Is 30+ plus the new tennis peak age ?

octogon

Hall of Fame
And to add onto this; Mayweather kept boxing as long as he did because he was above every competitor - not because he was peaking later or some other arbitrary reason.
Mayweather could keep boxing at the level he did for as long he is, because like Bernard Hopkins, he treated his body like a temple. He doesn't drink, doesn't do any drugs, has the best nutritional advice and recovery programmes available to him.

You can have all the talent in the world, but your body ages like everyone else. Treating his body well, and advances in nutrition and sports science is what helped preserve Mayweather and Hopkins bodies, speed and reflexes for long than average.
 

Jonas78

Legend
Ages of Major Finalists 2017

AO (Federer 35, Nadal 30)
FO. (Nadal 31, Wawrinka 32)
W. (Federer 35, Cilic 27)
USO (Nadal 31, Anderson 31)
Only one player, Cilic (now 28) was under 30.

Still just an anomaly or a trend?

Right below them you have the now 28/29 year old I major winners, Juan Martin Del Potro and Marin Cilic who IMO can still pull a Major win in the right circumstances.

The "close but no cigar" Berdych(31) Monfils (31) Gasquet (31) Tsonga (32) could still conceivably reach Qtrs or even SF's next year...

The "lost generation" of Dimitrov, Raonic, etc now 26 still haven't won a Major.

So if the young bucks, say 25 or younger don't step up to the plate in Majors in 2018 and with Novak, Murray and Wawrinka, all returning rested and hopefully recuperated from injuries, turning 31 and 33 in the first half of the year, has the tennis peak age shifted?
It will (almost) get back to normal when big4 + Wawrinka retires.

Federer, Nadal, Djokovic, Murray, del Potro, etc all peaked way BEFORE 30. The reason they are still winning in a declined state is because of the crappy young generation(s). Sooner or later this will get back to normal.

When i say almost, it is because improvements in nutrition, surgery etc makes it possible for players to keep a high level longer.

Still, i see no reason why a young talent cant do what Djokovic did in 2011 at age 24.
 
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mike danny

Bionic Poster
Tennis & Snooker both seem to have followed this trend in recent years-Ronnie O'Sullivan, Mark Williams & John Higgins all winning major titles in their mid-late 30's & now in their 40's & a bunch of career journeymen like Stuart Bingham & Barry Hawkins suddenly winning them as well at a similar age. Most shocking was last season Mark King who had been around for 25 years winning his first ranking event aged 42 & Anthony Hamilton who has been around for the same length of time winning his first one aged 45-making him the second oldest ranking event winner in history & that prior one came in an era of nowhere near as much depth. Steve Davis won his last world title aged 31 & although he had his moments after that even well into his 50's he was never a serious contender after winning the Masters aged 39 in something of a fluke. The man who knocked him off his perch Stephen Hendry won his last world title aged 30 & although he remained a big contender struggled to win the big ones-his last ranking title coming at the age of 35.

Both are individual rather than team sports, both are long & grueling-taking a huge toll mentally & it seems that the older players know the tricks better than the youngsters who tend to choke at key moments.
O'Sullivan is not winning any more majors though. That Selby loss in 2014 in the final did him in.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
He won the UK the following season & was runner up last time, along with winning the last two Masters so this is patently not true.
By the way, I haven't followed Snooker closely enough, but I have seen Ronnie play and his style attracted me.

Why didn't Ronnie win any Crucible's between 2009 and 2012? Did he have outside issues?
 

1477aces

Hall of Fame
No, it's just that there is zero new talent coming in, are people really that naive to believe Federer and Nadal are THAT good ?
Imagine if Thiem/Zverev/Dmitrov/Raonic/Kryios actually lived up to expectations ?

Would they have split the 4 slams this year ?
doubt it ...
Zverev has plenty of time to live up to expectations ... he's 19 and likely to end the year top 3 or 4. So he choked in slams this year, plenty of very young players do that, including Fed! We can't even fully write off thiem and kyrgios imo, tho getting close there. The raonic nishikori dimitrov etc generation is a total failure tho. Worst of all time.
 
By the way, I haven't followed Snooker closely enough, but I have seen Ronnie play and his style attracted me.

Why didn't Ronnie win any Crucible's between 2009 and 2012? Did he have outside issues?
Mental health, his long potting went awol & he refused to adopt the safety game Ray Reardon had taught him in the early 2000's. He took a year off, has worked with a sports psychologist ever since, adopted that safety game & the rest is history.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Mental health, his long potting went awol & he refused to adopt the safety game Ray Reardon had taught him in the early 2000's. He took a year off, has worked with a sports psychologist ever since, adopted that safety game & the rest is history.
Do you think he will win Crucible again in the future?

And do you think he will at least equal Hendry's 7 Crucible titles?
 

Druss

Hall of Fame
Maradona was a drug cheat that used cocaine and amphetamines to keep up his energy on the field as he aged. Try again.

Zidane was not a striker. Matthaeus was not a striker. CR7 and Ibra are. Strikers in the past were supposed to be done at world class level by around 30. Defenders and midfielders, and especially goalkeepers, if they pace themselves correctly, can last a little bit longer.

Foreman was an outlier at the time. And he was out of shape and fat when he won his second world title, but still had the knockout power in his fists, which is the last thing to leave a heavyweight. Have you listened to Holyfield lately? He can barely string a sentence together. He fought too bloody long, like Ali. Heavyweights don't lose knockout power so can still win at an older age, but their defense relexes goes to hell, and they end up punch-drunk. Mayweather and Hopkins were lean, mean fighting machines at an advanced age, who did not take much punishment. It's not the same thing at all.
Maradona had an issue with cocaine, a recreational drug not exactly doping. That had nothing to do with his skills and ability to play into his 30's. He was a genius and one of the top 3 footballers of all time. You could go on and on but you are not going to convince me that 30s is the new peak.

If you can honestly think that Nadal and Federer are playing as well as they did 10 years ago, then seriously, you have no idea about tennis and I can't take you seriously.
 

sarmpas

Hall of Fame
Old Pete was in far worse shape than the aging stars of today. Of all the ATGs you could mention, I'd say Pete suffered as much as any from lacking all the advantages aging players have today.
Federer's an extreme outlier, something you fail to acknowledge. To qualify as a trend it needs to happen for at least a few cycles/generations.
 

octogon

Hall of Fame
Maradona had an issue with cocaine, a recreational drug not exactly doping. That had nothing to do with his skills and ability to play into his 30's. He was a genius and one of the top 3 footballers of all time. You could go on and on but you are not going to convince me that 30s is the new peak.

If you can honestly think that Nadal and Federer are playing as well as they did 10 years ago, then seriously, you have no idea about tennis and I can't take you seriously.
Maradona was doping as he aged. He tested positive for ephedrine at the 1994 world cup, which is a performance enhancing drug that boosts energy, increases strength and reduces fatigue. He was sent home from the world cup for doping.It had everything to with his ability to play into his 30's, because he was taking shortcuts to stay fit and competitive. His talent alone wasn't enough. If you are going to pretend to know what you are talking about, at least get your facts straight. He was both a recreational cokehead AND a deliberate doper.

Who the hell said Nadal and Federer are as good as they were a decade ago? That's you saying that, not me. Sports sciences and nutrition can extend your ability to perform at the highest level. I never claimed that they would be beating faster, younger, stronger versions of themselves. Only that they can maintain a high enough level of strength, recovery and fitness as they age, to basically still be better than most of the field. Whereas 20 years ago, their level after 30 may have completely dropped of a cliff to the point where they'd struggle to keep up with top 10 players.
 
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