on the other court playing and they were hitting the fence alot. And yes this guy is alot tougher than the old guy I played

 

[dknotty]

Nice hitting bob. But... Hitting winners off feeders is a no no.

 

[NLBwell]

Your opponent is a very solid player and much tougher in a match than he looks on the video.

The shaking was Godzilla stomping and destroying the city behind you.

 

[Ballinbob]

Dknotty, you're absolutely right on the feed comment haha. Not sure why I did that. And NLB, didn't you play him last year? He is really tough... He almost never misses and if you drop the ball short to his forehand it's pretty much point over every time

Great guy though I've known him 3-4 years and he coaches me all the time

 

[dknotty]

Dknotty, you're absolutely right on the feed comment haha. Not sure why I did that. And NLB, didn't you play him last year? He is really tough... He almost never misses and if you drop the ball short to his forehand it's pretty much point over every time

Great guy though I've known him 3-4 years and he coaches me all the time

Haha all too easily done. Pulling the trigger is very gratifying!

 

[NLBwell]

Dknotty, you're absolutely right on the feed comment haha. Not sure why I did that. And NLB, didn't you play him last year? He is really tough... He almost never misses and if you drop the ball short to his forehand it's pretty much point over every time

Great guy though I've known him 3-4 years and he coaches me all the time

Yes, I played him when I first decided to get serious about improving my game. I may not have even won a game. It was very frustrating because in that match and also the next one I played, I kept getting game points and break points and just couldn't win games. I remember I was amazed at some of the balls he got to and returned. He was a really nice guy.

Fortunately, after playing almost every day and often twice a day for almost a year while working at the club, my game was on the way to getting pretty good again. Unfortunately, since moving, I've given up playing tennis again.