Pro's racquet from Thailand open

[____]

As one of the tournament organizer team,I was able to walk around the players , the stringer area and the practicing court.Here are what I found....

1.Tursunov use 98 sq inches 18 x 20 Head(No Flexpoint hole) with a K six one paint job.

2.Danai Udomchoke use a stock Aerogel 300 without any customization, no lead at all.

3.Karlovic does use a real Flexpoint instinct.His grip is very large,around 5.
His backhand is definitely way better than any club player.

4.Verdasco uses T-Fight 320 with the six middle main strings strung tighter than others.

5. Berdich's racquet is not Aerogel 200,just a paint job.He also built up the buttcap

6.Every pros I saw toss the ball in front for a kick second serve.No one toss it above their head.

 

[sharp*shooter]

lol... right

 

[Richie Rich]

2.Danai Udomchoke use a stock Aerogel 300 without any customization, no lead at all.

uh-huh. if you can't see lead it's either in the handle, under the bumper or his layup is not stock. no way a pro uses such a light frame - especially since the guy used to use a ncode 95 18x20 (or at least a pj of one) which is much heavier than the AG300

 

[therogerfan]

uh-huh. if you can't see lead it's either in the handle, under the bumper or his layup is not stock. no way a pro uses such a light frame - especially since the guy used to use a ncode 95 18x20 (or at least a pj of one) which is much heavier than the AG300

He used a wilson nsix-one team with quite a bit of lead

 

[Fedace]

uh-huh. if you can't see lead it's either in the handle, under the bumper or his layup is not stock. no way a pro uses such a light frame - especially since the guy used to use a ncode 95 18x20 (or at least a pj of one) which is much heavier than the AG300

He may have noticed the weight is very light also, if there is lots of lead under the grommets, the racket must feel much heavier. I have to assume this gentleman would notice that ?? But one thing i wonder about is Aerogel 300 is very powerful frame, and not sure how he can control it, even with some added lead.

 

[Fedace]

As one of the tournament organizer team,I was able to walk around the players , the stringer area and the practicing court.Here are what I found....

1.Tursunov use 98 sq inches 18 x 20 Head(No Flexpoint hole) with a K six one paint job.

3.Karlovic does use a real Flexpoint instinct.His grip is very large,around 5.
His backhand is definitely way better than any club player.

4.Verdasco uses T-Fight 320 with the six middle main strings strung tighter than others.

Karlovic's backhand is still better than 99% of any college players. Karlovic's grip size is actually bigger than size 5. He is also a guy that uses a fairly powerful racket.

 

[LarougeNY]

He may have noticed the weight is very light also, if there is lots of lead under the grommets, the racket must feel much heavier. I have to assume this gentleman would notice that ?? But one thing i wonder about is Aerogel 300 is very powerful frame, and not sure how he can control it, even with some added lead.

Its not that powerful of a racket. If strung in the upper 50s and lower 60s the racket isn't very powerful, about the equivalent of an mspeed strung in the mid 50s, which isn't very powerful. IMO, it was about even with the radical I tried out, and barely more powerful than the fxp prestige MP I tried.

Plus, the guys a pro. no question of controlling things, his life essentially revolves around tennis, so I'm sure controlling the racket won't be a problem.

 

[____]

That's what Danai told me in person and I was very surprised.
I think he knew so he let me swing 3 of his Aerogel 300.
I also ask him about his old stick lead and he said he doesn't need it for an AE 300.

I did swing many lower rank pro's racquets and many of them were pretty normal in weight.Not as heavy as I expected.

Danai's former racquet is N six one TEAM and then a K six one TEAM for a short period with lead added at 12.00.I used to post their pics on this forum.

 

[LPShanet]

2.Danai Udomchoke use a stock Aerogel 300 without any customization, no lead at all.

Although I don't know Udomchoke personally, I find it impossible to believe that he uses a racquet with no modification. Here's why: Even if he finds the stock spec of the Aerogel 300 perfect without any modification, the tolerances of making racquets mean that no two frames that come off the main Dunlop line are exactly the same in weight, balance and swingweight. So to get frames that exactly matched each other, he'd at least have to add some lead or modify the other frames to match the one he deemed his "favorite". And there's no way a pro at his level is playing without matching his frames to each other...they're just too inconsistent, and he'd feel the difference. He may refer to his frames as being "stock", but they're still being modified at least a little bit, if not a lot.

 

[LPShanet]

Although I don't know Udomchoke personally, I find it impossible to believe that he uses a racquet with no modification. Here's why: Even if he finds the stock spec of the Aerogel 300 perfect without any modification, the tolerances of making racquets mean that no two frames that come off the main Dunlop line are exactly the same in weight, balance and swingweight. So to get frames that exactly matched each other, he'd at least have to add some lead or modify the other frames to match the one he deemed his "favorite". And there's no way a pro at his level is playing without matching his frames to each other...they're just too inconsistent, and he'd feel the difference. He may refer to his frames as being "stock", but they're still being modified at least a little bit, if not a lot.

(It's also possible that the folks at Dunlop's pro room are doing the work for him in-house so that there isn't cosmetic evidence of having tweaked them to match.)

 

[snvplayer]

(It's also possible that the folks at Dunlop's pro room are doing the work for him in-house so that there isn't cosmetic evidence of having tweaked them to match.)

believe or not, some pros aren't sensitive to little differences among the same frames.

I remember when Pete Sampras' old stringer was invited to talk on this forum and he mentioned how some of the pros will literally walk into the shop, buy a racket and start playing with it. Obviously no names were disclosed. He also mentioned some pros aren't sensitive to small differences among the frames. Some are a lot more senstive about how their grip feels and stuff.

 

[Azzurri]

I am amazed how some of you think you know something about a players racquet and try to argue with someone THAT WAS THERE and FELT the RACQUET and TALKED to the PRO. Some of you live in fantasy land.

Thanks for the post OP.

 

[saram]

I am amazed how some of you think you know something about a players racquet and try to argue with someone THAT WAS THERE and FELT the RACQUET and TALKED to the PRO. Some of you live in fantasy land.

Thanks for the post OP.

!!!!!

 

[djsiva]

As one of the tournament organizer team,I was able to walk around the players , the stringer area and the practicing court.Here are what I found....

1.Tursunov use 98 sq inches 18 x 20 Head(No Flexpoint hole) with a K six one paint job.

2.Danai Udomchoke use a stock Aerogel 300 without any customization, no lead at all.

3.Karlovic does use a real Flexpoint instinct.His grip is very large,around 5.
His backhand is definitely way better than any club player.

4.Verdasco uses T-Fight 320 with the six middle main strings strung tighter than others.

5. Berdich's racquet is not Aerogel 200,just a paint job.He also built up the buttcap

6.Every pros I saw toss the ball in front for a kick second serve.No one toss it above their head.

Where did you ever get the idea pros toss behind them for kick?

Even Edberg tossed in front for kick.

Must be from some outdated textbook. Lots of tennis books and teaching pros are so wrong when it comes to mechanics.

 

[djsiva]

believe or not, some pros aren't sensitive to little differences among the same frames.

I remember when Pete Sampras' old stringer was invited to talk on this forum and he mentioned how some of the pros will literally walk into the shop, buy a racket and start playing with it. Obviously no names were disclosed. He also mentioned some pros aren't sensitive to small differences among the frames. Some are a lot more senstive about how their grip feels and stuff.

Its not that pros aren't sensitive. They adapt their swing to the racket. They are that good. Whenever I break a string, I just go to Good Will and pick up another wood racket and play until the string breaks or or the racket cracks.

No big deal. The grip size is probably the most important parameter.

 

[PurePrestige]

Not all pro's have rackets with matched specs, whether its done from the pro room or an outside company.
It was said once that Volandri just wanted the same amount of lead at the same spots on the frame on each racket. Even though the starting specs were different he just put the same amount of weight on each from stock.
So if he likes it stock he probably plays with the various stock specs that come off the line. He doesn't necessarily have to have any customization, only the top pro's have perfectly matched rackets etc. that's why they're at the top. Consistency in their rackets, training, and all of that.

 

[Azzurri]

Its not that pros aren't sensitive. They adapt their swing to the racket. They are that good. Whenever I break a string, I just go to Good Will and pick up another wood racket and play until the string breaks or or the racket cracks.

No big deal. The grip size is probably the most important parameter.

what's your point?

 

[Richie Rich]

(It's also possible that the folks at Dunlop's pro room are doing the work for him in-house so that there isn't cosmetic evidence of having tweaked them to match.)

that is what i was thinking. then again, who knows for sure? he could use a stock AG300. i find it very hard to believe that he would but it is possible.

 

[tennispro11]

Where did you ever get the idea pros toss behind them for kick?

Even Edberg tossed in front for kick.

Must be from some outdated textbook. Lots of tennis books and teaching pros are so wrong when it comes to mechanics.

How do you know that is true? Have you seen the manuals for the USPTA? I seriously doubt this since you think teaching pro's are wrong when it comes to mechanics.

 

[hoosierbr]

Edberg and Pat Rafter, both true blue serve-and-volleyers who used a mean kick serve to set up their volleys most of the time, tossed the ball in front of them. Edberg's toss was well into the court, more so than Rafter's.

Edberg got the spin on his serve from his exaggerated grip and his knee bend. There's some clips on youtube from a 1990 match he played in L.A. against Sampras where Vitas Gerulaitis, who was commentating, broke down Edberg's serve in slow motion. Great stuff.

 

[LPShanet]

I am amazed how some of you think you know something about a players racquet and try to argue with someone THAT WAS THERE and FELT the RACQUET and TALKED to the PRO. Some of you live in fantasy land.

Thanks for the post OP.

Fair enough, and I appreciate the post, too. But based on the tone of your response, I'm guessing you may have spent less time than I have both playing on the circuit and stringing, customizing and gripping racquets for the pros. The reason that I felt bold enough to make that assumption is based on personal experience and statistics. What you failed to recognize is that many pros who claim to use stock frames aren't telling the truth, but are doing so out of respect for their racquet contract and sponsor relationships. When a celebrity (for argument's sake, Michael Jackson) says they've had little or no plastic surgery, do you always believe them, too? As for picking up a racquet and "feeling" it, that means nothing. That's why we use machines such as the RDC. You can't necessarily tell whether a racquet is stock just from how it feels when you pick it up. It's true that some pros care more than others about matching frames, but the number that don't care is shrinking rapidly.

Getting the report on this chain is indeed useful and interesting, and I simply said that I'd be surprised if things were as Udomchoke said. Not impossible, just surprising. And I'd still be surprised. Feel free to flame me.

 

[paulfreda]

I was at the Thailand Open too and talked to one of the doubles twins ... he was also playing with the AG300 stock. I was astonished that he did not need any setup for it at all. I specifically asked him if the factory put any lead in for him and he said no ... eye to eye.

He also told me he and Danai and several other Thais switched from Wilson because the Thailand LTA chaiman made a deal with Dunlop. This also surprised me that a pro would switch frames just because of politics. I guess it is true that they are so good they can adapt to nearly any frame.

Finally, Wilson for the first time in 3 years was not represented with a booth at the Open. There was a distributor with product, but Wilson was not there like Prince, Yonex, Babolot and Fischer. Guess Wilson was angry about being dropped by the Thai pros. Also the K Factor frames are still not available here in Bangkok nearly a year after their release.

 

[anirut]

Hi Paul! It's been long since we last conversed.

Anyhow, IMO, Thais don't normally mod or customize their rackets. Very few of them would be brave enough to "screw up" a racket. Also, not many of them are on this board, so the knowledge is not spread around. Even those who know about it, they're still very reluctant.

Not many of them are be as crazy as I am ...

Well ... I think ALL of us here can actually play a stock racket well to very well ... It's just "in the blood" of TT-ers that we customize. Racket mod is an epidemic of this board ...

 

[Alafter]

I was at the Thailand Open too and talked to one of the doubles twins ... he was also playing with the AG300 stock. I was astonished that he did not need any setup for it at all. I specifically asked him if the factory put any lead in for him and he said no ... eye to eye.

He also told me he and Danai and several other Thais switched from Wilson because the Thailand LTA chaiman made a deal with Dunlop. This also surprised me that a pro would switch frames just because of politics. I guess it is true that they are so good they can adapt to nearly any frame.

Finally, Wilson for the first time in 3 years was not represented with a booth at the Open. There was a distributor with product, but Wilson was not there like Prince, Yonex, Babolot and Fischer. Guess Wilson was angry about being dropped by the Thai pros. Also the K Factor frames are still not available here in Bangkok nearly a year after their release.

Actually Paul, I talked to a couple of sellers, shopkeepers etc (cause sometimes these people are full of crap and I want to see if everybody's tall tale matches).

Here is the common picture:

-Wilson in thailand is distributed by this company called Amer (dont know the full name, they just keep saying Amer Amer)
-Amer hold sole license to distribute Wilson racquets in Thailand. The license will last a couple more years. No other company will be able to have the license to sell Wilson.
-Some kind of Wilson Asia group thought Wilson sticks are sselling too cheaply in Thailand (Thailand is bst seller in Asia btw) and wanted to raise price for wilson sticks in thailand.
-Amer disagreed and refused to raise price.
-Amer and Wilson Overseas got into an argument
-Wilson played hardball and said screw Thailand, you guys aint nothin
-Amer said fine, then your Wilson thailand is screwed since i have the monopoly license for distributing Wilson racquets in thailand
-Amer quickly switched to distribute and promote Dunlop stuffs.
-Wilson racquets will be gone until
1. Wilson give in to Amer
2. Amer sells the monopoly license to someone else
3. Amer license expires

I know you're a Wilson fan, so sorry to tell you this

 

[Alafter]

Hi Paul! It's been long since we last conversed.

Anyhow, IMO, Thais don't normally mod or customize their rackets. Very few of them would be brave enough to "screw up" a racket. Also, not many of them are on this board, so the knowledge is not spread around. Even those who know about it, they're still very reluctant.

Not many of them are be as crazy as I am ...

Well ... I think ALL of us here can actually play a stock racket well to very well ... It's just "in the blood" of TT-ers that we customize. Racket mod is an epidemic of this board ...

Waddee krub P'. Chee-wit pen yung rai barng krub? Laew hua-lai hai jeb laew yung?

 

[anirut]

Alafter ... I'll drop ya a call ... in five minutes after this post ...

 

[paulfreda]

Alafter
Thanks for the low down on Wilson. It is too bad about this disagreement and I hope they resolve it quickly.

Anirut
Yes its been a while. Did you know that the Silom courts where we hit last year are no longer open ? They were sold and Condo's will be built there I am told. Uhgggg ...
Are you going out to see Venus and Jancovic at the WTA tourney this week ?

 

[anirut]

Paul,
Too bad, eh? Condo's all over BKK. And that plot of land must have been like what price, at such a strategic location? Unimaginable!

 

[____]

Do I know you guys?

 

[paulfreda]

Maybe

Do I know you guys?

If you are in Port Washington, why should we in Bangkok know you ?

 

[AlpineCadet]

That's a good question, lol.

 

[____]

Cause I work in BKK for a couple of years now.

 

[Alafter]

Eh, still, even then, the chances that we know you are still ultra slim-jim.

 

[anirut]

Cause I work in BKK for a couple of years now.

Why not drop me, or one of us, a mail, then? It'd be great to make four of us, to have some doubles fun.

 

[Volleydropshot]

Actually Paul, I talked to a couple of sellers, shopkeepers etc (cause sometimes these people are full of crap and I want to see if everybody's tall tale matches).

Here is the common picture:

-Wilson in thailand is distributed by this company called Amer (dont know the full name, they just keep saying Amer Amer)
-Amer hold sole license to distribute Wilson racquets in Thailand. The license will last a couple more years. No other company will be able to have the license to sell Wilson.
-Some kind of Wilson Asia group thought Wilson sticks are sselling too cheaply in Thailand (Thailand is bst seller in Asia btw) and wanted to raise price for wilson sticks in thailand.
-Amer disagreed and refused to raise price.
-Amer and Wilson Overseas got into an argument
-Wilson played hardball and said screw Thailand, you guys aint nothin
-Amer said fine, then your Wilson thailand is screwed since i have the monopoly license for distributing Wilson racquets in thailand
-Amer quickly switched to distribute and promote Dunlop stuffs.
-Wilson racquets will be gone until
1. Wilson give in to Amer
2. Amer sells the monopoly license to someone else
3. Amer license expires

I know you're a Wilson fan, so sorry to tell you this

That doesn't sound too logical. If you didn't know (apparently so), Amer owns Wilson. Amer is a Finnish company and owns a bunch of other brands too (Salomon, Precor, Atomic to name a few). Anyhow, I don't think Amer would be against raising the prices of Wilson rackets in Asia...and Amer would not promote any Dunlop stuff, obviously.

If interested, here's more info about the corporation:
http://www.amer.fi/

 

[samster]

Actually Paul, I talked to a couple of sellers, shopkeepers etc (cause sometimes these people are full of crap and I want to see if everybody's tall tale matches).

Here is the common picture:

-Wilson in thailand is distributed by this company called Amer (dont know the full name, they just keep saying Amer Amer)
-Amer hold sole license to distribute Wilson racquets in Thailand. The license will last a couple more years. No other company will be able to have the license to sell Wilson.
-Some kind of Wilson Asia group thought Wilson sticks are sselling too cheaply in Thailand (Thailand is bst seller in Asia btw) and wanted to raise price for wilson sticks in thailand.
-Amer disagreed and refused to raise price.
-Amer and Wilson Overseas got into an argument
-Wilson played hardball and said screw Thailand, you guys aint nothin
-Amer said fine, then your Wilson thailand is screwed since i have the monopoly license for distributing Wilson racquets in thailand
-Amer quickly switched to distribute and promote Dunlop stuffs.
-Wilson racquets will be gone until
1. Wilson give in to Amer
2. Amer sells the monopoly license to someone else
3. Amer license expires

I know you're a Wilson fan, so sorry to tell you this

Alafter, that's a great play-by-play. You should consider working for ESPN...All the way!

 

[Alafter]

That doesn't sound too logical. If you didn't know (apparently so), Amer owns Wilson. Amer is a Finnish company and owns a bunch of other brands too (Salomon, Precor, Atomic to name a few). Anyhow, I don't think Amer would be against raising the prices of Wilson rackets in Asia...and Amer would not promote any Dunlop stuff, obviously.

If interested, here's more info about the corporation:
http://www.amer.fi/

Nope I didn't know Amer owns Wilson. On the other hand, I don't know anything about this company I wrote as "Amer" either. Whether it belongs to the company you are talking about, or if there is only one company called Amer in the world, I do not know. And even if it is the Amer you talk about, I don't know anything about their internal company structure, but I'd say internal conflict within a big company group is always possible.

 

[Volleydropshot]

Nope I didn't know Amer owns Wilson. On the other hand, I don't know anything about this company I wrote as "Amer" either. Whether it belongs to the company you are talking about, or if there is only one company called Amer in the world, I do not know. And even if it is the Amer you talk about, I don't know anything about their internal company structure, but I'd say internal conflict within a big company group is always possible.

True mate, it could be that Wilson and the "corporate" have some sort of dispute over there.

 

[Alafter]

True mate, it could be that Wilson and the "corporate" have some sort of dispute over there.

Turns out it is the same Amer as mentioned by you, but it's a thai subsidiary. Now only one thing left to verify--are they the ones selling dunlop.

 

[galain]

True mate, it could be that Wilson and the "corporate" have some sort of dispute over there.

Is that Veili Paloheimo????

 

[Volleydropshot]

Is that Veili Paloheimo????

Sorry to answer to you so late, I didn't notice your question until I checked some old threads.

No, I'm not Veli Paloheimo - I wish I was that good of a tennis player