2003 Agassi vs 2013 Murray - Australian open

[nolefam_2024]

2003 is the last time Andre Agassi won Australian open. He is 4 times slam winner with 90% win rate in the slam. He has beaten Pete in slam finals here.

2013 Andy Murray was the third time he reached slam finals here. He beat Federer for the only time in slam match here.

Who wins and why?

 

[RS]

If Murray doesn't have blisters he outlasts Agassi in my opinion. He is fitter at that stage and would get a lot of balls back on the not fast surface.

 

[RS]

Beats everybody else in AO 03 as well apart from possibly Fed.

 

[Kralingen]

Thought Murray was genuinely at his all time AO best in the first two sets. Even better than AO 12 because he served better imo.

So this is essentially peak Murray vs 4th best Agassi in Australia, which shows the implicit gap between them.

Even given that… outlasting Andre Agassi? The guy who went down with a whimper after 2 and a half hours? The one who couldn’t even move in the final set? That’s the guy who you think is going to win by outlasting? What a joke.

 

[Biotic]

Beats everybody else in AO 03 as well apart from possibly Fed.

Murray vs Schutteler 10 match series?

 

[RS]

Murray vs Schutteler 10 match series?

Don't see Schuttler/Hewitt/Roddick/El Aynaoui doing that well with Murray. Not sure how that translates to a series.

 

[nolefam_2024]

Thought Murray was genuinely at his all time AO best in the first two sets. Even better than AO 12 because he served better imo.

So this is essentially peak Murray vs 4th best Agassi in Australia, which shows the implicit gap between them.

Even given that… outlasting Andre Agassi? The guy who went down with a whimper after 2 and a half hours? The one who couldn’t even move in the final set? That’s the guy who you think is going to win by outlasting? What a joke.

First two sets were electric. They played like it's ping pong.

 

[BorgTheGOAT]

Don't see Schutteler/Hewitt/Roddick/El Aynaoui doing that well with Murray. Not sure how that translates to a series.

That guy’s name is Schüttler by the way.

 

[alexio]

rainer schuettler, remember him a bit, and that good loong match vs clement at wimby 08

 

[Poisoned Slice]

Hard to imagine Murray winning here.

 

[RS]

What if Agassi is the better player but Murray beats him based on the idea that the field improved and relative vs absolutes?

 

[RS]

That guy’s name is Schüttler by the way.

My bad spelling. Sorry.

 

[nolefam_2024]

This proves how much Andy is overrated to be included as atg.

We can't even think he will win vs an old Agassi.

 

[dking68]

This proves how much Andy is overrated to be included as atg.

We can't even think he will win vs an old Agassi.

Agassi would destroy Murray

 

[RS]

@The Guru

 

[RS]

Hard to imagine Murray winning here.

Douglas moment.

 

[metsman]

Murray vs 05 Agassi would be a real cracker of a match. Murray has no chance on this surface against any half decent moving version of Agassi, which is 04, much less 03.

Fresh 05 Agassi > 13 worn out Federer. If Tsonga hadn't softened him up before hand, Murray may have been in for some real embarrassment.

 

[RS]

Murray vs 05 Agassi would be a real cracker of a match. Murray has no chance on this surface against any half decent moving version of Agassi, which is 04, much less 03.

Fresh 05 Agassi > 13 worn out Federer. If Tsonga hadn't softened him up before hand, Murray may have been in for some real embarrassment.

Roddick AO 03 QF vs Murray AO 13 SF?

 

[metsman]

Thought Murray was genuinely at his all time AO best in the first two sets. Even better than AO 12 because he served better imo.

So this is essentially peak Murray vs 4th best Agassi in Australia, which shows the implicit gap between them.

Even given that… outlasting Andre Agassi? The guy who went down with a whimper after 2 and a half hours? The one who couldn’t even move in the final set? That’s the guy who you think is going to win by outlasting? What a joke.

13 fresh Federer is like 10th best Federer at AO, 13th worn out Federer is probably behind 14, 16, 17, 18 (I'll be nice and put it above 02/03 mugerer), so the 14th best Federer, and Murray still couldn't beat him properly in what was a top 3 performance in a grand slam match ever.

 

[The Guru]

Thought Murray was genuinely at his all time AO best in the first two sets. Even better than AO 12 because he served better imo.

So this is essentially peak Murray vs 4th best Agassi in Australia, which shows the implicit gap between them.

Even given that… outlasting Andre Agassi? The guy who went down with a whimper after 2 and a half hours? The one who couldn’t even move in the final set? That’s the guy who you think is going to win by outlasting? What a joke.

Actually like the first two sets in 15 more people sleep on that match.

This is not a fair critique. There's no way Murray gasses out as fast vs Dre the rallies would be not nearly as physical. There's no question who the more physical player between Andy and Andre is. Don't think outlasting is Andy's path to victory either but you scoffing at his physicality is dumb.

 

[RS]

Wait what happened to the relative absolute thing Guru since when Agassi in 4?

 

[Kralingen]

Actually like the first two sets in 15 more people sleep on that match.

This is not a fair critique. There's no way Murray gasses out as fast vs Dre the rallies would be not nearly as physical. There's no question who the more physical player between Andy and Andre is. Don't think outlasting is Andy's path to victory either but you scoffing at his physicality is dumb.

I was mainly trolling @RS for suggesting outlasting as if 03 Agassi was old mummy with a back brace who could barely move. Outlasting is laughable considering the biggest failure of Murray’s in the match was his lowered intensity and assumed blisters limiting his movement. It wouldn’t go the same way vs Andre.

Andre doesn’t need to get physical and play a bunch of long rallies of course as you said. The second he sees a Murray 2nd serve he’ll be depositing that meatball for winners into the corner every time like peak Mickey Mantle getting a hanging curve.

 

[RS]

I am in the supermarket now Krag. Later.

 

[HBK4life]

Agassi might have hit holes in the court attacking that second serve.

 

[buscemi]

I was mainly trolling @RS for suggesting outlasting as if 03 Agassi was old mummy with a back brace who could barely move. Outlasting is laughable considering the biggest failure of Murray’s in the match was his lowered intensity and assumed blisters limiting his movement. It wouldn’t go the same way vs Andre.

Andre doesn’t need to get physical and play a bunch of long rallies of course as you said. The second he sees a Murray 2nd serve he’ll be depositing that meatball for winners into the corner every time like peak Mickey Mantle getting a hanging curve.

Yeah, I mean 2003 Agassi would go on to come back from two sets and a break down at the French Open to beat Ancic, 7-5 in the fifth set. He definitely still had some gas in the tank at that point.

 

[NatF]

Agassi in 4.

 

[RS]

Murray in 5 yeah

 

[RS]

I was mainly trolling @RS for suggesting outlasting as if 03 Agassi was old mummy with a back brace who could barely move. Outlasting is laughable considering the biggest failure of Murray’s in the match was his lowered intensity and assumed blisters limiting his movement. It wouldn’t go the same way vs Andre.

Andre doesn’t need to get physical and play a bunch of long rallies of course as you said. The second he sees a Murray 2nd serve he’ll be depositing that meatball for winners into the corner every time like peak Mickey Mantle getting a hanging curve.

I said with no blisters and who said Agassi was mummy and had no fitness it's Djokovic fans who call him that.

 

[Third Serve]

Andre in 4. Had a mug draw but he was good.

I think he has a generally tougher time in the last two sets than Djokovic did but four sets nonetheless.

 

[RS]

Yeah, I mean 2003 Agassi would go on to come back from two sets and a break down at the French Open to beat Ancic, 7-5 in the fifth set. He definitely still had some gas in the tank at that point.

Was it a good match? Never seen it.

 

[buscemi]

Was it a good match? Never seen it.

I've never seen the full match, but there's some good, aggressive ball striking in the highlights, and Agassi looks pretty fresh in the fifth set (he'd go on to win his next two matches before losing to Coria in the QF).

 

[NoleFam]

Gotta go with Agassi. He was the previous AO king without a doubt.

 

[RS]

That's the relative level debate finished. 2003 wins.

 

[Backspin1183]

Murray if it's not the final. Agassi if it's the championship match.

 

[Razer]

Agassi won't need a 5th set, this is Australia.

 

[Wurm]

This proves how much Andy is overrated to be included as atg.

We can't even think he will win vs an old Agassi.

Anyone hear that echo? Anyone hear that echo? Anyone hear that echo?

 

[TearTheRoofOff]

Agassi in less than 5.

 

[RS]

Agassi AO 03 vs Federer AO 12?

 

[RS]

Thought Murray was genuinely at his all time AO best in the first two sets. Even better than AO 12 because he served better imo.

So this is essentially peak Murray vs 4th best Agassi in Australia, which shows the implicit gap between them.

Even given that… outlasting Andre Agassi? The guy who went down with a whimper after 2 and a half hours? The one who couldn’t even move in the final set? That’s the guy who you think is going to win by outlasting? What a joke.

I still think Murray's best match I saw was the AO 10 QF. But not sure if that Murray would have translated it to Djokovic in 12/13 probably not.

 

[NatF]

I still think Murray's best match I saw was the AO 10 QF. But not sure if that Murray would have translated it to Djokovic in 12/13 probably not.

Funny how many players have played their best matches again Nadal at the AO

 

[BauerAlmeida]

Agassi in 4, maybe 5.

 

[RS]

Funny how many players have played their best matches again Nadal at the AO

Bit like Fed's opponents in 04/05/07 everywhere

 

[RS]

Murray vs 05 Agassi would be a real cracker of a match. Murray has no chance on this surface against any half decent moving version of Agassi, which is 04, much less 03.

Fresh 05 Agassi > 13 worn out Federer. If Tsonga hadn't softened him up before hand, Murray may have been in for some real embarrassment.

2005 Agassi in 5?

 

[fedfan24]

agassi in 4

 

[NatF]

Bit like Fed's opponents in 04/05/07 everywhere

Lol not even remotely the same when Fed beat those guys.

 

[RS]

Lol not even remotely the same when Fed beat those guys.

Maybe not one on one like those you are thinking of but the principal isn't that far apart

 

[NatF]

Maybe not one on one like those you are thinking of but the principal isn't that far apart

Maybe if we're being totally disingenuous sure.

 

[RS]

Maybe if we're being totally disingenuous sure.

I will wait for the next extensive level of play thread that gets 20 pages and we will see

 

[D.Nalby12]

This proves how much Andy is overrated to be included as atg.

We can't even think he will win vs an old Agassi.

Murray had low ceiling. Certainly not enough to beat in form ATG.

 

[D.Nalby12]

I think biggest setback for Djokovic was losing two slams to Murray. Fedal would never let it happen.