underground
G.O.A.T.
:lol: All Raonic did was hitting I/O FHs to Djokovic's BH, despite Novak standing there and waiting for the ball to arrive (see 1st set SP). Not to mention the countless UEs and brain cramps he did in that match.
Rankings scenarios for YE#1 in 2014
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:lol: All Raonic did was hitting I/O FHs to Djokovic's BH, despite Novak standing there and waiting for the ball to arrive (see 1st set SP). Not to mention the countless UEs and brain cramps he did in that match.
falstaff78
Hall of Fame
Yes that is correct.
Djokovic is 1160 points ahead net net.
Maximum points Fed can win from Wtf = 1500
Maximum points Fed can win from DC = 225
Total = 1725
Less Djokovic's lead = 565
Winning 2RR + semi: 2x200 + 400 = 800
Winning 1RR + semi (unlikely): 200 + 400 = 600
Winning 3RR = 3 x 200 = 600
Motor city
New User
Even if you aren't a Djokovic or Federer fan it's certainly good for the sport to have drama and story lines.
I think the Paris victory locked Novak in for #1 but there is still excitement in the unknown.
I would like to see Fed/ Djoker final at WTF. That would cap a great season and if Fed wins but Djoker ends year as 1 that will make for great off season talk for AO.
I think the Paris victory locked Novak in for #1 but there is still excitement in the unknown.
I would like to see Fed/ Djoker final at WTF. That would cap a great season and if Fed wins but Djoker ends year as 1 that will make for great off season talk for AO.
falstaff78
Hall of Fame
Oh rookie! You have devastated Federer's entire fanbase with your genius of authorship and sarcasm! Your wit is truly like a sword!
One thing confuses me though. Since you are obviously a higher intelligence I'm surprised you haven't realized that your post is actually a compliment.
You see, when most players are 33 their fanbases are looking...searching...seeking...for NEW PLAYERS TO SUPPORT. But here we Fed fans have the good fortune of reaching...grasping..clinging..hoping..praying FOR THE FREAKING YEAR END NUMBER 1.
How could such an elementary thought fail to occur to someone as smart as you? Befuddling!
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underground
G.O.A.T.
If Fed does grab YE #1 I guess the most likely of the situation will be Djokovic losing to an on fire Stan/Cilic in the group stages and then getting knocked out by Fed himself in the semis.
Djokovic2011
Bionic Poster
But if Federer were to beat Nole in the semis, that would mean he must've lost a match in the group stages and I thought he'd have to win WTF without losing a match, as well as Davis Cup, to finish YE#1???
But if Federer were to beat Nole in the semis, that would mean he must've lost a match in the group stages and I thought he'd have to win WTF without losing a match, as well as Davis Cup, to finish YE#1???
Fed sweeps the prelims and Djoker takes 2nd in prelims, they would meet in the semis. 1 in Group 1 vs 2 in Group 2, and vice versa.
powerangle
Legend
But if Federer were to beat Nole in the semis, that would mean he must've lost a match in the group stages and I thought he'd have to win WTF without losing a match, as well as Davis Cup, to finish YE#1???
Well, pretty much this:
I guess that IS the most likely scenario for Fed to sneak out the YE#1. If it's going to happen, it's probably going to happen that way.
Novak just needs to be (and I hope he will be) super sharp and take care of every single RR match and then just clinch it right then and there.
veroniquem
Bionic Poster
This whole thing is beyond ridiculous. Djoko has 5 tier 1 titles this season. There shouldn't be any scenario in which a guy with 2 master titles in all can troll him for #1 at the last minute. The rankings are every kind of wrong if they allow that kind of nonsense to happen. The only positive I see is that the ATP will have to confront how wrong it is if it happens, which means they will have to do something about it to retain some credibility with their ranking system.
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
No one is beating Novak at WTF in his group. Change that. I dont even see him lose a set.
Strobe Lights
Semi-Pro
Unless something strange happens with Novak, he will get the results he requires to be YE#1 and he really does deserve it given his results this year.
As a Fed fan, it would feel like a bit of a hollow ranking given Novak's clearly superior season. But given Fed's age and the fact that Novak has done so well this season, it is incredible that this is even a possibility and shows how consistent Fed has been.
I think the ranking system is fine. This is just one of those anomalous situations that will sometimes occur.
I don't care about YE#1 more than just being #1. Let Pete keep that one record. I would far prefer if Fed was to get the ranking back, that it was done by the highly unlikely scenario of him winning the WTF and then the AO.
As a Fed fan, it would feel like a bit of a hollow ranking given Novak's clearly superior season. But given Fed's age and the fact that Novak has done so well this season, it is incredible that this is even a possibility and shows how consistent Fed has been.
I think the ranking system is fine. This is just one of those anomalous situations that will sometimes occur.
I don't care about YE#1 more than just being #1. Let Pete keep that one record. I would far prefer if Fed was to get the ranking back, that it was done by the highly unlikely scenario of him winning the WTF and then the AO.
It is a little ridiculous, but it's the first time anything like this has even gotten close to happening since they changed the points system in 2008/2009 (I forget which). In any case, it's not going to happen. Djokovic completely owns Berdych and Cilic, and Wawrinka can barely win a match these days. Not to mention Federer has to hold up his end of the bargain as well, which he failed to do in Paris.
Devil's_Advocate
Banned
Can't believe people are still worrying about this. Federer lost his shot when he lost to Raonic in Paris. Djokovic has the YE#1. The most likely way for Federer to get to #1 would be to win the 2015 AO (which will be very tough). I think he has his chances of getting to #1 till after Wimbledon next year, but it's not going to happen after that.
FEDERERNADAL13
Legend
Novak made 7 finals. 4 masters titles and 1 grandslam title, in addition to a final.
Roger made 10 finals. 2 masters titles, 3 finals, and 1 grandslam final.
These two aren't as far apart as you like to make it sound. Should Roger win the WTF (a big if), it would get even closer.
The ranking system isn't at fault. If anything, blame Novak for not beating Roger in Dubai, Monte Carlo, or Shanghai. Any of those wins would either make it a moot point or almost a moot point.
veroniquem
Bionic Poster
They are VERY far apart. Fed didn't make 10 tier 1 events finals. 3 out of his 5 titles are minor. It is beyond me how anyone could claim that 2 master titles is even remotely close to 1 slam + 4 master titles. It's not even half!!!
As for consistency, it's not like Djoko hasn't been. It's not like he has skipped a slam or lost in a slam in early rounds like Nadal in 2013. I guess he's paying the high price for getting injured in M-C and missing Madrid. (Still the 2 slam finals back to back should have made up for that).
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
You should be happy Fed did not play Madrid and tanked Rome.
veroniquem
Bionic Poster
Actually, Fed made exactly the same # of tier 1 events finals as Djoko: 6. The difference is that Djoko won 5 out of the 6 while Fed LOST 4 out of the 6!!!
veroniquem
Bionic Poster
Fed didn't play Madrid??? I didn't even remember. So it's not that. Madrid should make 0 difference. Fed hasn't even been significantly more consistent than Djoko.
The change I am proposing to the ranking system is: if (and only if) the point differential is minimal, then the #1 should go to the guy with a slam title. Easy to implement and much more fair.
Devil's_Advocate
Banned
Why not just make it so that the #1 should have a Slam title? If he doesn't, the highest ranked Slam-winner will get the #1. Either way, the system is what it is, and Federer will be a deserving #1 if he gets there, which he most likely won't.
veroniquem
Bionic Poster
That's my beef, that he wouldn't really DESERVE it but yeah the system is what it is and it's too late to change anything this year. I will settle for the adjective another poster used in this thread: "hollow" #1 (if it happens).
Tennis_Hands
Banned
You are incompetent, so it doesn't matter what you have to say.
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
What is the point differential you propose ?
Fed is ahead of slam winner Stan /Cilic by 4000 points and Rafa by 2000 points.
Yeah, if Djokovic had had a year more like Nadal's (win a slam, one masters, and a couple other tournaments), Federer would be way ahead. Then it shouldn't be unreasonable for a person without a slam to finish number one (unless anyone thinks it's unreasonable for Federer to be ahead of Nadal as things stand).
Still, though, 2 Masters + the WTF is nowhere close to a slam and four Masters. On the off chance that Federer does finish number one, I think it's still clear that Djokovic had the better season, regardless of what the points say.
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
ATP values both achievement and consistency , whereas fans are swayed over by achievement and ignore consistency.
Yeah, but it's not like Djokovic has been inconsistent. He had a rough patch before the U.S. Open, but those are his only early losses.
veroniquem
Bionic Poster
Neither Cilic nor Rafa are up for #1. It's between Djoko and Fed and I think the point difference could be less than 200.
veroniquem
Bionic Poster
There is a difference between "ignoring" and letting consistency take complete precedence.
Tennis_Hands
Banned
@all the crybabies
What does "YE#1" stands for?
What does "YE#1" stands for?
From 2008, Federer reached #1 only if Nadal was injured or Djokovic and Nadal kinda burned out competing each other.
We might want to weight more points on slams but it's also due to current
dynamics of tour at the top 3 or 4.
Nadal injured and not much of a force, Djokovic kinda absent after Wimbledon
and marriage, Murray down after back surgery.
So it's not a big surprise Federer can lurk for #1 spot.
Look at new guys like Cilic, Raonic and Nishikori rising.
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Tennis_Hands
Banned
What happened in 2012?
veroniquem
Bionic Poster
Djoko was not exactly "absent" after W. He made 2 semis and won 2 titles. (Fed didn't do any better than him at USO which was the main event after W)
It is a huge surprise that 2 master titles is enough to overcome someone with 1 slam and 4 master titles. If THAT is not a huge surprise, I really don't know what could be...
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