Synthetic Gut Question

[WhereIsMacMac]

I know almost all synthetic gut strings are pretty much the same, but which of these plays closest to Gosen OG Sheep Micro? Prince Original Synthetic Gut?

a. Babolat
b. Dunlop
c. Gamma
d. Head
e. Toalson

Thanks in advance for your feedback

 

[Chotobaka]

You can probably easily find a Toa analog since they are made in the same factory. Same for all Gamma synthetics. Ditto for some Head and Dunlop (if the packages are marked "Made In Japan"). There is not going to be a lot of variance in basic synthetic gut with the same solid core/single wrap construction.

 

[THESEXPISTOL]

Wilson Extreme Synthetic Gut plays the closest to Gosen OGSM.

 

[The forehand]

Does anybody have any comparisons between basic synthetic gut and cheap multifilaments such as Clay court plus or Gutex Ultra. Also which synthetic gut stays crisp the long as Wilson ESG tends to die quickly.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

You can probably easily find a Toa analog since they are made in the same factory. Same for all Gamma synthetics. Ditto for some Head and Dunlop (if the packages are marked "Made In Japan"). There is not going to be a lot of variance in basic synthetic gut with the same solid core/single wrap construction.

Did I read that right? Gosen, Toalson and Gamma are made in the same factory?

 

[Chotobaka]

Did I read that right? Gosen, Toalson and Gamma are made in the same factory?

Gamma distributes Toalson strings under the Gamma brand name. Gosen and Toalson strings have been made under the same roof for decades. They are part of the same ownership group and although the OG stands for Osaka Gosen, the manufacturing facility has been located on Kyushu since the 50's.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Gamma distributes Toalson strings under the Gamma brand name. Gosen and Toalson strings have been made under the same roof for decades. They are part of the same ownership group and although the OG stands for Osaka Gosen, the manufacturing facility has been located on Kyushu since the 50's.

So I'll be basically its the same string? Like the case of the natural gut of Babolat, Prince and Wilson? (except Prince and Wilson are using the old formula)

 

[Chotobaka]

So I'll be basically its the same string? Like the case of the natural gut of Babolat, Prince and Wilson? (except Prince and Wilson are using the old formula)

If you find strings with the same construction, they should be very similar. Bear in mind that Toalson and Gosen are two separate entities, or sister companies, with ownership connections through a corporate group. That said, they share R&D and manufacturing in the same facilities (crossover production within Gosen and Toalson brands). A simple solid core, single wrap string just does not have a whole lot of room for differences other than the resiliency of the nylon and perhaps anti-abrasion treatment of the wrap.

Edit: Are you having a problem finding Gosen where you are located? It is pretty ubiquitous stuff.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

If you find strings with the same construction, they should be very similar. Bear in mind that Toalson and Gosen are two separate entities, or sister companies, with ownership connections through a corporate group. That said, they share R&D and manufacturing in the same facilities (crossover production within Gosen and Toalson brands). A simple solid core, single wrap string just does not have a whole lot of room for differences other than the resiliency of the nylon and perhaps anti-abrasion treatment of the wrap.

Edit: Are you having a problem finding Gosen where you are located? It is pretty ubiquitous stuff.

I did not know that they're sister companies. What I know is that they're both made in Japan.

Yes, no Gosen here, unfortunately. No Prince Original Synthetic Gut either.

 

[Chotobaka]

I did not know that they're sister companies. What I know is that they're both made in Japan.

Yes, no Gosen here, unfortunately. No Prince Original Synthetic Gut either.

You might want to try Gamma Synthetic Gut or Gamma Wear-Guard SG if they are available in your area. These are great quality and reasonably priced Japanese made strings.

 

[sm01]

Thanks for the info Chotobaka. Do you know how Leoina fits into the equation? I used 66 then 77 for a number of years back in the 70s.

Also, Klip sells Gosen on their AU site. Related?

Thanks

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

You might want to try Gamma Synthetic Gut or Gamma Wear-Guard SG if they are available in your area. These are great quality and reasonably priced Japanese made strings.

I think I saw that one a while ago on my local tennis shop, I'll give it a go. Which one do you prefer? The one with wear guard or the original?

 

[Radicalized]

Gamma Synthetic Gut WITHOUT wearguard.

For Dunlop, use S-gut in black for a more crispy feel. I like the feel of black a bit more than white, and when stringing yourself, the white feels annoyingly "waxy."

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Gamma Synthetic Gut WITHOUT wearguard.



For Dunlop, use S-gut in black for a more crispy feel. I like the feel of black a bit more than white, and when stringing yourself, the white feels annoyingly "waxy."

Ever tried another color of the Dunlop?

 

[Radicalized]

Ever tried another color of the Dunlop?

No. I've never ordered or had a request (few of those anyway as I don't string for clients in the true sense of the word). I generally stick with the basic colors. I think the slight difference between the two would make me think more black given what I thought you were going for. Some people don't like black string.

I will add that they most likely (the other colors) would be similarly towards the crisp side "relative" to others. Sometimes a shop might only carry the more basic colors.

Right now, I like Genesis Blizzard (synthetic gut), but that isn't a brand/option on your list.

The Dunlop I have is made in China. A softer type like Technifibre Syn Gut is made in Taiwan.

All of these range from $3.50 to about $4 US.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

No. I've never ordered or had a request (few of those anyway as I don't string for clients in the true sense of the word). I generally stick with the basic colors. I think the slight difference between the two would make me think more black given what I thought you were going for. Some people don't like black string.



I will add that they most likely (the other colors) would be similarly towards the crisp side "relative" to others. Sometimes a shop might only carry the more basic colors.



Right now, I like Genesis Blizzard (synthetic gut), but that isn't a brand/option on your list.



The Dunlop I have is made in China. A softer type like Technifibre Syn Gut is made in Taiwan.



All of these range from $3.50 to about $4 US.

Thanks! I'll try both colors. Given its synthetic gut I doubt I will notice the difference. But thanks for your feedback.

I didn't know where Dunlop made their strings. Until you guys pointed out that se are made in Japan, China and Taiwan.

How's the tension maintenance on the Dunlops? That might be an issue for me because I don't play that regularly.

 

[rodrigoamaral]

I would probably say toalson

 

[Chotobaka]

Thanks for the info Chotobaka. Do you know how Leoina fits into the equation? I used 66 then 77 for a number of years back in the 70s.

Also, Klip sells Gosen on their AU site. Related?

Thanks

After all this time, Leoina 66 is still a great SG in my opinion -- a perfect string for newer spin racquets. No info on Klip, but if they are selling Gosen on their own site it may be an indication that Gosen is the OEM/ODM for any Klip branded synthetics made in Japan. Gosen and Toa have historically been and continue as huge OEM's for other brands.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

I would probably say toalson

Toalson over Gamma?

 

[Chotobaka]

Toalson over Gamma?

Exact same strings, different labels. Gamma is the long-time master distributor for parts of the world where Toalson does not heavily market their own brand. Worldwide, it is generally easier to find a wide variety of Gamma branded items than Toalson. There are some, like TNT, Asterisk, Rencon, etc. that are marketed broadly under both labels. Still the same strings.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Exact same strings, different labels. Gamma is the long-time master distributor for parts of the world where Toalson does not heavily market their own brand. Worldwide, it is generally easier to find a wide variety of Gamma branded items than Toalson. There are some, like TNT, Asterisk, Rencon, etc. that are marketed broadly under both labels. Still the same strings.

Wow

Gamma costs a little more though

 

[Radicalized]

Thanks! I'll try both colors. Given its synthetic gut I doubt I will notice the difference. But thanks for your feedback.

I didn't know where Dunlop made their strings. Until you guys pointed out that se are made in Japan, China and Taiwan.

How's the tension maintenance on the Dunlops? That might be an issue for me because I don't play that regularly.

Tension maintenance is good. The synthetic guts recently mentioned are all certainly very playable. I don't know anything about you or your equipment, but when taking the strings' characteristics into consideration, consider the tension for your frame size.

For example, for myself, the feedback I've gotten tells me to string the Dunlop slightly lower than the Gamma. But you know from reading the board that really you have to find your way to what feels right for you given all the variations in person and equipment. That is a catch-all comment, but it rings true in the end.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Tension maintenance is good. The synthetic guts recently mentioned are all certainly very playable. I don't know anything about you or your equipment, but when taking the strings' characteristics into consideration, consider the tension for your frame size.



For example, for myself, the feedback I've gotten tells me to string the Dunlop slightly lower than the Gamma. But you know from reading the board that really you have to find your way to what feels right for you given all the variations in person and equipment. That is a catch-all comment, but it rings true in the end.

This is the first time I'll be trying synthetic gut again. So maybe I'll start at mid tension and see how it plays.

By the way, I'm using a Dunlop Hotmelt 300G.

 

[mikeler]

Gamma Synthetic Gut WITHOUT wearguard.

For Dunlop, use S-gut in black for a more crispy feel. I like the feel of black a bit more than white, and when stringing yourself, the white feels annoyingly "waxy."

I agree with this, the wearguard breaks twice as fast.

 

[Rabbit]

I put some PSG 17 in my frame. It ain't bad. I put Babolat 17 in the other one; yet to hit it.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

I agree with this, the wearguard breaks twice as fast.

Why did they call it wearguard at the first place. Lol

What's your experience with Gamma Synthetic Gut? While I'm happy with my poly multi hybrid, I want to go back to basics with synthetic gut

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

I put some PSG 17 in my frame. It ain't bad. I put Babolat 17 in the other one; yet to hit it.

Please tell me if you're able to hit with the Babolat, that one is largely available in my area.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

I'd also like to put Forten Sweet 16 in the mix, any feedback from this string?

 

[Chotobaka]

How about Forten Sweet 16?

Very soft string. This is the long time go-to string for softening any stringbed. A better all around string IMO is Forten Dynamix. Not as easy to find. Both are good quality strings from Taiwan.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Very soft string. This is the long time go-to string for softening any stringbed. A better all around string IMO is Forten Dynamix. Not as easy to find. Both are good quality strings from Taiwan.

What about in a full bed? How does it compare to OG Sheep and Prince?

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Chotobaka,

This is the only Toa synthetic I could find, its labeled as "Toalson Synthetic Tournament." Says in the package, its supposed to be a new version of Original Synthetic 63, not sure what is that. I can't find the Toa Analog you're talking about.

Do you know anything about this string?

Regards

 

[Chotobaka]

What about in a full bed? How does it compare to OG Sheep and Prince?

Softer. It is a very nice feeling SG that plays above its price range, especially when used to soften up a hybrid. OG and PSG suit me more in a full bed. If you like a medium/firm SG you might find Sweet to play too soft. You could also try to moderate its softness by raising tension.

 

[Chotobaka]

Chotobaka,

This is the only Toa synthetic I could find, its labeled as "Toalson Synthetic Tournament." Says in the package, its supposed to be a new version of Original Synthetic 63, not sure what is that. I can't find the Toa Analog you're talking about.

Do you know anything about this string?

Regards

This is TOA's most reasonably priced SG. I have never played with it but it looks like the same construction as TOA Gold, which is positioned as a step up in softness and playability. After TOA Gold you start getting into the slightly more complex designs within TOA's "Synthetic" line of strings.

For p165, I doubt you are going to find a better deal in PI. I am sure it plays just fine and should be very comparable to OG or PSG.

What other strings are available in your area, and are any others reasonably priced? A sub $5.00 string in PI is a really good find IMO.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

This is TOA's most reasonably priced SG. I have never played with it but it looks like the same construction as TOA Gold, which is positioned as a step up in softness and playability. After TOA Gold you start getting into the slightly more complex designs within TOA's "Synthetic" line of strings.

For p165, I doubt you are going to find a better deal in PI. I am sure it plays just fine and should be very comparable to OG or PSG.

What other strings are available in your area, and are any others reasonably priced? A sub $5.00 string in PI is a really good find IMO.

So which is Toa's most basic synthetic?

I have found a Prince Synthetic but with duraflex. The Gamma are... Well they're 250 pesos. A silversky synthetic (kind of like pro's pro) is worth 90 pesos.

 

[Chotobaka]

So which is Toa's most basic synthetic?

I have found a Prince Synthetic but with duraflex. The Gamma are... Well they're 250 pesos. A silversky synthetic (kind of like pro's pro) is worth 90 pesos.

The one you pictured, Synthetic Tournament. This is their entry level string.

Which Gamma strings are p250?

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

The one you pictured, Synthetic Tournament. This is their entry level string.

Which Gamma strings are p250?

This one:

 

[Chotobaka]

This one:

Challenger's string cross section is exactly the same design as Toa Synthetic Tournament and the Gamma strings here in the USA labeled simply as Gamma Synthetic Gut (TW $3.50/p153). All three are described as "All Around".

However, Gamma Challenger is described as "high tenacity copolymer center and wraps, with Nylon 6 coating" vs "Nylon 6 core/nylon monofilament wraps/nylon coasting" on the Gamma Synthetic Gut. So there is some difference in materials, which may or may not make any difference.

Another tennis e-tailer here says this about Challenger: "This string is very similar to Prince Synthetic Gut". It is one step higher in Gamma's line up than their regular Synthetic Gut. Definitely worth a try since PSGO is one of your targets.

I would buy one each of Challenger; Synthetic Tournament; and Babolat Synthetic Gut and figure out which one you like best. I have a feeling there is not much difference, if any, between all of these strings.

Overall, pricing on all of them does not seem to be too much higher than here, either.

Edit: Just an educated guess, but I think Challenger is the Gamma version of TOA Gold, which I do know plays like PSGO.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Challenger's string cross section is exactly the same design as Toa Synthetic Tournament and the Gamma strings here in the USA labeled simply as Gamma Synthetic Gut (TW $3.50/p153). All three are described as "All Around".

However, Gamma Challenger is described as "high tenacity copolymer center and wraps, with Nylon 6 coating" vs "Nylon 6 core/nylon monofilament wraps/nylon coasting" on the Gamma Synthetic Gut. So there is some difference in materials, which may or may not make any difference.

Another tennis e-tailer here says this about Challenger: "This string is very similar to Prince Synthetic Gut". It is one step higher in Gamma's line up than their regular Synthetic Gut. Definitely worth a try since PSGO is one of your targets.

I would buy one each of Challenger; Synthetic Tournament; and Babolat Synthetic Gut and figure out which one you like best. I have a feeling there is not much difference, if any, between all of these strings.

Overall, pricing on all of them does not seem to be too much higher than here, either.

I might try it later, but I'm going to stick with sub $4 string. I might like the Toa (or Babolat) because of the price. I can string whenever I want. Problem is, when I can't find these kind of strings anymore, where will I get them?

 

[Chotobaka]

I might try it later, but I'm going to stick with sub $4 string. I might like the Toa (or Babolat) because of the price. I can string whenever I want. Problem is, when I can't find these kind of strings anymore, where will I get them?

You should be able to get the Toa and Gamma on an ongoing basis with no problem. Here is their PI master distributor, I am sure they can point you to a dealer. They have stores too, but mostly golf oriented -- is this where you are buying now?

DYNAMIC SPORTS CORPORATION
5F, K PLAZA BLDG. 18 KAMUNING ROAD. QUEZON CITY, PHILIPPINES
TEL+63-2925-2391 FAX+63-2925-1534
e-mail:dynamicsports@dynamicsportsph.com

I do not see how you can go wrong with either of the p165 strings. By the way, Dynamic Sport's website shows Ashaway as a string brand they carry, which might give you more options in the future depending on which ones they stock.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

You should be able to get the Toa and Gamma on an ongoing basis with no problem. Here is their PI master distributor, I am sure they can point you to a dealer. They have stores too, but mostly golf oriented -- is this where you are buying now?

DYNAMIC SPORTS CORPORATION
5F, K PLAZA BLDG. 18 KAMUNING ROAD. QUEZON CITY, PHILIPPINES
TEL+63-2925-2391 FAX+63-2925-1534
e-mail:dynamicsports@dynamicsportsph.com

I do not see how you can go wrong with either of the p165 strings. By the way, Dynamic Sport's website shows Ashaway as a string brand they carry, which might give you more options in the future depending on which ones they stock.

I checked their website, although it shows Toa strings, it says no product availabe. I think the website is not updated. I messaged them in their Facebook page, I hope I can get a reply.

Yeah these strings are really cheap. And I figured that synthetic gut might benefit my game more versus a complicated poly multi hybrid.

 

[Chotobaka]

I checked their website, although it shows Toa strings, it says no product availabe. I think the website is not updated. I messaged them in their Facebook page, I hope I can get a reply.

Yeah these strings are really cheap. And I figured that synthetic gut might benefit my game more versus a complicated poly multi hybrid.

Good quality synthetic gut is highly under rated and is probably the string most people should be playing with.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Good quality synthetic gut is highly under rated and is probably the string most people should be playing with.

Can't agree with you more. Plus I kind of like no-nonsense tennis equipment now as compared to stuff with so much "technology."

Sure I get more spin with a polyester but the "con's" does not justify the "pro's."

 

[Radicalized]

Challenger is an extremely soft string. In my opinion, it lacks durability. I haven't had any for a while, but when it sold in sets (last I saw without looking for this issue), it was $2.35 US, where the regular Gamma Synthetic Gut sold at $3.50.

I will post a pic later.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Challenger is an extremely soft string. In my opinion, it lacks durability. I haven't had any for a while, but when it sold in sets (last I saw without looking for this issue), it was $2.35 US, where the regular Gamma Synthetic Gut sold at $3.50.

I will post a pic later.

Aside for being softer and less durable than the regular synthetic gut counterpart, what is different from the Challenger?

 

[Radicalized]

Physically, if you can see the pictures, the Challenger is a translucent white type of string. The regular Synthetic Gut (in this case white--black is similar but has the coloring) is that "pure white" (more a plastic-type outer layer--though not the most plastic, surely by far, for syn guts on the market) type. The Challenger is very pliable.

When playing, the Challenger does tend to move more. As far a spin, they are both nylon, so you're getting the spin you put into it with your stroke (as with any, but the spin isn't accentuated).

Touch I think will depend on your response to how the string feels to you. I wouldn't say the Challenger is "mushy," just soft, as the ball is "pocketing."

Also, the Challenger isn't particularly powerful, but it isn't dull either with the pop that you do get. I use all these words relative to the strings mentioned, not to the overall world of strings.

The Challenger is a very "hum drum" string in my opinion.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

Physically, if you can see the pictures, the Challenger is a translucent white type of string. The regular Synthetic Gut (in this case white--black is similar but has the coloring) is that "pure white" (more a plastic-type outer layer--though not the most plastic, surely by far, for syn guts on the market) type. The Challenger is very pliable.

When playing, the Challenger does tend to move more. As far a spin, they are both nylon, so you're getting the spin you put into it with your stroke (as with any, but the spin isn't accentuated).

Touch I think will depend on your response to how the string feels to you. I wouldn't say the Challenger is "mushy," just soft, as the ball is "pocketing."

Also, the Challenger isn't particularly powerful, but it isn't dull either with the pop that you do get. I use all these words relative to the strings mentioned, not to the overall world of strings.

The Challenger is a very "hum drum" string in my opinion.

Thank you for your input

Now if Gamma is made in the same factory in Japan as with Gosen and Toalson. What is the "Challenger" string of Gosen and Toa

 

[Radicalized]

For some reason I thought you were in Australia. When I read another thread, you said Phillipines, right?

If you check the Toalson site (I did in English), they list a distributor (with contact info) in Quezon City.

Aside from that, none of the synthetics noted on that site match Challenger directly. That lists includes
SYNTHETIC:
SYNTHETIC GUT ULTRA SOFT
SYNTHETIC 140 SOFT
SYNTHETIC 130 SPIN
TOA GOLD
SYNTHETIC TOURNAMENT

Note: For North America they list (in U.S.) ATS/Gamma

But they do have a ZigZag shaped poly. I missed that one before anywhere. :?

And I forgot to say, the Challenger stretches A LOT when stringing it.

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

For some reason I thought you were in Australia. When I read another thread, you said Phillipines, right?

If you check the Toalson site (I did in English), they list a distributor (with contact info) in Quezon City.

Aside from that, none of the synthetics noted on that site match Challenger directly. That lists includes
SYNTHETIC:
SYNTHETIC GUT ULTRA SOFT
SYNTHETIC 140 SOFT
SYNTHETIC 130 SPIN
TOA GOLD
SYNTHETIC TOURNAMENT

Note: For North America they list (in U.S.) ATS/Gamma

Yeah, I got their contact info courtesy of Chotobaka

It might be useful if I decide to use this as my go-to string

 

[WhereIsMacMac]

You should be able to get the Toa and Gamma on an ongoing basis with no problem. Here is their PI master distributor, I am sure they can point you to a dealer. They have stores too, but mostly golf oriented -- is this where you are buying now?

DYNAMIC SPORTS CORPORATION
5F, K PLAZA BLDG. 18 KAMUNING ROAD. QUEZON CITY, PHILIPPINES
TEL+63-2925-2391 FAX+63-2925-1534
e-mail:dynamicsports@dynamicsportsph.com

I do not see how you can go wrong with either of the p165 strings. By the way, Dynamic Sport's website shows Ashaway as a string brand they carry, which might give you more options in the future depending on which ones they stock.

UPDATE: I was able to contact dynamic sports. They said they only do wholesale and not retail. So basically I can't buy from them.

 

[Rabbit]

Good quality synthetic gut is highly under rated and is probably the string most people should be playing with.

I'm 100% in agreement. I've been dallying with synthetic gut of late and it's like I've come full circle. At one point, whilst in the middle of my poly use, I even thought I couldn't use syn gut.

If you're looking for a comfortable, spin friendly, and inexpensive string, look no further than syn gut. If you need to balance control/power, simply find a tension that gives you the blend you're looking for. For me, that was 60 pounds in a Wilson six.one 16X18 (although I may go up/down as time goes by).

At around $3.00/string, you'd be hard pressed to find anything at that price.