Tennis Elbow Procedures

[AZJ1973]

Anyone have any luck with any of the three possibilities once it becomes clear TE is not going to heal naturally? In talking with my doctor all three of them have a 12-week recovery timeline from procedure to resumption of tennis.

1. Surgery. Doctor doesn't recommend it and indicates it only has a 80% success rate, which in the medical field is not considered good.

2. TENEX.
https://www.drbadia.com/video/tenex...w-tendionopathy-fasciotomy-surgical-tenotomy/

3. Platelet Rich Plasma Injection.
https://paindoctor.com/prp-for-tennis-elbow/

 

[HouTex]

12 weeks recovery is extraordinary optimistic if it's full blown TE. I finally scheduled surgery after about 5 months of TE pain. I canceled it when I received a second opinion and really understood the 15-20% failure rate. My TE took 20 months of PT, flexbar exercises, soaking in hot water, graston treatment, and other treatments before I could play tennis again.

 

[tennishabit]

sports injuries specialists would be much better:?))........they might help u to solve the problem for good by changing technique:?)).......

surely nothing can replace resting n might b a good idea working on technique while resting...............

 

[andreh]

I'd stay away from surgery and keep that as a very last resort. I'm Sweden, and many other European countries, they practically don't do TE surgery anymore due to the low success rate. The convalescense is also much longer than 12 weeks, usually. There are different types of procedures, though.

Tenex I've never heard of.

A PRP is relatively safe and non-intrusive, and has some documented successes, but is still considered to be an experimental treatment. Mainstream medical care does not perform it in most European countries and will have to be paid for out of pocket. Some times it's covered by private insurance.

From what I've heard it's common that you have to do more than one injection and that in many cases the healing time is still many months. With that in mind, it's likely to be a waste of money except possibly in the most difficult of cases.

All my own research and opinions. I'm not a doctor, and my is advice provided with that in mind.

 

[Andy Miller]

I had elbow surgery twice once for tennis elbow other for golfers elbow. I had a 100% success rate that was 15 years ago. Now I play 4 times a week no issues but never use a poly

 

[andreh]

I had elbow surgery twice once for tennis elbow other for golfers elbow. I had a 100% success rate that was 15 years ago. Now I play 4 times a week no issues but never use a poly

I had the opposite experience. Had TE surgery 10 years ago. I did nothing for me.

The science seems to tell us that TE surgery is basically hit and miss, which is why many surgeons have stopped doing them.

 

[tennishabit]

I had the opposite experience. Had TE surgery 10 years ago. I did nothing for me.

The science seems to tell us that TE surgery is basically hit and miss, which is why many surgeons have stopped doing them.

te/ge-ers can 100% recover once stop playing n rest for couple of yrs at most, why go through the surgery:?))).............keep them playing then causing more damage:?)))..................

a guy i hit w/ stopped playing tennis for ~5 yrs n te completely gone but started playing again a few mths ago n now it came back to haunt him.............stopped playing again......................

 

[ByeByePoly]

te/ge-ers can 100% recover once stop playing n rest for couple of yrs at most, why go through the surgery:?))).............keep them playing then causing more damage:?)))..................

a guy i hit w/ stopped playing tennis for ~5 yrs n te completely gone but started playing again a few mths ago n now it came back to haunt him.............stopped playing again......................

And that is exactly why I chose light hits as PT after a couple of months off ... 100% time off is no guarantee either. Madening injury ... not all TE the same ... we are left doing a lot of guessing.

 

[tennishabit]

And that is exactly why I chose light hits as PT after a couple of months off ... 100% time off is no guarantee either. Madening injury ... not all TE the same ... we are left doing a lot of guessing.

every te/ge-er's different but i'm sure the only same thing's they'll surely 100% recover if no playing at all for long enough, it might take 3 mths for some but might 3 yrs for some others. u can't choose 'light hits' as the damage's accumulative w/o ur knowledge until the damages done n it'll be too late already. absolutely no hitting at all n not a single step on tennis court at all..........sitting side of the court watching others ok................

 

[ByeByePoly]

every te/ge-er's different but i'm sure the only same thing's they'll surely 100% recover if no playing at all for long enough, it might take 3 mths for some but might 3 yrs for some others. u can't choose 'light hits' as the damage's accumulative w/o ur knowledge until the damages done n it'll be too late already. absolutely no hitting at all n not a single step on tennis court at all..........sitting side of the court watching others ok................

"but i'm sure the only same thing's they'll surely 100% recover if no playing at all for long enough"

Not true ... if you define "recover" as tendon ready for tennis. I read comments where someone took a year off, had no more TE pain, and immediately had TE pain when they stepped back on tennis court. Also ... many take x time off, do no PT, and are TE free. That is what I meant by guessing ... the highest percentage success is probably is just do nothing ... but I didn't want to be the guy who waited a year and tendon was still permanently degraded.

Also ... when is PT? I would think most PT starts after the initial injury healing (they say first 2-4 weeks a critical healing time for tendons/TE), but PT starts before 100% healed. The thinking with the flexbar is to start early because it is thought to help the tendon fibers heal lengthwise ... ending up with stronger/healthier tendon. Educated guessing. I did that (flexbar early), and then light hits at two months. Anything sharp pain ... stopped immediately, no serving for 8 months. But mild discomfort on grounstrokes kept getting better ... not worse over time. Swinging the racquet was perfect PT for the goal of getting back to swinging a racquet.

At 8 months post TE it is quite possible my elbow would have been just as healed ... or maybe better (I can't play poly anymore) if I stayed off the court. Just glad I healed "enough".

 

[socalmd123]

I just play through the pain. Stringing at very low tension helps a bit. I think the poly was what screwed up my arm.

 

[tennishabit]

I just play through the pain. Stringing at very low tension helps a bit. I think the poly was what screwed up my arm.

that'll cause a lot more pain later on. nothing can solve the problem except technique correction. i know it's sososo hard to change once the muscle memo's done as i hit w/ quite a few te/ge-ers, none of them can get rid of it yet..........

 

[pastashop42]

that'll cause a lot more pain later on. nothing can solve the problem except technique correction. i know it's sososo hard to change once the muscle memo's done as i hit w/ quite a few te/ge-ers, none of them can get rid of it yet..........

Any specific links or tips on what’s “proper technique” that minimizes chances of TE or GE?

 

[tennishabit]

Any specific links or tips on what’s “proper technique” that minimizes chances of TE or GE?

tldr.......minimizing the arm/wrist/hand usage. legs/waist/gravity can do much better job w/ ease ie so called kinetic chain, why laboring/wearing the little/fragile body parts:?)))

>enough threads/posts in tt here re. te/ge already, search...........................
>enough ytb goats vid-slomo or any atp <no.300 ok kinetic-chain-wise...........................

 

[HouTex]

I just play through the pain. Stringing at very low tension helps a bit. I think the poly was what screwed up my arm.

That's a risky approach. I tried playing through the pain until the pain was unbearable and then I was out of tennis for 20 months. Sure, some players can play through it, make some tweeks to their swing/equipment and make it through OK. But for many players they are setting themselves up for a very long recovery and a lot of PT and other treatments. The obvious problem with playing through the pain is you can't know how it will end up when the decision is made to continue playing. My body always healed fairly quickly and I thought TE was usually a minor nuisance for players and that it would just go away with a reduced playing schedule. Boy was I wrong.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

I just play through the pain. .

Worst advice ever.
Hilarious if you're actually an MD.

 

[tennishabit]

Worst advice ever.
Hilarious if you're actually an MD.

lolololol man, ofc not. dat's why named 'so called md'..............

 

[shamaho]

Anyone have any luck with any of the three possibilities once it becomes clear TE is not going to heal naturally? In talking with my doctor all three of them have a 12-week recovery timeline from procedure to resumption of tennis.
[snipped]

Why do you say "becomes clear TE is not going to heal naturally? " ? this premise is completely wrong as your body can definitely and will definitely heal itself if you give it the proper care and raw materials to heal the tendon.
later today I'll send you via PM a reference to a site that will explain the injury and healing process - I've used it in my TE.

What have you tried to say it won't heal ?

 

[AZJ1973]

Why do you say "becomes clear TE is not going to heal naturally? " ? this premise is completely wrong as your body can definitely and will definitely heal itself if you give it the proper care and raw materials to heal the tendon.
later today I'll send you via PM a reference to a site that will explain the injury and healing process - I've used it in my TE.

What have you tried to say it won't heal ?

I would love to see that as well, if possible. I would like to better understand the injury and most importantly the healing process.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

For How long has the TE not gone away?
Do you keep playing?
what is the longest break you took?

 

[shamaho]

I would love to see that as well, if possible. I would like to better understand the injury and most importantly the healing process.

it is a paid though inexpensive instruction product! inexpensive but for me it was invaluable for my TE !

 

[shamaho]

I would love to see that as well, if possible. I would like to better understand the injury and most importantly the healing process.

But I'll try to write up the gist of both processes, time permitting sometime in the next couple of days...

 

[socalmd123]

Worst advice ever.
Hilarious if you're actually an MD.

It wasn’t advice. I just stated a play with a little pain. I play just about every day bc my 3 kids play.

 

[socalmd123]

Ive been doing the flex bar for 3 days and my tennis elbow is almost gone

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Ive been doing the flex bar for 3 days and my tennis elbow is almost gone

If your TE is gone in 3 days,
then you did not have TE.

PT cant heal torn tendons

 

[socalmd123]

If your TE is gone in 3 days,
then you did not have TE.

PT cant heal torn tendons

Dude shut up. U are so annoying

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

I may be annoying, but you are giving harmful advice.

 

[tennishabit]

Ive been doing the flex bar for 3 days and my tennis elbow is almost gone

it's the 1st time i heard of te recovered in 3 days...........i personally don't have te/ge but i hit w/ them all for yrs n none of them could recover in 3 wks or even 3 mths, no matter what procedure they took. actually the best proven procedure is nothing but: rest.................

i hope there's a way, someway somehow somewhat to alter the technique during their rest 'down time' so come out aft that to hit the ball in a 'te/ge free style', root the problem once for all.................

easy 2 say hard 2 do........so far never seen any1 successful, yet.........................

 

[shamaho]

But I'll try to write up the gist of both processes, time permitting sometime in the next couple of days...

Well easier if I just post a link to someone else making the sme points:

1. on recovery -

a) pay special attention to this guy explaining why nutrition is so so important
b) pay special attention to his trigger point therapy - but apply it to the forearm
c) ignore the scraping part

d) several ice bath of the entire forearm (entire forearm is critical) - as like shown here

e) doing some hichhikers for shoulder mobility - don't remember his argument for such

 

[shamaho]

Well easier if I just post a link to someone else making the sme points:

1. on recovery -

a) pay special attention to this guy explaining why nutrition is so so important
b) pay special attention to his trigger point therapy - but apply it to the forearm
c) ignore the scraping part

d) several ice bath of the entire forearm (entire forearm is critical) - as like shown here

e) doing some hichhikers for shoulder mobility - don't remember his argument for such

oh and BTW OP, before anything else on said treatment (it's not a blanket case thing), it would be very very very advisable to know if you have calcification on the affected tendon... (via some sort of exam)
and if you do (unlikely in the case of the OP), go to a phisio to massacre the hell out of that tendon to remove calcification, while you do the stuff above...

 

[AZJ1973]

Family got me a TENS machine for birthday No. 46. Hoping this device helps with recovery.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

How long have you had TE ?
How long have you been resting ?

 

[tennishabit]

Family got me a TENS machine for birthday No. 46. Hoping this device helps with recovery.

2 b honest, it won't work on te/ge. btw not sure it could ever help anything from user side but surely help the sellers n manufacturers................

only known effective procedure is resting, ie stop using forearm completely as long as necessary..........

btw during resting, if possible, change ur ball striking technique ie trouble shooting ur kinetic chain if u'v got any. a lot of te/ge-ers don't have dat at all........lolololol manohman........in dat case nothing there for trouble shooting. u have to build dat from ground up. mission impossible, m8.................

so far never seen a single 1 'golden oldie' could change anything on his/her strokes, yet.............

that's why we need 'nxt gen' n they'r growing fast. 'young puppies can learn new tricks'....................

 

[AZJ1973]

How long have you had TE ?
How long have you been resting ?

From Sept 2017 until Nov 2018 I was able to play pain free, but my elbow would hurt the other 22 hours of the day. Starting in November 2018 the pain was constant and I couldn’t even grip a racquet or do daily activities with my left arm that didn’t cause pain. So, I have been resting since November. 6 months.

 

[tennishabit]

te/ge isn't life threatening issue like cancer etc but it is 'cancer' from tennis point of view due to it's horrible debilitating affect on any hope of improvement as it simply stops u 'hitting enough balls' which's crucial for any improvement........

aft hitting w/ so many te/ge-ers i knew how bad that was n some really bad 1s told me they couldn't hold coffee cups or even turn a page of book w/o terrible pain for couple of mths........sad stories for such a otherwise wonderful sport............

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

How does it feel after 6 months ?

 

[AZJ1973]

How does it feel after 6 months ?

Much better but I still don’t think I’m ready to go back to playing. Only because I want to be healed and I don’t want this to be an issue all the time.

My entire forearm is pain free and 100%. There is just a tiny, very stubborn spot right on my elbow bone (knob) that is still weak and will produce a minor burn if I do anything that produces stress to the elbow or if I go too hard doing my PT strength training.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

Another cautionary tale to STOP PLAYING when TE reveals itself.
Playing with TE seems to cause serious damage.
You might need to give it another 6 months and see how it feels.

 

[Raul_SJ]

That's a risky approach. I tried playing through the pain until the pain was unbearable and then I was out of tennis for 20 months. Sure, some players can play through it, make some tweeks to their swing/equipment and make it through OK. But for many players they are setting themselves up for a very long recovery and a lot of PT and other treatments. The obvious problem with playing through the pain is you can't know how it will end up when the decision is made to continue playing. My body always healed fairly quickly and I thought TE was usually a minor nuisance for players and that it would just go away with a reduced playing schedule. Boy was I wrong.

There might be a later stage where "play thru the pain" advice works.

Was talking to a teaching pro that was suffering from TE. Diagnosed over 6 months ago.
He was still in pain but still out on court teaching with very limited shots. Asked him why he did not just rest it.
Said he consulted with numerous Doctors. Consensus was that TE is gonna take time to heal no matter what. Once you get beyond the early stages, more resting it is not gonna speed up the healing.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

I'd use common sense.
If you broke your leg, would you keep walking on it, even when it's half healed?

By playing on it, he is not letting it heal.
Net net, it will never heal.

I am so glad I just stepped away from the game for the entire winter.

 

[AZJ1973]

I was holding out hope that switching to a ProKennex Ki Q+ 315 with a full bed of Natural Gut Lux would allow me to play and still heal.

Probably inaccurate but resting sucks.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

No gear or contraption can heal damaged tendons

 

[sredna42]

On the subject, my bodybuilder friend flew into town for some competition recently so i got to catch up with him. In whining about my GE in conversation, he told me how he had severe TE in the past, apparently its very common amongst bodybuilders/powerlifters who lift heavy.

He said he tried all therapy but couldn't shake it, he cured it by injecting bpc157 directly into the injury with tiny insulin needles. He said the pain was intense, but worth it. Had never heard of it before.

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

I've gotten GE from lifting, but never TE.

 

[graycrait]

No gear or contraption can heal damaged tendons

I disagree. It is all about learning to relax while hitting, and not being late then trying to salvage something so often with a death grip on the racket. When you feel a twinge start with hard finger massage into the forearm and upper arm. I also use one of those little roller balls. Then use a 20 dollar massager directly on and directly above and below the point of pain. Get that blood moving because those capillaries are small. Use a bigger grip if it allows you hold the racket looser. Maybe even some Gasquet-like taping. Whatever it takes to hold the racket looser. After every point or rally end take the racket out of your hand shake your arm loose. I actually think the electric massager is a key component. I also have no TE issues as long as the racket I am using is 11.5oz+ 100% graphite using Ashaway Kevlar x Zyex Pro at 65/55lbs. Of course if you must use a RA 70+ Babolat with poly strung at 55+lbs then good luck to you.

 

[tennishabit]

........ a teaching pro that was suffering from TE..................

hope he's 'teaching' those already te/ge-ed guys/gals.....not the young kids or new uncontaminated newbies.........

every now n then i saw those 'teaching pros' passing the 'viruses' to young kids........manohman..............

 

[shamaho]

oh and BTW OP, before anything else on said treatment (it's not a blanket case thing), it would be very very very advisable to know if you have calcification on the affected tendon... (via some sort of exam)
and if you do (unlikely in the case of the OP), go to a phisio to massacre the hell out of that tendon to remove calcification, while you do the stuff above...

And now for the the dynamics causing the TE... explained for another joint/tendon but the dynamic is the same - very good explanation

 

[Moldy]

On the subject, my bodybuilder friend flew into town for some competition recently so i got to catch up with him. In whining about my GE in conversation, he told me how he had severe TE in the past, apparently its very common amongst bodybuilders/powerlifters who lift heavy.

He said he tried all therapy but couldn't shake it, he cured it by injecting bpc157 directly into the injury with tiny insulin needles. He said the pain was intense, but worth it. Had never heard of it before.

Long time lurker here - created an account just to touch on BPC-157.

I'm surprised this is the first and only time this compound has been mentioned on TTW as it's been used for several years by bodybuilders to cure a whole host of injuries - tendon injuries like TE and GE included.

I'm currently on day 6 of using it myself for GE problems stemming from gripping too hard while I serve (with an APD+ no less). Though, my main elbow issue is some nagging triceps tendonitis behind my elbow from weightlifting/bench pressing. All in all, I've seen some marked improvement in my elbow in just 6 days, though the jury is still out on whether BPC-157 is the main thing healing my tendons since I'm doing a myriad of other things to try to heal.

If you're feeling desperate with your tendon injuries (like I was) then you may be interested in researching BPC-157 more. This article seems to be a great and easily digestible guide:

https://bengreenfieldfitness.com/article/supplements-articles/how-to-use-bpc-157/

 

[TimeToPlaySets]

The author of that blog is the ultimate example of a snake oil quack wack-job idiot.
People like this belong in jail. You have linked to a paid advertisement.

 

[tennishabit]

The author of that blog is the ultimate example of a snake oil quack wack-job idiot.
People like this belong in jail. You have linked to a paid advertisement.

nowadays a lot of commercial practices do push like that n u can see them everywhere.

short sighted 'fixing'/profiting, but the $$$ made now won't even cover 0.01% the $$$$$$$$.....n(n+1)$ needed to spend on rectifying the damage caused.......sometimes by the very same very short sighted idiots or even worse, by their children's children.........................