How would you define a weapon?

[Ballinbob]

I realize this is a simple question but my friend and I actually got in an argument over it. My friend plays tennis and I told him that I post here and stuff, so he checked my posts and saw that I claimed my serve to be better than my volleys. He laughed at me and asked me what I was smoking lol, for he told me my serve breaks down alot while my volleys do not. I countered by saying when my serve is on, its alot better than my volleys. I did agree with him that about my volleys not breaking down though, they dont. My volleys are just punch volleys that I can place pretty good. I dont go for crazy angles, I just punch it in the open court and wait for a weak reply. My serve on the other hand is fast but is inconsistent some days. I consider my serve my "weapon" because I figured, when its on, its amazing. I can hit aces regularly and can hit my slice serve with good spin and placement. My volleys I consider "above average" because I don't really do angle volleys or go for the lines that much because I feel hitting to the open court works just as good, and I feel the people who have their volleys as a weapon can do that.

My question is would a serve that, when its on, has the potential to be your best shot be your weapon or would consistent,simple volleys that never break down be your weapon? The serve breaks down sometimes under pressure while my volleys dont.Just assume I have perfect form and footwork an all that. (I dont have even close to good footwork, but just assume) I just dont want replies that "well, if you can get into good postion to volley everytime" or "well, if your serve has good technique then it should...". You get the idea.

What exactly should your "weapon" be?

Thanks

 

[RoddickAce]

I realize this is a simple question but my friend and I actually got in an argument over it. My friend plays tennis and I told him that I post here and stuff, so he checked my posts and saw that I claimed my serve to be better than my volleys. He laughed at me and asked me what I was smoking lol, for he told me my serve breaks down alot while my volleys do not. I countered by saying when my serve is on, its alot better than my volleys. I did agree with him that about my volleys not breaking down though, they dont. My volleys are just punch volleys that I can place pretty good. I dont go for crazy angles, I just punch it in the open court and wait for a weak reply. My serve on the other hand is around 85mph but is inconsistent some days. I consider my serve my "weapon" because I figured, when its on, its amazing. I can hit aces regularly and can hit my slice serve with good spin and placement. My volleys I consider "above average" because I don't really do angle volleys or go for the lines that much because I feel hitting to the open court works just as good, and I feel the people who have their volleys as a weapon can do that.

My question is would a serve that, when its on, has the potential to be your best shot be your weapon or would consistent,simple volleys that never break down be your weapon? The serve breaks down sometimes under pressure while my volleys dont.Just assume I have perfect form and footwork an all that. (I dont have even close to good footwork, but just assume) I just dont want replies that "well, if you can get into good postion to volley everytime" or "well, if your serve has good technique then it should...". You get the idea.

What exactly should your "weapon" be?

Thanks

In my opinion, a weapon is something that can put constant pressure on your opponent. So in this case, if your volleys always generates weak replies, then I would consider that your biggest weapon.

 

[tennis_balla]

Well there will be a lot of opinions on this, none wrong or right. I see a weapon as something you build your game around. If you feel you have a big forehand for example, you like hitting that shot then you'll try and find ways to hit it as much as possible and adjust your tactics accordingly.
Also I don't see 'weapons' as only confined to strokes. Your speed, mental toughness, court sense or having a knack to figure out an opponents game can also be classified as weapons I believe.

 

[Ballinbob]

In my opinion, a weapon is something that can put constant pressure on your opponent. So in this case, if your volleys always generates weak replies, then I would consider that your biggest weapon.

Yeah, I realize this. But when my serve is on, I can put alot more pressure on my opponent than my volleys. but that's when its on. So whats the better stroke?

Tennsi-balla I agree with you. I dont think theres an answer, but I still want to hear what everyone thinks

 

[J011yroger]

A weapon is something that you use to your advantage to win points from your opponent, and is an outstanding attribute, which is above the norm for your and your opponent's level.

If you serve is unreliable then on some days it may be a weapon, and on others a liability.

If your volleying is solid, and useful in winning points, but your volleys in and of themselves are not above average or more damaging than would be expected for your level of play, then I would consider that a tool more than a weapon.

J

 

[mdjenders]

i love the analysis, jolly. very astute. i have always patterned my game around my forehand. before, it was more of a tool than a weapon, aka i could confidently place the shot all day, but had trouble finishing points with it. now that i have flattened it out a bit, people generally comment that my fh is superior for my play level, and it shows in matches. the fh directly wins points.

 

[Ballinbob]

but your volleys in and of themselves are not above average or more damaging than would be expected for your level of play, then I would consider that a tool more than a weapon.

J

Thanks for the reply, but can you elaborate on this part? I have decent form on volleys, but I guess you can say that I play it too safe and dont go for lines too often.What do you mean by in and of themselves?

 

[J011yroger]

Thanks for the reply, but can you elaborate on this part? I have decent form on volleys, but I guess you can say that I play it too safe and dont go for lines too often.What do you mean by in and of themselves?

In and of themselves means when considered seperately from the other parts of your game.

In order for me to consider someone's volleys a weapon, they have to,

1. Not miss often.
2. End points or hit nasty setups on balls above the net.
3. Get to everything that isn't a stellar pass or lob.

If someone can inflict serious damage, on easy balls, and stay alive on hard ones, and also hurt you on volleys that ordinarily would have to be hit defensively, then you consider that to be a weapon.

From what you describe, I would consider your volleying to be more of a tool than a weapon.

Remember, it is OK to not have any weapons, and just have a well rounded and neatly groomed game. Guys that rely on weapons too heavily, lose when those weapons misfire.

J

 

[GeorgeLucas]

Smarteepants

In and of themselves means when considered seperately from the other parts of your game.

In order for me to consider someone's volleys a weapon, they have to,

1. Not miss often.
2. End points or hit nasty setups on balls above the net.
3. Get to everything that isn't a stellar pass or lob.

If someone can inflict serious damage, on easy balls, and stay alive on hard ones, and also hurt you on volleys that ordinarily would have to be hit defensively, then you consider that to be a weapon.

From what you describe, I would consider your volleying to be more of a tool than a weapon.

Remember, it is OK to not have any weapons, and just have a well rounded and neatly groomed game. Guys that rely on weapons too heavily, lose when those weapons misfire.

J

I'm inclined to agree with j0lly here. If you're not rushing the net and putting serious pressure on your opponent with your volley, your game isn't really "based around" it. On the other hand, like you said, during your ON days, you can win points outright with your serve or force a weak reply to put away with a forehand or volley. In this light, I see your serve as the structure for your points.:shock:

 

[Ballinbob]

wow lol I never thought of it that way. So I guess somedays I have a weapon and somedays I dont, all depending on the serve. I actually have good technique with my serve, its just that I once I start loosing concentration then my timing goes off, which is just as important as technique when it comes to the serve. I usually serve my best when I havent played for a while b/c im pumped up to go and play. So anyways, a weapon is above just good then right? Its something that you have thats way past your skill level right? And yeah Jolly your right, I have this friend with a killer forehand and nothing else. His forehand was way ahead with the rest of his game and he relied on it too much. The one match his forehand wasnt on was horrible. It was painful to watch, for his game isnt that great but he uses his forehand to make up for it. Oh man that was quite the match...

 

[lethalfang]

In my opinion, a weapon is something that can put constant pressure on your opponent. So in this case, if your volleys always generates weak replies, then I would consider that your biggest weapon.

I agree that a weapon is something that puts pressure on your opponent.
Consistency itself is a weapon. (Kinda like the saying, "quantity is a quality in itself.")
If a guy's serve has potential to be really good, but tend to break down from time to time, I'd still consider it to be a weapon, but not a reliable one.

 

[kungfusmkim]

Yeah, I realize this. But when my serve is on, I can put alot more pressure on my opponent than my volleys. but that's when its on. So whats the better stroke?

Tennsi-balla I agree with you. I dont think theres an answer, but I still want to hear what everyone thinks

A weapon is something that can get you out of trouble any time in the match. I have to go with your friend on this one. You see both my backhand and my forehand is solid. I do win a lot of the points with my forehand for it is really powerful. But i cant control it when i start spraying and i cant seem to land the ball on the line. However, my backhand makes less winner but also makes less errors. My forehand breaks down under pressure mental or physical. My backhand does it will make the same errors as it always does whether it is on a break point or a match point.

 

[kungfusmkim]

wow lol I never thought of it that way. So I guess somedays I have a weapon and somedays I dont, all depending on the serve. I actually have good technique with my serve, its just that I once I start loosing concentration then my timing goes off, which is just as important as technique when it comes to the serve. I usually serve my best when I havent played for a while b/c im pumped up to go and play. So anyways, a weapon is above just good then right? Its something that you have thats way past your skill level right? And yeah Jolly your right, I have this friend with a killer forehand and nothing else. His forehand was way ahead with the rest of his game and he relied on it too much. The one match his forehand wasnt on was horrible. It was painful to watch, for his game isnt that great but he uses his forehand to make up for it. Oh man that was quite the match...

You cant say one day i have a weapon and the next day you dont. Weapon is something that is there 24/7. Whats the point of carrying a gun you cant control on some day and control well on other day in war field? you dont know when your enemies will attack, so you need something reliable that can never go wrong. gernades (drop shots) can b a weapon, itll catch some one by surprise and kill them and win the fight(point) if you are good at controling it.

 

[kungfusmkim]

William sisters have a really powerful forehand soemtimes makes even high quality winner compared to their backhands. This only implies when their timing is on. If its off it flies every where spraying every where. However, their backhand is solid never misses and makes high quality winner every time.

 

[[ GTR ]]

Well Federer has a huge forehand as his main weapon and it misfires sometimes very badly..

 

[Ballinbob]

I agree that a weapon is something that puts pressure on your opponent.
Consistency itself is a weapon. (Kinda like the saying, "quantity is a quality in itself.")
If a guy's serve has potential to be really good, but tend to break down from time to time, I'd still consider it to be a weapon, but not a reliable one.

I liked this. Yeah, I would say my serve is an unreliable weapon as well. GTR makes a good point that federers forehand is a weapon but sometimes misfires. How are you going to argue that kungfusmkim lol?

 

[[ GTR ]]

I would say Blake and Federer's forehand are huge weapons when they are on but aren't good on their off days..

I would say Nadal's forehand is more consistant and therefore more of a weapon than those 2 guys^.

 

[Ballinbob]

wait, so your saying my volleys would be more of a weapon b/c theyre more consistent? where do u stand on that?

 

[lethalfang]

wait, so your saying my volleys would be more of a weapon b/c theyre more consistent? where do u stand on that?

If you can volley back attempted passing shots time after time, it'll put pressure on your opponent to hit a better passing shot than he is capable, and he loses these points because of your consistent volleys that force him to make errors.

The key question is, does your opponent dread over seeing you at the net?
If the answer is yes, then your volley is a weapon.
If the answer is no, then it isn't.

 

[Ballinbob]

If you can volley back attempted passing shots time after time, it'll put pressure on your opponent to hit a better passing shot than he is capable, and he loses these points because of your consistent volleys that force him to make errors.

The key question is, does your opponent dread over seeing you at the net?
If the answer is yes, then your volley is a weapon.
If the answer is no, then it isn't.

I dont know if they dread me at the net or just expect me to go to the net, because Im a S&V player and my whole game is at net. Yes, I absolutely can get to any ball because of speed and fitness. It is rare that someone can lob me and for me not to get to it with plenty of time. Runnign a 11.9s 100m dash helps with that lol. "he loses these points because of your consistent volleys that force him to make errors."that quote right there describes my volley game perfectly. and the best part of em is they never break down.

So you would say my volleys are better because they're more consistent and I can win points of em pretty easy? My serve can do the same thing but better though when its on.

 

[OhDear]

A weapon is a shot that your opponent does everything to avoid. If your opponent's are groaning when you break because they know they can't break back, your serve is a weapon. If they panic when you rush the net because they know you'll dominate with some volleys, then it's your volleys.

 

[downdaline]

Your volleys are a weapon. Your serve is a wildcard. Haha.

 

[downdaline]

Your volleys are a weapon. Your serve is a wildcard. Haha.

 

[Zachol82]

A deadly weapon is one that actually hits.

That being said, your volleys compliment your serves. If a good serve goes in, then it's easier for you to put that point away with your volleys. However, if the serve doesn't even go in, then you can't even use your volleys.

What's your second serve like?

 

[Ballinbob]

A deadly weapon is one that actually hits.

That being said, your volleys compliment your serves. If a good serve goes in, then it's easier for you to put that point away with your volleys. However, if the serve doesn't even go in, then you can't even use your volleys.

What's your second serve like?

My 2nd serve isnt the one that breaks down, its my first (usually a flat-hard slice). I have a heavy kick serve for my 2nd serve and its reliable. I like my harder serves though b/c those are the serves that get me aces and service winners and just blow my oppoent away. Its not too bad when Im not on with my first serve. If it happens i just end up hitting kick serves the whole match which works since Im a S&V player.

Thanks everyone for the replies. Interesting arguments, I see arguments for both sides

 

[halalula1234]

weapon should be consistent and the shot that u can break ur opponent down or hit most of ur winners from etc.

for example venus williams has a more powerful FH than her BH but her bh is her way more consistent side so ppl consider this to be her weapon. as well as her other shots.

 

[Ultra2HolyGrail]

Sounds like your serve is the real weapon. You said that you don't hit big angles but have good consistency, but it sounds like it's a result from the serve and you are putting away easy volleys?

 

[Ballinbob]

Sounds like your serve is the real weapon. You said that you don't hit big angles but have good consistency, but it sounds like it's a result from the serve and you are putting away easy volleys?

yup, couldnt have put it better myself. I think my serve is my weapon. Even if my first serve is letting me down, I still have a good kicker that puts the reciever on the defensive anyway. I think for my volleys to be considered a true weapon I should be able to hit the lines at will and hit angle volleys more effectivley

 

[Ultra2HolyGrail]

yup, couldnt have put it better myself. I think my serve is my weapon. Even if my first serve is letting me down, I still have a good kicker that puts the reciever on the defensive anyway. I think for my volleys to be considered a true weapon I should be able to hit the lines at will and hit angle volleys more effectivley

That's cool. I would prefer to hit easy volleys myself, or none at all. Always love when the player misses. But if you play enough competition there's going to be players that will test you with their returns.

 

[onehandbh]

In general I think it's hard for someone to have their
volleys be their weapon in singles b/c you are dependent
on another shot (approach/serve) to get you to the net.
Very few players can just charge in and have their volleys
be effective. Edberg is probably one of the few players to
ever be able to consistently hit volleys from seemingly
defensive positions as winners or offensive volleys.
In theory it's possible for you to be pinned to the baseline
if an opponent is returning well and your first serve isn't
going in much. You "weapon" would then be taken out of
the equation.

It's good to have a FH be your weapon b/c even if your
opponent tries to hit to your BH you could still run around
it quite a bit to hit FH's. It's harder to run around your
FH to hit a BH.

 

[Ballinbob]

my forehand is garbage. But yeah, its nice to have a good forehand.edberg is my idol lol. Ive seriously been trying to emulate his game as much as possible. I started using twist/kick serves as both my serves after him.

 

[Ballinbob]

That's cool. I would prefer to hit easy volleys myself, or none at all. Always love when the player misses. But if you play enough competition there's going to be players that will test you with their returns.

yeah its nice to just fire off aces. Im hitting big twist serves now though, im not in to the harder serves as much now. I changed my 5ft kicker to a 6 ft kicker with a twist in 2 weeks, and this has been a more effective serve than my flat. It bounces 6ft high and away from reciever while allowing me time to cover the net. Right now this is my money serve. I played my friend today (hes a legit 4.5) and even he had trouble returning my twist. He told me it was a great serve and it really complimented my game, but he also said to hit some slice serves too to keep em honest. Anyway, Im really happy with my twist. This serve doesnt break down like my harder ones and is equally as damaging. This is my one and only weapon right here

 

[Ultra2HolyGrail]

my forehand is garbage. But yeah, its nice to have a good forehand.

Yup a solid forehand and backhand is nice to have. All depends on how good you want to get. But there are players that are tough to beat that don't have a great ground game, but trying to break their serve can be tough. If you are hitting big kicking serves there is no reason why you could not develop a killer forehand. Forehand should come easy if you can hit big kickers. But if you are always attacking the net you probably won't hit as many as a baseliner.

 

[snvplayer]

Yup a solid forehand and backhand is nice to have. All depends on how good you want to get. But there are players that are tough to beat that don't have a great ground game, but trying to break their serve can be tough. If you are hitting big kicking serves there is no reason why you could not develop a killer forehand. Forehand should come easy if you can hit big kickers. But if you are always attacking the net you probably won't hit as many as a baseliner.

There is no correlation between having a good kick serve and a good forehand.

Pat Rafter had a good kick serve but his ground game was pretty mediocre. The same goes for Stefan Edberg.

 

[NamRanger]

Yup a solid forehand and backhand is nice to have. All depends on how good you want to get. But there are players that are tough to beat that don't have a great ground game, but trying to break their serve can be tough. If you are hitting big kicking serves there is no reason why you could not develop a killer forehand. Forehand should come easy if you can hit big kickers. But if you are always attacking the net you probably won't hit as many as a baseliner.

The forehand for me is a fairly unnatural stroke. Sometimes it just doesn't happen. I will have to admit, I have a nasty dropshot though that makes up for my lack of skill from the baseline.

 

[Ballinbob]

Yup a solid forehand and backhand is nice to have. All depends on how good you want to get. But there are players that are tough to beat that don't have a great ground game, but trying to break their serve can be tough. If you are hitting big kicking serves there is no reason why you could not develop a killer forehand. Forehand should come easy if you can hit big kickers. But if you are always attacking the net you probably won't hit as many as a baseliner.

As much as I would love having a big forehand, I would have to agree with NamRanger and junbumkim that there is no correlation between kick serves and a forehand. The serve is just something I find natural and I find it strange that not all people have good serves. The way I look at it is: You control this stroke 100% and you have a chance to hurt your opponent with it but some people still don't practice it enough? When I first heard all my friends complaining they cant hit a kick serve that actualy made me go out and try and master it just so I could show off some. Also, i dont have many hitting partners so I go and serve by myself everyday I can. Of course you can look at it the other way with the forehand as well I guess. I know I will HAVE to develop at least a consistent ground game so I can compete at higher levels, which is what im aiming for now.

 

[wyutani]

Your volleys are a weapon. Your serve is a wildcard. Haha.

you are not serious aren\ you?????????

 

[Kaptain Karl]

Provactive question ...

In my opinion, a weapon is something that can put constant pressure on your opponent. So in this case, if your volleys always generates weak replies, then I would consider that your biggest weapon.

This is pretty good.

A weapon is something that you use to your advantage to win points from your opponent, and is an outstanding attribute, which is above the norm for your and your opponent's level.

I like this, too.

You cant say one day i have a weapon and the next day you dont. Weapon is something that is there 24/7.

Nonsense. Players *do* have days when what is normally a weapon ... is a dud.

If you are hitting big kicking serves there is no reason why you could not develop a killer forehand. Forehand should come easy if you can hit big kickers.

This makes no sense at all.

_____________

While reading this thread and thinking about the OP's question, the answer which came to me is ...

A "weapon" is any attribute of your game which compels your opponent to alter their game plan in an attempt to neutralize or defeat said weapon.

Using myself as an example ... sometimes it's just about "match-ups". I play an All Court game with an emphasis on Attack the Net. Against most players my serve, approaches and volleys are weapons. My Return is probably the "weak link" in my singles game. (It's one of my weapons in Dubs, though.)

I am told my serve is unreadable (because I hit all three of my serves from the same toss) and I can place it very well. My approach shots are really forcing; maybe being outright winners 20% of the time. My volleys are very strong, forcing and dependable.

I have a regular practice partner / friend who I have never beaten. And even he could not figure out why until we laughed about it after yet another 5-7, 4-6 defeat. Against most players, his weapons would be Serve, Return and Volley. But I don't match-up against him well....

His Return is honestly better than my Serve, which neutralizes that weapon of mine. But my Return (somewhat) neutralizes his Serve ... only because I have learned how to read his serve so well. I rarely get to use my Approach shots on him; he knows he must get to the net immediately to prevent that (and he is very quick vertically). Since both his Serve and his Return are strengths, he can beat me to the net. (If I S&V, he picks me apart; it's amazing!) We are "even" at the net, but he is able to get there before I do about 60% of the time ... so he wins the match-up battle and the match.)

He's "my Bill Tilden." (Tilden would attack his opponents strengths ... so all they had to fall back on were their weaknesses.)

He is the only person I've ever played who can "tee-off" on my Serve. It is astonishing ... and annoying. I love playing him because he is the Litmus Test for my game. (And he's goin' down one of these days...!)

 

[Ballinbob]

Thanks for sharing Karl. My serve often gets picked on when I play people with strong backhands as well as return games. My twist kicks to their backhand everytime which most people dont like, but these guys can put me on the defensive when I hit this serve. Luckily most people dont have both a good backhand and return though.

As for attacking peoples strengths, that sounds pretty risky