An undefeated WTF means beating 5 Top-10 players, which is hardly ever done in the majors. In fact- Borg, McEnroe, Connors, & Lendl preferred playing in the WTF rather than the Australian Open most of the times. Therefore the numbers look like this- Federer (22) with 5/6 undefeated WTFs; Sampras (14) with 0/5 undefeated WTFs; Nadal (13); Lendl (13) with 5/5 undefeated WTFs; Borg (12), etc. Of note, Djokovic moves up to (8) with 2/3 undefeated WTFs, joining Agassi & Connors & Wilander. Federer's number looks quite safe for now.
Undefeated WTF = major
- Thread starter SHUtennis
- Start date
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
Op, i really see the rationale in your analysis. Kudos.
Saving a new account?
furryballs
Banned
yep.......even boris said the wtf is harder to win than a major.
furryballs
Banned
but its only a glorified exo as far as some people are concerned and its so easy to win because you can lose a match and still win it.but poor old "mighty warrior "cant win it can he?
The-Champ
Legend
That explains why his trophy cabinet is loaded with FOs..oh wait..
WTF stronger than Australian Open in the 70s & 80s. No disrespect to Johan Kriek, but he never gets close to winning a major if not for WTF around the same time. The Australian Open was the 4th major played in December, not the 1st major played in January then and the top players made their choices. This and its importance today makes it the 5th major.
furryballs
Banned
ok then....why does nadal not have a couple of wtf's?why?
vive le beau jeu !
Talk Tennis Guru
undefeated or not, winning the WTF is a huge achievement.
The-Champ
Legend
The fittest and less exhausted of the top players usually win it, which Nadal at the end of every year is not. There's your answer!
The-Champ
Legend
HUGE achievement without a doubt. Equating it to a major on the other hand is ridiculous.
furryballs missed the point- I'm talking about undefeated WTF championships, not a win where you lose 1 match; the undefeated nature of this makes it equivalent to a major, otherwise winning a WTF while losing a match makes it less "valuable" for a career resume. And this is NOT an anti-Sampras post, I was shocked that all of his WTFs included a loss.
WhiskeyEE
G.O.A.T.
Is that why he was begging to have it played on clay?
Indoor hard is unfair to Rafa, remember?
The-Champ
Legend
Even if it's clay, he wont win it. It's at the end of the season.
WhiskeyEE
G.O.A.T.
Even Uncle Toni said that the ATP not changing the surface is the reason he hasn't won.
The-Champ
Legend
Even Uncle Toni said that the ATP not changing the surface is the reason he hasn't won.
But isn't Toni a lying mass-murderer?
WhiskeyEE
G.O.A.T.
Uncle Toni would argue that having the WTF in January would create a better spectacle for the fans if that's what would benefit Nadal.
This wasn't meant to be an anti-Nadal thread. This was to beef up the careers of those from the 70s & 80s who chose the WFT instead of the Australian. McEnroe at 10 majors and Lendl at 13 seems more accurate in comparing careers of the greats and making only the undefeated WTF count may make it easier for the "purists" to accept this calibration.
furryballs
Banned
no mate i get the point but im trying to drum it into nadal supporters thick heads what it means to win one of these let alone undefeated.
furryballs
Banned
and what happened when he had a month off to prepare for it?federer smacked him in the final.is the super warrior the only one thats tired at the end of the season?what a complete idiot argument.
furryballs
Banned
sorry mate but seriously.....i think it really should count towards a major's tally.different format but harder matches from the start.
abmk
Bionic Poster
oh please, he was bounced out of YEC 11 in the RR. then goes on and smashes everyone to pieces at the Davis Cup on clay ....
furryballs
Banned
true but is it actually harder to win?
The-Champ
Legend
What do you think is easier to win for Federer? Rome or WTF?
The-Champ
Legend
Was that against the french team? yeah...Nadal didn't need to be fresh for that one..LOl
Playing djokovic, federer, ferrer will be a different prospect even on clay at the end of a season.
Nadal cannot win it because he is physically spent.
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Forehand Of Doom
Banned
furryballs
Banned
why cant the greatest tennis warrior of all time overcome a little obstacle like the wtf?let me tell you...hee hee...he aint good enough thats why...he's good on clay...mr clay
but that is only some people on these boards...no top player thinks that. We know that from their interviews around wtf time.
WhiskeyEE
G.O.A.T.
'Unlucky' Nadal calls for surface change at World Tour Finals
Rafael Nadal believes it is unfair that the ATP World Tour Finals are played in an indoor arena, insisting being 'unlucky' is the main reason why he has yet to win the tournament during his career.
"It is not only fatigue. One of the small reasons was fatigue, one of the main reasons was I have never been a fantastic player on the indoor surface. Also I have been unlucky," the world No. 1 said at his pre-tournament press conference at London's O2 Arena.
http://www.espn.co.uk/tennis/sport/story/254473.html
Rafael Nadal believes it is unfair that the ATP World Tour Finals are played in an indoor arena, insisting being 'unlucky' is the main reason why he has yet to win the tournament during his career.
"It is not only fatigue. One of the small reasons was fatigue, one of the main reasons was I have never been a fantastic player on the indoor surface. Also I have been unlucky," the world No. 1 said at his pre-tournament press conference at London's O2 Arena.
http://www.espn.co.uk/tennis/sport/story/254473.html
Even Uncle Toni said that the ATP not changing the surface is the reason he hasn't won.
95% of the tour slow to medium surfaces now....Nadal can't have everything his way.
furryballs
Banned
i know it,you know it,the players know it,most players would give their right bollock to reach the wtf.
furryballs
Banned
how does rome come into this?
abmk
Bionic Poster
I mis-remembered it -- after the YEC in 2011, he demolished monaco and had a tough 4-setter vs delpo who was playing well .
the demolition of the French team was after the gruelling final vs djokovic @ the USO in 11 -- including that of gasquet, who btw is no slouch on clay ... he lost only 4 games to him ...
1) It is mathematically possible to lose 2 group matches in the WTF and still win the WTF;
2) Best of 3 set matches; and
3) Indoors which means the conditions are controlled, no exposure to the elements.
equals the WTF is no where near the status of a slam. In fact, the WTF is insignificant when compared to a slam.
2) Best of 3 set matches; and
3) Indoors which means the conditions are controlled, no exposure to the elements.
equals the WTF is no where near the status of a slam. In fact, the WTF is insignificant when compared to a slam.
furryballs
Banned
better to beat an opponent ranked 75 than play in fair conditions for all....thats what you people dont seem to understand..nadal didnt adapt to the conditions ,they adapted to his style of game and the wtf is the last bastion of anti nadal and hopefully other tourneys will take note
furryballs
Banned
lets get some carpet on the scene!
T
TheAnty-vic
Guest
Undefeated WTF = WTF! :lol:
WTF = A glorified Masters event.
DEAL WITH IT! 8):twisted:8)
WTF = A glorified Masters event.
DEAL WITH IT! 8):twisted:8)
furryballs
Banned
why doesnt injury boy have one then or two or more?
T
TheAnty-vic
Guest
furryballs
Banned
so hes not very good at all 'round conditions?
furryballs
Banned
if youre going to be considered the greatest of all time,surely you can win a mickey mouse exo at the end of the year....but...........injury boy cant......too injured or too tired,the fittest tennis warrior the world has seen!i love this forum it cracks me up.
N
Nathaniel_Near
Guest
WTF is a bit like a World Championship; only the best will suffice.
D
Deleted member 307496
Guest
Not exactly.
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