Would you have let them have it?

[Chingoo1255]

So I went to the courts and checked the reservation sheet; my favorite court was reserved until 7:30 and no one was on it. The reservation didn't have a name on it, just ALTA. since it was 7:40, we hopped on and warmed up. Some time later, a guy came and sat ta the other court and then his friend went to the third court. Our courts are grouped as two courts per cell so the third court is out of the cell I'm on. All the courts are next to trees but the court I was on was the cleanest one so its always the most prized court. The other three had lots of leaves and pine needles. The lighting is also the brightest on that court.

The othe guy eventually comes into my group of courts and those two guys start hitting. Gradually more guys come in. When they had enough people, one guy proceeds to ask us to leave and go to the other courts. I said heck no, in a firm almost demanding voice. He then proceeds to claim that he court is reserved, and I demanded we go look at the sheet. By now it's passed 8, with no reservation for 8. He insisted it was still his court, and now he is joined by his teammates declaring its their court and they were nice for not kicking me off when I got on at 7:40, on a first come first served court.

Well it got tense but I stood my ground and eventually they left for the other courts. I guess I could have been nice and let them have it; I've seen them before practicing those two courts. But when he demanded I get off because they had reservations that expired 30+ min ago and were not on the court when I got on, that was the defining moment.

 

[OrangePower]

Clearly you had the right to keep the court. As far as what I would have done: if they asked nicely, I would move. I've had team practices where we've used 2 or more courts, and it's nicer when the courts are adjacent. So I get it. But, if they are being ***** about it I would stand my ground.

 

[NTRPolice]

The lowest duration for a reservation block that i've seen is 1 hour. I'm going to assume that it's at least an hour or more.

If the court is reserved at 730, then the earliest anyone should be on there is 830. It does not matter if no one is on it at 730. What matters is that the court is available for the designee until that time block lapses. The only exception is if there is some sort of court attendee there to revoke the privileges for a no show. People have tried what you've done in our USTA leagues and were forced off the court. They literally got to the courts at 645am, then hopped on the one empty court that was still open at 705am since some players were late. At around 710-715 they were asked to vacate and refused to leave because we did not occupy that court at 0700. That's not how it works. People have even tried to play on courts reserved by USTA as USTA players, but were not scheduled on that court. Their reasoning was "this court is reserved for USTA, and we ARE USTA." even though we were trying to start our match according to schedule.

So, unless there is a court attendee there to authorize use, you should not be on that court for the entire duration of the reservation if you are not the designee.

EDIT: Critical error made. Reserved UNTIL 730, not FROM 730.

If there is no reservation, then it's first come first serve.

 

[Chingoo1255]

The lowest duration for a reservation block that i've seen is 1 hour. I'm going to assume that it's at least an hour or more.

If the court is reserved at 730, then the earliest anyone should be on there is 830. It does not matter if no one is on it at 730. What matters is that the court is available for the designee until that time block lapses. The only exception is if there is some sort of court attendee there to revoke the privileges for a no show. People have tried what you've done in our USTA leagues and were forced off the court. They literally got to the courts at 645am, then hopped on the one empty court that was still open at 705am since some players were late. At around 710-715 they were asked to vacate and refused to leave because we did not occupy that court at 0700. That's not how it works. People have even tried to play on courts reserved by USTA as USTA players, but were not scheduled on that court. Their reasoning was "this court is reserved for USTA, and we ARE USTA." even though we were trying to start our match according to schedule.

So, unless there is a court attendee there to authorize use, you should not be on that court for the entire duration of the reservation if you are not the designee.

EDIT: Critical error made. Reserved UNTIL 730, not FROM 730.

If there is no reservation, then it's first come first serve.

the blocks are two hours here. The courts were reserved for 5:30-7:30. They didn't show up until after 7:30 claiming it was still their court. Wrong!

Conspiracy theory is they never reserved the court and used the previous reservation as a starting point to bully us off the court. They thought we were fewer and obviously not as good so must not know anything about court reservations, we'll just kick them off to the dirty courts.

 

[Deleted member 23235]

lol i read it as "from 730" the first time, too..

yeah, not sure why it was even an conflict... i'm picturing a bunch of old retirees that are used to "owning the club" - ie. no one around because we're all working , so they are used to getting whatever court they want. unless there was something to gain from reinforcing a positive relationship with them (ie. they are better players (and i have a chance ot hit with them!), they are the keys to the elite tennis clique, their kids are friends with my kids, business parter, etc...), i'd have just shrugged, looked at them like they were crazy, and kept hitting.

 

[Cindysphinx]

Whaaaat? You started playing *after* their reservation expired?

Stand your ground. Before you know it, people like this will run the world. Then when they fail to show for their 8:00 restaurant reservation and the restaurant finally seats you, they will demand that you get up from *their* table.

 

[Gemini]

I don't know why they would think they could just walk up and tell you that it's their court given that there was no reservation for the court after 7:30. You were well within your rights to keep the court.

 

[wsk429]

Now comes the fun part. Do you guys give each other dirty looks when you see each other? LOL

 

[sureshs]

Our club has a 15 minute grace policy after the reserved time begins, and then you lose the court

 

[Chingoo1255]

Now comes the fun part. Do you guys give each other dirty looks when you see each other? LOL

Oh, I can't wait, I see those guys all the time! I ALMOST went to try to smooth it over, but those guys are usually stuck up so I didn't .

lol i read it as "from 730" the first time, too..

yeah, not sure why it was even an conflict... i'm picturing a bunch of old retirees that are used to "owning the club" - ie. no one around because we're all working , so they are used to getting whatever court they want. unless there was something to gain from reinforcing a positive relationship with them (ie. they are better players (and i have a chance ot hit with them!), they are the keys to the elite tennis clique, their kids are friends with my kids, business parter, etc...), i'd have just shrugged, looked at them like they were crazy, and kept hitting.

No, it's their assumption that they play better than I do. Their level is about the same as mine and there's no incentive to hit/play with them. They also are chain smokers so when the wind blows the courts smell like a bar from the 80s

 

[heninfan99]

it's amazing how some leaves and uneven lighting can lead to such things but it does

 

[Chingoo1255]

it's amazing how some leaves and uneven lighting can lead to such things but it does

These courts even have nice brooms hanging off the fences. And the lighting isn't even that bad, just a tiny tad dimmer on outside courts.

 

[heninfan99]

These courts even have nice brooms hanging off the fences. And the lighting isn't even that bad, just a tiny tad dimmer on outside courts.

hahaha. we rec players deserve the best!

 

[kingcheetah]

I would have if they'd been nice, but there's no need to if they're being jerks and not actually entitled to the court.

I too can't stand people that make reservations and then no show. I find that it never happens on indoor courts, when you're paying hourly, but during the outdoor season where courts are free for club members, it happens a ton (front desk person will tell me everything is booked, I go outside and oftentimes 2-3 courts are open)-- the club claimed they were going to start charging people a fee ($5-10) if I remember right, but they've never followed through on it. The best way to counter that would be revoking reservation privileges for a period of time after 2-3 no-shows, basically having the player on "standby" only.

 

[r2473]

The important thing to know is, do you live in a "stand your ground" state?

the blocks are two hours here. The courts were reserved for 5:30-7:30. They didn't show up until after 7:30 claiming it was still their court. Wrong!

Conspiracy theory is they never reserved the court and used the previous reservation as a starting point to bully us off the court. They thought we were fewer and obviously not as good so must not know anything about court reservations, we'll just kick them off to the dirty courts.

They should have told you right away "we have the court reserved from 7:30-9:30, but some of our guys are late. You can hit on it until they get here, but then you'll have to leave. So you might want to grab one of the other courts now in case they get taken".

What you should have done in the circumstances as you describe them, it comes down to what is "normal and customary" for your courts. It sounds like their expectation was that it is their court for the length of their reservation no matter when they show up and can kick off anybody using the court. Is that normal? Is a 15 minute grace window normal?

You don't give us the crucial facts necessary to make a good assessment.

What I'm NOT a fan of are people that say "I'd give it up if they ask nicely, but otherwise no". How they ask has nothing to do with the rules. And people have different versions of "nice". For example, I like straightforward people ("we have the court reserved". Full stop.).

But most people like "softer" approaches ("I'm terribly sorry to bother you, I know you are having fun playing tennis and it breaks my heart to interrupt your play. Trust me, if I there was any other option, I'd gladly do it. But it appears as if you overlooked my name on the reservation sheet for this time. I know, it is easy to do.........................20 minutes later............."so I will have to ever so graciously ask you to honor the rules and my court reservation and allow my friends and I to play on this court").

 

[Tuskarr]

I've never heard of a facility not giving your court away if you are late for your reservation. 15 min and it's going to someone else. Tell them to **** off.

 

[Deleted member 23235]

Oh, I can't wait, I see those guys all the time! I ALMOST went to try to smooth it over, but those guys are usually stuck up so I didn't .



No, it's their assumption that they play better than I do. Their level is about the same as mine and there's no incentive to hit/play with them. They also are chain smokers so when the wind blows the courts smell like a bar from the 80s

ah, i now see where they are coming from.
so in my younger, stupid days, i used to joke that because I played better than someone, i should have the rite to challenge them to a set, and then kick them off, just because I was awesome (i being a 3.5ish, "they" being a 3.0)... clearly these guys have not grown up

 

[kevrol]

I always pull out my phone and reserve the open court if I don't have a reservation to prevent this issue.

 

[Big_Dangerous]

I always pull out my phone and reserve the open court if I don't have a reservation to prevent this issue.

What if the courts have a no cell phone policy?

 

[kingcheetah]

What you should have done in the circumstances as you describe them, it comes down to what is "normal and customary" for your courts. It sounds like their expectation was that it is their court for the length of their reservation no matter when they show up and can kick off anybody using the court. Is that normal? Is a 15 minute grace window normal?

You don't give us the crucial facts necessary to make a good assessment.

What I'm NOT a fan of are people that say "I'd give it up if they ask nicely, but otherwise no". How they ask has nothing to do with the rules. And people have different versions of "nice". For example, I like straightforward people ("we have the court reserved". Full stop.).
).

I don't see how it would make sense for someone to reserve a court and be more than 15 minutes late and hold their right to the reservation-- most places make reservations in half-hour blocks, so missing more than half of a block of time is just preventing others from using the court.

If someone says they have the court reserved, and are on time, the direct "I have this court" is no problem. If they didn't actually have the reservation anymore, but there were other courts open and they wanted to have two adjacent courts and asked nicely ie "We have a team practice and were looking for two courts next to each other-- would you mind moving?" I'd probably help em out.

The worst are the people that show up 20 minutes early and act as if you having a reservation before them is somehow an unfair impediment to them.

 

[Big_Dangerous]

I've never heard of a facility not giving your court away if you are late for your reservation. 15 min and it's going to someone else. Tell them to **** off.

Yeah I'd be a little upset if I spent like 6-10 bucks to reserve a court and because you show up 10-15 minutes late, the reservation is given away.

 

[sureshs]

Yeah I'd be a little upset if I spent like 6-10 bucks to reserve a court and because you show up 10-15 minutes late, the reservation is given away.

In our club, only members can make reservations and we pay a yearly fee, so we don't face this problem. '

Are you saying you have to prepay, and then will lose the whole amount if you are 15 minutes late? Seems like they should give you a refund minus 10% or so.

 

[Tuskarr]

Yeah I'd be a little upset if I spent like 6-10 bucks to reserve a court and because you show up 10-15 minutes late, the reservation is given away.

Show up on time then.

 

[OrangePower]

I too can't stand people that make reservations and then no show. I find that it never happens on indoor courts, when you're paying hourly, but during the outdoor season where courts are free for club members, it happens a ton (front desk person will tell me everything is booked, I go outside and oftentimes 2-3 courts are open)-- the club claimed they were going to start charging people a fee ($5-10) if I remember right, but they've never followed through on it. The best way to counter that would be revoking reservation privileges for a period of time after 2-3 no-shows, basically having the player on "standby" only.

Yeah, this happens at one of the places I play. Reservations are free to make, and can be made a week in advance. So some people habitually make reservations exactly a week ahead as soon as it's possible to do so, without having anything set up yet to play. But then often they don't end up playing and can't be bothered to cancel the reservation. Meanwhile others who are looking for a court can't get reservations and have to risk coming as walk ons.

If I was in charge, I would charge a refundable deposit of say $10 when a reservation is made, which is credited back to the player when they show up (or if they cancel a reasonable period of time in advance). No-shows lose the $10.

 

[OrangePower]

What I'm NOT a fan of are people that say "I'd give it up if they ask nicely, but otherwise no". How they ask has nothing to do with the rules. And people have different versions of "nice". For example, I like straightforward people ("we have the court reserved". Full stop.).

But most people like "softer" approaches ("I'm terribly sorry to bother you, I know you are having fun playing tennis and it breaks my heart to interrupt your play. Trust me, if I there was any other option, I'd gladly do it. But it appears as if you overlooked my name on the reservation sheet for this time. I know, it is easy to do.........................20 minutes later............."so I will have to ever so graciously ask you to honor the rules and my court reservation and allow my friends and I to play on this court").

You're missing the point. There was no valid reservation. So if someone claimed to have one, whether they did this nicely or not, I would not budge.

But if they approach me in a different manner, I would probably be nice and give up the court. Something along the lines of: "We know you got this court first and are entitled to it, but we have a group of 8 and would like to have two adjacent courts if possible. Can we ask you to switch courts with us and take the far court instead? We would really appreciate it!"

 

[Gemini]

You're missing the point. There was no valid reservation. So if someone claimed to have one, whether they did this nicely or not, I would not budge.

But if they approach me in a different manner, I would probably be nice and give up the court. Something along the lines of: "We know you got this court first and are entitled to it, but we have a group of 8 and would like to have two adjacent courts if possible. Can we ask you to switch courts with us and take the far court instead? We would really appreciate it!"

Exactly. The fact is the OP says that he jumped on the court after the reservation has already expired. The original reserved block was from 5:30 to 7:30 and the OP claimed the court at 7:40. It would have been just as easy for the OP to claim that he and his partner reserved the court from 7:30 to 9:30 because his word is just as valid as the guy trying to kick him off the court given there's no written reservation from either party involved in the discussion.

 

[tennis tom]

The problem is the prevalence of unsupervised facilities today. It seems the only clubs that have someone around to control the inmates, are the traditional old clubs--like the ones that require collared shirts. Club owners are too damn cheap to hire someone to manage their business and, members are too timid or stupid to demand some supervision and enforcement of basic rules to maintain some semblance of civility. Front desks are far from the courts, unable to observe the courts and populated by high-school kids who have no knowledge of tennis. Club owners don't know or care about their members, allowing this kind of stuff to prevail. If someone doesn't cancel a reservation they should be fined and their privileges to make reservations suspended--(end of rant).

 

[Robert F]

OP when you looked at the sheet and saw nothing booked for your favorite court from 7:30-9:30, did you write your name in to block the time on that court?
Maybe they saw the sheet was empty when they came too and if didn't put your name down could they have written theirs in while you were hitting? Not necessarily trying to steal the court but more likely to reserve as they came on.

 

[Chingoo1255]

OP when you looked at the sheet and saw nothing booked for your favorite court from 7:30-9:30, did you write your name in to block the time on that court?
Maybe they saw the sheet was empty when they came too and if didn't put your name down could they have written theirs in while you were hitting? Not necessarily trying to steal the court but more likely to reserve as they came on.

The sheet is computer generated and its locked behind a glass case. I honestly think they were just being bullies. I've seen same group send two guys early before main group to "hold" courts by sitting on benches doing nothing. They won't let anyone use until the team shows up either and they aren't using either. Gonna have to check with office to see if that's legal if they keep this bs up. And no, the office is usually closed at 5 so it could just get uglier if I do find out about that rule and try to hold my ground if that happens.

 

[tennis tom]

...the office is usually closed at 5 so it could just get uglier if I do find out about that rule and try to hold my ground if that happens.

Maybe it's time to join one of those hoity-toity old line clubs requiring collared shirts, that are staffed when open.

 

[NTRPolice]

The sheet is computer generated and its locked behind a glass case. I honestly think they were just being bullies. I've seen same group send two guys early before main group to "hold" courts by sitting on benches doing nothing. They won't let anyone use until the team shows up either and they aren't using either. Gonna have to check with office to see if that's legal if they keep this bs up. And no, the office is usually closed at 5 so it could just get uglier if I do find out about that rule and try to hold my ground if that happens.

The part I find strange is that they allow reservations after the "office" is closed. I've never heard of that. If the office closes at 5, and reservation blocks are 2 hours long, I would assume the last time slot that could be reserved would be from 3pm to 5pm, any everything else after that is FCFS. The whole point of having a clubhouse/marshal is to prevent conflicts like these.

Did they try to claim the courts saying they were "ALTA" or did they just more or less claim they had it reserved after "ALTA"?

 

[Gemini]

The part I find strange is that they allow reservations after the "office" is closed. I've never heard of that. If the office closes at 5, and reservation blocks are 2 hours long, I would assume the last time slot that could be reserved would be from 3pm to 5pm, any everything else after that is FCFS. The whole point of having a clubhouse/marshal is to prevent conflicts like these.

Did they try to claim the courts saying they were "ALTA" or did they just more or less claim they had it reserved after "ALTA"?

This sounds like these are apartment community courts where most offices here in Atlanta close at 5 or 5:30pm. At least that's been my experience. The office is the leasing office so policing the courts is not really its primary focus.

Also, if an ALTA team is playing out of a given apartment community, the leasing office should publish a standing reservation for that team each week. I've seen postings at the courts that say something like "Courts 1 and 2 reserved for ALTA practice on <insert a sequence of dates> from <insert time range>. Otherwise, this leads to situations like what the OP experienced.

 

[Chingoo1255]

They claimed they were the Alta team that reserved the courts. But why would a team that reserved a court at 5:30 show up around 8? It's just a bogus claim.

It's s city park and reservations do go up to 9 pm. Most everyone plays by the rules, they just thought I would walk off quietly onto the less desirable courts.

 

[Gemini]

They claimed they were the Alta team that reserved the courts. But why would a team that reserved a court at 5:30 show up around 8? It's just a bogus claim.

It's s city park and reservations do go up to 9 pm. Most everyone plays by the rules, they just thought I would walk off quietly onto the less desirable courts.

Sounds like Tolleson Park when you describe the conditions. But agreed. If they can't prove they have a reservation for that time slot, the courts are fair game.

 

[beernutz]

So I went to the courts and checked the reservation sheet; my favorite court was reserved until 7:30 and no one was on it. The reservation didn't have a name on it, just ALTA. since it was 7:40, we hopped on and warmed up. Some time later, a guy came and sat ta the other court and then his friend went to the third court. Our courts are grouped as two courts per cell so the third court is out of the cell I'm on. All the courts are next to trees but the court I was on was the cleanest one so its always the most prized court. The other three had lots of leaves and pine needles. The lighting is also the brightest on that court.

The othe guy eventually comes into my group of courts and those two guys start hitting. Gradually more guys come in. When they had enough people, one guy proceeds to ask us to leave and go to the other courts. I said heck no, in a firm almost demanding voice. He then proceeds to claim that he court is reserved, and I demanded we go look at the sheet. By now it's passed 8, with no reservation for 8. He insisted it was still his court, and now he is joined by his teammates declaring its their court and they were nice for not kicking me off when I got on at 7:40, on a first come first served court.

Well it got tense but I stood my ground and eventually they left for the other courts. I guess I could have been nice and let them have it; I've seen them before practicing those two courts. But when he demanded I get off because they had reservations that expired 30+ min ago and were not on the court when I got on, that was the defining moment.

Why didn't you reserve the 7:30 to 9:30 slot for that court when you first looked at the reservation book?

Nevermind I read your previous answer to this question.

 

[Deleted member 23235]

Why didn't you reserve the 7:30 to 9:30 slot for that court when you first looked at the reservation book?

Nevermind I read your previous answer to this question.

this comment reminded me that at some clubs, one douchey maneuver that people would do is to "officially" reserve a court when they arrive just to take another court that's already occupied (ie. for various reasons it's a "better" court) - ie. take advantage of the fact that a walkon did not "sign in" to reserve the court.

i'm surprised the guys in the OP did not do that

 

[TennisCJC]

You should have moved to the other court unless your club has specific rules about showing up within a few minutes of reservation time. ALTA teams typically will let 1 court be used until enough players show up to use it. Then, they will ask you to move. You should have moved.

 

[beernutz]

You should have moved to the other court unless your club has specific rules about showing up within a few minutes of reservation time. ALTA teams typically will let 1 court be used until enough players show up to use it. Then, they will ask you to move. You should have moved.

I think you misread the original post. The ALTA reservation was from 5:30 to 7:30 and the OP did not get on the court until 7:40. No reservation had been made for 7:30 and after for the court.

 

[Gemini]

I've never heard of a facility not giving your court away if you are late for your reservation. 15 min and it's going to someone else. Tell them to **** off.

That's just it. The other guys didn't even have a reservation. The last reservation (that was written down) expired 10 minutes before the OP step on the court. These guys were just being a***oles.

 

[tennis tom]

Rules are worthless without someone in authority to enforce them, most clubs today are un-supervised because owners are too cheap to pay for one and members too timid to demand one--or they are in line to break them themselves. In cases like this, it gets unpleasant for everyone and the biggest bully or the biggest posse wins. I was on my reserved court doing a practice, at my private club, and the club swindler walked on and said it was his, because he and his buddy, were "preparing for a tournament". His buddy who knew better, stayed outside and hid in the shadows behind the gate, letting his partner do the dirty-work for the pair. I told him he was in error and pulled out the slip of paper I have in my pocket, with my reservation time and court number on it in case I erred. He backed off fast. I told him, "Nice try, next time reserve a court like I did." This guy makes out like he is the biggest humanitarian at the club--hide your wallet! His "tournament" partner is not much better. Someone not knowing their m.o.'s would have conceded the court and been bullied off. Did I say these two play everyday all day long--and the last time I played the chief perp, he called five shots I hit on the middle of the line out--I just laughed and avoid this magnificent duo at all costs.

 

[NTRPolice]

Rules are worthless without someone in authority to enforce them, most clubs today are un-supervised because owners are too cheap to pay for one and members too timid to demand one--or they are in line to break them themselves. In cases like this, it gets unpleasant for everyone and the biggest bully or the biggest posse wins. I was on my reserved court doing a practice, at my private club, and the club swindler walked on and said it was his, because he and his buddy, were "preparing for a tournament". His buddy who knew better, stayed outside and hid in the shadows behind the gate, letting his partner do the dirty-work for the pair. I told him he was in error and pulled out the slip of paper I have in my pocket, with my reservation time and court number on it in case I erred. He backed off fast. I told him, "Nice try, next time reserve a court like I did." This guy makes out like he is the biggest humanitarian at the club--hide your wallet! His "tournament" partner is not much better. Someone not knowing their m.o.'s would have conceded the court and been bullied off. Did I say these two play everyday all day long--and the last time I played the chief perp, he called five shots I hit on the middle of the line out--I just laughed and avoid this magnificent duo at all costs.

It sounds like this was a municipal court. In some places the general public can reserve courts for fees, whereas some places they can only be reserved by NGO's. You can reserve campsites online here, and sometimes there is drama, but usually a simple talk will make things work out. One time we reserved a camp site (site #2), but traded our site for #1 because a family reserved theirs late and wanted two adjoining sites but were stuck with #1 and #3 instead. No one needed to call the police, which is the only way it could have been mediated if we could not reach an agreement. It can work without "authority" if people can be civil.

 

[TTMR]

the blocks are two hours here. The courts were reserved for 5:30-7:30. They didn't show up until after 7:30 claiming it was still their court. Wrong!

Conspiracy theory is they never reserved the court and used the previous reservation as a starting point to bully us off the court. They thought we were fewer and obviously not as good so must not know anything about court reservations, we'll just kick them off to the dirty courts.

If they were better players, they were entitled to the court, plain and simple. If you believe they were under a misapprehension about your abilities and you were actually evenly skilled, you should have challenged them to play for the court. At the rec level, superior tennis players (ex-college athletes, club professionals, tournament champions) are privy to preferential court privileges given that court quality varies from club to club and certainly from public park to park. Strong players are highly susceptible to injury (due to the speed of the game) if playing on substandard courts. Weaker players that are really just goofing around with balls and racquets are far less harmed by playing on a court with a saggy net, poor lighting, leaves, cracks, divots, weeds, and so on.

 

[beernutz]

If they were better players, they were entitled to the court, plain and simple. If you believe they were under a misapprehension about your abilities and you were actually evenly skilled, you should have challenged them to play for the court. At the rec level, superior tennis players (ex-college athletes, club professionals, tournament champions) are privy to preferential court privileges given that court quality varies from club to club and certainly from public park to park. Strong players are highly susceptible to injury (due to the speed of the game) if playing on substandard courts. Weaker players that are really just goofing around with balls and racquets are far less harmed by playing on a court with a saggy net, poor lighting, leaves, cracks, divots, weeds, and so on.

Take a lesson amateur trolls, this is how a professional troll writes.

 

[Deleted member 23235]

If they were better players, they were entitled to the court, plain and simple. If you believe they were under a misapprehension about your abilities and you were actually evenly skilled, you should have challenged them to play for the court. At the rec level, superior tennis players (ex-college athletes, club professionals, tournament champions) are privy to preferential court privileges given that court quality varies from club to club and certainly from public park to park. Strong players are highly susceptible to injury (due to the speed of the game) if playing on substandard courts. Weaker players that are really just goofing around with balls and racquets are far less harmed by playing on a court with a saggy net, poor lighting, leaves, cracks, divots, weeds, and so on.

lol, a little part of me was nodding my head to this.. but realized i'm not part of your superior list

it did remind me of a conversation i had with someone on the public courts. it had drizzled a bit and a guy was teasing me about coming off the court, after barely a sprinkle. Left saying, "if i moved as well as you do (he didn't) I'd stay on the court too".

 

[tennis tom]

It sounds like this was a municipal court. In some places the general public can reserve courts for fees, whereas some places they can only be reserved by NGO's. You can reserve campsites online here, and sometimes there is drama, but usually a simple talk will make things work out. One time we reserved a camp site (site #2), but traded our site for #1 because a family reserved theirs late and wanted two adjoining sites but were stuck with #1 and #3 instead. No one needed to call the police, which is the only way it could have been mediated if we could not reach an agreement. It can work without "authority" if people can be civil.

It sounds like this was a municipal court.

My incident occurred at a private club, but "unsupervised" meaning there's a high-school kid at the front desk, who pays little attention to the comings and goings, while fixated on texting; this person doesn't play tennis therefore has no feel for the members or the ability to mediate tennis related issues. A real club has full time employees in a position where the can see, hear and monitor play and know the members games and foibles. When there is a dispute they know who usually instigated it from prior experiences. These employees also fill-in for late arrivals and no-shows, it's part of their job. La Jolla Beach and Tennis is a great example of a well managed club.

It can work without "authority" if people can be civil.

That's a nice thought, but without being able to fall-back on authority when necessary to enforce rules they are worthless--the bullies will win, just watch what's going on with "civilization" on the news today.

 

[NTRPolice]

My incident occurred at a private club, but "unsupervised" meaning there's a high-school kid at the front desk, who pays little attention to the comings and goings, while fixated on texting; this person doesn't play tennis therefore has no feel for the members or the ability to mediate tennis related issues. A real club has full time employees in a position where the can see, hear and monitor play and know the members games and foibles. When there is a dispute they know who usually instigated it from prior experiences. These employees also fill-in for late arrivals and no-shows, it's part of their job. La Jolla Beach and Tennis is a great example of a well managed club.

So if you call the clubhouse and issue a complaint regarding reservation of a court, they dont do anything? I've never seen or heard of that. I've called "high school kids" working the club house before regarding golf complaints and they sent out the marshal pretty quickly. Well, it seemed rather fast, but then again our front 9 took us 3 hours which was the crux of the complaint, so it could've taken them an hour to respond by which time I was already blasted off Bud light.

That's a nice thought, but without being able to fall-back on authority when necessary to enforce rules they are worthless--the bullies will win, just watch what's going on with "civilization" on the news today.

I guess so. Everyone knows the only people you can call when there is no intermediate is calling the police. Since no one really wants to call the police over a tennis court or campsite, I guess they can play that angle as part of their intimidation strategy. I've called the police regarding tennis courts, but never over a disagreement over who occupy the court.

 

[tennis tom]

So if you call the clubhouse and issue a complaint regarding reservation of a court, they dont do anything?

My point is that at a supervised, well managed club, these issues don't happen in the first place, because the bullies, cheaters and weirdos are well known to management personnel and have been dealt with previously. They basically have shaped up or been shipped out. At a well managed, supervised club, you can recreate at ease, and unpleasantness rarely raises it ugly head. Members treat each other with due respect and the game of tennis is elevated for it. Unfortunately, at most clubs these days, management is cheap, uncaring of it's members well being, and only concerned with getting their monthly auto-pay dues out of them. Monthly newsletters with greetings to new members and by'es to departing ones have gone by the way side in another cost-saving move--but the obnoxious alcoholics are welcome at the bar because they have big bar tabs, while chasing out other members with their loutish behavior; (end of rant).

 

[GlennK]

Although they couldn't do anything about the lighting (which you said is only slightly different), you could have said that if they clean the other court off, you'll move as a favor to them.

 

[Bluefan75]

this comment reminded me that at some clubs, one douchey maneuver that people would do is to "officially" reserve a court when they arrive just to take another court that's already occupied (ie. for various reasons it's a "better" court) - ie. take advantage of the fact that a walkon did not "sign in" to reserve the court.

i'm surprised the guys in the OP did not do that

Wait, what? I must be dense at the moment. Walk me through that one. So I show up at x o'clock, court 1 is free, so I just go on. At x:01, ********* shows up, wants court 1, so he somehow "reserves" in order to kick me off? How does he even get to reserve the court at that point?

 

[Bluefan75]

My point is that at a supervised, well managed club, these issues don't happen in the first place, because the bullies, cheaters and weirdos are well known to management personnel and have been dealt with previously. They basically have shaped up or been shipped out. At a well managed, supervised club, you can recreate at ease, and unpleasantness rarely raises it ugly head. Members treat each other with due respect and the game of tennis is elevated for it. Unfortunately, at most clubs these days, management is cheap, uncaring of it's members well being, and only concerned with getting their monthly auto-pay dues out of them. Monthly newsletters with greetings to new members and by'es to departing ones have gone by the way side in another cost-saving move--but the obnoxious alcoholics are welcome at the bar because they have big bar tabs, while chasing out other members with their loutish behavior; (end of rant).

Like the golf course owners who are so afraid of upsetting the slow group they tolerate them, and have no regard for the fact many of the 20 groups being held up by these guys just won't play there anymore.