Tennis and Supplements

BenjiM

New User
Hello my fellow tennis players,

Recently I have started taking this supplement called NO-Xplode before I work out. It gives me a lot of energy and focus for my workout, but I don't think it would be good to take before tennis. Lifting weights and playing tennis are very different exercises.

However, I could use this same type of energy and focus during my matches and training sessions. I was actually thinking of creating an energy supplement that was made specifically for tennis.

What do you all think? Would there be a market for a tennis supplement?

Thanks!
 

r2473

G.O.A.T.
I was actually thinking of creating an energy supplement that was made specifically for tennis.

What do you all think? Would there be a market for a tennis supplement?

Thanks!

The tours call these "steroids". But I like supplements. Has a nice ring to it.

How much do you plan on charging?
 

BenjiM

New User
Haha, no I wouldn't put any banned substances in them.

I would probably test a few different prices to see what works best.

Right now, this is super far away. I am just trying to see if it is worth pursuing. So I would like to hear from as many people as possible.

Is a pre-tennis supplement an idea worth pursuing? Or do you guys think no one would go for it?
 

Vyse

Semi-Pro
Mmmm it would be tough to get into that. Try NO Xplode before tennis, I don't see why you wouldn't like it. You may be battling against Gatorade and many other companies. None sell just "tennis supplements" but supplements altogether. I think you would have a very difficult time in the industry.
 

maverick66

Hall of Fame
NO Explode is a testament to what marketing can do for you. Its one of the biggest piece of crap supplements out there but they market it so well that it sells to all the people who have no idea what they are doing.
 

Talker

Hall of Fame
Check what their taking in other similar sports. Maybe martial arts forums have some people describing what they do. Both of these sports need explosive movements, some endurance etc.
You could google "nutrients reflexes", and variations of that.
Go thru a few hundred links or more, by then you'll have a good idea what might possibly work.

Bring the results of possibilities back here so we can argue about it. :)
 

007

Professional
pre-lifting supplements tends to include creatine, caffeine and NOX. During tennis your body won't benefit nor need the creatine but it can benefit from the NOX for vasodilation. The caffeine will provide a temporary mental boost but some people are sensitive to it.

before tennis the right mix of carbs and a bit of protein will get you fueled up

but a mental boost courtesy of red bull, AMP's, NOs or a simialr drink is a personal thing.
 

Bud

Bionic Poster
Mmmm it would be tough to get into that. Try NO Xplode before tennis, I don't see why you wouldn't like it. You may be battling against Gatorade and many other companies. None sell just "tennis supplements" but supplements altogether. I think you would have a very difficult time in the industry.

NO Explode is a testament to what marketing can do for you. Its one of the biggest piece of crap supplements out there but they market it so well that it sells to all the people who have no idea what they are doing.

I tried a can of the NO Xplode and liked it. It definitely boosts energy (caffeine) and pumps the muscles (creatine).

However, it seems many people suffer live issues while taking it (high liver enzyme count). Based on some accounts of their blood tests... their doctors figured they had contracted hepatitis. That drove me away from the stuff.
 

albino smurf

Professional
I'm pretty sure you need to be careful with your hydration when using creatine so I'd b a lot more wary using it while playing tennis, particularly in the summer months.
 

Archmage

New User
I'd think that any supplement marketed specifically for tennis is questionable at best.

The supplement could be marketed for endurance sports, but it's difficult to be more specific without some BS marketing.

If I were to make a "tennis supplement," I'd include ingredients for focus, endurance, and performance enhancement, and I'd design a formula that could be used daily, safely.

Well-researched people will recognize the following:

Focus Category:

- CDP and Alpha-GPC choline + possibly piracetam or oxiracetam
- NA-RALA + Glycine-Propionyl L-carnitine (Nitric Oxide production = don't need arginine) and Acetyl-L-Carnitine-Arginate (RALA taken separately from carnitine)
- Co-enzymated B-vitamins, low-dose + possibly some sulbutiamine instead of regular thiamine (Here is your dopamine boost and improved reaction time, but tolerance may develop to this particular ingredient)
- Possibly a cerebral blood-flow enhancer (rosemary and/or ginkgo) = blood thinner = caution

Endurance and Performance:

- Minerals ("electrolytes"), possibly as krebs cycle chelates. Extra Calcium (possibly enhances grip strength in weight-lifters - might help for tennis)
- Beta-Alanine + Taurine (I often skip this because the paresthesia makes me uncomfortable, but supporting evidence is solid)
- Micronized creatine monohydrate ("creapure" German manufacturer only - don't want creatinine junk) - I'd go low-dose on this one for nootropic effect
- Instantized branched Chain amino acids (2:1:1) + possibly glutamine, or just whey protein isolate. There are more expensive options for amino acid delivery as well... not worthwhile for endurance sports.

If choosing to add anti-oxidants in the formula, I'd use low doses of grape seed extract and pomegranate, and maybe Vit C.

I'm not a fan of the popular workout formulas... so I make my own. I do, however, understand what I'm doing - otherwise I wouldn't bother.

Being well-fed is most important.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Bionic Poster
I've noticed that there are a number of products targeted towards golfers for alertness/mental focus (Swing Juice, BrainQuicken, 418 Energy, Tee Shotz, etc). BrainQuicken (aka BodyQuicken) looks like the most interesting of the ones that I've looked at.

For tennis (and badminton) I've had excellent results with Choco Energy and ProEndorphin. Honorable mentions to 5-Hour Energy and 6 Hour Power. Are you looking for something different than these?
 

maverick66

Hall of Fame
I need to get in the supplement industry. You people buy all kinds of unnecessary things that are not helping at all.
 

ogruskie

Professional
I think you're better off having a cup of coffee an hour before your tennis. I find that a small cup gives me just enough mental focus to feel good without crashing later on.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Bionic Poster
I need to get in the supplement industry. You people buy all kinds of unnecessary things that are not helping at all.

Sure there is a lot of stuff out there that doesn't help. Do you even attempt to keep an open mind about these sort of things? Believe me when I endorse these products, they've had a very real effect for me. As I get ever closer to 60, I'm looking for alternatives to prescription drugs (with beau-coup side effects) to help me cope. Many of them don't do much while every once in a while, you find something that does.

When you get there, you might sing a different tune.
.
 
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maverick66

Hall of Fame
Dont you think you should be a little more careful about what you put in your body?

I used quite a few supplements in my playing days and yes they helped but I never took any kind of stimulant ever. Anything that messes with the brain makes you worse at everything when timing is necessary.
 

Archmage

New User
meh...

With the exception of choline supplementation, most of the time I just make sure I'm well-fed and well-hydrated.

A good steak will have the aminos and carnitine and a little bit of each vitamin and mineral. Some vegetables will provide more minerals (Eat your vegetables).

That, and I'll try to have a banana and/or apple with me to replenish glycogen reserves during exercise. Some simple whey protein will partially alleviate the muscle-breakdown from an extended catabolic state (I lose tons of muscle while playing tennis).

Everything else I've mentioned because there is ample evidence to support usage - someone interested in supplementation would look into it.

What to look for:

I'm not endorsing any product, but 5-hour energy uses CDP-choline as its choline source. Most products, including "BodyQuick," use cheap choline bitartrate. It's garbage in comparison. I'd rather eat some eggs for my choline... (eggs are a great deal).

It'd behoove anyone to analyze the ingredients and reasons for their inclusion into these formulas.

I'll review BodyQuick's formula, because it was mentioned, and because a few of my friends tried it before they knew better - same people are now biology pHD's or candidates.

http://www.bodybuilding.com/store/bq/body.html?MCID=FGOOG

Note that the specific amounts of each ingredient are not disclosed for the most part. In general, good supplement manufacturers will disclose everything, and maybe even provide 3rd party Certificates of Analysis when asked (lab-testing to ensure that what we're ingesting isn't contaminated).

- Cordyceps: No standardization provided. You're probably just getting plain mushroom powder... Whether or not cordyceps works is another debate.
- Choline bitartrate: cheapest form they could have used
- Glutamine: Ridiculous to put in a pill like this when you get more from food or just whey protein. It seems like a filler.
- Tyrosine: OK - they went for the dopamine buzz. Easy way to exert some discernable effect.
- Salix Alba: aspirin... well... it doesn't do nothing
- Paullina Cupana: Guarana = caffeine source...
- Dimethylaminoethanal: DMAE = another cheap choline source.

The rest: I wouldn't use vinpocetine or huperzine-A. You'll feel the effects, but I have reason to believe that they're not worth the risk.

Vinpocetine is a cerebral blood flow enhancer, and a potent one. But if its mechanism of action is understood correctly, then it can affect monoamine transport and storage in the long-term, leading to serious cognitive complications (similar to the drug "resperine") - avoid.
Huperzine-A: is an acetylcholinesterase inhibitor included to prolong the effect of the cheap choline they've included. It'll work, but it'll likely cause some downregulation in the long-run, whereas something like CDP-choline actually increases receptor density, and thus self-potentiates its cholinergic activity.


Lesson: most supplements are marketing junk. They'll exert some effect, but they are possibly unsafe - these manufacturers don't review the available medical literature, or simply don't care.
 

Archmage

New User
That guy is a bit nutty about his coconut oil... it's not a panacea, but it's a stable cooking oil, as is plain butter. I use it in my frozen-berry protein shakes as well.

Nutiva Extra Virgin Coconut Oil - best deal, and good taste. There are some that just taste chalky.

I also use a high quality EV Olive oil, but not for cooking.

I don't have a problem endorsing good FOOD. I don't see that as a supplement.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Bionic Poster
I think you're better off having a cup of coffee an hour before your tennis. I find that a small cup gives me just enough mental focus to feel good without crashing later on.

With coffee, I find that my mental focus is very good for 20-30 minutes. After that it starts turning on me. I'll get the jitters & my alertness/focus starts to unravel. It could be that I may be hypersensitive to some of the constituents in coffee (but not necessarily the caffeine).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coffee#...d_pharmacology

Coffee is not really all that benign. Most people equate the effect of coffee (both positive & negative) on its caffeine content but this is very misleading. Some of the positive effects of coffee are not due to its caffeine content (see link above). Many of the negative coffee effects (heartburn, hypertension, etc) are not due to caffeine either.

http://www.springerlink.com/content/r165687515131203

(From the link above) -- "More than a thousand chemicals have been reported in roasted coffee. Of 28 chemicals tested, 19 are rodent carcinogens. There are more rodent carcinogens in a single cup of coffee than potentially carcinogenic pesticide residues in the average American diet in a year, and there are still a thousand chemicals left to test in roasted coffee."
.
 
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That guy is a bit nutty about his coconut oil... it's not a panacea, but it's a stable cooking oil, as is plain butter. I use it in my frozen-berry protein shakes as well.

Nutiva Extra Virgin Coconut Oil - best deal, and good taste. There are some that just taste chalky.

I also use a high quality EV Olive oil, but not for cooking.

I don't have a problem endorsing good FOOD. I don't see that as a supplement.

You got to be kidding right? Butter a stable cooking oil?
It browns so damn easily at high heat.. Coconut oil does not...
I've been using this stuff (Coconut oil) for just over a month and I feel great, physically...
You missed the part about the essential fatty acids, I guess....
I even rub some over my face and scalp and it really does the trick as a moisturiser. Excellent stuff...
And it doesn't oxidise, so no more oxidised fat in my body making any deposits in my arteries...
 
D

Deleted member 22147

Guest
haha, no explode before tennis, next thing you'll be on the legendary cell-tech.
 

SystemicAnomaly

Bionic Poster
Dont you think you should be a little more careful about what you put in your body?

I used quite a few supplements in my playing days and yes they helped but I never took any kind of stimulant ever. Anything that messes with the brain makes you worse at everything when timing is necessary.

Yes, this is exactly why I stay away from most prescription & OTC drugs.

With supplements and other alternatives, I make a point of doing a considerable amount of research (seeking out both positive & negative views) before I put anything into my body. I would urge others to always do the same.

What stimulants are you referring to? Is it the B vitamins or the amino acids? Perhaps ginseng or one of the choline sources present in some products? Granted there is a small amount of caffeine/stimulants present in chocolate and yerba maté.

You've never ingested coffee or caffeinated teas? The caffeine content of products that I've mentioned is moderate. For the serving size that I ingest, I'm getting about 35 mg of caffeine -- about what you would get in 1/2 cup of "weak" coffee. (Choco Energy is the exception. Caffeine content of a vial is equal to a full cup of coffee)

While coffee tends to "mess with the brain" and often creates issues with hand-eye and timing for me, I've not had this problem at all with the products I've mentioned. However, most other energy drink products, especially ones that contain high levels of sugar and caffeine, do produce the uneven results seen with coffee - jitters, crash, etc.
.
 
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Archmage

New User
You got to be kidding right? Butter a stable cooking oil?
It browns so damn easily at high heat.. Coconut oil does not...
And it doesn't oxidise, so no more oxidised fat in my body making any deposits in my arteries...

I still use coconut oil for its taste and health benefits. I do love the stuff.

It seems the issue is the word "stability":

- Butter and Coconut Oil have roughly the same smoke point (about 350F). It is the milk solids that are browning within the butter - the same will not occur with clarified butter or Ghee (which has a higher smoke point). The actual fats are similarly "stable."

- In general, saturated (and mono-unsaturated) fats will be more stable than unsaturated fats. Palm oil can be another good cooking oil for that reason. All of these fats will oxidize to some degree approaching and past their smoke point - they just don't oxidize nearly as easily due to their saturated structure. Furthermore, some oils, like olive oil, naturally contain anti-oxidants, preventing oxidation during storage (still not good for cooking though).

- One argument against butter: it seems to contain more advanced glycation end-products than Coconut oil, thus I use it for taste. Ghee is a form of butter in which proteins and sugars are removed, and thus glycation will be reduced, but oxidized cholesterol (specifically that) will increase due to heat exposure in the clarification process.

- As you probably know, Coconut oil is full of MCT's and fats that are considered saturated or nearly so. Saturated fat isn't bad at all - people with a low HDL and higher VLDL could probably improve their cholesterol profiles simply by consuming more saturated fat (which should displace other calories in their diet, hopefully grains/sugar). This also means that animal fats will likely improve their blood lipids - the famous Stanford diet study is good evidence of this. Unfortunately, people and doctors panic at higher total cholesterol numbers... they've never heard of a VAP test.

- http://cmbi.bjmu.edu.cn/news/0406/6.htm - Anyone worried about increased metabolic rate from coconut oil can have a look at these accelerated mice. There is evidence that coconut oil improves mitochondrial efficiency - we'll be furnaces as though we ingested a DNP-uncoupling agent, but at least we won't suffer high mitochondrial-oxidation... assuming human applicability.

If you just want a bunch of coconut research for some reason, I'll leave you to it: http://coconutresearchcenter.org/coconut-research.htm

I'm done...
 

BenjiM

New User
You guys are awesome!!!Thanks so much for the replies and opinions. Y'all are an interesting bunch. Thanks!

Now I'm going to have to take some time to mull over all of this and decide if trying to create a tennis supplement is a good idea.
 

10ACE

Professional
Hello my fellow tennis players,

Recently I have started taking this supplement called NO-Xplode before I work out. It gives me a lot of energy and focus for my workout, but I don't think it would be good to take before tennis. Lifting weights and playing tennis are very different exercises.

However, I could use this same type of energy and focus during my matches and training sessions. I was actually thinking of creating an energy supplement that was made specifically for tennis.

What do you all think? Would there be a market for a tennis supplement?

Thanks!

Citrulline malate is great for endurance sports such as tennis- sups for ATP tennis is tough due to their guidelines.
 
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