jm1980
Talk Tennis Guru
It's not inaccurate to say Zverev was points away from a 2-0 lead
The truth about the Rafa-McDonald match
- Thread starter Kralingen
- Start date
Rafa4LifeEver
G.O.A.T.
It is inaccurate when the fact is that he lost set1 & it was about to get into yet another TB in set2.
If anything, he was points away from a 0-2 deficit rather than a 2-0 lead.
jm1980
Talk Tennis Guru
Well yes but he was also up 6-2 in the first set TB
Dominic & Andrey
Legend
Amen to Kralingen
Rafa4LifeEver
G.O.A.T.
Did he win that set?
jm1980
Talk Tennis Guru
He was one point away from winning the first set and two points away from winning the second
alexio
G.O.A.T.
in terms of pure closeness (since we talking only about that/forgetting for a sec about who won it or not finally) zebrev was closer..6-2 at tb is like 85/15, at the start of tb 2 its like 70/30 in nadal favor, but taking also into account moment of 5-3 30-30 then its becoming kinda 60/40 in favor of nadal in second set, overall 85+40>60+15=125>75 zebrev wins (closeness)
I have my own set of eyes! The upper body of Fed/Djok got a lot slimmer.
Nadal went in the other direction, he got a lot bigger!
Mivic
Hall of Fame
Well even you seem to agree that McDonald appeared to be playing out of his skin at times yesterday, even if a half decent Nadal would have won fairly comprehensively? I think the point is more that all of the good work that McDonald seemed to be doing was more a function of the looks that Nadal was giving him with his trade/rally ball than it was Mackie raising his level above his norm in any meaningful way ceteris paribus, which I agree with. We've seen too many players over the years benefit more than we'd typically expect from ballstriker-friendly conditions against certain versions of Nadal given the level discrepancy to believe that it's coincidence at this point. It doesn't make sense when fans complain about these guys showing up against Nadal and Nadal only when it's obviously a direct result of what Rafa is doing on the other side of the court. Nadal was playing the conditions all wrong yesterday and against Draper too, which gives guys like McDonald chances if they're willing to play proactively, even if they don't particularly have any real firepower or weaponry to speak of.
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MeatTornado
Talk Tennis Guru
Apparently my sarcasm wasn't quite thick enough.
Of course it was a function of Nadal not being at his best. I was just making fun of him for feeling the need to point that out when all I did was give Mac a compliment about his forehand last night. Everyone who watched the match knows Nadal was not playing up to his standards.
Mivic
Hall of Fame
Fair enough. I still found it a bit strange that certain posters seemed so taken aback by McDonald's level in the match thread yesterday. If you're offering up the kind of rally balls that Nadal was in the first two sets then you can expect to be punished, even against a guy like McDonald. I don't think Mackie's level was anything out of the ordinary for his standards at all.
AnOctorokForDinner
Talk Tennis Guru
That's the questionable part. Would you really expect an ATP journeyman to have the gall to aggressively punish Pushdal? You know, beak 3 aura and the general mediocrity of modern tennis. Squaremac actually ballsing up to do it was a pleasantly surprising occurrence.
MeatTornado
Talk Tennis Guru
Real talk though, we've seen the Big 3 have terrible days or be injured and the opponent still can't keep the ball in play. Sometimes a Nadal playing poorly gets in their head and makes them even more nervous if they think they should be winning, and then they suddenly start dumping every other forehand into the net.
I was impressed that Mackie kept a steady level like it was any other match. Didn't have any real letdowns in momentum, didn't let the MTO get to him or anything like that. It's all easier said than done. Especially on a show court with everyone watching.
Mivic
Hall of Fame
I think this was just a really bad version of Nadal, maybe as bad as I've ever seen him in a HC major, so I don't think it's fair to compare McDonald's exploits to previous Nadal opponents who have fallen short in the past. Conditions were ideal for Mackie as well. I expected Nadal to win in a tough four setter prior to the match based on the Draper performance, which is quite possibly how things would have played out without the injury tbf.
Mivic
Hall of Fame
Nadal quite literally couldn't move yesterday though. It wasn't like the Fritz match at Wimbledon last year where Nadal was actually striking the ball as crisply as he had been all tournament from the baseline at times post-injury even if his serve (and movement partially) was compromised. It says a lot about the state of the tour when we expect solid pros like McDonald to fold against a Nadal that is quite literally playing on one leg. Plenty of guys have taken it to Nadal for a set and a half anyway, McDonald took care of the 'easy' part in good fashion. It wasn't too surprising to me that McDonald was able to build a lead and punish Nadal considering the level he was bringing (like I said this is maybe the worst I've ever seen Nadal in a HC major) and there's no telling how he would have faired against a healthy Nadal at crunch time in the second set (which is when the choking typically happens) anyway. We could have quite easily been looking at a tough four set victory in Nadal's favour under those circumstances. So yeah, McDonald's level didn't really surprise me and Rafa's injury was bad enough that it would have been one of the worst chokes I've seen if Mackie hadn't closed it out. So pretty much par for the course imo.
I think Fed fans in particular are so jaded from seeing Nadal come out on top in matches he has no business winning that they fail to see certain situations for what they are in objective terms. The guy is playing as badly as I've ever seen him. Just because he's been able to win ugly in the past doesn't mean we should expect him to retain the ability to do so in the future if his level of play continues to decline at it's current rate, especially not if he's being severely hobbled by injuries.
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ghostofMecir
Legend
It really wasn’t—most of it was in reaction to hundreds of threads about “Weak Era” and the head to head.
AgassiSuperSlam11
Professional
Reported by a Rafan since I dare to say Nadal should've thought about retirement last year. Perhaps it's one of the three Rafans I put on ignore. No profanities or Obscenities used but still reported.
AgassiSuperSlam11,
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AgassiSuperSlam11
Professional
I think when he went to WImbledon and barely finished against Taylor Fritz and gave Kyrgios a walkover it was a bad sign. The Nadal-Djokovic Wimbledon Final should've happened but didn't due to injury. Nadal is now 1-6 since the USO and he is going on 37. Rosewall won his last Major at 37 years and 2 months. I can be proven wrong, but I see too many degenerative issues to see a major change in the European clay season.
Don Felder
Semi-Pro
Nadal made a balls-to-the-wall push to win those slams last year, including numbing his foot etc. Once that ab popped at Wimbledon, that was it. He’s pushing 37. He sacrificed everything to get those two slams.
Omega_7000
Legend
If you are buying the abdominal tear story I've got a bridge to sell you.
Rafa4LifeEver
G.O.A.T.
Did he win though?
DIMI_D
Hall of Fame
Murray is horrible I would hate to be a fan of his.. Plus the attitude on the guy is so poor always mouthing off after every shot whether it’s the opposition just playing better just patheticAll said about Murray. Now who's laughing - I know it's only Berro, but it's no fluke a cripple is in into the second round of a Slam.
You can't write off Nadal or Even Murray, it's daft - Sorry !
BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
It's like arguing with a piece of broccoli at this point. Let them try to spin it anyway they wish. Zedraffe lost the FO match to Nadal in 2022 and he sure as he'll isn't doing anything big in 2023.
Maybe in their bizarro world Zedrot has won 32 slams, the world just hasn't found out about it.
ChrisJR3264
Hall of Fame
I questioned some of his “treatments” to recover and received a similar message from TW. Like what?
Sampras-Bruguera 1993
Legend
Well it does show its probably time to start to wind things down for Nadal. The injuries are now becoming commonplace. Not a once off thing once in a while. Its one thing to get upset by Kyrgios, Rosol or whatever on grass as grass is known for upsets, but when you start losing to the likes of Mcdonald at the AO on a slow, high bouncing hards , its probably time to wind your career down. Nadal's time is probably up.. Lets be honest here. He's going to be 37 and hes getting injured every time he hits the court now.
He isn't going to come back from this at his age. Hes not in his 20s or even early 30s any longer. I bet he loses in the 3rd or 4th round of the French as well. If not sooner. Its amazing Nadal even made it to the year 2023, much less win 2 slams in 2022.
He isn't going to come back from this at his age. Hes not in his 20s or even early 30s any longer. I bet he loses in the 3rd or 4th round of the French as well. If not sooner. Its amazing Nadal even made it to the year 2023, much less win 2 slams in 2022.
AgassiSuperSlam11
Professional
After what a poster said to me during a heated Martina-Graf discussion (I never reported) these infractions appear quite trivial. The only remote possibility is talking about age is inappropriate. There are some ultra-sensitive Nadal fans who have come after me over some silly things. I have no doubt that this was one of the three Rafans I put on ignore. When I say positive things about the man there is no issue yet when I say anything as perceived as critical, I get called out or reported. Yet, some ********* still think I am a Rafan troll.
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Azure
G.O.A.T.
Federer won wimbly 2019
Razer
Legend
Nadal is finished outside clay but he has like 2 clay seasons ahead, maybe even 3, he probably can take a major on clay, his rise started with clay in 05, his end will also happen on clay, thats the cycle of life. Like Roger, he began winning big on grass, his end happened on grass.
DSH
Talk Tennis Guru
Do you forget that before that Nadal had four set points and one of them with the second serve of the lanky German player?
alexio
G.O.A.T.
ur post proving that jm won that debate (who was closer) over our gentleman, which was also backed up by his changing rails to ..did he win it, coz since 2-0 or 0-2 been mentioned it becomes irrelevant who won it eventually, in other words it shouldnt have been mentioned at all after that
Azure
G.O.A.T.
I am not good at trolling. I need to spend more time here and develop a thicker skin in the process. Give me time
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