counterloop
Professional
This woman is the greatest of all time.
2017 WTA Australian Open QF: Johanna Konta v Serena Williams
- Thread starter Aussie Darcy
- Start date
Nah. Still recovering from the twists and turns of the prior match, is all. Expressed myself poorly I guess.
ACE of Hearts
Bionic Poster
Serena will play till she's 40.
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
I kinda facepalmed reading that too. When in doubt, just remember it's mug eraSerena was never really in trouble, so what is there to stress about?
Konta was a small threat prior to the match but once Serena broke her after 10 minutes you knew she had the match in her hands.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
Those last few games went way too quickly for my liking, very anticlimactic. Decent effort by Jo but just not enough 1st serves in which against someone like Serena just isn't gonna get the job done.
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
With the field that she's facing I wouldn't be surprised if she played till she's 50 and I'm dead serious.
N
NewOrder
Guest
Ah ah ah! Maybe she/he'll be the next Serena or Federer.
Again, I really just meant that I was still recovering from the prior match. And ordinarily I'd recover pretty quickly which is why I joked that it must be the hormones.
Andy Murray Is Goat
Rookie
Well guys 6-2 6-3 Serena
Man of steel
Hall of Fame
Serena won 8 slams in a tougher field than federer ever played.
She faced multiple slam champions throughout draws early in her career. Jankovic ivanovic and safina were all around at the top in 07 so i don't know what your talking about seeing as thats still part of the "strong era" apparently. The tour didn't magically become weak after 07/08. WTF are you talking about.
Azarenka and sharapova alone are better competitors against serena than everyone was against federer bar nadal and djokovic. Better than even murray ffs. And i love how you omit players like Li Na, Kvitova, Kerber, clijsters as well as azarenka and sharapova that were around well past 07.
Who the hell did federer have? Phillipousis? Pffftt The only ones you can even mention are roddick and hewitt and we all know just how competitive they were against him.
I speculated earlier that the respect she openly expressed for Konta's game - she openly admitted to watching a ton of JK's matches - might sharpen her, just as knowledge of Safarova having been her slam final opponent two years ago seemed to zone her in in the second round. I think I was right about that. She knew there was no screwing around with JK and she went in accordingly.
Aussie Darcy
Bionic Poster
I'm actually at work at the moment so shouldn't even be here! I was sneakily watching the womens matches but gotta crack down and focus now. I'm following the score though!I kinda facepalmed reading that too. When in doubt, just remember it's mug era
And Darcy why the heck weren't you watching the doubles? Aussie boys vs Herbert/Mahut.
Don't bother, for real. It's so dumb to even debate Federer vs. Serena to begin with. They're not each other's competitors, and a slam for either doesn't take away anything from the other player.
@La Grande , I wouldn't say "humbled' is the word. JK didn't go in arrogant, so she could hardly have been "humbled." She'll be back. I expect her to be a t10 mainstay going forward.
counterloop
Professional
@ManOfSteel...lol...why bother? Some people are just going to accept Alternative Facts when it comes to evaluating Serena Williams. Lol
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
You're wasting your breath. The reason Serena is the greatest is because no one, past or present, can beat her at her best except maybe a redlining Venus on grass or a fast court. Federer was owned by a player in his prime so some people question the greatest title where he is considered. When it comes to Serena, there really is no doubt. Let people believe what they want. You will never convince the blind.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
Let the excuses flow. Serena has been feasting on pathetic fields for almost a decade now and nobody can deny that.
Philippoussis lol he faced him exactly one time (wasn't that the same Philippoussis who demolished Sampras in a HC Slam right in the middle of his peak?), what about Jankovic, Safarova, Safina, Zvonareva, Radwanska, Wozniacki and those are just off the top of my head. LOL BRING IT ON. You don't have an issue calling Serena GOAT despite her feasting on the weakest era of bums and no names for a decade yet give Federer flak for facing an easier opponent 2-3 times out of like 30 that he's played (didn't Baghdatis beat 3 top 10 players to reach the final, didn't Gonzalez absolutely fu**ing decimate your GOAT Nadal in the QF? What was the problem, Fed was waiting in the final as always, or did Rafito only bother in Monte Carlo?).
Federer's opposition in 2004-2007 is 10x harder than whatever Serena has faced after 2007. One Azarenka who's been there for like 2 seasons. GIMME A BREAK MAN_OF_FAIL.
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tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
The same way Djokovic owned Nadal in 2011. And a 24/25 year old Nadal was a lot closer to his peak than Federer was in 2008/2009 cause that's exactly the Federer that Nadal was beating in the Slams outside of the FO (and just barely), not 2004-2007 peak Federer. I don't remember Serena being the flat out best player in 1999-2007, there were actually several players who could beat her in the Slams on a consistent basis like Capriati or Henin.
Aussie Darcy
Bionic Poster
Tennis Pro is an expert troll, don't bother responding to that utter nonsense.
Defends Baghdatis and Phillipousis as a slam opponent yet lols at those women he listed who all smashed top 10 players throughout their career and reached the top of their sport. How did Baghdatis end up? Lol.
Tennis Pro is inconsistent and hates the WTA and will always argue against it.
Not worth the time of day @Man of steel
Defends Baghdatis and Phillipousis as a slam opponent yet lols at those women he listed who all smashed top 10 players throughout their career and reached the top of their sport. How did Baghdatis end up? Lol.
Tennis Pro is inconsistent and hates the WTA and will always argue against it.
Not worth the time of day @Man of steel
Andy Murray Is Goat
Rookie
LOLOLOLOLOl I love watching trolls at work makes me laugh like mad
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
How is Australia's greatest hope top 10 player Tomic doing again?
Aussie Darcy
Bionic Poster
A lot better then you are right now.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
I may be wrong but I think t_p's German and a bit of a Graf fan hence why he tries his best to discredit Serena's achievements just in case she gets the slam record.
@skyline: Congrats on the pregnancy
I think we'll both live, and it was MLB-Pliskova match that had me on the edge. And really I only joked that it must be the hormones; I am one nervy fan in general.
Not Serena's fault.
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
You wish xD.
I'm sorry that I don't have the same enthusiasm as you about Serena collecting another Slam while facing bums. No need to call me a troll cause if you wanna play the cheap shot game you're gonna get more than you asked for.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
It wasn't just the French. It was in places like Miami and Dubai on courts where he should never have lost to Nadal, not to mention all the losses he suffered on clay. Please let's not bring up prime this and prime that since Federer is in the SF at 35 years old and made two SFs last year. If he can be in form at 35 I'm pretty sure he could be when he was 26 and 27. The fact is that he could not figure Nadal out. Serena took some beatings but she always figured them out and turned the tables on them in the end. Of course she wasn't the best player in 1999 when she was 17 years old not to mention that her sister dominated the tour in 2000 and 2001. 2002-2003, she was unstoppable until an injury forced her out to have knee surgery and then her sister was murdered. She still was winning Slams in 2005 and 2007 and could beat anybody in the world even though she was not at her fittest or in the best form.
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
Unlike a lot of people here I never root for players just because I come from the same country. I have dissed Becker 99,9% of the time I talked about him.I may be wrong but I think t_p's German and a bit of a Graf fan hence why he tries his best to discredit Serena's achievements just in case she gets the slam record.
Graf will remain the GOAT until I see a player better than her. Serena is overrated and she's been beating bums for 10 years.
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Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
Haha, I can't really say anything - you oughta see me when I watch some of Djokovic's matches, even the ones in Masters 1000s and below.I think we'll both live, and it was MLB-Pliskova match that had me on the edge. And really I only joked that it must be the hormones; I am one nervy fan in general.
Aussie Darcy
Bionic Poster
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
Give me a break. Federer wasn't near his best in both tournaments and it's well documented that he had health issues in both tournaments, especially in Miami. If they played at the AO or the US in 2004-2007 Federer would've never lost to Nadal. All this "Federer can't beat Nadal" premise started in 2008/2009 when absolute peak Nadal beat a declining Federer in 2 very close Slam finals. The only 2 times Nadal faced peak Federer in a Slam outside of the FO were 2 Wimbledon finals and he lost both matches. Federer would've been favored more at the AO and US. Federer actually did OK against Nadal in 2004-2007, he won their 5 most important matches outside of clay (out of 7 matches) and only started losing more after he started declining.
The same way Nadal could not figure Djokovic out? Djokovic has absolutely pummeled Nadal in the last 2-3 years yet Nadal doesn't get critisized as much as Federer. When Djokovic started pummeling Nadal he was the same age as Federer was in 2008/2009. The level of hypocrisy is off the charts. If Nadal was born in 1981 and Federer in 1986 Federer the h2h would look completely different.
I thought you were a big boy and knew that the h2h between 2 ATG's 99% of the time is lead by the younger player.
Serena never faced anyone of Nadal's or Djokovic's callibre, not even CLOSE.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
There is always excuses so I don't know why I or anyone else bothers when it comes to you and Federer. All tennis players have health issues but lopsided head to heads cannot just be overlooked when you want someone to bow and crown your favorite player King. It's funny how Federer was declining when he lost. It was never that the other player was better. In fact, the other player was better which is why Federer lost. Nadal did figure Djokovic out the next year and turned the tables for a bit. It's not like Djokovic dominated him from 2011 until the present. There was a time when Nadal came back. The fact is Serena doesn't really have any peers. Go look at the head the heads of 3 generations of players and get back to me. She is the undoubted Queen of tennis. Up and downs, injuries, motivation issues, etc., but she bested them all. Can you say the same for Federer? The answer is no which is why there is doubt where he is concerned. And of course Serena never faced anyone of Nadal and Djokovic's caliber since she is a woman and they are men, and I'm done with this subject.
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
Federer's level had to drop for Nadal to barely get him. Talk all you want but nobody sane will say that 2008/2009 Federer was as good as 2005/2006 Federer.
When Djokovic's level dropped. Besides, that "figuring out" happened on clay when Nadal beat him 3 times on that surface in 2012. Only beat him on HC in 2013 when he peaked again and Djokovic was playing like crap losing to guys like Robredo or old Haas. Nadal as good as he is has been the most opportunistic player ever.
I never said Serena wasn't the best player in the last 20 years. I just don't think she is the GOAT because there are just way too many easy Slams that she has won.
You can't be for real...do you even know what you're saying? Someone like Nadal or Djokovic = if Serena had someone like Navratilova or Evert. There has been 1 fairly good player since 2007 and that's Victoria Azarenka who has played at a high level for 2-2,5 years and is pregnant as we speak.
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
because she beat Konta, yeah hooray
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
Vika's up the duff again?!
She's only just had her first!
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
forgot she already delivered but you know what I mean, it's gonna take months before she comes back and starts playing well againVika's up the duff again?!
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Easy Slams? LOL. Have you ever looked at a Serena Williams draw? Let's just pull a year out of the air. Take 2010. Australia, she had to beat Kvitova, Suarez Navarro, Stosur, Azarenka, Li Na and Henin in the final just to win the title. Even at Wimbledon that year she had to beat Cibulkova, Sharapova, Li Na, Kvitova and Zvonareva to get the title. She had some of the toughest draws you could think of. That argument is pretty bogus unless you have actually seen how tough her draws are for almost two decades and she still walked off with 22 Slams. Now I'm really done with this argument.
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
Ok Serena had it tough. Wozniacki, Radwanska, Jankovic, Safina, Zvonareva, Safarova in Slam finals. So tough. Serena GOAT.
La Grande
G.O.A.T.
I only watched the slams back then, but Nadal's level was rising every year. Why should he be expected to beat peak Federer at 19/20?
If you look at Wimbledon (grass), 2006 he took a set, 2007 took it to 5. I wasn't surprised at all when he beat him in 2008. Natural progression. Mono or no mono, that would've been close. Are you saying that Federer was declining rapidly at 25?
I know you're arguing about Serena, but why does Nadal never get his props?
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
Nadal beat a very good Federer in a Wimbledon final, all I'm saying is that Federer wasn't at his peak which isn't so crazy.
I also don't think Nadal played that much better in the 2008 final compared to the 2007 final. Federer was more stable in 2007, though.
TennisFan436
Semi-Pro
Because she won 22 and counting GS...
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Yea I agree, Serena is GOAT. 3 of those players you mentioned were #1 not to mention she beat Hingis, Venus (x6), Sharapova (x3), Davenport, Henin, Azarenka (x2), Kerber and Muguruza (all former or current #1s and multiple Slam champions except Muguruza) That is 16 Slams if you want to add them up. Your precious Graf beat Mary Joe Fernandez (x2), Zvereva, Sukova, and headcases Novotna and Sabatini to win 6 of hers but no mention of those though right? Double standards are large with this one. Good night.
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La Grande
G.O.A.T.
Fair enough.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
The thing is t_p, why would you expect Nadal or any player for that matter to be able to beat a peak Federer on grass when he's arguably the greatest ever on that surface? It's like when Nadal fans used to ridicule Federer and Djokovic over the years just because they could never beat a prime Nadal at RG but why should they be expected to when the Spaniard's peak level on clay was simply too good? I've just always found it strange how some people believe a slam victory only deserves credit if you achieved it by beating an ATG at the very top of his game. IMO defeating even a 90% Federer on grass or a 90% Nadal on clay is still one hell of an accomplishment worthy of praise.
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
No but I call BS on people denying Federer because he lost 2 close matches vs peak Nadal when he was declining. Nadal has so many more flaws than Federer it's not even funny.
Mickey Bricks
New User
Sooooo, what u're saying is that she's the best in the world?
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
Oh come on mate, you can't honestly tell me Federer was in decline at just 27. Look at the level of tennis he's still able to produce and the guy's 35 now!
InsideOut900
Legend
A lot of those players don't have pedigree,but they where quite good around that time.
Safarova and Jankovic in particular played quite well. Wozniacki wasn't too bad,but Serena was in the zone at that USO.
If you look at pre final rounds during 2008-2010,they were tough,2012-2013 had weak field,but good competition at the top.
2015 was the only weak year,but even then Serena still got deep draws at RG and Wimby and a good Sharapova in the AO final.
2016 Wimby was weak,but Serena was playing really well there
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
He played worse in 2008 than in 2007. Give me arguments that he didn't.
Mickey Bricks
New User
Who are these fantasy players u keep referring to who are somehow AWOL from their destiny to "expose" Serena's "decline"? Your hatred might be a bit out of control bro...u sound like a nut?
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
I never said he did but the fact remains he still played very well just as he did in the '09 AO final. I'm no fan of Nadal and at the time wanted nothing more than for Roger to beat him but you can't say those wins don't deserve credit and let's face it, no other player would've beaten Fed the way he was playing in those finals.
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