Gee
Hall of Fame
I disagree. I played both these frames extensively and I think the TC97 18m is crisper than the TC95 18m.
The Official Angell Users Club
- Thread starter The_Racketeer
- Start date
I got the answers. Just to put it here in case someone is looking for it.
The approximate strung SW and balance for the frames would be as follows (assuming the frames are 27” length).
TC97 16x19 300g/325mm - 328SW and 335mm ( Strings will typically add 28 SW points and move the balance 3pts)
TC95 18x20 300g/325mm - 325SW and 335mm
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
Is anyone else having string durability issues in the TC100?
Solinco Confidential 16 barely makes it 4 hours for me in this frame.
Perhaps it's the string itself, as I used to have Hyper G 16 in my PCG100, and I could get 6 hours of play from it. Will give it a try in the TC100.
Any other recommendation for a softer poly with good durability to use in this frame?
Solinco Confidential 16 barely makes it 4 hours for me in this frame.
Perhaps it's the string itself, as I used to have Hyper G 16 in my PCG100, and I could get 6 hours of play from it. Will give it a try in the TC100.
Any other recommendation for a softer poly with good durability to use in this frame?
Sardines
Hall of Fame
It is an open string pattern but the launch angle isn't that crazy, even with 3lbs differential, but my stringer has stringing issues with the TC100's forcing 3 strings parallel in a grommet designed for 2!
Try the Cyclone Tour with a smooth poly cross? A smooth poly cross can sometimes extend string life.Off topic a bit, but finally got to rally with the K7 Lime. Really enjoying it. Using Diadem Solstice Power 1.20, I was able to generate plenty of spin. Slices were fantastic, as was the comfort/feel. Will need to eventually get some matches in before a final determination, but definitely a keeper.
bleno567
Professional
Yeah. I used to absolutely eat through strings in the TC 100. The pattern is just too open if you hit with heavy spin. I just hit with Ytex Quatro yesterday and today, and it really is as soft as they say. Big improvement in elbow comfort from hyper g imo.
BPlain
Semi-Pro
Both of those polys are pretty stiff according to TW's Compare Strings Tool: 222 lb/in for Confidential 16 and 219 for Hyper G 16.
I'm now 6 hours of play into using Angell Halo Spin 7 (1.25) in the mains, Angell Halo Four (1.18) in the crosses, both strung at 50 lbs, in my K7 Red. I'd definitely recommend it. Still stiff enough to control the ball with plenty of power, feel, and touch as well. While Angell (to my knowledge at least) doesn't publish stiffness ratings for their strings, I would say Halo Spin 7 is pretty close to Confidential and Hyper G. I started with a full bed of Halo Spin 7 but it was too much for my elbow and a little under powered. Using the Halo Four in the crosses has extended their durability – I broke them pretty quickly as mains – and softened up the Halo Spin 7 a bit too while improving power, spin, and feel.
I've used Hyper G, Volkl Cyclone, Cyclone Tour, and V-Squared in the past and tend to break strings pretty fast. If you're used to Confidential and Hyper G, I think Cyclone Tour would feel REALLY soft by comparison with Cyclone and V-Squared being slightly softer than what you're used too. My issue with Volkl strings (aside from breaking them too fast) was the quick tension loss. Got used to it but playing with Angell strings now, they seem to hold their tension much better overall.
Hope it helps!
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
Thanks for taking the time to answer. I don't have any particular comfort issue with either Hyper G or Confidential strings, seeing that I use only soft frames (59-63 RA). I have used Volkl Cyclone in the past, in a 17 gauge in a Yonex DR98, and didn't care much for it either. Plays well for about 4 hours, but then the drop in tension makes it borderline unplayable for me. The flip side is that it doesn't cost too much. Interesting recommendation on the Halo, will give it a go.
Sardines
Hall of Fame
Cyclone is stiffer than Cyclone Tour, and the tension maintenance is better than Cyclone Tour. When I was playing with Cyclone Tour, I found a 7% prestretch helped with tension consistency.
Also I found this thread about the blocked 7T stringing issue. Good thing I didn't buy it, but for those who pay stringers and use 15L or thicker gut, it's important info to consider! My stringer is charging me $2 for the added effort to string the TC100. Looking at how much more time Irvin has to spend to get the cross through the blocked hole, I can understand why!
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edelp
Semi-Pro
why are you surprised? i have three models and like them all and you have to say either the one you like most or is best for your game and this is not necessarily the same in my case. If you want more input I can detail on the tc95 open pattern, tc97 closed pattern and the tc100 all V3
jangotango
Semi-Pro
TC95 V3 18x20 70RA on sale for 100 GBP + shipping. Worth a buy? I just bought the H22 but I feel a 300g, 6HL TC95 would be a better switch from the Six.One Team.
I'm surprised because I heard TC 95 16X19 is kinda over powered (power wise), and I don't see many people voting for TC 97. I thought TC 97 is the most popular one.
Would love to hear about your TC 97 18X20, particularly if it's very prone to hit into the next, since people keep saying it has extremely low launch angle, and whether it gives you any problems because of its low power level.
On another note, has the TC 97 ever been on sale?
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edelp
Semi-Pro
Hi,
To start with, I have never seen the tc97 on sale…
I see your point on the tc95 16x19. I would not call it overpowered but yes you are right it has for a thin beam, smallish head frame quite some power and this is why I at the end of the day prefer it currently. I am saying currently… the tc100 that I like as well has an even slightly higher launch angle and even more power. Obviously, I can always play to a certain extent with thicker gauges and higher tension…
And now what could sound as contradiction. The one I play least with is the closed pattern tc97 (have not yet tried the 16x19) but if I had a better fitness and higher level to play two full hours with good speed against good opponents, this is the one I love. Control is superb, feel as well, slice brutal. But the launch angle is far lower and power also. Having said that, the power level is from my point of view (at same specs) slightly better than a for example IG prestige mp or even than old closed pattern Radical MPs. So if your level is good, then go for it.
The tc95 gives me more but sometimes both this and the tc100 launch angle is so high jeje that I even though I “hurt” my opponent I do not enjoy it that much (on a high level, no misunderstanding it, super frames). If I could I would use the tc97 18x20. Yes I play some more to the net, but not a big deal as I also play some more “long” with the other. So at the end it is the less spin and less power that make me prefer the open pattern tc95 (and have also in RA63 a nice feel)… So for a game right now, tc95 16/19 is my king
What are you playing with currently? In the past, now I have it under control jajajaja since Angell, I was quite a racquetholic “and tried them all…” so I might be able to compare…
I used Pro Staff 16x19 11.5oz (strung) a few years ago. I broke the racquet when I lost control of the racquet during serving. I currently have a Pure Strike 16x19 and a Pure Drive 16x19. The Pure Drive is too beat up since it was my only racquet for quite a while. It has been good to me but I play better tennis with a control oriented racquet, that's why I bought the Pure Strike two years ago. I also serve better with the Pure Strike. I believe its smaller racquet head made the head speed a tad faster. Honestly I have nothing bad to say about the Pure Strike at all. I want to buy Angell racquets because I'm curious to get a custom frame and I want a pair of the same racquet. I know the rational decision is to get another Pure Strike, but racquetholics are not rational by default.
I also don't like how big brands are cramming "new technologies" into racquets. Isn't it ridiculous that Babolat has been "improving" the Pure Drive over the years, but they finally decided to remove Cortex from the racquet so it plays more like the the 2012 Andy Roddick version? I personally can't comment if the Andy Roddick one is actually better since I never owned one, but the fact that they are removing something they heavily marketed for years says a few things. Besides, if the new technologies are that good, should not the pros be swarming to the new racquets?
Sardines
Hall of Fame
An update on the TC100 V3. I decided to get the SW and balance matched to my SV98+. To get it to 32cm balance, I'd have to add a whopping 22g to the butt, bringing it over 358g. I decided to keep it at 350g, 5g over my SV98+ and settled on 32.6cm balance. Overall, the TC100 V3 27.5" 16x19 is a great feeling racquet, especially with gut hybrid, to the point I felt like I was playing with my Tour 90 again. Playing with the TC100, the feedback allows for smooth stroking and stroke changes with the feedback. It is grippier with balance now nearer where I like it, and the flicks and rolls felt good. The only stroke I have serious difficult with is still the variation of serves. The TC100 doesn't give easy power or spin, so it requires a more aggressive contact angle and racquet head speed to get the heavier ball. Playsight shows I don't serve as well with the TC100, either in speed or spin. And my opponents, who patiently waited for me to key in Playsight data for each racquet after each set, both said my SV98+ serves were more difficult to handle, the balls kicked higher and deeper, and were more acutely angled. A 2hr session of singles today confirmed that for me the TC100 is a great feeling racquet I can use when I want to play at 80% power. I felt during warm up I could get into groove much faster due to the feel. I had fun hitting 80% pace serves and playing all court tennis. Ultimately, once I need that last 20% of juice and spin, I don't think I've spent enough time to gel and also not willing to do so because the SV98+ definitely has easier power and spin, so I have more choices on shots, so I won't be using the TC100 against better players.
Depends on your initial spec.. you can probably open up the pallet and adjust/move the weight piece(s) around to better achieve your desired balance...
edelp
Semi-Pro
I see thanks. Well playing with the Pure Strike, you should go to the TC95 or tc97 I guess, they are regarding headsize the same for me, the rest is super details or "marketing differentiation". In this case, the beam construction is different.
I tested the project one pure strike 16x19 but some time ago. It was a very good racquet, so let me compare it to the TC95. I like to read you like it and cannot say anything against it, because if I stopped it was because for me it was not comfortable at all. I have a "****ty arm", far to sensitive, and it was brassy, stiff. A pity because control was very good, power level as well. Very good allround frame. In my case the "official" (if I am not mistaken) 305 unstrung SW was there, I could feel it, not so easy to move quickly. So more difficult to move than my 295 swingweight TC95. The launch angle of the Angell is higher, more depth, prefer it in serve as well. Control maybe on par, and in groundstrokes more or less.
Comfort: TC95 by far (I have the RA63 version)
handling: tc95
spin: tc95
stability: same, or strike
power: maybe strike but as the TC95 gives you quite some I cannot be totally sure
volleys: strike
slice: maybe tc
touch feel: tc95
serves tc95
control. on par or strike (cannot remember this one).
And yes having the option to just have a second or third sharing the serial number and getting the same specs is very nice. I did that with first the tc100 and right now with the tc95 and this is a pleasure, gives freaks peace of mind
Just share with us once you decide whether to finally pull the trigger and for which one.
Enjoy.
Sardines
Hall of Fame
Thanks. I did think of that but Angell apparently doesn't sell different pallets anymore. I am considering 3D printing a new pallet and changing the butt cap, since the shape isn't my favorite, but I got used to it. I prefer the Yonex butt that doesn't flare as much. For added weight, seemed easier to add a leather grip and silicone the rest into the butt cap. Since it is a custom, I should check out how much weight there is under the grommet to achieve the original spec, but I'll have to get new grommets first. A lot of work for 30% of the time when I'm playing with this racquet to grove my stroke. Need to get the strings tension right to mimic the SV98+ launch angle first too.
since you need to get new grommets, you can always email the Angell team/Paul, as i remember reading you need to check with them first and they will tell you which "option" to pick for pallets....
can't help with the tension as it is a personal thing, so good luck with that
rider4ever
Rookie
Angell still sells pallets and butt cap separately. You can choose the size and shape you want.
For pallets, please make a purchase on our site using the link below for Variation - level 3 (£15) to cover the cost of each pallet and endcap set. Please add to the notes section the shape and size needed and we will get these despatched to you.
http://www.angelltennis.com/product/variations/
Sardines
Hall of Fame
Ah so they hide it in some obscure menu under a non-descriptive name?
Thanks for that. I've got the balance down to it's acceptable.for evaluation. So I'll save that option if I still want to play with this. Still have difficult serving well with the TC100, even with a more open string pattern and slightly larger hoop. I guess the SV98+'s stiffness makes up the differences. I have better spin, consistency and pace with the SV98+, on serve.
jangotango
Semi-Pro
How long does it usually take for Angell to tailor a racquet to personal spec? I ordered a TC95 V3 at 290g, 4pt headlight unstrung earlier this week and it is still processing.
No need for rush, it's just making me impatient Everytime I read a review
No need for rush, it's just making me impatient Everytime I read a review
Tennishippie
New User
Angelloneans,
I’m starting my quest for a new stick, checking the forums when I saw this massive thread and thought there has to be something here. After reviewing only about 20-50 pages I am ready to make the move but am in a bit of confusion as to which stick would best suit me. I would like to ask for the help of this board helping me make this decision so thank you in advance for reading my long post.
I’m 58 , 6’1’, 195 lean athletic type. Didn’t pick up a racquet until age 30. Good shape although not as flexible as I would like to be. Past surgeries on knee and feet but fine now. Only nagging issue is a mild right shoulder pain that sometimes keep me up at night (when sleeping on right side). Shoulder pain seems to come from bursa or rotator cuff tendon area more towards the back than the front of shoulder.
I’m 4.5 level (middle of the bunch as SoCal 4.5 USTA has a big spread)
Right handed, hard courts, topspin but flatter in general.
Aggressive baseliner with big forehand (liability at times due to mechanics -seem to lift shoulder on follow through which lifts elbow and slows down follow through)
2HBH which is solid but not a weapon per se
Decent volleys, touch is lacking, weaker drop shots
Decent serve, not as big as it should be for my height, can attract DF’s at times (usually long rather than net)
USTA dubs, singles with friends
RACQUETS & STRINGS (starting from current) all grips are L2 (4 ¼ with a overgrip)
Wilson Blade 98 V7 18/20 – Klip 17g gut mains @ 50, Lexilon ALU Power Rough cross @ 46. I like this stick but feel I launch the ball long more than I prefer, think I need more topspin. Hasn’t hurt or helped shoulder. The 18/20 in a 98 frame I think was a mistake on my part.
Yonex VCORE Pro 97 330 16/19 – Volkl 17g gut mains @ 50, Volki Cyclone cross @46. I realized I am not a young man or Stan the man so gave up on this. Felt like I had to work hard to be good with this stick consistently and maybe bothered shoulder more often after a couple of hours.
Yonex Ezone 98 305 16/19 - Pacific 16g gut mains @ 50, Pacific Polyforce cross @ 46. Loved this stick, played well but felt like it got pushed around when up against heavy balls, hitters. Added 4” of lead at hoop and felt a bit better but that also started me down the racquet rabbit hole, ha.
Head Graphene Speed Pro 100 18/20 - Pacific 16g gut mains @ 50, Pacific Polyforce cross @ 46. Liked this stick, first in long time going to 18/20. I got bored so decided to try Yonex.
Now the big question, what’s the best Angell stick for me? WTF? Here is what I am thinking and welcome all constructive input. My thoughts on the 310 is that most of my sticks have been in the 305 range.
Angell TC 95 16/19 63RA 27” 310 6ptsHL 4 ¼ grip B pallet. I am hesitant with this stick thinking the head size is too small for my level.
Angell TC 98 16/19 66RA 27” 310 6ptsHL 4 ¼ grip B pallet.
Angell TC100 16/19 19 63RA 27” 310 6ptsHL 4 ¼ grip B pallet. Hesitant with this stick thinking the head size is too big but just realized the Speed Pro was 100 head but with 18/20, now I a really confused, ha.
Thanks for being here on the forum and adding your input, I and many others appreciate the positive input and support here. Looking forward to placing my order and joining the club soon.
Hope all are safe and healthy during these crazy times.
Peace
I’m starting my quest for a new stick, checking the forums when I saw this massive thread and thought there has to be something here. After reviewing only about 20-50 pages I am ready to make the move but am in a bit of confusion as to which stick would best suit me. I would like to ask for the help of this board helping me make this decision so thank you in advance for reading my long post.
I’m 58 , 6’1’, 195 lean athletic type. Didn’t pick up a racquet until age 30. Good shape although not as flexible as I would like to be. Past surgeries on knee and feet but fine now. Only nagging issue is a mild right shoulder pain that sometimes keep me up at night (when sleeping on right side). Shoulder pain seems to come from bursa or rotator cuff tendon area more towards the back than the front of shoulder.
I’m 4.5 level (middle of the bunch as SoCal 4.5 USTA has a big spread)
Right handed, hard courts, topspin but flatter in general.
Aggressive baseliner with big forehand (liability at times due to mechanics -seem to lift shoulder on follow through which lifts elbow and slows down follow through)
2HBH which is solid but not a weapon per se
Decent volleys, touch is lacking, weaker drop shots
Decent serve, not as big as it should be for my height, can attract DF’s at times (usually long rather than net)
USTA dubs, singles with friends
RACQUETS & STRINGS (starting from current) all grips are L2 (4 ¼ with a overgrip)
Wilson Blade 98 V7 18/20 – Klip 17g gut mains @ 50, Lexilon ALU Power Rough cross @ 46. I like this stick but feel I launch the ball long more than I prefer, think I need more topspin. Hasn’t hurt or helped shoulder. The 18/20 in a 98 frame I think was a mistake on my part.
Yonex VCORE Pro 97 330 16/19 – Volkl 17g gut mains @ 50, Volki Cyclone cross @46. I realized I am not a young man or Stan the man so gave up on this. Felt like I had to work hard to be good with this stick consistently and maybe bothered shoulder more often after a couple of hours.
Yonex Ezone 98 305 16/19 - Pacific 16g gut mains @ 50, Pacific Polyforce cross @ 46. Loved this stick, played well but felt like it got pushed around when up against heavy balls, hitters. Added 4” of lead at hoop and felt a bit better but that also started me down the racquet rabbit hole, ha.
Head Graphene Speed Pro 100 18/20 - Pacific 16g gut mains @ 50, Pacific Polyforce cross @ 46. Liked this stick, first in long time going to 18/20. I got bored so decided to try Yonex.
Now the big question, what’s the best Angell stick for me? WTF? Here is what I am thinking and welcome all constructive input. My thoughts on the 310 is that most of my sticks have been in the 305 range.
Angell TC 95 16/19 63RA 27” 310 6ptsHL 4 ¼ grip B pallet. I am hesitant with this stick thinking the head size is too small for my level.
Angell TC 98 16/19 66RA 27” 310 6ptsHL 4 ¼ grip B pallet.
Angell TC100 16/19 19 63RA 27” 310 6ptsHL 4 ¼ grip B pallet. Hesitant with this stick thinking the head size is too big but just realized the Speed Pro was 100 head but with 18/20, now I a really confused, ha.
Thanks for being here on the forum and adding your input, I and many others appreciate the positive input and support here. Looking forward to placing my order and joining the club soon.
Hope all are safe and healthy during these crazy times.
Peace
I see thanks. Well playing with the Pure Strike, you should go to the TC95 or tc97 I guess, they are regarding headsize the same for me, the rest is super details or "marketing differentiation". In this case, the beam construction is different.
I tested the project one pure strike 16x19 but some time ago. It was a very good racquet, so let me compare it to the TC95. I like to read you like it and cannot say anything against it, because if I stopped it was because for me it was not comfortable at all. I have a "****ty arm", far to sensitive, and it was brassy, stiff. A pity because control was very good, power level as well. Very good allround frame. In my case the "official" (if I am not mistaken) 305 unstrung SW was there, I could feel it, not so easy to move quickly. So more difficult to move than my 295 swingweight TC95. The launch angle of the Angell is higher, more depth, prefer it in serve as well. Control maybe on par, and in groundstrokes more or less.
Comfort: TC95 by far (I have the RA63 version)
handling: tc95
spin: tc95
stability: same, or strike
power: maybe strike but as the TC95 gives you quite some I cannot be totally sure
volleys: strike
slice: maybe tc
touch feel: tc95
serves tc95
control. on par or strike (cannot remember this one).
And yes having the option to just have a second or third sharing the serial number and getting the same specs is very nice. I did that with first the tc100 and right now with the tc95 and this is a pleasure, gives freaks peace of mind
Just share with us once you decide whether to finally pull the trigger and for which one.
Enjoy.
Yes will do! I'm still waiting for the reply from Paul to confirm the SW.
landcookie
Semi-Pro
Cyclone tour lasts bugger all in my 100. Strung on a CP but wasn't pre stretched though. Found hyper g OK but launch angle was high. Am thinking of trying Max Power 1.3 to tame the launch angle, power, and give me more tension stability.It is an open string pattern but the launch angle isn't that crazy, even with 3lbs differential, but my stringer has stringing issues with the TC100's forcing 3 strings parallel in a grommet designed for 2!
landcookie
Semi-Pro
Save the money and spend it on your shoulder. Seriously. It's a ticking time bomb the way you've described it. I have the same issue and it's costed me a year (and going) off tennis because I ignored it until it's too late.
It looks like you want to jump just for the sake of jumping.
But, if I were you, this is what i'd do first to get a better idea of what you want:
- Change strings on your Blade to a lower powered, higher spin potential poly, ie hyper g. If you can't, up tension on your gut hybrid.
- Play more with the ezone and Speed. At 4.5 you shouldn't be wanting for stability. Balls just aren't that big at that level. I mean, you said you liked the Speed so why change?
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
I would second that. I had the same issue on my left shoulder (thankfully not my playing one), which got increasingly painful and would have lead to a more serious rotator cuff injury down the line. Went to see an osteopath, who gave me a routine of 3 movements to do, which take me 5mn every day, and it's mostly fixed it after a few weeks. I would really start with this.
As for gear, the Ezone 98 305 is an excellent stick, but it can be a bit unstable. Not sure where you put the lead, but 2-3g at 3 and 9 each would fix the issue.
Now, if you just really want to buy a new Angell racquet, here's my 2 cents:
- I am 50 years old around the 4.5 mark, and I have moved away from midsized frames over the past year (used to play a Prince Pnatom Pro 93P). The reality is that a 97/98/100 sq.in. is just easier to play and offers more tolerance when the footwork isn't accurate, which happens a lot at our level. So I would stay away from a 95 sq.in. frame
- TC100: I love this frame, but the launch angle is quite high, so if you play mostly flat, it might not be for you. One really needs to put decent amounts of spin to tame the power of this racquet. But otherwise, it's a rare blend of comfort, power and tolerance
- TC97: I have no first hand experience with this. Apparently the power level is lower than the TC100, so you're unlikely to spray long as much on flat shots. Would definitely stay away from the 18x20 on this one, as it would lower the power even more
As for balance, I have noticed you only consider the least headlight option at 6pt HL. Be aware that Angell's swing heavier than other racquets of the same weight / balance due to their foam filled construction. For instance, my TC100 63RA 310g / 9pt HL was measured by Paul at a SW of 297 unstrung. That would put it around 325-327 strung, which is already pretty healthy. And considering that you have shoulder issues, I would definitely not recommend going any higher. If I were you, I'd go with the 9pt HL option. You can always add a little bit of lead to bump it up, should you feel the need.
landcookie
Semi-Pro
Good to hear you recovered quickly. I had to go through 1 year of general physio with no progress, consulted 2 highly accredited sports physicians (guys who have worked with elite tennis players), who both put me on to a shoulder specialist. Fingers crossed it is the start of a full rehab process.
SteveXtreme1978
Rookie
I made the switch too from reading this thread. I switched from my Yonex DR98+ to an Angell TC101. I had the some thought thinking a bigger headsize may lose me some control however having now played with the TC101 this is not true at all. In fact I am playing better than ever and definitely improved my slices and forehand. Worth researching the TC 101 too.
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
Sorry to hear about the issue. Mine had been lingering for some time before I took action, but thankfully it was not too compromised. And it definitely helped that it wasn't my playing shoulder. I suspect it would have taken much longer in that case. Good luck with the specialist. Hopefully, he will sort you out and you'll be back on court soon.
Tennishippie
New User
Thank you all for your replies and feedback, I appreciate the constructive input. Not to hijack the thread but would you mind sharing the routine of 3 movements your ortho gave to you that has helped the shoulder?
I will probably start my journey trying to HL the Blade 98 V7 18/20 a bit and/or stringing the gut mains a bit tighter.
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
No worries. You'll need an elastic band that you can attach to your door. Then have a look at the following video:
Rotator Cuff Exercises
The ones I am doing are:
- Medial External Rotation (at 0:34) - works better if you tuck a towel under your elbow to avoid lifting the arm (very important)
- Lateral External Rotation (at 8:00)
- Rotational Diagonal Raise (at 11:38)
The other exercises are fine too, but I am specifically targeting the back of my shoulder as this is where my issue is located.
Don't use a band that is too strong, but aim at slow repetitions (3 seconds each). 3 sets of 10 for each exercise.
Good luck.
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
Right. So my experience with the TC100 is turning into a bit of a debacle.
First, let me repeat that I love the way this frame feels and swings. The blend of comfort, spin and power is pretty amazing.
But here are the issues:
1) String durability
I posted this here before and under a separate thread in the String forum: this is by far the worst string eating frame I have ever played. Confidential 16 at 52/54 lasts me 3 to 4 hours. Switched to Hyper G 16 at 52/54, and got 5 hours of play.
I have noticed that I always break in the same location: second main from the middle (or 7th from the side), at the 4th cross from the top, and this got me curious. So I measured the spacing between the 3rd and the 4th crosses, and then between the 4th and the 5th crosses, and compared to my Prince Classic Graphite 100, which was giving me 6 to 7 hours of play with Hyper G 16:
- 3rd to 4th cross: TC100 1.6cm / PCG100 1.5cm
- 4th to 5th cross: TC100 1.5cm / PCG100 1.3cm
There you have it: the TC100 has a more open string pattern than the PCG100 despite having one extra cross (16x19 vs. 16x18). At least towards the upper part of the hoop where I hit most of my balls, and where off center hits are more likely to happen. This is due to the shape of the respective frames, the TC100 being more elongated than the PCG100, and the missing string in the latter being in the very bottom of the hoop, where it doesn't matter.
Mind you, the PCG100 already had a more open string pattern than the Prince Phantom 100P, where I was getting 8+ hours of play with Hyper G 16L (a thinner gauge), so it's really open to start with. I guess that the extremely open pattern of the TC100 explains the power level and launch angle of that frame. But the irony is that one of the reasons I got the TC100 was in the hope that it's 16x19 pattern would help increase string life over what I was getting in the PCG100. Well, that surely backfired in a spectacular way.
2) Handle issue:
Last night, when playing a doubles game, something seems to have happened to the handle of one of my frames After hitting a powerful, but normal forehand (the ball wasn't framed or off-centered), I started to notice a squeaking noise coming from the handle. It's quite loud when I shake the racquet, and leads me to believe something has broken inside the handle.
I must have had 8-10 hours of play, at the most, in this racquet since I got it, as I rotate it with the two other TC100 I got from Angell.
Has anyone else ever gotten the same kind of issue? If so, how did it get fixed? I have sent an email at the customer service alias of Angell explaining the problem. I hope to hear from them and that they will provide a solution.
Where to from there?
Frankly, I am less concerned about the handle issue. This kind of things happen in any mass produced product, even semi custom ones, and as long as Angell stand by their product, it won't turn me off the brand.
But the string pattern / durability issue is a real concern. I will next try a full be of 4G, which has a round profile vs. the square Confidential / Hyper G, to see if it helps durability, and then I will hybrid Hyper G in mains and 4G in crosses. I am looking for a set up that gives me 7-8 hours of play, which for me translates into 2 weeks. Breaking every week is just a pain in the neck.
If I can't achieve that, I will seriously consider selling those frames, but it will be with a heavy heart. Which begs the question: seeing that I really do value getting frames right on specs, and like the feel of the Angell's, where to from there?
I am not prepared to go back to a mid-size, as I now find them a bit too challenging to play, and that's the reason why I transitioned from a Prince Phantom 93P to 100 sq.in. frames in the first place. So this excludes the TC95. Would the answer to be found in the TC97's? I am aware that the flex profile is different from the TC100 (stiffer throat / flexier hoop in the TC97 vs. constant flexibility in the TC100), but this is probably something I can get adjusted to. Then, there is the question of the string pattern:
- the 18x20 will for sure increase the string life, but I am concerned it will be at the expense of a substantial drop in power and launch angle. It's generally not an easy pattern for me to play (I tend to hit a lot in the top of the net), and I am reading that the one on the TC97 is pretty tight
- the 16x19 should help with power and launch angle, but I am wondering if dropping the hoop size by 3 sq.in. will be enough to compensate for the open pattern as far as string durability is concerned. Is anyone capable of providing input on that front? It would be great if someone had direct experience with both the TC100 and the TC97 16x19
Really appreciate any advice and input at this stage. This thread is great, and the Angell users community seems pretty tightly knitted, so I'm hoping some of you can help. Thanks in advance.
First, let me repeat that I love the way this frame feels and swings. The blend of comfort, spin and power is pretty amazing.
But here are the issues:
1) String durability
I posted this here before and under a separate thread in the String forum: this is by far the worst string eating frame I have ever played. Confidential 16 at 52/54 lasts me 3 to 4 hours. Switched to Hyper G 16 at 52/54, and got 5 hours of play.
I have noticed that I always break in the same location: second main from the middle (or 7th from the side), at the 4th cross from the top, and this got me curious. So I measured the spacing between the 3rd and the 4th crosses, and then between the 4th and the 5th crosses, and compared to my Prince Classic Graphite 100, which was giving me 6 to 7 hours of play with Hyper G 16:
- 3rd to 4th cross: TC100 1.6cm / PCG100 1.5cm
- 4th to 5th cross: TC100 1.5cm / PCG100 1.3cm
There you have it: the TC100 has a more open string pattern than the PCG100 despite having one extra cross (16x19 vs. 16x18). At least towards the upper part of the hoop where I hit most of my balls, and where off center hits are more likely to happen. This is due to the shape of the respective frames, the TC100 being more elongated than the PCG100, and the missing string in the latter being in the very bottom of the hoop, where it doesn't matter.
Mind you, the PCG100 already had a more open string pattern than the Prince Phantom 100P, where I was getting 8+ hours of play with Hyper G 16L (a thinner gauge), so it's really open to start with. I guess that the extremely open pattern of the TC100 explains the power level and launch angle of that frame. But the irony is that one of the reasons I got the TC100 was in the hope that it's 16x19 pattern would help increase string life over what I was getting in the PCG100. Well, that surely backfired in a spectacular way.
2) Handle issue:
Last night, when playing a doubles game, something seems to have happened to the handle of one of my frames After hitting a powerful, but normal forehand (the ball wasn't framed or off-centered), I started to notice a squeaking noise coming from the handle. It's quite loud when I shake the racquet, and leads me to believe something has broken inside the handle.
I must have had 8-10 hours of play, at the most, in this racquet since I got it, as I rotate it with the two other TC100 I got from Angell.
Has anyone else ever gotten the same kind of issue? If so, how did it get fixed? I have sent an email at the customer service alias of Angell explaining the problem. I hope to hear from them and that they will provide a solution.
Where to from there?
Frankly, I am less concerned about the handle issue. This kind of things happen in any mass produced product, even semi custom ones, and as long as Angell stand by their product, it won't turn me off the brand.
But the string pattern / durability issue is a real concern. I will next try a full be of 4G, which has a round profile vs. the square Confidential / Hyper G, to see if it helps durability, and then I will hybrid Hyper G in mains and 4G in crosses. I am looking for a set up that gives me 7-8 hours of play, which for me translates into 2 weeks. Breaking every week is just a pain in the neck.
If I can't achieve that, I will seriously consider selling those frames, but it will be with a heavy heart. Which begs the question: seeing that I really do value getting frames right on specs, and like the feel of the Angell's, where to from there?
I am not prepared to go back to a mid-size, as I now find them a bit too challenging to play, and that's the reason why I transitioned from a Prince Phantom 93P to 100 sq.in. frames in the first place. So this excludes the TC95. Would the answer to be found in the TC97's? I am aware that the flex profile is different from the TC100 (stiffer throat / flexier hoop in the TC97 vs. constant flexibility in the TC100), but this is probably something I can get adjusted to. Then, there is the question of the string pattern:
- the 18x20 will for sure increase the string life, but I am concerned it will be at the expense of a substantial drop in power and launch angle. It's generally not an easy pattern for me to play (I tend to hit a lot in the top of the net), and I am reading that the one on the TC97 is pretty tight
- the 16x19 should help with power and launch angle, but I am wondering if dropping the hoop size by 3 sq.in. will be enough to compensate for the open pattern as far as string durability is concerned. Is anyone capable of providing input on that front? It would be great if someone had direct experience with both the TC100 and the TC97 16x19
Really appreciate any advice and input at this stage. This thread is great, and the Angell users community seems pretty tightly knitted, so I'm hoping some of you can help. Thanks in advance.
Happi
Hall of Fame
@flanker2000fr I play both TC100 and TC95 and can shift back and forth with very little adjustments.
If you measure both racquets TC100 is only 1 cm longer and 0,5 cm wider than the TC95, so that should not be a problem to psychical adjusting between the two frames, unless it is more mental issue.
The TC97 and TC95 are almost identical to my eyes and they also share the same grommets.
I also played the Prince 93P and the TC95 is nothing like the 93P.
The TC95 is 0,5 cm longer and 2mm wider than my TT95.
TC95 it is almost identical to Head MG Radical 98.
I think you should give the TC95 a serious consideration.
Cheers, H
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
That's really good feedback, thank you.
Yes, I guess you're right, it's a bit of a mental thing with the TC95. Would you care to elaborate on the difference you found with the 93P?
I might also be focusing too much on the head size, as it is not the only parameter I have changed when transitioning from the 93P to 100 sq.in. frames. I also lowered the static weight quite a bit. The 93P 18x20 came at 330g unstrung while the 14x18 I used for a few months was at 325g. Compared to 315g for the PCG100 and 310g for the TC100. So at least a part of the ease of play I am finding with these frames can be explained that I tire less quickly.
And you bring up a very good point regarding the shared grommets of the TC95 and TC97: it means they will have the exact same pattern and therefore the same durability for the strings. Whereas the TC95 will have a more familiar flex profile, and from what I read it is a more powerful frame than the TC97, so perhaps easier to adjust from the TC100.
So a TC95 63RA 310g / 315mm (same RA / weight / balance as my TC100) might be the right balance between playability, power and string durability.
Happi
Hall of Fame
It is really hard to give advice on racquets as it is such a personal thing, I am all about the feeling and that is so individual.
When I read the glowing reviews on the 93P 18x20 I decided to get one, but it was simply too demanding for me as I couldn't find the sweet spot in that frame (I'm still in doubt if this is the first frame produced without a sweet spot
) - I was getting pushed around, but most important I did not like the feel.If the Prince power level on the 93P is 700 the TC95's power level is about 1100.
My TC100's and TC95's are also 310 / 315 / 63RA, and I find it easy to swift back and forth.
A good friend let me try his TC95 / 70RA and as I have a VERY sensitive elbow I was afraid that the stiffness would kill my arm. But to my surplice it played very well, just a little crispier and some more power (closer to the TC100's power level), and is now my favorite one.....
Angell has a sale right now on TC95 18x20 70RA, and I could not resist getting 2 frames 310 / 315, it is on process and I can't wait to get my hands on them and play. I think the 18x20 combined with the power level of a 70RA flex frame might be an interesting setup. I think that the Angell 18x20 might even be a tight 18x20, so strings breaking should be reduced.
Good luck with your quest.
Cheers, H
edelp
Semi-Pro
Hi,
I would like to subsribe what @Happi said. Do not forget the TC95 16x19. I played one year with the TC100 (v3 version) and now switched to the TC95 (but keep the wonderful tc100 nevertheless). I had the prince 93P in closed pattern and the pcg100 as well.
Just for info, my tc95 is 300gr and 32,5cm Bp (SW 295), meaning same frame you might be ordering but with less weight in the handle. It has a big sweetspot, smaller than the tc100 that I consider huge but gives more control (still plenty of power and spin), and the strings will last longer…
It will also give you more power than the PCG100 and much more than the 93P! in terms of headize the tc97 ( I have one in 18x20) and the 95 are the same for me, as it was said they even share same grommets, just minimally longer the tc97. So do not discard the 95, might be the best compromise in the long way from 93P to TC100. I do not know why but even though the feel of TC100 and TC95 are very close, you see same DNA…, I even slightly prefer the feel of the TC95. This does not mean that I cannot change between them, I could also go fully back to the tc100 that I love, but the tc95 gives this “balance of all”. And also here I sometimes think, wow how much power for a thin beamed 95 head frame… So the comment of Happi on the closed pattern tc95 in RA70 makes me nervous…
I would like to subsribe what @Happi said. Do not forget the TC95 16x19. I played one year with the TC100 (v3 version) and now switched to the TC95 (but keep the wonderful tc100 nevertheless). I had the prince 93P in closed pattern and the pcg100 as well.
Just for info, my tc95 is 300gr and 32,5cm Bp (SW 295), meaning same frame you might be ordering but with less weight in the handle. It has a big sweetspot, smaller than the tc100 that I consider huge but gives more control (still plenty of power and spin), and the strings will last longer…
It will also give you more power than the PCG100 and much more than the 93P! in terms of headize the tc97 ( I have one in 18x20) and the 95 are the same for me, as it was said they even share same grommets, just minimally longer the tc97. So do not discard the 95, might be the best compromise in the long way from 93P to TC100. I do not know why but even though the feel of TC100 and TC95 are very close, you see same DNA…, I even slightly prefer the feel of the TC95. This does not mean that I cannot change between them, I could also go fully back to the tc100 that I love, but the tc95 gives this “balance of all”. And also here I sometimes think, wow how much power for a thin beamed 95 head frame… So the comment of Happi on the closed pattern tc95 in RA70 makes me nervous…
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
Hi,
I would like to subsribe what @Happi said. Do not forget the TC95 16x19. I played one year with the TC100 (v3 version) and now switched to the TC95 (but keep the wonderful tc100 nevertheless). I had the prince 93P in closed pattern and the pcg100 as well.
Just for info, my tc95 is 300gr and 32,5cm Bp (SW 295), meaning same frame you might be ordering but with less weight in the handle. It has a big sweetspot, smaller than the tc100 that I consider huge but gives more control (still plenty of power and spin), and the strings will last longer…
It will also give you more power than the PCG100 and much more than the 93P! in terms of headize the tc97 ( I have one in 18x20) and the 95 are the same for me, as it was said they even share same grommets, just minimally longer the tc97. So do not discard the 95, might be the best compromise in the long way from 93P to TC100. I do not know why but even though the feel of TC100 and TC95 are very close, you see same DNA…, I even slightly prefer the feel of the TC95. This does not mean that I cannot change between them, I could also go fully back to the tc100 that I love, but the tc95 gives this “balance of all”. And also here I sometimes think, wow how much power for a thin beamed 95 head frame… So the comment of Happi on the closed pattern tc95 in RA70 makes me nervous…
Thank you, that's very valuable. Especially the comparison TC95 / TC100 / 93P / PCG100.
Maybe I should keep a couple of TC100's, and complement them with a couple of TC95's, allowing for the ability to switch, like you and Happi seem to have done. Could be interesting to use the TC95 as a main stick, and keep the TC100 in reserve for those days where the footwork isn't that great and more help is needed. On good days, a bit more control over the TC100 would probably be a good thing.
that is also what i did previously (for the longest time i can remember). the TC95 and TC100 has the same beam and i was able to switch quite quickly. i much prefer the TC95 (probably in my head) that it plays better for me and less power than TC100. the thumping sound from TC95 is awesome!
i am not a poly user, so i have used Halo 3 extensively on both (54/54) - it plays good for me. but i have since moved over to Blade 98 18x20 and Pure Strike 98 16x19.
flanker2000fr
Hall of Fame
yeah - i believe so, although there isnt much to it between the 95 and the 98.
the Angell 16x19 seems to be more open than most.... and i got hooked on the "box beam". both Blade and PS has 8 mains at throat.
between the two - i would say i prefer the 16x19 with 8 mains at the throat.
Return_Ace
Hall of Fame
Do you know how the Angell 18x20 pattern compares to a "closed" 16x19? Since that should also have 8 mains in the throat.
I'm pretty sure that I'm finding my TC95 16x19 too open, but not completely sure about going back to 18x20 after being so used to a closed 16x19 (Radical/Prestige Pro).
sorry, not yet.
when i can get back, i have plans for a few 18x20 (with 8 mains) and 1 x 16x19 (with 8 mains) to try. one of them is a TC97 18x20 - all box beams
Pneumated1
Hall of Fame
Have you ever seen an Angell hairpin with the pallets removed? They have chambers (for lack of a better term) where they add lead chunks/squares to bring your racquet to specs. Mine were siliconed or glued in and covered with some type of double sided tape. In most cases, once the pallets cover these chambers, they're secure. Sounds like one yours probably came loose and is rattling a little, which would be annoying. Hope they take care of it.
tennis347
Hall of Fame
I played with the Clash 98 for 3 sessions and the feel was way to muted and the sweetspot felt small. In contrast, the K7 Red has a really nice feel, great spin potential and good control along with fantastic comfort. The Clash 98 also felt really clunky with the wide beam. The numb feel with Clash was a real turn off and also felt string as well but tension sensitive.
I highly recommend the K7 Red but my only knock is that it doesn't have the put away power. You have to be alot more patient and use topspin to draw errors and short balls. I still have a matching pair of Red frames but my racquet of choice these days is the 2020 Prince Phantom 100p.
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Lozannois
Rookie
Very interesting thanks!
I just pulled the trigger for one K7 red and one ASL 2 both with a swingweight of 285 unstrung. Will compare them side by side and post my review.