New Wilson Baiardo

Rabbit · Nov 5, 2019

@brownbearfalling, I hear you. I'd bet, even considering @Wikky 's post that the bases on the L will hold up to everyday use. That said, I had a base fail on my Mighty Sensor. It is great to know that you can upgrade those bases to gravity clamp bases though. I wonder if the cost is prohibitive.

Irvin · Nov 5, 2019

Wikky said:
I've traveled with the L several times now. I can tell you that I can get it set up by myself in under 5 minutes. I don't think the clamp bases stand up to the star 5. But again you can upgrade to the original gravity clamp bases if you prefer.

I’m not sure I’d want to upgrade to the gravity release bases. That was one of Tennis Industry’s cons on the Baiardo machine.

Tennis Industry Baiardo review (http://www.tennisindustrymag.com/articles/2009/09/16_wilson_baiardo.html)

…The auto clamp base release can be a little awkward when preparing to make the first pull on a racquet. If you don’t maintain a small amount of tension on the string by hand, the clamp can fall and release the base. Also, during stringing, we found that if you don’t align the clamp just right when clamping the string, it doesn’t want to fall when you open the clamp. This means you have to pull the clamp down by hand. But, if you pull the clamp down by hand with the base still locked, the clamp’s diamond dust can scratch the surface of the string. This is why we were happy to see the button that allows you to manually release the clamp base. By manually releasing the clamp base first when the clamp does not drop on its own, you can move the clamp so that the diamond dust won’t scratch the string…

Rabbit · Nov 5, 2019

Irvin said:
I’m not sure I’d want to upgrade to the gravity release bases. That was one of Tennis Industry’s cons on the Baiardo machine.

Tennis Industry Baiardo review (http://www.tennisindustrymag.com/articles/2009/09/16_wilson_baiardo.html)

…The auto clamp base release can be a little awkward when preparing to make the first pull on a racquet. If you don’t maintain a small amount of tension on the string by hand, the clamp can fall and release the base. Also, during stringing, we found that if you don’t align the clamp just right when clamping the string, it doesn’t want to fall when you open the clamp. This means you have to pull the clamp down by hand. But, if you pull the clamp down by hand with the base still locked, the clamp’s diamond dust can scratch the surface of the string. This is why we were happy to see the button that allows you to manually release the clamp base. By manually releasing the clamp base first when the clamp does not drop on its own, you can move the clamp so that the diamond dust won’t scratch the string…

Clearly, whoever wrote this didn't know what they were doing. The easy solution is to have tension pulled on the string before setting a clamp. This can be done in any number of ways, here are 2.

1. The Yusuki method. Pull both center mains at the same time. Use a starting clamp outside the frame to hold tension nearest the tension head and then use a fixed clamp at the other end. Once both clamps are set, release the tensioner.

2. Put a starting clamp on one of the first two mains outside the frame. Pull tension on the other main. Set a machine clamp on the main that has the starting clamp. Release tension.

In both these instances, the effect of gravity is defeated. And, shock upon shock, the fixed clamp is set with tension on it. This also has the benefit of reducing the amount of tension the clamp has to resist when the un-tensioned main is pulled. This has been discussed many times on the boards and really has become nothing more than a pointless claim made by those who don't understand gravity release clamps.

The writer of the article does mention that if the clamp is opened but does not fall, the remedy is to unlock the clamp base and voila! the clamp falls.

BTW, gravity release clamps are great ideas on lockout machines too.

It ain't rocket science.

kkm · Nov 5, 2019

Irvin said:
@brownbearfalling Why don’t you buy one and give us a review. Or wait until the USRSA comes out wi5h a review.

The USRSA doesn’t even have an office anymore. All they have is a box at a UPS Store.

Wikky · Nov 6, 2019

kkm said:
The USRSA doesn’t even have an office anymore. All they have is a box at a UPS Store.

I'm gonna check with Dave Bone on that one when I see him in a month haha.

I'll be doing ITAs with the L in February. Maybe I'll do a live stream and we'll see how it holds up. Dollar for dollar I have a lot of faith in it compared to any machine in the industry.

Nostradamus · Nov 6, 2019

afeller said:
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does it have good pre-stretch function ?

kkm · Nov 6, 2019

Wikky said:
I'm gonna check with Dave Bone on that one when I see him in a month haha.

I'll be doing ITAs with the L in February. Maybe I'll do a live stream and we'll see how it holds up. Dollar for dollar I have a lot of faith in it compared to any machine in the industry.

All the address (1000 Peachtree Industrial Blvd Ste 6-492 • Suwanee, GA 30024-6777) listed on the USRSA web site (https://www.racquettech.com/top/staff.php) is, is Box 492 at the UPS Store in Suwanee:

The UPS Store | Ship & Print Here > 1000 Peachtree Industrial Blvd

Find directions, store hours & UPS pickup times. If you need printing, shipping, shredding, or mailbox services, visit The UPS Store #3257. Locally owned.

locations.theupsstore.com

brownbearfalling · Nov 7, 2019

Irvin said:
@brownbearfalling Why don’t you buy one and give us a review. Or wait until the USRSA comes out wi5h a review.

as much as I would love to be the guinea pig for this L I don’t want to regret not buying the standard Baiardo over the L. Given the price point I think there will be people who buy the L and provide feedback.

brownbearfalling · Nov 7, 2019

Wikky said:
I've traveled with the L several times now. I can tell you that I can get it set up by myself in under 5 minutes. I don't think the clamp bases stand up to the star 5. But again you can upgrade to the original gravity clamp bases if you prefer.

Any other comments on the L? Do you manually tilt the machine everytime you work on crosses? Would you recommend the L over the standard Baiardo?

Irvin · Nov 8, 2019

I heard that if you can pick up the full version for not much more used after a tournament. But I'm not sure the motors, display, and gravity clamps/bases would be something I'd need.

brownbearfalling · Nov 10, 2019

I would love to get my hands on one of those tournament used machines. I have also heard that they are sold after the tournament for a decent price. Never have been able to get access to that though.

brownbearfalling · Nov 10, 2019

All Baiardo users: how does the machine handle badminton racquets?

I can see the L has moveable posts that accommodate badminton. The more I look at the machine I question that design decision. Wouldn’t that bring the side arms too close together? The side arms look like they’re already close in distance. By bringing the posts closer together, it looks like the side arms would just be supporting the same area (9:00 & 3:00). Also it would be hard to work in that area. Would love to see a badminton frame mounted on the L.

In my experience Babolat’s solution with the star 5 to badminton racquets is the way to go. Just ship longer center support pieces ( 12:00 & 6:00) along with the machine.

Irvin · Nov 10, 2019

brownbearfalling said:
I would love to get my hands on one of those tournament used machines. I have also heard that they are sold after the tournament for a decent price. Never have been able to get access to that though.

They have pre sold them after the Atlanta BB&T tournament the last 2 years for $4,000. They will ship also but buyer pays shipping. Usually have about 250 rackets strung on them.

kkm · Nov 10, 2019

brownbearfalling said:
All Baiardo users: how does the machine handle badminton racquets?

I can see the L has moveable posts that accommodate badminton. The more I look at the machine I question that design decision. Wouldn’t that bring the side arms too close together? The side arms look like they’re already close in distance. By bringing the posts closer together, it looks like the side arms would just be supporting the same area (9:00 & 3:00). Also it would be hard to work in that area. Would love to see a badminton frame mounted on the L.

In my experience Babolat’s solution with the star 5 to badminton racquets is the way to go. Just ship longer center support pieces ( 12:00 & 6:00) along with the machine.

A stringer I know strings many badminton racquets and has a couple Baiardos. She said that she told Wilson that the side supports were too short, and that they changed the side supports (made the arms longer?) on later machines.

Kdude · Nov 19, 2019

Has anyone gotten the lite yet ? Would like to get a solid review before I pull the trigger ... A buddy has a Star 5 refurbished asking $3,500 , What do you guys think about the Babolat deal ?

Irvin · Nov 19, 2019

Kdude said:
Has anyone gotten the lite yet ? Would like to get a solid review before I pull the trigger ... A buddy has a Star 5 refurbished asking $3,500 , What do you guys think about the Babolat deal ?

Wow what a buddy you have, that is quite high for a Star 5.

Rabbit · Nov 19, 2019

@Kdude I would opt for the Baiardo. The Wilson is new, has more features and most importantly has a warranty.

Goodman · Nov 19, 2019

Irvin said:
Wow what a buddy you have, that is quite high for a Star 5.

Thanks, Irvin. That's helpful.

Irvin · Nov 19, 2019

Goodman said:
Thanks, Irvin. That's helpful.

You’re welcome, when I bought my Star 5 (for $175) I talked to Tennis Machines. That was over 6 years ago and TM told me one in great shape could get $2,800. You may want to see if they have any, or at least give you a good idea of a price. Many shops are getting rid of their Star 5s now and the price should be coming down.

Goodman · Nov 19, 2019

Cool story. Tell me more. This helps kdude quite a bit.

kkm · Nov 19, 2019

Kdude said:
Has anyone gotten the lite yet ? Would like to get a solid review before I pull the trigger ... A buddy has a Star 5 refurbished asking $3,500 , What do you guys think about the Babolat deal ?

The price of a brand new Star 5, when it was still in production, was $3000. I wouldn’t buy a refurbished machine for which they’ve discontinued replacement parts.

Goodman · Nov 19, 2019

Rabbit said:
@Kdude to answer your question without being a smart ass, I would opt for the Baiardo. The Wilson is new, has more features and most importantly has a warranty.

This.

Rabbit · Nov 19, 2019

@Goodman - thanks.

My story is this. I bought my 3rd real machine (NEOS 1000, NEOS 1500), a Babolat Sensor a few years ago. I paid $2200 for it. I had been refurbished including the tension head. The Sensor Dual new was $6000. I have been completely happy with my purchase. The machine is fantastic and does everything really well. I am happiest with the clamps and overall build of the machine.

All of that said, in retrospect, knowing what I know now, I might have sprung an extra grand for the Babolat or the Ghost II (and the comfort of a new machine and a warranty). Why? Well as nice as the Mighty Sensor is, it doesn't have all the bells and whistles of the newer machines. The Ghost II has an automatic magnetic table lock, nicer key pad and display etc. I know Babolats have a strong following among tour stringers, but these other machines are really nice. They have more features, are more ergonomic and are more portable (by and large).

@Kdude you can't go wrong with a well kept used Babolat. But you should weigh the price you pay for that versus something like the Wilson Baiardo L or Alpha Ghost II. Look at the features included versus the Star 5. At that price, you're going to get a machine that is far and away more than you need; and that is not a bad thing! But don't jump on a Babolat simply because you read lots about it on these boards. There are newer machines available new at about the same price with more and slicker features (it's called progress).

In summary, think about a stringing machine like a PC. Would you pay top dollar for a 5 - 7 year old PC? Heck no you wouldn't (if you have a brain in your head). Electronic stringing machines are very much like PCs. They both have motherboards, memory, and electronics. Think about how much the electronics in a PC mother board have advanced.....in college, one of my professors (teaching me BAL teehee) said "One day, one day we will have a gigabyte of disk. Just think about that. It will take a whole building to house that much disk." 37 years later, I have 64 GB on my dadgum phone! BTW - my senior year in college, IBM release the first PC. I came standard with 2 - 8 inch floppy drives. One for the operating system and the other for your programs and data.

Kdude · Nov 19, 2019

Rabbit , Irvin, kkm, really appreciate the advice and steering me in the right direction. I will see if I can get a used one from CH and take a look at Ghost while I'm shopping around.

brownbearfalling · Nov 19, 2019

Kdude: looking forward to seeing what machine you decide on. Especially if you go with Baiardo L it would be awesome if you could post a review

Kdude · Nov 20, 2019

brownbearfalling said:
Kdude: looking forward to seeing what machine you decide on. Especially if you go with Baiardo L it would be awesome if you could post a review

Looking forward to a change. I've had the same Ektelon H model for close to 40 yrs. Its been dead reliable , easy to calibrate and with experience you can even get a consistent string bed...

Wikky · Nov 20, 2019

brownbearfalling said:
Kdude: looking forward to seeing what machine you decide on. Especially if you go with Baiardo L it would be awesome if you could post a review

There should be some reviews coming up before the end of the year. I'll get some links as soon as they're available.

Kdude · Nov 23, 2019

I was able to buy the L from

Rabbit said:
@Goodman - thanks.

My story is this. I bought my 3rd real machine (NEOS 1000, NEOS 1500), a Babolat Sensor a few years ago. I paid $2200 for it. I had been refurbished including the tension head. The Sensor Dual new was $6000. I have been completely happy with my purchase. The machine is fantastic and does everything really well. I am happiest with the clamps and overall build of the machine.

All of that said, in retrospect, knowing what I know now, I might have sprung an extra grand for the Babolat or the Ghost II (and the comfort of a new machine and a warranty). Why? Well as nice as the Mighty Sensor is, it doesn't have all the bells and whistles of the newer machines. The Ghost II has an automatic magnetic table lock, nicer key pad and display etc. I know Babolats have a strong following among tour stringers, but these other machines are really nice. They have more features, are more ergonomic and are more portable (by and large).

@Kdude you can't go wrong with a well kept used Babolat. But you should weigh the price you pay for that versus something like the Wilson Baiardo L or Alpha Ghost II. Look at the features included versus the Star 5. At that price, you're going to get a machine that is far and away more than you need; and that is not a bad thing! But don't jump on a Babolat simply because you read lots about it on these boards. There are newer machines available new at about the same price with more and slicker features (it's called progress).

In summary, think about a stringing machine like a PC. Would you pay top dollar for a 5 - 7 year old PC? Heck no you wouldn't (if you have a brain in your head). Electronic stringing machines are very much like PCs. They both have motherboards, memory, and electronics. Think about how much the electronics in a PC mother board have advanced.....in college, one of my professors (teaching me BAL teehee) said "One day, one day we will have a gigabyte of disk. Just think about that. It will take a whole building to house that much disk." 37 years later, I have 64 GB on my dadgum phone! BTW - my senior year in college, IBM release the first PC. I came standard with 2 - 8 inch floppy drives. One for the operating system and the other for your programs and data.

Rabbit after reading your story I had a similar story but it stopped at the Ektelon H which I've been stringing on for close to 40 yrs. Dead reliable , easy to calibrate. I was going to buy a used but refurbished Star 5 ( always loved the look) now I just bought a slightly used L. Everything you said made sense so it made my choice easy. Thanks and thanks to all the other guys who posted here. I will only get to put her together in two weeks, but I will do a good review shortly there after.

Rabbit · Nov 24, 2019

@Kdude - congrats and please write a review!
Remember “the dude abides”

Nostradamus · Nov 24, 2019

Can you make this machine using 3D printer ??

kkm · Nov 24, 2019

Kdude said:
I was able to buy the L from

Rabbit after reading your story I had a similar story but it stopped at the Ektelon H which I've been stringing on for close to 40 yrs. Dead reliable , easy to calibrate. I was going to buy a used but refurbished Star 5 ( always loved the look) now I just bought a slightly used L. Everything you said made sense so it made my choice easy. Thanks and thanks to all the other guys who posted here. I will only get to put her together in two weeks, but I will do a good review shortly there after.

I think that the first part of your post ("I was able to buy the L from") may have been censored, and my post about the source with a few used Ls for sale seems to have been deleted by the mods (sorry, mods, for falling afoul of forum rules!).

Anyway, congrats on your new L. I hope that it fits your needs, and I look forward to reading your review.

Rabbit · Nov 25, 2019

Nostradamus said:
Can you make this machine using 3D printer ??

You sure can, I think one was first 3D printed at Stanford.

Herb · Nov 26, 2019

Ordered one today, supposed to be delivered on the 3rd. Will let you know what I think. I will try to do a side by side comparison video.

Herb · Nov 27, 2019

Just an FYI, when I purchased mine, after putting it in the cart and going to checkout it applied an $875 discount. After tax and free shipping it was only $2750. For those on the fence you might want to try.

Rabbit · Nov 27, 2019

Herb said:
Just an FYI, when I purchased mine, after putting it in the cart and going to checkout it applied an $875 discount. After tax and free shipping it was only $2750. For those on the fence you might want to try.

OK, now that is a no brainer!!!!!! Merry Christmas, Herb!

shoesandko · Dec 1, 2019

afeller said:
The clamps are very good. Normally they fit really close to the frame and holds the string very good.
The clamp base and rails are very smooth (not so smooth as tecnifibre!). Very easy to handle them.
The tension unit is very solid, easy to hande and also have a lot of settings.

Also you can move the towers to string Badminton rackets and have the side supports on the right position (not possible on Wilson and Babolat machines).

And a lot more...

String a few rackets on it and you will see the difference.

I have been using in the store the past few months, it is very nice, has a large tool tray which is wonderful and does all the things you mention. I do not like the mounting compared to babolat machines
and the clamps are very light, they constantly need adjustment for different gauge strings, even the older star 5 /sensor machines do not need much adjustments on the clamps unless its 15 or 19 ga.
I'm finding multi's slip unless you tighten the clamps up, at this point it marks the string. This occurs even right after a cleaning. I do two days a week and string roughly 50 a week at the store on this machine.
Not sure if I would purchase one,

Herb · Dec 10, 2019

Herb said:
Just an FYI, when I purchased mine, after putting it in the cart and going to checkout it applied an $875 discount. After tax and free shipping it was only $2750. For those on the fence you might want to try.

I was wrong, total was $2840.75. Supposed to be here Thursday between 1pm and 5pm. It was originally supposed to be delivered on the 3rd, but has been sitting at a UPS facility in Tennessee and just departed this morning.

Herb · Dec 12, 2019

Here is my quick review after setup. Still have not strung on it.

Wikky · Dec 12, 2019

Great video herb!

Rabbit · Dec 12, 2019

Agreed great job

brownbearfalling · Dec 13, 2019

Wow thanks for the video Herb. Touched on all the points I was wondering about. Thanks for mentioning about the clamps, weight, subtle differences in the design and even the texture

A few questions: how different are the clamp posts from the STD to the L? And are the clamp bases interchangeble? I know Wilson stated the posts are different sizes but do they fit at all? I imagine one is bigger than the other so maybe the bigger ones just has a loose fit. Also if you don’t mind tinkering with your machine to confirm the bases are interchangeable I know some members would like a L model with gravity release bases and 5 prong clamps in a perfect world.

How exactly does the tilting function? I know you showed the hex tool inserted into the small hole. How much does the machine tilt per turn? I can’t imagine someone tilting and untiling the machine for every job If it requires that much work to do.

does the tension head initiate when the gripper is pressed in (like the alpha ghost 2)?

Herb · Dec 13, 2019

brownbearfalling said:
A few questions: how different are the clamp posts from the STD to the L? And are the clamp bases interchangeble? I know Wilson stated the posts are different sizes but do they fit at all? I imagine one is bigger than the other so maybe the bigger ones just has a loose fit. Also if you don’t mind tinkering with your machine to confirm the bases are interchangeable I know some members would like a L model with gravity release bases and 5 prong clamps in a perfect world.

How exactly does the tilting function? I know you showed the hex tool inserted into the small hole. How much does the machine tilt per turn? I can’t imagine someone tilting and untiling the machine for every job If it requires that much work to do.

does the tension head initiate when the gripper is pressed in (like the alpha ghost 2)?

The clamps were interchangeable. I can put either clamp on the others base no problem. Seem to fit perfectly either way. So, if you have an original you could buy the 5 tooth clamps and replace the 4 tooth with no problems.

The bases are not. The original is to wide to slide through through the rail of the L model. You can buy the rails for the original and replace the ones on the L model.

The tilt is just a screw that you screw up or down. As you screw it down it tilts. It is pretty smooth, and I would guess one full turn is around 5 degrees or so. We just found a comfortable angle and will leave it there.

No, the head does not initiate with the gripper. You have to push the lever.

Jster · Dec 13, 2019

Herb said:
The clamps were interchangeable. I can put either clamp on the others base no problem. Seem to fit perfectly either way. So, if you have an original you could buy the 5 tooth clamps and replace the 4 tooth with no problems.

The bases are not. The original is to wide to slide through through the rail of the L model. You can buy the rails for the original and replace the ones on the L model.

The tilt is just a screw that you screw up or down. As you screw it down it tilts. It is pretty smooth, and I would guess one full turn is around 5 degrees or so. We just found a comfortable angle and will leave it there.

No, the head does not initiate with the gripper. You have to push the lever.

Hey herb, thanks for the review.
Does the Knot function still overrides the prestretch function on the last string on tieoff?

Herb · Dec 13, 2019

Jster said:
Hey herb, thanks for the review.
Does the Knot function still overrides the prestretch function on the last string on tieoff?

That I do not know. I do not get enough request for pre-stretch to really worry about it to be honest. So doubtful I will even check. In the last 7 or 8 years I have had 2 people ask for pre-stretch.

Kdude · Dec 14, 2019

I finally had the time to put my Lite together. It was love at first sight. I have been stringing on an Ektelon H for 40 yrs and after a bit of a learning curve I have to say the machine is rock solid. Easy to string on , easy maintenance. Herb's video is spot on. Im not 100% sure but I think the prestretch will still come before the Knott function engages.

Herb · Dec 15, 2019

Jster said:
Hey herb, thanks for the review.
Does the Knot function still overrides the prestretch function on the last string on tieoff?

Bored so, I tried it today. It does not override the pre-stretch on the Baiardo Lite. It pulls the pre-stretch, backs off, then pulls the knot tension.

Jster · Dec 15, 2019

Herb said:
Bored so, I tried it today. It does not override the pre-stretch on the Baiardo Lite. It pulls the pre-stretch, backs off, then pulls the knot tension.

looks like they fixed this tiny problem from wilson baiardo(original version)

Kdude · Dec 21, 2019

Nostradamus said:
does it have good pre-stretch function ?

yes .. 10 and 20 %

HRS · Apr 1, 2020

Kdude said:
yes .. 10 and 20 %
Just inquiring, can the Baiardo Lite be used as a Table Top machine?

Herb · Apr 1, 2020

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