What are the benifits of a Poly/Synth Hybrid in 2018?

[tegg96]

When Poly string originally came out onto the market they were known to be extremely stiff and uncomfortable. But players loved the extra spin and control these plastics wires offered over the most commonly used cheap synthetic gut strings.

So I guess a stringer at the time, say around mid 1990s decided if you cross the poly mains with a cheap synth gut you will get the control and spin of the poly but with a little more power and comfort of the synth gut. So there and then the Poly/Synth Hybrid was born.

Till this day I get customers wanting this setup, none can tell me why they think they should have it, only that that's what they've always used and want to stick with it.

My argument is that todays polys are far far more comfortable than the old stuff. A full bed of soft poly works far better in the spin and control department, whilst maintaining comfort and power, over any poly/synth hybrid. The synth gut inhibits the sliding/snapback of the poly. It often lessons the comfort also. Polys also work extremely well at lower tensions also. I say just go with a full bed of poly.

So can someone please offer an explanation on why in 2018 does anyone feel the need to string up their racquet with Poly main Synth gut cross Hybrid??

 

[jxs653]

Somehow I agree with you. Poly has advanced through the time. But is poly still poly? I also like to see what experienced people in this board have to say about it.

 

[travlerajm]

Often, a synthetic gut cross paired with poly main will wear in a way that the syn gut cross flattens into a ribbon shape rather than forming a dent in a single place, like most poly crosses do. It's the denting behavior of poly crosses -- and the concentrated impulse required to dislodge the main from the dent -- that results in the discomfort and elbow issues that poly is notorious for. Conversely, when the cross wears into a flat ribbon shape, there is much less shock transmitted to the arm.

 

[tegg96]

Often, a synthetic gut cross paired with poly main will wear in a way that the syn gut cross flattens into a ribbon shape rather than forming a dent in a single place, like most poly crosses do. It's the denting behavior of poly crosses -- and the concentrated impulse required to dislodge the main from the dent -- that results in the discomfort and elbow issues that poly is notorious for. Conversely, when the cross wears into a flat ribbon shape, there is much less shock transmitted to the arm.

Ok this example is of well well used string beds, where all sorts of undesirable things happen after prolonged use, regardless of either set up.
But what about the perceived benefits of a fresh poly/synth hybrid?

 

[Protennis2014]

Ok this example is of well well used string beds, where all sorts of undesirable things happen after prolonged use, regardless of either set up.
But what about the perceived benefits of a fresh poly/synth hybrid?

Likewise polys have advanced a lot, to the point that there is no manufacturer that does not have a variety of good Co-poly, so have the so-called Multis, many not nylon (nothing cheap) for example Rexis, Origin, the new Söderling, the Yonex Multi Sensa, the Babolat M7, the Tecnifibre Duramix, Diadem Evolution, and the Solinco Vanquish and others that I forget now, but that will continue. That there are very good that come from nylon, Tecnifibre has a lot to say. I think, that each player has liked to continue making combinations with more or less Topspin, less stiffness, more comfortable, in short, we will continue to do it to our liking and lis pros to them.

Enviado desde mi G8341 mediante Tapatalk

 

[CopolyX]

http://www.tennisindustrymag.com/articles/2015/07/15_nylon_vs_poly.html

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

I believe in 2018 it has been determined that a round poly cross with a silicone coating is the best way to start your stringbed.

Sent from my SM-T560NU using Tapatalk

 

[Addxyz]

I would also like to see if doing 40-45# fb poly vs 45-50 poly/synth or poly/multi comparisons in terms of comfort, etc.

 

[Shroud]

When Poly string originally came out onto the market they were known to be extremely stiff and uncomfortable. But players loved the extra spin and control these plastics wires offered over the most commonly used cheap synthetic gut strings.

So I guess a stringer at the time, say around mid 1990s decided if you cross the poly mains with a cheap synth gut you will get the control and spin of the poly but with a little more power and comfort of the synth gut. So there and then the Poly/Synth Hybrid was born.

Till this day I get customers wanting this setup, none can tell me why they think they should have it, only that that's what they've always used and want to stick with it.

My argument is that todays polys are far far more comfortable than the old stuff. A full bed of soft poly works far better in the spin and control department, whilst maintaining comfort and power, over any poly/synth hybrid. The synth gut inhibits the sliding/snapback of the poly. It often lessons the comfort also. Polys also work extremely well at lower tensions also. I say just go with a full bed of poly.

So can someone please offer an explanation on why in 2018 does anyone feel the need to string up their racquet with Poly main Synth gut cross Hybrid??

Totally agree that that is a pretty useless combo. Unless you are a flat hitter I cant see why anyone would do that to perfectly good poly. Maybe to save money but thats about it.

 

[Shroud]

I would also like to see if doing 40-45# fb poly vs 45-50 poly/synth or poly/multi comparisons in terms of comfort, etc.

IMHO it depends on how you hit. If you are a spinny player the unlocked bed will be more comfy. If you hit flat the hybrid will probably be more comfy.

 

[Addxyz]

IMHO it depends on how you hit. If you are a spinny player the unlocked bed will be more comfy. If you hit flat the hybrid will probably be more comfy.

I will have to try it out in the coming months after my arm is less tender.

 

[Shroud]

I will have to try it out in the coming months after my arm is less tender.

rest up man and dont forget to get the blood flowing if its an elbow issue. Heat or massage or both can speed healing. At least it did for me. And when healed keep doing stretches and massage.

 

[Chadillac]

I use a poly main (51) and soft syn cross (55). Straight poly is too stiff for me.

The crosses simply support the mains, unless you hit side spin. Mixing in a syn cross gives flexibility to what i want. Stiff syns are much different than soft. Can get that perfect elasticity.

Poly usually dies (so ppl say, i use vibrasorb, always dead), the syn seems to break when you were going to restring anyways.

As a stringer i love poly mains and syn cross, poly crosses can burn you. Really nice to get in a tight string tie off hole, otherwise sucks. I strung 1pc black widow, once. Those edgy polys suck *5 on crosses

 

[Chadillac]

A full bed of soft poly works far better in the spin and control department

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/Tourna_Quasi_Gut_Armor_String_16/descpageACUNIQUE-TQGA16.html

This is my favorite soft poly, the problem is a soft string + poly blend breaks faster. This stuff is rubbery like technifibre, so strings eat into each other. Soft + hard at core doesnt work.

Its also rare to find a perfect cross and main when you start shopping around. Quasi was my favorit 1pc, but not nearly as good as a poly/syn hybrid.

 

[tegg96]

Totally agree that that is a pretty useless combo. Unless you are a flat hitter I cant see why anyone would do that to perfectly good poly. Maybe to save money but thats about it.

The thing though this combo remains the default combo for countless rec players that have had this hybrid for years. Stringers still recommend this setup above all.
Is this popular hybrid setup simply a mistake by stringers in the early days of poly. It has now become basically a mythical setup based on an error in string theory and will just not go away from the rec playing public psyche.
Perhaps we need to do some experiments with matched racquets, 1 full poly the other poly/synth and note the perceived benefits of the Hybrid. No one can seem to give me a good an explanation.

 

[Traffic]

The thing though this combo remains the default combo for countless rec players that have had this hybrid for years. Stringers still recommend this setup above all.
Is this popular hybrid setup simply a mistake by stringers in the early days of poly. It has now become basically a mythical setup based on an error in string theory and will just not go away from the rec playing public psyche.
Perhaps we need to do some experiments with matched racquets, 1 full poly the other poly/synth and note the perceived benefits of the Hybrid. No one can seem to give me a good an explanation.

I think a poly/sgut hybrid is still valid. A poly is still a poly in that it still loses tension and elasticity and becomes dead without visible indicators. At most, you may see mains notching significantly.

At least with a poly/sgut, as the poly de-tensions, the stringbed seems to gain power. A dead poly crossed with sgut still provides some comfort of full bed of dead poly. But it's been a while since I've abandoned the hybrid after my son moved on from the hybrid to full poly.

I, on the other hand, have gone the other way. I use multi main and poly cross. I wanted to get a little added spin that the poly cross provides while maintaining most of the performance of the multi. I'm finding this is the far superior setup for me.

Basically, if you need poly, go full poly. But if you shouldn't be playing with poly, then I think a gut or nylon based string in the mains and poly crosses may be a better fit.

Though my doubles partner uses a Pure Drive with poly mains and gut cross. But he hits so differently than I do. It's like he hits with his racquet head vertically oriented on ground strokes rather than horizontal... Oh well, he plays better than I do so who am I to judge.

 

[1HBHfanatic]

Wrist issues linked to all poly strings is my guess,,
a poly is still a poly,, new or old, its stiff..
the syn.gut cross is softening up the blow,,
Poly/syn.gut combo is a great intro for younger players,, once they have the swing and/or arm strength..

to minimize the danger to your wrist, a FB.poly needs to be paired well with the player type, raket and "tension/s"

 

[PBODY99]

@tegg96
Why don't you try the comparison with your favorite string ? Find what works and enjoy.
Gut/ poly & poly gut are used by players at the highest levels. For those of us with smaller games & stringing budgets Nylon /poly or poly/ nylon yields a string bed we can play with.
Just as there are many different frames, string set up vary from Nestor to @Shroud & Dustin Brown.
In the end it is a feel that we are looking for..................

 

[tegg96]

@tegg96

In the end it is a feel that we are looking for..................

So your actual view is poly/synth is better because of "feel". I know what my perspective is, and have tried and tested both
And yes I know there are endless combos that can be used but I'm specifically trying to get some feedback from others as to benefits of this hybrid as it the one asked for and recommended the most.

 

[PBODY99]

So your actual view is poly/synth is better because of "feel". I know what my perspective is, and have tried and tested both
And yes I know there are endless combos that can be used but I'm specifically trying to get some feedback from others as to benefits of this hybrid as it the one asked for and recommended the most.

@tegg96
Players who ask me to install poly crossed either way with anything else; want a softer string bed but do not want an all poly at low tension set up.

 

[tegg96]

@tegg96
Players who ask me to install poly crossed either way with anything else; want a softer string bed but do not want an all poly at low tension set up.

Excellent point. I would say that would be the best reason to do a poly/synth hybrid.
I'm actually a convert to this set up now.

Sonic Pro Edge poly mains crossed with Wilson Synthetic Gut Power at same tensions. In a 95sq racquet 48lbs to a 102sq racquet at 52lbs.
Feel, comfort, pocketing is greatly increased with the synth gut cross. The spin effect and grab of the poly is still evident with mains still snapping back easily to straight across the synth gut crosses.

I prefer this cheap basic synth gut in the cross over natural gut or any multi including the much hyped "poly like" Velocity.

 

[Muppet]

3 reasons:

The texture of the sg crosses slows down the dwell of the ball on the strings, due to more friction at the intersections. More dwell allows a sense of greater control on the shot.

Because there's more inter-string friction, poly/sg robs power from the racquet. This loss of power provides more control and the ability to swing out and still keep the ball in play.

This also allows the use of lower tensions and greater comfort.

 

[Pneumated1]

3 reasons:

The texture of the sg crosses slows down the dwell of the ball on the strings, due to more friction at the intersections. More dwell allows a sense of greater control on the shot.

Because there's more inter-string friction, poly/sg robs power from the racquet. This loss of power provides more control and the ability to swing out and still keep the ball in play.

This also allows the use of lower tensions and greater comfort.

I've played hybrids of different types of strings in various combinations for years, and my experience corroborates this. The best string bed I've ever played was a random hybrid of ALU Power mains/Mantis Comfort Synthetic crosses in a Becker London years ago. The control I got was amazing, and it played better and better for me until I finally broke the crosses. It was confounding based on a lot of what I'd read on this forum.

Since then, I've played often enough with gut/poly hybrids, most recently with Klip Gut 18/Volkl V-Star 18 in my TC95 18x20s. I found this setup to play great when freshly strung--and really throughout if I'm honest--but when the poly went dead and the gut wore a bit, it played a little quick/snappy for my tastes. I will say, though, that V-Star was probably the best poly cross I've used, most likely because its stiffness is more in line with a synthetic gut, so there was more dwell throughout the string life. If I play it again, I'll up the tension.

While I hit with plenty of spin, my strokes are semi-linear and more through the ball than brushy. Therefore, I think there's a point where the gut/poly displacement and snap-back is just irrelevant for my game, almost a detriment. The comfort is exactly what I want, but with not much of a compromise in that dept., I get a lot more control and bite out of a smooth poly main/syn cross hybrid.

 

[n8dawg6]

I'm actually a convert to this set up now.

whoa! a complete 180

 

[Pneumated1]

whoa! a complete 180

Even though I can't explain why, there's something to it.

 

[n8dawg6]

Even though I can't explain why, there's something to it.

pretty simple for me ... the bed feels softer.

 

[Dansan]

Syn gut mains with poly cross has been kind of a sleeper setup I've been using now for months. Gosen OG sheep micro 16 mains with round/slick poly 17g. No one believes me until they try it.

I've used all kinds of full poly stringbeds around 48-51lbs in my frames. I've also tried natural gut/poly hybrids. And I've tried full syn gut, and finally syngut/poly hybrids. After all this, I've settled on the synguy/poly as my preferred setup.

To answer your question (for me):

My issue with full poly: initially it plays well like the first session or two. Sometimes I end up with arm pain, sometimes not. After about two sessions, it starts feeling unpredictable and stiff. More balls into the net, sailing long, loss of feel. If it's a soft poly, it goes to hell even quicker.
Natural Gut/Poly Hybrids: Amazing feel and blend of power/control for about 3 hours. In Florida humidity and heat, the natural gut goes to hell so fast. Once it's done, sailing everything long. Springy, spongy, rocket launcher. Even at high tension I've had this happen. If I had a lot of money to spend and a lot of time to string, I would use this setup...but for me, I can't afford a super expensive stringjob for 3 hours of playability.

Syngut/poly hybrid: My preferred setup, lasts 4 sessions before I start to notice anything has changed. It's stupid cheap. The feel to me is on par with the top tier natural gut/poly hybrids I have tried. More pop and more comfort than full poly. I still get loads of spin with a slipper round poly cross like poly tour fire or red code wax.

 

[Lefty5]

Agree. Useless combo in this day and age of softer co-polys and (stiffer multi's). You might have to dig a bit to find a "real" soft poly (i.e. not RPM Blast) despite what my dumb stringer might say. But that's besides the point. A full bed of a soft poly > than any poly/synth hybrid no matter how much coin you drop.

 

[Pneumated1]

pretty simple for me ... the bed feels softer.

You opened the door there for your classic line, but I digress ...

And gut/poly hybrids are even softer than poly/syn, but I play better with the latter. That's what I was referring to.

 

[n8dawg6]

You opened the door there for your classic line, but I digress ...

And gut/poly hybrids are even softer than poly/syn, but I play better with the latter. That's what I was referring to.

yeah its a dichotomy for me too. i tend to play better w a firmer bed but prefer the feel of ... wait, am i getting into TWSS territory

 

[geubes]

It plays better for doubles and 90% of tennis here is doubles. Touch, volleys and driving the ball flatter/tight to the net is better with this combo. It's also consistent through its life, useful for people that don't restring often or play for weeks at a time. I do prefer full poly for singles baseline blasting, but only play that twice a month, so poly/multi for the 3 times a week doubles is played.

 

[Winners or Errors]

I have been experimenting with textured poly-smooth poly hybrids, but I still think my favorite hybrid is 17g poly mains with 16g Multifeel crosses. The Multifeel retains its playability until it breaks, so the impact of dead poly on my arm is greatly lessened. It is also both longer lived and better feeling than any of the synthetic guts I have tried. It also maintains reasonable levels of spin.

I'm about to order some blue Multifeel. Still thinking about the poly to use as the main in my next hybrid. It will probably be some low powered shaped poly like Cyclone (testing it full bed in my new XTC 305s at the moment), Black Shark, BHS7T, or the like.

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

I have been experimenting with textured poly-smooth poly hybrids, but I still think my favorite hybrid is 17g poly mains with 16g Multifeel crosses. The Multifeel retains its playability until it breaks, so the impact of dead poly on my arm is greatly lessened. It is also both longer lived and better feeling than any of the synthetic guts I have tried. It also maintains reasonable levels of spin.

I'm about to order some blue Multifeel. Still thinking about the poly to use as the main in my next hybrid. It will probably be some low powered shaped poly like Cyclone (testing it full bed in my new XTC 305s at the moment), Black Shark, BHS7T, or the like.

You should reverse this and it would play better.

 

[Winners or Errors]

You should reverse this and it would play better.

But durability would be squat, no, even in 18x19.

 

[Muppet]

I think MF will shred pretty quick with a shaped poly main. The coating on MF is kind of gummy/oily. Pro's Pro Gutex Ultra would be a good choice.

 

[Pneumated1]

I regretfully sold a few racquets recently but got them back when the buyer decided to stick with his old frames. One came back with Genesis Spyder 8 mains/Tier One Ghost Wire crosses. The other frame is full Spyder 8. I don't like the Genesis poly in a full bed, but throw in Ghost Wire crosses and it plays fantastic.

I'm not seeing any drawbacks to these soft, slick poly crosses like Ghost Wire and V-Star in a hybrid with shaped poly mains--at least compared to Gosen and similar synthetics--unless they go the way of all poly at 10-15 hours.

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

But durability would be squat, no, even in 18x19.

Fair enough. Really think a poly/poly hybrid might be better for you.

Yonex poly tour fire 1.25 is magic as a cross. GW 1.22 is solid also but not quite as plush in feel.

 

[Winners or Errors]

Fair enough. Really think a poly/poly hybrid might be better for you.

Yonex poly tour fire 1.25 is magic as a cross. GW 1.22 is solid also but not quite as plush in feel.

I've been thinking about that. Had some Spiky and Cyberblue, and have found it not awful as a setup, though the blue is not as slick as I'd like and Super Smash Spiky is an arm wrecker of a poly. Trying to think through other options. I may go to something like Focus Hex and Cream.

 

[2nd Serve Ace]

I've been thinking about that. Had some Spiky and Cyberblue, and have found it not awful as a setup, though the blue is not as slick as I'd like and Super Smash Spiky is an arm wrecker of a poly. Trying to think through other options. I may go to something like Focus Hex and Cream.

The 2 crosses I mentioned perform better than cream. Never used an MSV string.

 

[FIRETennis]

I've recently tried side by side ALU Power full bed vs. ALU Power Mains / Synthetic Gut Crosses. Yes, there's more plushness, comfort and pop sound in the hybrid, but the spin is incomparable.
After 2h the hybrid string bed locks up and spin falls off a cliff. They are probably playable longer (with less spin) than full bed poly but to be honest I am looking forward to breaking or cutting them out because I play way better with a fresh set of poly.

 

[Thomas O’Malley]

Poly has come a long way, but it’s still softer to use a syngut or multi hybrid with it, especially if you’re using a poly like PHT or regular Alu Power. that said if i was a higher level player and wanted to get the best of both worlds, I’d just pony up the extra bucks to get a more expensive multi or origin in the cross.