Who wins these hypothetical matchups between Young gen vs Fed's gen of players?

BauerAlmeida

Hall of Fame
Medvedev vs Hewitt
Thiem vs Safin
Zverev vs Roddick
Stefanos vs Ferrero
Berrettini vs Nalbandian
Alcaraz vs Davydenko
Sinner vs Gonzalez
Ruud vs Ferrer
FAA
vs Blake
Shapo vs Baghdatis
Kyrgios vs Philippoussis
Rublev
vs Ljubicic

Alcaraz vs Davy is a tricky one, Davy might have the edge for now but eventually, it will be Alcaraz.

Similar case to Sinner vs Gonzalez. But I'm giving the edge to Gonzalez, Sinner never reached that AO 2007 level or when he beat Federer at the TMC. Not sure Sinner will reach that but he might. Anyway, Sinner and Alcaraz are a different generation, one might argue FAA too.
 
H

Herald

Guest
False equivalence? Federer's 2 losses came in 2000 and 2004. Djokovic's 5 losses? 2008-2010.
Focus. Djokovic's losses were before he got into his rhythm or produced a dominant season. Hrbaty actually beat Fed during his first dominant season, so the argument is stronger.
I know you're more than smart enough to see this, so let's call a spade a spade and drop the constant use of the Roddick h2h as if it means anything
 
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ChrisRF

Legend
My estimation at all 4 Slams, in order:

Medvedev vs Hewitt: MHHH
Thiem vs Safin: STSS
Zverev vs Roddick: ZZRR
Stefanos vs Ferrero: TFTF
Berrettini vs Nalbandian: NNBN
Alcaraz vs Davydenko: DDAD (as of now; Alcaraz will become better and would most likely make it AAAA at his future best)
Sinner vs Gonzalez: GSSS (Gonzalez didn't show much besides 2007 AO)
Ruud vs Ferrer: FFxF (x on grass because none of them showed anything there)
FAA vs Blake: BAAB
Shapo vs Baghdatis: Clearly B at AO, but everything else totally random IMO.
Kyrgios vs Philippoussis: PPPP (just on best form, but Kyrgios can of course win a match because both are totally inconsistent)
Rublev vs Ljubicic: RLRR (Ljubicic sucked at the Slams and only had a decent showing at RG)
 

Russeljones

Talk Tennis Guru
My estimation at all 4 Slams, in order:

Medvedev vs Hewitt: MHHH
Thiem vs Safin: STSS
Zverev vs Roddick: ZZRR
Stefanos vs Ferrero: TFTF
Berrettini vs Nalbandian: NNBN
Alcaraz vs Davydenko: DDAD (as of now; Alcaraz will become better and would most likely make it AAAA at his future best)
Sinner vs Gonzalez: GSSS (Gonzalez didn't show much besides 2007 AO)
Ruud vs Ferrer: FFxF (x on grass because none of them showed anything there)
FAA vs Blake: BAAB
Shapo vs Baghdatis: Clearly B at AO, but everything else totally random IMO.
Kyrgios vs Philippoussis: PPPP (just on best form, but Kyrgios can of course win a match because both are totally inconsistent)
Rublev vs Ljubicic: RLRR (Ljubicic sucked at the Slams and only had a decent showing at RG)
I consider the end of 2009 and start of 2010 Davydenko's absolute peak. Depending on how Alcaraz develops, you might very well be proven right. What I think would be an issue for him, the way it was for Nadal, is the manner in which that peak Davydenko robs his opponents of time. Alrcaraz, I reckon, would hate being rushed on his forehand side particularly. Davydenko would alternate angles to further frustrate a player only too conscious of his own athletic superiority and ability to crush the ball. From the entire list, this could very well be the highest quality tennis (hypothetically speaking of course).
 

tudwell

G.O.A.T.
You are seriously overrating the old gen.

The new gen will inevitably end up with more accomplishments and I find them more consistent than the old gen who peaked for just 2-3 years and then completely faded away.

But as of now, old gen > new gen but with time, it could be more even stevens.
Will they? I'm not so sure. At least if we're discussing the older, established Next Gen players – Medvedev, Zverev, Tsitsipas, Berrettini, Rublev, etc. Hell, even throw Thiem in there. They've managed 2 slams so far. How many did Hewitt, Roddick, Safin, Ferrero, etc. manage to accumulate?

The Next Gen could, of course, overtake Fed's gen (minus Federer, of course, which for real parity would require removing the most successful Next Gen player from consideration as well), but it wouldn't be shocking if they didn't. Rublev and Berrettini are never winning a major. Tsits maybe an outside shot at nabbing a Roland Garros title at some point, but that's it. Zverev has all the tools but from day one has mentally bottled it and has shown no signs of ever changing. Wouldn't be the least bit surprising if he never wins a major. Med can consistently challenge for hard court slams but has steep competition there so probably won't win more than 2 or 3 majors total. Thiem seems like he's pretty much done.

Including the Next Next Gen with Alcaraz and Sinner and whoever else changes the calculus, because they're so much younger and also more prodigious at that age than any of the older Next Gens were (except for Zverev, I guess), but that's also including a wide swath of players that's not really comparable to the pretty-close-in-age Fed's Gen being discussed here.
 

AnOctorokForDinner

Talk Tennis Guru
My estimation at all 4 Slams, in order:

Medvedev vs Hewitt: MHHH
Thiem vs Safin: STSS
Zverev vs Roddick: ZZRR
Stefanos vs Ferrero: TFTF
Berrettini vs Nalbandian: NNBN
Alcaraz vs Davydenko: DDAD (as of now; Alcaraz will become better and would most likely make it AAAA at his future best)
Sinner vs Gonzalez: GSSS (Gonzalez didn't show much besides 2007 AO)
Ruud vs Ferrer: FFxF (x on grass because none of them showed anything there)
FAA vs Blake: BAAB
Shapo vs Baghdatis: Clearly B at AO, but everything else totally random IMO.
Kyrgios vs Philippoussis: PPPP (just on best form, but Kyrgios can of course win a match because both are totally inconsistent)
Rublev vs Ljubicic: RLRR (Ljubicic sucked at the Slams and only had a decent showing at RG)

AO F, RG SF, WB QF, USO QF. Peak Gonzalez beats peak Sinner as of now (of course things may change later) in all four slams; only Wimbledon is debatable. (Don't rate the clown five-setter, neither played well at the same time: first Sinner was poor, then Djokovic was really poor, then Sinner was poor again. Gonzalez making 2/3 sets close against a consistently strong Federer in 2005 QF is more impressive.)

2012 Wimbledon Ferrer was actually strong, crushing del Potro and almost going two sets up on Murray, making him infinitely better than anything Ruud has ever shown on the surface. Strange how Ferrer was uniquely good on grass that one time and never again before or after, yet it is clear.

I guess Ferrero>Tsitsipas at Wimbledon that way too, at least JCF has 2007 QF where he took a set off Federer.
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
My estimation at all 4 Slams, in order:

Medvedev vs Hewitt: MHHH
Thiem vs Safin: STSS
Zverev vs Roddick: ZZRR
Stefanos vs Ferrero: TFTF
Berrettini vs Nalbandian: NNBN
Alcaraz vs Davydenko: DDAD (as of now; Alcaraz will become better and would most likely make it AAAA at his future best)
Sinner vs Gonzalez: GSSS (Gonzalez didn't show much besides 2007 AO)
Ruud vs Ferrer: FFxF (x on grass because none of them showed anything there)
FAA vs Blake: BAAB
Shapo vs Baghdatis: Clearly B at AO, but everything else totally random IMO.
Kyrgios vs Philippoussis: PPPP (just on best form, but Kyrgios can of course win a match because both are totally inconsistent)
Rublev vs Ljubicic: RLRR (Ljubicic sucked at the Slams and only had a decent showing at RG)

1. Hewitt over Med at AO as well. Med got lucky with faster AOs. Hewitt's run in AO 05 clearly superior to anything Med has done there. And he actually played a good final. Safin just GOATed.
2. Thiem vs Safin: agree
3. Roddick at AO as well. His AO 03 match vs El Ayanoui blows anything Zverev out of the water. prime level years in AO 04/05/07 (before semi) and 09 also better than Zverev
4. Ferrero has 2 QFs at Wim - 07 and 09. Tpas hasn't got past 3R at Wim so far
5. Berr vs Nalby: agree
6. Alcaraz vs davy: agree
7. Sinner vs Gonzalez: how quickly does one forget!?
a) Gonzo was in red hot form in RG 09. crushed Murray in the QF (incl a bagel) and took Sod to 5 sets (was up a break in the 5th set in fact). Gonzo also took peak ferrero in RG 03 to a 5th set in the QF.
b) current run of Sinner at Wim is similar to Gonzo's in Wim 05
c) Gonzo has 2 QFs at USO (02,09). Sinner as max 4th round
8. Ruud vs Ferrer: Ferrer had a good Wim in 12, straight-setting delpo in 4R and had competitive 4-setter vs Murray
9. Shapo vs Baggy: baggy made SF at Wim in 06 losing to Nadal and epic 5-setter vs djoko in Wim 07. had beaten hewitt in Wim 06 as well. gonna give him the edge.
10. Scud vs Kyrgios: agree
11. Rublev vs Ljubicic: Ljubicic made QF at AO in 06 straight-setting everyone and it took baggy 5-setter to beat him. But no other really good run. So gonna call AO about even.
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
Never thought much about Ferrero, He was solid, but didn't have any big weapons. Would fit right into this era lol.
Stef > Fererro (not by much though)

might want to check some more of peak ferrero. His FH was an absolute weapon and his BH was pretty good as well. He's not a Ferrer.
He easily beats Tsitsipas at RG (00-03), Wim (07,09), USO (03)
 

Third Serve

Talk Tennis Guru
Not so sure tbh I think some of these matchups might be closer than you think.

Medvedev vs Hewitt - Hewitt on natural surfaces, Med on HCs

Thiem vs Safin - yeah Safin is better anywhere off clay. Tim is more consistent but Safin's peak is godly

Zverev vs Roddick - Roddick on grass, Zed on clay, 50/50 on HCs

Stefanos vs Ferrero - Ferrero slightly better on grass and clay, but Steffy is probably better on HCs

Berrettini vs Nalbandian - Berry on grass, Nalby on clay, and 50/50 on HCs (Nalby underachieved in BO5 HCs)

Alcaraz vs Davydenko - I think Carlos is clearly a better player than Davy

Sinner vs Gonzalez - I think Gonzo has the advantage in this case except on grass

Ruud vs Ferrer - Ferrer is clearly superior everywhere

FAA vs Blake - I think Felix has an equally slight edge on each surface

Shapo vs Baghdatis - this one is gonna be a slug-fest

Kyrgios vs Philippoussis - 50/50 although this would be a grudge match for both players

Rublev vs Ljubicic - Rublev slightly better on each surface but not by a lot
You’re giving a lot of credit to the younger guys. Let's split it up by surface for each of them:

Medvedev vs. Hewitt: Hewitt clearly on clay and by a massive margin on grass. I would give Hewitt hard court too, peak for peak, but let's be generous here and hand hards to Med. Even so, that's by a tiny margin and surely not enough to outweigh the massive lead Hewitt has on natural surfaces.

Thiem vs. Safin: Safin unquestionably on hard and even grass. Clay goes to Thiem but Safin wasn't terrible there.

Zverev vs. Roddick: Roddick clearly on grass, Zverev clearly on clay. I actually respect Zverev's peak level on hard as he's come up with some good stuff there but I would still hand it to Roddick here because unlike Zverev, Roddick actually brought that peak level to the hard court Slams. Z probably gets best of 3 hard though.

Stef vs. Ferrero: Ferrero on both grass and clay; peak for peak I would actually take hard court too as I've never been too impressed by Stef on hard courts; his best is reserved for clay, and even there Ferrero was better.

Berrettini vs. Nalbandian: I think Nalby is very overrated but I would still take him over Berrettini here. Berrettini gets the edge on grass and Nalby on clay, neither by significant margins, and hard court I would lean Nalbandian. He did underachieve at the Slams but his underachieving is still better than Berrettini's results. The match with Roddick at the 2003 US Open and the match with Federer at the 2004 AO are still firmly above anything Berrettini has done there IMO. When we bring Bo3 into the conversation it's even more lopsided as we can bring his 2007 indoor swing into the mix.

Alcaraz vs. Davydenko: I have no doubt that Alcaraz will become the better player as time goes on (he's not even really in the Zverev/Med/Tsitsipas gen), but for now I think I'd hand it to Davydenko. Alcaraz possibly gets clay (it's close, Davydenko could definitely play on the surface as his Rome 2007 match with Nadal showed) but Davydenko was firmly better on hard courts peak-to-peak. Grass is basically a wash. Again, Carlos hasn't even hit his peak yet (hopefully) so I expect him to get even better but as it stands Davydenko has shown a higher level of tennis on the whole.

Sinner vs. Gonzalez: I also think Sinner has still yet to peak, but I'd take Gonzalez most places as of now. Except for maybe grass.

FAA vs. Blake: I'd take FAA everywhere except hard courts. I also believe he's still got time to improve.

Shapo vs. Baghdatis: I might actually give this to Baghdatis everywhere lol.

Kyrgios vs. Philippoussis: Scud wasn't really from Fed's gen and he was only there for one Slam final but whatever. I think Scud wins everywhere but by close margins.

Rublev vs. Ljubicic: Both players have been extreme underachievers at the Slams so they don't tell us a whole lot. I think Rublev is better everywhere but hard courts (and especially indoors).
 

tudwell

G.O.A.T.
Medvedev would destroy Hewitt on HC, Danya even destroys a declined Djokovic, but who is still far superior than peak Lleyton and also can serve.
However, I agree with the rest, Fed Gen is better than Next Gen by a lot.
Medvedev would not destroy Hewitt. He doesn't even destroy Djokovic today. I find a potential match-up between them interesting, though – they have somewhat similar flat-hitting, counterpunching games. Both have trouble generating the typical point-ending pace other top guys get on the forehand side (Med's got better top-end power, but it's not like it's the bread and butter of his game) and great backhands that can redirect the ball on a dime. Hewitt with maybe a bit more natural power on the backhand side, or at least he can take the ball early and maintain more aggressive court positioning. I'd say in terms of their regular topspin groundstrokes, they're about even, but then Hewitt has all this other stuff – he's faster, he's got a better return, a way better slice, a way better net game, way better passing shots and lobs if Med himself decides to come to net, etc.

The one thing swinging massively Med's way is the gap on first serve, and that can be a great equalizer, especially on faster courts, but if Med has a not-great serving day, I think Hewitt outrallies Med in play more often than the reverse.
 
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