Why do players sometimes follow through to

Bjorn99

Hall of Fame
the same side as they are hitting from? The reason I am asking is that we will probably receive a lot of silly responses. I will bet that three or four of you know, but there will be a lot of interesting returns, that I can assure you.

AND, if we can't get this. HOW can we possibly expect to understand Federer forehand?????
 

VictorS.

Professional
I know Nadal does this quite often. I think in Nadal's case...it is because he is generating so much topspin...brushing up on the back of the ball.
 

FiveO

Hall of Fame
These topics, i.e. the Fed forehand, the reverse forehand, have been covered in depth by some actual teaching pros over in the Tennis Tips/Instruction forum, if you truly are looking for some insights.

John Yandell, who has done a ton of quality analyses of such topics with the use of video a little superior to that found on youtube.com, and stops by regularly.

Good threads, do a search.
 

Bjorn99

Hall of Fame
Humour me, because John Yandell hasn't satisfied me at all. And as such, he hasn't ran off with my 19.99 a month. You wouldn't be him, plugging your own site would you? Just asking? Because the first gentleman at least tried.
 

Bjorn99

Hall of Fame
No you didn't, he was referred to me by someone who couldn't answer any of my questions, way back. I was bemused to find that Yanell doesn't reveal much and charges you money to get a whiff. All in his rights I suppose.

I can suggest right back to him that he should show a little more than some video to get at peoples wallets. Any idea of how many subscribers he has? I would imagine he has a couple of thousand. Not a bad income for a days work.
 

FiveO

Hall of Fame
Bjorn,

Your threads ask more than they answer. No offense but your "contributions" to the threads you initiated may contain word count but say absolutely nothing aside from some unsupported self-congratulatory references to some mystical secrets, insiders and students you claim as yours and yours alone.

If you are confident in your knowledge and theory, show some courage and put it out there. There are enough savvy people here who will be able to discern whether you are talking out of any orifice other than your mouth.

If this is intended to be some sort of learning through self-exploration technique it is worthless without an identifiable framework.

Come on Bjorn you either are or you aren't, you do or don't. Yandell has at least had the courage to publish his findings in written form, or were you distracted by the images. Your aggressive critique of a "fellow" instructor is also beginning to sound eerily reminiscent of an all too familiar "cultist" following. I hope not.

Come on Bjorn, man up and come out from behind the curtain and show us what you've got, if anything at all.
 

tricky

Hall of Fame
I happily admit that all the stuff about Fed's forehand is from Yandell's site. I just didn't want to misrepresent his work. In any case, it's absolutely worth the fee for that and just a really, really clear breakdown of every aspect of the game. He never teaches you what to think, but how to see.

Bjorn, are you a practitioner of the Oscar Wegner method? Some of your writings kinda makes me think so.
 

Bjorn99

Hall of Fame
Oscar Wegner? No.


Like Federer, probably a lot of trial and error and then you find a wave. AND DIDN'T I just offer one possible reason to why a follow through on the same side? I have never heard ANYONE come up with that one before either. You may say that is a small contribution, but if it wins you three extra points a set...................................

And tricky, I wasn't sounding off on you, or really anybody else either. But I did FINALLY offer something.
 

tricky

Hall of Fame
Could be a combination of things.

1) Most important thing is whether and where you stick the elbow bend. If no (i.e. classical form), then obviously the hand doesn't travel across body and land on left side. You'll swing more out in front because there's less arc.

2) If you strike at above shoulder level, then it's possible that your hand will swing across back to the right side, so that you don't lose your balance. That happens with Nadal a lot.

3) A lot of forward torso rotation is really a product of what's going on with the hand/wrist. If you pronate and snap your wrist, your follow through will pull you until you're almost facing the left fence. Likewise, the stiller you keep that wrist, the more "right-side" your follow through post-contact will be.
 

Bjorn99

Hall of Fame
You know tricky, I think it is more than that. And I have to say, that it allows for a very sharp crosscourt forehand if done way out in front. But it is obviously more than that also.

And question? Why the heck does Gasquet do it ALL the TIME? I think he is making a huge mistake with that personally and is a big reason why his forehand is a weakness in a lot of situations.
 

tricky

Hall of Fame
And I have to say, that it allows for a very sharp crosscourt forehand if done way out in front. But it is obviously more than that also.

Yeah, that's due to the wrist angle. Depending on where you pivot the elbow, your wrist is going to start going forward. If you just go straight-arm, your wrist (and therefore racket) stays farther back pretty much through the stroke. Thus you need to complete more of the swing arc in order to get the racket through the contact zone. This gives you the sick angle you want, though at the cost of pace. In fact, I actually don't think this is necessarily a good thing, because it encourages people to pivot late on the elbow in order to "reach the ball."

What's interesting is that using the straight-arm lets you hit relatively flat shots with the western grip. So, a guy like Nadal can still change shots and hit put-away winners when he wants to.
 

SoBad

G.O.A.T.
Bjorn, when you agreed to coach Vinnie and myself you promised you wouldn't let anybody else in on our Federer forehand trick. You are playing with fire here, you still want those 10% of our future prize money, no? Cause that's a lot of money...
 

David L

Hall of Fame
Bjorn99 said:
the same side as they are hitting from? The reason I am asking is that we will probably receive a lot of silly responses. I will bet that three or four of you know, but there will be a lot of interesting returns, that I can assure you.

AND, if we can't get this. HOW can we possibly expect to understand Federer forehand?????
There are a number of reasons why anyone might play this stroke. All examples below refer to a right handed player.

1. It allows for an unobstructed follow through upwards when trying to generate extreme topsin, so the jarring sensation you would experience if you had to come across the body doing this is avoided. In some instances when generating heavy topsin with an unusually high follow through, going up in front of you as opposed to across you, is more comfortable and provides the potential to create more topsin because of the ability to extend upwards without obstruction.

2. If you are stretched out on the forehand side and are unable or don't want to get your left foot across, à la Sampras running forehand, and instead plant or, on clay, slide your right foot into place in an open stance, the follow through on the same side feels more comfortable than coming across the body.

3. When pressed for time in a similar scenario to the last, the follow through on the same side means less time is taken than with the more traditional follow through where the shoulder or even back might be pointing at the net. With the lasso type forehand, your chest will be facing the net ready for the next ball as soon as you have finished the stroke. Even the set up takes less time because the whole waist/shoulder turn is not required. When really stretched out wide, all of this is very handy when you don't really have the time or space to do all the traditional things. The pace comes from the fact you can really extend you arm both up and in front of you unrestricted by having to come across the torso.

Generally I think the stroke is used more for comfort and convenience, some might say laziness. There are, however, some benefits in the action one can put on the ball, and time saved in preparation and follow through, useful if one is not able to get into an ideal position. It's also mostly done with western type grips, with the eastern it feels more uncomfortable, and is quite handy on clay where a lot of sliding with the right foot on the forehand side is necessary.

As a side note, Sampras was able to hit his running forehand because of his eastern grip, which allowed him to get good extension when pulled wide, even with the traditional left foot lead set up. If he had had any of the western grips, he would not have been able to hit the running forehand the way he did. The lasso type forehand is a comfortable alternative for those who have western based grips. It allows them to get balls on the stretch and still generate some pace and spin, with comfort.
 

rod99

Professional
the simple answer is to get additional topspin. nadal has a western group with extreme topspin but he generates even more spin by having his follow through over his left ear. by doing so you can also bend the ball from the doubles alley into the singles corner. most of the time players use this shot on the run but you need the topspin to control the ball when you're out of position. sampras and gasquet both have this follow through mainly b/c they use eastern groups and they need the follow through for safety and additional spin. women players like sharapova, davenport, and clijsters also use this follow through a lot.
 
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