SweatyGrip
New User
here's some ball machine footage of yours truly, obviously I slow down at times to catch my breathe and recover a bit
now since i cant afford a coach pls help me wisemen of the forums
I'll stick to one hand lolLooks like you have good tennis in your future if you don't break an ankle on a ball. Clear all balls always. I have seen a serious injury from stepping on a ball.
I would consider lowering the feed rate ...
I saw those two 2hbhs ... not as easy is it looks is it?
I'll stick to one hand lol
I would have to disagree with some people in this thread that your BH is all arm and your FH is good.
From my observation its your FH that its mostly arm, mostly all the time.
Your BH is also alot of arm a good amount of times, but a good amount of times you also show some decent coiling and using of ur body.
As you can see, in alot of backhands you do coil somewhat and use some of ur body, so its not mostly arm, but you could coil ALOT more, turn your back to ur opponent almost completely, but I think its a solid foundation to build on. You at least have some clue that you need to do it, even if you do it ineffectively mostly, tho sometimes you do forget to do it almost completely.
Now look at the contact point in your forehand, you basically hit the ball already and look at where your hips are, look at where your upper body is turned, its basically all arm 95% of the time on your FH side, my whole arm hurts everytime you swing the FH.
Here your hips are still way back, ur upper body and shoulders is a bit better tho, but you seem to jump for some reason sometimes almost just for the sake of jumping because you see it on tv it feels? Pro players don't jump, they push off the ground to start the chain that goes to the hips and upper body and contact point to hit the ball, and the force itself propels them in the air, they are not trying to jump actually.
Just some small observations so maybe you take something from it.
Some additional tips:
1.Watch a ton of youtube videos explaining the techniques and strokes, observe what the pro coaches are saying, watch a lot of tennis and observe what pro players are doing, read articles about it, you will learn a ton of stuff, and start to understand the mechanics how the strokes work and why, only by understanding how and why will you be able to really be aware of what you need to do, to start doing it the right way and programming ur body to do it on autopilot.
2.FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MOVE THE BALLS AWAY, I was almost cringing everytime you almost stepped on the ball
3.You have good potential, you are young, you seem very in shape (do any other sports, fitness?) with a ton of energy, now you just have to love the game and strive to improve every day and put ur effort into it, and you will be an awesome player one day!
I would have to disagree with some people in this thread that your BH is all arm and your FH is good.
From my observation its your FH that its mostly arm, mostly all the time.
Your BH is also alot of arm a good amount of times, but a good amount of times you also show some decent coiling and using of ur body.
As you can see, in alot of backhands you do coil somewhat and use some of ur body, so its not mostly arm, but you could coil ALOT more, turn your back to ur opponent almost completely, but I think its a solid foundation to build on. You at least have some clue that you need to do it, even if you do it ineffectively mostly, tho sometimes you do forget to do it almost completely.
Now look at the contact point in your forehand, you basically hit the ball already and look at where your hips are, look at where your upper body is turned, its basically all arm 95% of the time on your FH side, my whole arm hurts everytime you swing the FH.
Here your hips are still way back, ur upper body and shoulders is a bit better tho, but you seem to jump for some reason sometimes almost just for the sake of jumping because you see it on tv it feels? Pro players don't jump, they push off the ground to start the chain that goes to the hips and upper body and contact point to hit the ball, and the force itself propels them in the air, they are not trying to jump actually.
Just some small observations so maybe you take something from it.
Some additional tips:
1.Watch a ton of youtube videos explaining the techniques and strokes, observe what the pro coaches are saying, watch a lot of tennis and observe what pro players are doing, read articles about it, you will learn a ton of stuff, and start to understand the mechanics how the strokes work and why, only by understanding how and why will you be able to really be aware of what you need to do, to start doing it the right way and programming ur body to do it on autopilot.
2.FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MOVE THE BALLS AWAY, I was almost cringing everytime you almost stepped on the ball
3.You have good potential, you are young, you seem very in shape (do any other sports, fitness?) with a ton of energy, now you just have to love the game and strive to improve every day and put ur effort into it, and you will be an awesome player one day!
Good job on going through the coiling/uncoiling. I thought about it but it seemed the "jumping" and "falling back" thing "jumped out". That and using the balls as a cone footwork drill. We need Sweaty to live to make another video... I think he can be really good.
I liked his balance and weight transfer on his FHs when he hit off the back leg than many of his BHs. Weight transfer might not be the best term, because I'm not just referring to just transferring onto a front leg (bh). With many of his FHs off back foot, he loads on back leg/foot and passes that into the shot without the loss from falling back you see on too many BHs. So some elements are better about his bh (coil) ... but some are better with his FH. Regardless ... given what he is already doing ... seems like coiling better and removing the balls could payoff quickly.
@SweatyGrip ... I'm in ... I want to subscribe to the video series.
Regarding the racket drop motion before the start of the forward swing on the backhand drive - It looks as if the racket, hand and arm are mainly being rotated down by the back arm -
See racket high point in take back and drop before the forward swing. Backhand starts around second 56, racket drop 1:07.
Gasquet, see similar racket drop on several drives.
To examine single frame 1) click "Vimeo", 2) Hold down SHIFT KEY & use ARROW KEYS.
Lopez, see similar racket drop. Starts at second 7. But Lopez's stroke is different on the forward motion. See post #98.
I don't know the function of the racket drop motion of the one hand backhand drive. Is it to position the racket for the incoming ball height? Or, to rotate hand to cause internal shoulder rotation and/or pronation and prestretch ESR and supination muscles. Both functions? Other?
In a Tennis Chanel Academy show, Justine Henin demos this racket drop slowly. I would say that her slow demo does not portray the racket drop very accurately in comparison to the high speed video. Also, she demos ESR and/or supination after impact perhaps indicating pre-stretching was used. ?
What does the racket drop do?
This post from another thread shows a comparison and analysis of poster Mojo28's one hand backhand drive and Gasquet's from the start of the forward racket motion. Note the chest and upper arm of the high level backhand.
[ Note for new readers - It is necessary for this analysis to understand the defined joint motions of internal shoulder rotation (ISR) and external shoulder rotation (ESR). The upper arm between the shoulder joint and elbow does not go anywhere, it just spins like a top around the upper arm's center line.]
Pictures of each frame of Mojo's video. The time scales are in milliseconds with "0" milliseconds being impact. -267 milliseconds is about 1/4 second before impact.
I point out differences between better high level strokes and the poster's strokes. A poster can select a high level stroke and copy it or use some other stroke model. Or, go with instruction or on their own without a model or instruction.
Mojo's ball is lower than Gasquet's. Compare similar ball heights for better analysis.
Frame at -267 ms. It looks as if at 267 milliseconds before impact the OP has turned his shoulders back to about the same angle as Gasquet has. Compare also shoulder turn angles at impact, at Frame -0 ms. The positions of the arms and rackets are different. Gasquet's racket has not come down and is still in front of his body. Is Mojo copying some other backhand stroke? Mojo has also done pronation to bring the racket down. Impression is that Mojo is doing his own thing. ? (To see angles more accurately, the cameras for both backhands need to view the players and courts from the same angle. Wear tight fitting clothes or a short sleeve shirt to better see the upper arm, elbow angle, etc.)
Frame at -233 ms. Mojo has brought his racket farther down. Gasquet's racket has gone up slightly. Mojo's elbow looks bent more and his upper arm (between the shoulder and elbow) has more downward rotation (ISR). Compare ISR angle to ISR angle as these frames progress.
Frame at -200 ms. Mojo's racket is still lowering and low. Gasquet's is just starting to lower.
Frame at -167 ms. Mojo's upper arm is down from the shoulder joint. Gasquet's upper arm is more across the chest.
Frame at -133 ms. Mojo's racket still lowering. Gasquet's now lowering with more rapid drop.
Frame at -100 ms. Mojo's upper arm is down at the chest. Gasquet's upper arm is more across the chest. Gasquet now appears to have started more upper body turn. I believe that to produce this early arm and racket acceleration that Gasquet is pressing hard on his upper arm with his chest powered by the forces of turning his upper body. If a credit card were between his chest and upper arm, would it be pressed tightly? How much upper arm pressing Mojo is doing this is not clear (due to the obscuring shirt and arm angle). But his upper body does not appear to be turning as rapidly.
Frame at -67 ms. The racket head speed developed by any rotation depends on the location of the axis of rotation and the distance out from that rotation axis. Look at the arm and racket angle and the distance out from the location of the rotation axis (guessed for now). It looks as if Mojo's arm angle is not favorable for racket head speed. Also, Mojo's racket is already much more rotated toward the ball trajectory. Gasquet's racket is >180° back from the ball's trajectory. Gasquet's upper arm is pressed to his chest as discussed.
Frame at -33 ms. Look at the racket to ball trajectory angle for Mojo, 45°? Look at the racket to trajectory angle for Gasquet still >180°. The total turns of Mojo's and Gasquet's upper bodies from Frame -267 ms seem somewhat similar, similar average speeds. The upper arm and racket have been used differently. Another motion - now look at the elbow bones and estimate the angular position of internal shoulder rotation, or axial rotation of the upper arm in the shoulder joint. Compare ESR from -33 ms to -0 ms.
Frame at -0 ms closest to impact. The big differences from Frame -33 ms to Frame -0 ms are the angular movement of Gasquet's racket and the much larger movement of his hand in the forward direction in comparison to Mojo. Also, Mojo's racket is open and Gasquet's is closed at impact. Possibly the ball height was a factor in how closed the racket was.? Now look at Gasquet's elbow bones and compare them to Frame -33 ms. Gasquet has done rapid external shoulder rotation (ESR) from Frame -33 ms to Frame -0 ms. That has moved the racket up and added to the topspin that the upward hand path already would have produce without ESR. Because Gasquet brought down his racket earlier with a near straight arm, it caused rapid ISR and pre-stretched his ESR muscles, he is using those stretched muscles in this frame. (Search the Stretch Shorten Cycle).
Frame at +33ms after impact. Mojo's hand and racket go more forward. Gasquet's goes more forward and up. ESR has continued.
Frame at +67 ms. Comparison of the follow throughs.
Video.
Last edited: Mar 5, 2017"
Gentle feedback
here's some ball machine footage of yours truly, obviously I slow down at times to catch my breathe and recover a bit
now since i cant afford a coach pls help me wisemen of the forums
OP asked for GENTLE feedback. He didn’t ask for candid feedback. If he wants candid feedback, then yes, both forehand and backhand need a lot of work.I would have to disagree with some people in this thread that your BH is all arm and your FH is good.
From my observation its your FH that its mostly arm, mostly all the time.
Your BH is also alot of arm a good amount of times, but a good amount of times you also show some decent coiling and using of ur body.
As you can see, in alot of backhands you do coil somewhat and use some of ur body, so its not mostly arm, but you could coil ALOT more, turn your back to ur opponent almost completely, but I think its a solid foundation to build on. You at least have some clue that you need to do it, even if you do it ineffectively mostly, tho sometimes you do forget to do it almost completely.
Now look at the contact point in your forehand, you basically hit the ball already and look at where your hips are, look at where your upper body is turned, its basically all arm 95% of the time on your FH side, my whole arm hurts everytime you swing the FH.
Here your hips are still way back, ur upper body and shoulders is a bit better tho, but you seem to jump for some reason sometimes almost just for the sake of jumping because you see it on tv it feels? Pro players don't jump, they push off the ground to start the chain that goes to the hips and upper body and contact point to hit the ball, and the force itself propels them in the air, they are not trying to jump actually.
Just some small observations so maybe you take something from it.
Some additional tips:
1.Watch a ton of youtube videos explaining the techniques and strokes, observe what the pro coaches are saying, watch a lot of tennis and observe what pro players are doing, read articles about it, you will learn a ton of stuff, and start to understand the mechanics how the strokes work and why, only by understanding how and why will you be able to really be aware of what you need to do, to start doing it the right way and programming ur body to do it on autopilot.
2.FOR THE LOVE OF GOD MOVE THE BALLS AWAY, I was almost cringing everytime you almost stepped on the ball
3.You have good potential, you are young, you seem very in shape (do any other sports, fitness?) with a ton of energy, now you just have to love the game and strive to improve every day and put ur effort into it, and you will be an awesome player one day!
here's some ball machine footage of yours truly, obviously I slow down at times to catch my breathe and recover a bit
now since i cant afford a coach pls help me wisemen of the forums
Top things I'd probably work on, if i were you:
* shaping the ball with more topspin (especially on bh)... practice hitting balls below the net
* weight move forward on every shot + extend out to target - on a ball machine, your technique should be perfect (ie. you know where the ball is gonna be)
interesting, but why?Oh dear. The instructor should be put away for life for ruining this kid!
interesting, but why?
interesting, but why?
i thought the kid was hitting solidly... what's the instructor doing that's so bad?
Probably because he is using modern technique, he should be using the technique that players used in 1970s.
Sigh..
here i was taking you seriously... SMHCompare Chris Evert's shots and it should become obvious:
Watch:
i here i was taking you seriously... SMH
Why are people so scared to post footage of themselves on Tennis Tips??? It's not that bad! It's not like your thread will turn south!
12 seconds in I rate @SweatyGrip as most likely to suffer a career ending ankle injury.Looks like you have good tennis in your future if you don't break an ankle on a ball. Clear all balls always. I have seen a serious injury from stepping on a ball.
I would consider lowering the feed rate ...
I saw those two 2hbhs ... not as easy is it looks is it?
Good start. i agree, watch out for the balls on the floor. you can roll your ankle with them.
here's some ball machine footage of yours truly, obviously I slow down at times to catch my breathe and recover a bit
now since i cant afford a coach pls help me wisemen of the forums
Why are people so scared to post footage of themselves on Tennis Tips??? It's not that bad! It's not like your thread will turn south!
Because nobody here actually plays tennis. They just talk about it.
Maybe. Roll a d20 for a perception check and pass the Geritol.Wait so you're telling me this forum is just full of roleplayers and boomers that call everyone a beginner???
Your strokes are pretty good, just try to work a little more on the footwork, shorter steps and better anticipation so you can place yourself behind the ball and then transfer energy forward, you know, kind of step-in and not step-out like in the video. And in the one hander, try to lower your body more so you can start to swing more low to high more naturally, so you can add more top spin and "open" the strike zone on your backhand side, but again, pretty nice shots