why do people use demanding frames?

[JoostT]

But I never said that it was the best way. I said I'd rather stick with my low-powered, player's racquet and hit the ball the same way that I have been for 30 years rather than switch to a modern, big-headed, high-powered racquet and be forced to completely change my technique or re-learn a new technique just in order to use the new racquet. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

At 35, Sampras will not change his technique on his eastern grip forehand nor his serve motion, right? McEnroe, at 47, still uses the same continental grip on all of his shots that he always has and still hits the ball the same way. These guys will never change their techniques so they're not good candidates for racquets like the Pure Drive. Can you imagine Sampras or McEnroe switching to a Pure Drive and completely changing their techniques to start hitting the ball like Nadal? It's never going to happen. Do you get what I mean?

Ever hit with a dunlop maxply, the new version McEnroe is using now? It is a lot closer to a babolat pure drive than a midsize players frame. It's a stiff frame and midplus (97). Didn't change his technique one bit...

 

[j3d0]

I will answer this.

Most recreational players using powerful racket, they usually do not employ full swing and body rotation into their shot, so a powerful racket can create deep flat groundstrokes for them even they don't have proper techinque because of the power level of the racket.

However, when a player does employ full swing using a powerful racket, the ball will go out if not hitting with enough topspin. So the answer is more topspin, but it is very difficult to tame the power, because with a fullswing, slight mishit or slightly wrong angle of attack, the ball will be flying pass the baseline. So, it takes skills to control the power hitting with full swing.

The PS85 is a different animal to tame. Its small headsize and heavier weight will create problem to player with poorer hand-eye coordination, or weaker physique, etc. It is a totally diffierent problem.

Don't judge a player or yourself by the racket. Player's racket, tweeners, beginner's racket, they are all just names. Personally, I don't not like these definition, it gives players wrong ideas about rackets.

You have a point man. I'm with you.

 

[JoostT]

I played with wood racquets for over 12 years, and I've used modern racquets, including the Pure Drive, for longer than that. Since neither the ball nor my strokes have changed, I can confidently say that the Pure Drive has more power than a wood racquet and that with the same exact swing, the ball travels further with the Pure Drive than with the wood racquet. Why? Is that really hard for you to believe?

I don't think you can make the exact same swing with a woodie and a pure drive (and know for sure that you did). The weight and balance and swingweight are so far apart, that it would be impossible to match a stroke exactly.

The comparison is also meaningless, yes a pure drive is more powerfull, no it doesn't matter that much, because the specs of a racquet will force you to change your technique to get the same results. Just find some specs that match your technique. But it is clear that a pure drive has specs that fit a lot of people, more than a woodie (or ps85).

 

[BreakPoint]

I don't think it works this way. While different racket will require a player to adapt to hit in certain way, it would never be as extreme as from Federer to Nadal, heck, they are not even using the same grip. Federer is not "old school" at all, he hit far out in front, with all shoulder rotation and almost no arm (from looking at this famous slow motion video). Try hit that with a wood racket, the ball will have difficulty to get pass the net.

Federer hits the ball with no arm? Exactly which Federer are you talking about? That guy Joe Federer that lives next door to you? LOL Because how does Roger Federer's arm end up wrapped across his body after his forehand swing if he hardly used his arm?

BTW, most people who use Pure Drives tend to use full Western grips. Thus, if Federer were forced to use a Pure Drive, he would most likely have to also change to a full Western Grip in order to generate the topspin needed to control all that power. That's why I said what I said, and that's why you'll never see Federer switching to a Pure Drive.

BTW, how often have you ever played with a wood racquet?

 

[BreakPoint]

Ever hit with a dunlop maxply, the new version McEnroe is using now? It is a lot closer to a babolat pure drive than a midsize players frame. It's a stiff frame and midplus (97). Didn't change his technique one bit...

The simple answer is that the Maxply McEnroe that McEnroe uses is a paintjob. It's much heavier than the stock model and perhaps flexier, too. Even with the stock model, people that have played with it report that it's closer to an old school racquet than it is to a Pure Drive. I haven't seen anyone mention that it's anything like a Pure Drive.

 

[cabernetjunkie]

thanks for the good words.

i dont like Sangiovese's either for the reason you say..too harsh and acidic, and I dont enjoy the aftertaste. My pallete is running more towards reds lighter than Cabs these days, maybe having someting to do with living in Forida, and thats a reason why I have been liking the Riojas and also Pinot Noirs..merlots dont stand up enough for my pallete usually and seem 'watery' to me. some blends of cab/merlot I like...now this stuff is all subjective...kind of like comparing the ball feel of diferent racquets...with most everythng else tennis, it is possible to be objective about i think...be well.
NBM

ps - the Crianza/Rioja I've been enjoying is Condeza de Leganza and the last time I bought a case, it was running around 8 bucks per bottle. Where can we try your wines?

NBM, shoot me an email and I can get you hooked up with some of my wines. dohabwine@bellsouth.net. If not, the only states we are in are GA. and SC. Hoping to be able to distribute in FL. within the next year.
Take care
CJ

 

[Kaptain Karl]

Most people who use player's racquets already have pretty good technique or else they would not be very successful using them. Thus, if we use a less demanding racquet that allows us to hit the ball over the net even without good technique, then eventually we'll likely lose that well-honed technique since we'll probably get lazy and stop using so much effort into hitting the ball.

This is just ... nonsense. I don't know ANY of my peers (I'm 50) who have allowed their technique to falter / break down / whatever you call it by using the "modern" frames they use today. As AndrewD indicated, the technique involves ball control. If one cannot control the ball with the newer frames, it's their own fault.

(I still prefer certain frames over others -- and I expect everyone does. But finding a frame which suits your game and gives you psychological confidence is important too.) If you gain that suitability and psychological comfort from a T-2000, a FlexPoint or a Babolat ... more power to you.

People use demanding frames mostly for ego.

If you'd posted, "Most people use demanding frames to satisfy their own egoes" I'd probably have agreed. (Emphasis on "most".)

What amazes me is the people who stubbornly insist on satisfying *only* the psychological comfort part of the equation ... and won't listen to those who give them good counsel about better matching other frames' characteristics to their games. "Oh well...."

- KK

 

[jonolau]

You obviously either have not even read my reviews or you don't know how to read:

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/playtests/BREAKP01.html

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/playtests/BREAKP04.html

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/playtests/BREAKP06.html

These are all the Volkl racquets I've playtested for TW. Look at the "Overall Rankings" at the bottom of each review.

Here's a quote for your enjoyment:

If I had to choose one of these three racquets to switch to from my PS 6.0 95, it would be the Volkl Tour 10 MP Gen II. It plays the closest to the PS 6.0 95, with similar static and swingweights, very headlight balances, and stiff throats and flexible hoops. This racquet almost feels like a modern version of the Dunlop Maxply Fort wood racquet that I grew up playing tennis with!

If I were you (and I thank God I'm not), I'd be a helluva lot more concerned about the objectivity of someone sponsored by Volkl (NBMJ) in praising and pushing all things Volkl on this board, as is contractually obligated.

Nice try in trying to discredit me. How ironic coming from someone who has ZERO credibility on these boards and who only a few months ago didn't even know what "stability" means in a tennis racquet (yes, I saw that thread, too).

If only you could see yourself from an outsiders point of view, Breakpoint.

You write all these reviews which appear objective, but on the message boards, you get yourself tangled up in these types of heated exchanges with a very condescending/patronising attitude. You may win over some, but you won't win over most of us.

One look at the attitude in your replies on this board, and you've immediately lost a fair amount of objectivity and credibility. You obviously can't see this fact as you're blinded by anger, ego and aloofness.

Until you're able to keep your emotions in check and your attitude neutral and objective, there'll be no end to questions on your objectivity.

One good look at someone who is able to stay objective is DireDesire. He has done a great job as a moderator, but is also able to dish out objective advice without being condescending or patronising.

 

[drakulie]

This messaage board is filled with people/zombies who simply repeat what racauet manufacturers say. Myths that promise to give a player more power and control, and more importantly make them a better player.

Take the radical line as an example. Since it's conception there has been the 260, titanium, i radical, liquid metal, flex point, etc, etc etc. More radicals than I can count or remember. Each one has promised the same thing..."more power and more control", than it's predecessor.

If each radical through its history delivers on what Head promises, then logically Agassi would be hitting 250 MPH serves by now. When he first started with Head he was already hitting 120 MPH serves. Yet, for some inexplicable reason his serve speed has not improved with each and every "racquet change" he has made. Neither has the pace on his groundstrokes.

Sure some racquets are more powerful than others. But quite frankly, I have yet to use a racquet that makes my current serve speed of 85 to 100 MPH go to 130 MPH. Even with a Babolat PD, my serve speed did not improve more than 5 to 10 MPH. For me, that is hardly a monumental "technological" improvement, to give up playing with a "20 year old racquet" that is considered "old technology and obsolete".

Nor for that matter, has any racquet assisted me in improving on topspin, groundstrokes, volleys, or control.

Oddly enough, one racquet I enjoyed was the Dunlop 300g. However, it is no longer sold because.........Yup, there is a new and improved Dunlop version of this racquet. I also enjoyed the Wilson Hyper Pro Staff.........yup, there has been several new and improved versions of this racquet--the tour, ncode, etc.

If I would have switched to either of these racquets, I would be spending more time searching the internet in hopes of finding some to buy them up, than being on the tennis courts and playing.

Of course if I cant find used ones, I would have to go through the whole process again, then again, etc.

So, why on earth would I change? In my case, there has been no positives, and only negatives in switching. I could always find used PS85's. In garage sales, internet, etc.

Quite frankly, until I play with a racquet that feels as good or better in my hands than the current racquet I am playing with---I am going to stick to playing tennis, and not worry about "buying a new and improved" racquet.

From my experience the two biggest changes in equipment over the last 20 years has been "larger head sizes", and strings. New technology hasn't made racquets more powerful, or improved a players control.

Guys were hitting 130+ MPH serves 20 years ago and 90+ forehands.

 

[drakulie]

If you'd posted, "Most people use demanding frames to satisfy their own egoes" I'd probably have agreed. (Emphasis on "most".) - KK

No matter what anyones choice of racquet is, someone is going to be playing with a "less" demanding frame. Therefore, everyone is playing with a "demanding" frame.

 

[AndrewD]

BTW2, I've never written a playtest for TW on the PD, so how would you know how much spin I would use to control the racquet?
[/SIZE][/SIZE]

No-one said you had and the idea is to control the ball, not the racquet.

Look, I know you have a mighty struggle with reading comprehension but it's really not too difficult. I'm sure if you put in the effort you'll work it out, eventually.

When you've got that sorted you might like to work on adding some variety to your posts. To date, your contributions can be summed up as:

1. BreakPoint is right/good)
2. NBMJ is wrong/evil/biased/sponsored by Volkl (they all mean the same to you)
3. PS95 is a good racquet
4. I use(d) the PS95 (insert racquet name) so it’s a really, really good racquet
5. I have such beautiful strokes people come to watch me play (translation: people stare and laugh when I play tennis)
6. Big headed racquets are bad
7. Small headed racquets are good
8. Big headed racquets make my backhand go ouch
9. Small headed racquets make me feel pretty
10.


Congratulations! It must have been darn tough to string together over 8,000 posts when all you do is say those same things ad nauseum (with emphasis on the nauseum). Imagine how good it would be if you'd strung together 8,000 posts that actually made sense (I'd have been happy if you'd managed 10).

 

[BreakPoint]

I also have my strong reservations about the objectivity in his racquet reviews for TW. It is particularly disturbing to read his extreme disdain for certain brands (Volkl, in particular) and skewed support of others.

This coming from Volkl fanboy junior on these boards who obviously is very strongly skewed toward Volkls and who has stated that he hates all other brands that he's tried.

Here are my objective opinions. Sure looks like I disdain Volkls and am biased towards other brands, huh?

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/playtests/BREAKP01.html

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/playtests/BREAKP04.html

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/playtests/BREAKP06.html

These are all the Volkl racquets I've playtested for TW. Look at the "Overall Rankings" at the bottom of each review.

Here's a quote for your enjoyment:

If I had to choose one of these three racquets to switch to from my PS 6.0 95, it would be the Volkl Tour 10 MP Gen II. It plays the closest to the PS 6.0 95, with similar static and swingweights, very headlight balances, and stiff throats and flexible hoops. This racquet almost feels like a modern version of the Dunlop Maxply Fort wood racquet that I grew up playing tennis with!

You are so owned!

 

[BreakPoint]

No-one said you had and the idea is to control the ball, not the racquet.

Look, I know you have a mighty struggle with reading comprehension but it's really not too difficult. I'm sure if you put in the effort you'll work it out, eventually.

When you've got that sorted you might like to work on adding some variety to your posts. To date, your contributions can be summed up as:

1. BreakPoint is right/good)
2. NBMJ is wrong/evil/biased/sponsored by Volkl (they all mean the same to you)
3. PS95 is a good racquet
4. I use(d) the PS95 (insert racquet name) so it’s a really, really good racquet
5. I have such beautiful strokes people come to watch me play (translation: people stare and laugh when I play tennis)
6. Big headed racquets are bad
7. Small headed racquets are good
8. Big headed racquets make my backhand go ouch
9. Small headed racquets make me feel pretty
10.


Congratulations! It must have been darn tough to string together over 8,000 posts when all you do is say those same things ad nauseum (with emphasis on the nauseum). Imagine how good it would be if you'd strung together 8,000 posts that actually made sense (I'd have been happy if you'd managed 10).

And you and NBMJ are any different?

 

[newnuse]

"Volkl Fanboy JR" ... .... stop it man... I just had dinner

 

[NoBadMojo]

And you and NBMJ are any different?

when will this stuff ever end..this 2 years or more of badgering and stalking of me has gone beyond creepy and dysfunctional and morphed into something which isnt even possible to describe. he connects me with anything he doesnt like no matter how unrelated. it really is beyond obsessive behaviour..anyone can see.

 

[Marius_Hancu]

They use them because they win with them.

Heck, my 6.0 85 is 415g heavy, 432g swingmass (no error, measured recently on a Babolat machine; which is explained by about 40g lead total at 3 and 9 only), but I am playing S-V with it. Simply very solid and powerful in this configuration. And controllable, at 68lbs string tension. For me, that is.

Not the most maneuverable, of course, but I am not playing a la Fed, slashing and dashing, but a la Sampras, blocking and guiding the volleys, of course.

I have over 10 other racquets (PC 600, Babolat Pure Drive+, 6.1 Hyper ProStaff, Fischer 98 Retro, Mitt 97, POG Mid, Estusa, etc) , and I train and use them in matches too, but I can't play the same with them. I prefer this howitzer, it generates a heavy ball on all shots. But I need to use my legs and the inertia of the racquet, to use the wrist-release, the rocking motion on serve, the whole set of useful techniques which you know very well.

Matter of preference, not of superman-icity.

I experimented many times, during matches in which I was in critical situations, or which I lost, to switch to other racquets. Didn't bring a lot of improvement.

The answer: the racquet isn't the essential ingredient. It's myself, my conditioning, my tactics, my training, my focus on the ball, etc. This is where I should concentrate and work on.

The racquet is just a matter of preference. But don't hurt yourself with inappropriate choices (too stiff, too light, you know my tune by now)

 

[newnuse]

Personally I played with a PS 85" because of my ego.

Plus, I find that all the tennis groupies that hang at the local courts really dig man that use PS85"

 

[Two Fister]

I have to admit, it's kind of like a bad car accident on the side of the freeway. You don't want to look, but you can't help yourself.

Been around this board long enough to know that BOTH parties (or should I say fundamentalist "teams") have some culpability in this war. Neither side is completely innocent.

Interesting how the anonymity of the internet allows people to be very uncivil to each other. I'm willing to bet that if locked in the same room for a couple of hours, Breakpoint and NBMJ would be nowhere near as aggressive with each other and would actually come to agreement about things and be able to get along just fine.

Anyway, I use a "mid-sized" racquet (the DNX 10 mid) cuz it is pretty easy on my bum elbow, it seems to generate more spin than the dnx 10 mp version, and it has a good combo of power and control for my game, and just about the right static and swingweight for me. Could care less if it is mid-sized or not (actually a big mid at 93). Not willing to say that it is more "demanding" than my AeroProDrive+. Maybe more difficult to hit as hard with the dnx 10 mid, but easier to keep the ball in the court. Just my two cents.

 

[chowdhurynaveen]

Originally Posted by Marius Hancu
The answer: the racquet isn't the essential ingredient. It's myself, my conditioning, my tactics, my training, my focus on the ball, etc. This is where I should concentrate and work on.

Well said Marius Hancu!!

 

[BreakPoint]

I also have my strong reservations about the objectivity in his racquet reviews for TW. It is particularly disturbing to read his extreme disdain for certain brands (Volkl, in particular) and skewed support of others.

Yes, I have strong opinions about racquets. I think just about everyone here does. But the difference between you and me is that I do not allow my personal opinions, preferences, biases, or whatever you want to call it, influence my objectivity when conducting and writing playtest reviews on behalf of TW. I have no hidden agendas nor any ulterior motives. I have no obligations nor incentives to promote or support certain brands. Thus, there is no benefit to me whatsoever to tout or slam one brand over another.

The concrete proof of that is, although I may not personally like most Volkl racquets, my personal sentiment is not reflected in any way in my TW reviews. Because I know that although I may not like that Volkl feel nor appreciate some of the qualities that Volkl has to offer, there are many other people who do.

 

[jonolau]

Yes, I have strong opinions about racquets. I think just about everyone here does. But the difference between you and me is that I do not allow my personal opinions, preferences, biases, or whatever you want to call it, influence my objectivity when conducting and writing playtest reviews on behalf of TW. I have no hidden agendas nor any ulterior motives. I have no obligations nor incentives to promote or support certain brands. Thus, there is no benefit to me whatsoever to tout or slam one brand over another.

The concrete proof of that is, although I may not personally like most Volkl racquets, my personal sentiment is not reflected in any way in my TW reviews. Because I know that although I may not like that Volkl feel nor appreciate some of the qualities that Volkl has to offer, there are many other people who do.

We have seen the way you have strongly attacked or defended certain racquets and brands in this forum, and that's fine. Each one of us is entitled to our personal opinions.

However, no matter how much you claim to be objective in your reviews, the fact that you have strong views and a personal dislike for most Volkl racquets already puts a discount on half of what you say in your reviews regardless of how positive or negative the review. The fact that you hold these views would already plant a seed of doubt in your subconcious mind and may affect your decisions/findings with or without your conscious knowledge.

You may not see this fact yourself, but people in this forum perceive it differently. It is akin to asking a judge who has publicly aired his anti-abortion views to preside over an abortion case because even if he claims to be objective there is a clear conflict of interest.

Please think about this carefully before replying.

 

[jonolau]

This coming from Volkl fanboy junior on these boards who obviously is very strongly skewed toward Volkls and who has stated that he hates all other brands that he's tried.

You are so owned!

Whoa, don't make such sweeping scathing statements and attacks.

I do like Prince and bought an O3 White for my wife. I also like Dunlop and will be buying an M-Fil 300. I also own a Head TXE and do like that racquet. I also own a Wilson PS 7.5 and Hyper Hammer 6.3 and do take those out to hit once in a while.

So, do I hate all other brands that I've tried? No. I only do not like certain models that I've tried.

In my mind, only my parents, wife and kids have the unconditional right to claim they own me and I'm happy with this fact.

So, please don't get personal.

 

[JoostT]

The simple answer is that the Maxply McEnroe that McEnroe uses is a paintjob. It's much heavier than the stock model and perhaps flexier, too. Even with the stock model, people that have played with it report that it's closer to an old school racquet than it is to a Pure Drive. I haven't seen anyone mention that it's anything like a Pure Drive.

Specs of the Maxply McEnroe (tennis-warehouse website)

Head Size:
98 sq. in. / 632 sq. cm.Length: 27 inches / 69 cmStrung Weight: 11.3oz / 320gBalance: 3pts Head LightSwingweight: 327Stiffness: 68Beam Width: 21 mm Straight BeamComposition: Hot Melt GraphitePower Level: Low-MediumSwing Speed: Moderate-FastGrip Type: LeatherString Pattern:
16 Mains / 19 Crosses
Mains skip: 8T,8H
One Piece
No shared holes

Racquets similar to Dunlop Maxply McEnroe Racquets [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat Drive Z-Tour Racquets[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]A solid Midplus racquet well suited to intermediate to advanced level players. Continues the trend of light, powerful and spin friendly offerings from Babolat. 100 sq. inches, 10.7 ounces, 16/19 string pattern, 27 inch length.
Price: $169.00, Customer Feedback, [/FONT][FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat Pure Control Team Standard Racquets[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Traditional weight and balance in a standard, 27-inch length. Ideal for 4.5-7.0 level players who generate their own power and are seeking enhanced control. 11.8 ounces, 98 sq. inch head.
Price: $179.00, Customer Feedback, [/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat Pure Drive Team Standard Racquets[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat's best selling racquet offers a high level of stability and comfort. Racquet choice of many touring pros including Carlos Moya and 2005 US Open Champ, Kim Clijsters.
Price: $179.00, Review, Customer Feedback, [/FONT][FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat Pure Storm Team Racquets[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]A lightweight control racquet that provides a solid feel at impact and is suited to a variety of playing styles. 11 ounces, 98 square inch headsize and 16/20 string pattern.
Price: $179.00, Customer Feedback[/FONT]

 

[BreakPoint]

Specs of the Maxply McEnroe (tennis-warehouse website)

Head Size:
98 sq. in. / 632 sq. cm.Length: 27 inches / 69 cmStrung Weight: 11.3oz / 320gBalance: 3pts Head LightSwingweight: 327Stiffness: 68Beam Width: 21 mm Straight BeamComposition: Hot Melt GraphitePower Level: Low-MediumSwing Speed: Moderate-FastGrip Type: LeatherString Pattern:
16 Mains / 19 Crosses
Mains skip: 8T,8H
One Piece
No shared holes

Racquets similar to Dunlop Maxply McEnroe Racquets [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat Drive Z-Tour Racquets[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]A solid Midplus racquet well suited to intermediate to advanced level players. Continues the trend of light, powerful and spin friendly offerings from Babolat. 100 sq. inches, 10.7 ounces, 16/19 string pattern, 27 inch length.
Price: $169.00, Customer Feedback, [/FONT][FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat Pure Control Team Standard Racquets[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Traditional weight and balance in a standard, 27-inch length. Ideal for 4.5-7.0 level players who generate their own power and are seeking enhanced control. 11.8 ounces, 98 sq. inch head.
Price: $179.00, Customer Feedback, [/FONT] [FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat Pure Drive Team Standard Racquets[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat's best selling racquet offers a high level of stability and comfort. Racquet choice of many touring pros including Carlos Moya and 2005 US Open Champ, Kim Clijsters.
Price: $179.00, Review, Customer Feedback, [/FONT][FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]Babolat Pure Storm Team Racquets[/FONT]
[FONT=verdana,arial,helvetica]A lightweight control racquet that provides a solid feel at impact and is suited to a variety of playing styles. 11 ounces, 98 square inch headsize and 16/20 string pattern.
Price: $179.00, Customer Feedback[/FONT]

Huh? So where are the people that play with the Maxply McEnroe who say that it plays like a Pure Drive?

 

[JoostT]

Huh? So where are the people that play with the Maxply McEnroe who say that it plays like a Pure Drive?

That is called a strawman;

I haven't seen anyone mention that it's anything like a Pure Drive.

And if you look at the specs, it is very close to a Pure Drive. It plays a lot closer than a max 200g...

 

[BreakPoint]

And if you look at the specs, it is very close to a Pure Drive. It plays a lot closer than a max 200g...

I never said it plays close to a Max 200G. No racquet in the world does nor ever did. I just said that out of all the reviews written by posters on this board and other comments from people that actually play with the racquet, I've never heard of anyone saying that the Maxply McEnroe plays like a Pure Drive.

Here's the customer feedback for the Maxply McEnroe. I haven't read it all but I doubt anyone mentions it plays like a Pure Drive.

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/feedback.html?pcode=DMMC

BTW, don't ever just go by specs. Having played with hundreds of racquets over the years, I've learned that one can never just go by the specs. You have to play with it yourself as many racquets will play quite differently from what their specs may indicate.

BTW, do you play with both the Maxply McEnroe and the Pure Drive? If not, how do you know they play very similar?

 

[AngeloDS]

The assistant college tennis coach who owns a tennis shop and is a dunlop dealer (and deals other brands too like Fischer); dunlops are pretty good. The guy who won the conference championships was playing with a dunlop (incredible game). I tried out the Maxply McEnroe, it was an alright racquet but it felt really stiff and backhand slices didn't feel the same.

I'd say the Maxply McEnroe strung at 55 lbs plays like a Pure Drive strung at 60 lbs to be honest. At 60 the woofer affect isn't there but it feels a bit soft. At 55 lbs the Maxply McEnroe feels soft and has a good deal of power behind it.

One thing I didn't like about the Maxplay McEnroe is where the head is placed and its shape. I find the head to be too oval for my tastes. So I don't like it too much for one-handed backhands. I prefer more rounder heads.

 

[JoostT]

I never said it plays close to a Max 200G. No racquet in the world does nor ever did. I just said that out of all the reviews written by posters on this board and other comments from people that actually play with the racquet, I've never heard of anyone saying that the Maxply McEnroe plays like a Pure Drive.

Here's the customer feedback for the Maxply McEnroe. I haven't read it all but I doubt anyone mentions it plays like a Pure Drive.

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/feedback.html?pcode=DMMC

BTW, don't ever just go by specs. Having played with hundreds of racquets over the years, I've learned that one can never just go by the specs. You have to play with it yourself as many racquets will play quite differently from what their specs may indicate.

BTW, do you play with both the Maxply McEnroe and the Pure Drive? If not, how do you know they play very similar?

Yes I have owned and played with them both. These are not demanding frames and quite comparable powerwise. Now the Max 200g is a demanding frame, both in specs and how it plays.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BreakPoint
But I never said that it was the best way. I said I'd rather stick with my low-powered, player's racquet and hit the ball the same way that I have been for 30 years rather than switch to a modern, big-headed, high-powered racquet and be forced to completely change my technique or re-learn a new technique just in order to use the new racquet. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

At 35, Sampras will not change his technique on his eastern grip forehand nor his serve motion, right? McEnroe, at 47, still uses the same continental grip on all of his shots that he always has and still hits the ball the same way. These guys will never change their techniques so they're not good candidates for racquets like the Pure Drive. Can you imagine Sampras or McEnroe switching to a Pure Drive and completely changing their techniques to start hitting the ball like Nadal? It's never going to happen. Do you get what I mean?


Ever hit with a dunlop maxply, the new version McEnroe is using now? It is a lot closer to a babolat pure drive than a midsize players frame. It's a stiff frame and midplus (97). Didn't change his technique one bit...

You state that McEnroe's technique has not changed. He is however using very different frames. So you don't have to change your technique, to play with a modern big-headed, high powered frame, at least.

It does make me wonder if you ever tried a pure drive.

 

[NoBadMojo]

I.

Interesting how the anonymity of the internet allows people to be very uncivil to each other. I'm willing to bet that if locked in the same room for a couple of hours, Breakpoint and NBMJ would be nowhere near as aggressive with each other and would actually come to agreement about things and be able to get along just fine.

.

This isnt true at all..

 

[couch]

Haven't we beat this one to death?

Can't we all just hug and make up? Okay, maybe just get along. I think both Breakpoint and NBMJ have good points in most of their threads/replies.

What's the big deal if NBMJ is a Volkl rep or even owns a part of the company? Actually, I think he's probably just a sponsored pro that uses Volkls and likes them, so what. I could be wrong, but I don't think NBMJ puts down any other racquet companies he just pushes Volkl. If you like what he has to say about Volkl then go out and demo the racquet(s) yourself and make your own decision. We're all big boys around here. I personally like to hear what he has to say about Volkl because I play with one.

And I don't think Breakpoint dislikes Volkl, I think he and NBMJ dislike each other and it seems he's dissing Volkl everytime he gets in an argument with NBMJ when in fact he's not. I've read some of Breakpoint's reviews and find them quite informative. He has had some nice things to say about the Volkl Tour 10 VE.

Back to the original post and I've gotta get out of this one--

I think some people who use traditional strokes and grips could also benefit from tweener or lighter racquets. I play with a few guys who have absolutely no weapons and yet play with racquets like the ncode 6.1 90 sq. in. and could probably benefit from a lighter frame with a little more pop. I also play with some guys who use prestiges, etc. who hit the absolute crap out of the ball. I'm not going to tell them to change a thing because it's obviously working. And then there are guys who use powerful racquets who could probably benefit from a more control-oriented frame but choose not to because they like to hit the crap out of the ball and guess where it's going.

Who's right? I guess everyone is right because everyone plays with what frame they like for whatever reason.

And Drakulie-

I give up, you win. Can we try and be civilized from now on out?

 

[Offshore]

Haven't we beat this one to death?

Can't we all just hug and make up? Okay, maybe just get along. I think both Breakpoint and NBMJ have good points in most of their threads/replies.

What's the big deal if NBMJ is a Volkl rep or even owns a part of the company? Actually, I think he's probably just a sponsored pro that uses Volkls and likes them, so what. I could be wrong, but I don't think NBMJ puts down any other racquet companies he just pushes Volkl. If you like what he has to say about Volkl then go out and demo the racquet(s) yourself and make your own decision. We're all big boys around here. I personally like to hear what he has to say about Volkl because I play with one.

And I don't think Breakpoint dislikes Volkl, I think he and NBMJ dislike each other and it seems he's dissing Volkl everytime he gets in an argument with NBMJ when in fact he's not. I've read some of Breakpoint's reviews and find them quite informative. He has had some nice things to say about the Volkl Tour 10 VE.

Back to the original post and I've gotta get out of this one--

I think some people who use traditional strokes and grips could also benefit from tweener or lighter racquets. I play with a few guys who have absolutely no weapons and yet play with racquets like the ncode 6.1 90 sq. in. and could probably benefit from a lighter frame with a little more pop. I also play with some guys who use prestiges, etc. who hit the absolute crap out of the ball. I'm not going to tell them to change a thing because it's obviously working. And then there are guys who use powerful racquets who could probably benefit from a more control-oriented frame but choose not to because they like to hit the crap out of the ball and guess where it's going.

Who's right? I guess everyone is right because everyone plays with what frame they like for whatever reason.

And Drakulie-

I give up, you win. Can we try and be civilized from now on out?

Great post to, hopefully, end this thread on a positive note. I agree that NoBadMojo has posted some great information and feedback, mainly regarding Volkl frames. His input is greatly appreciated. Breakpoint has also made some good contributions on the board and is obviously passionate about tennis and has his own views on many subjects...that doesn't make him right or wrong - just opinions.

Hopefully we can all be more positive and less personal in future threads. Remember.....Its just tennis!!!.

 

[oldguysrule]

No-one said you had and the idea is to control the ball, not the racquet.

Look, I know you have a mighty struggle with reading comprehension but it's really not too difficult. I'm sure if you put in the effort you'll work it out, eventually.

When you've got that sorted you might like to work on adding some variety to your posts. To date, your contributions can be summed up as:

1. BreakPoint is right/good)
2. NBMJ is wrong/evil/biased/sponsored by Volkl (they all mean the same to you)
3. PS95 is a good racquet
4. I use(d) the PS95 (insert racquet name) so it’s a really, really good racquet
5. I have such beautiful strokes people come to watch me play (translation: people stare and laugh when I play tennis)
6. Big headed racquets are bad
7. Small headed racquets are good
8. Big headed racquets make my backhand go ouch
9. Small headed racquets make me feel pretty
10.


Congratulations! It must have been darn tough to string together over 8,000 posts when all you do is say those same things ad nauseum (with emphasis on the nauseum). Imagine how good it would be if you'd strung together 8,000 posts that actually made sense (I'd have been happy if you'd managed 10).

Ok, for good or bad, I am jumping back in.

AndrewD, I have never a seen you make a post that was disrespectful, or insulting. I also have rarely disagreed with one of your opinions. This post is beneath you.

If we remove the personality clashes, insults, hyperbole, defensiveness, pettiness, self-righteousness, personal attacks from these threads this is what we are left with.

Group A: Right or wrong, they like a small-headed, heavier, flexier frame and think there is still a place for this frame in tennis. Most of these posters, BP included, recognize that there are different styles of tennis and different racquets to statisfy those styles. Most of them say use what works for you. This is a valid viewpoint.

Group B: Right or wrong, they think that the above frames are obsolete and tennis players would be better served by using a frame that is to some degree lighter, stiffer, with a bigger head. Most of them do not acknowledge any benefits from a so-called "player's" frame. This is a valid viewpoint, although a bit exclusive.

In my observation, most of the posters in Group A sound a bit immature and have, at times, silly reasons for using a player's frame. However, they recognize that not everyone will want to. The posters in Group B sound more mature and reasonable, but typically think that they are right and everyone else is wrong. This is the attitude that starts the flame wars, in my opinion. At that point, nobody is right.

Breakpoint's entire message is that there is a place for the "player's" frame as well as the "modern" frame. This is his opinion. I think he initially presents it well. I think there is an attempt to shout him down and discredit him. And I will be the first to say that he can sound immature, condescending, and insulting with the best of them. To his credit though, he does not try to tell others that they should not use what they want to use. If you truly read this thread from the beginning, BP did not start this nonsense.

The posters in Group B have their opinion and many of them present it well. My only complaint is that instead of just presenting their opinion, they present it as a fact that everyone should agree with. (there are exceptions). Anyone who does not agree is "wrong".

 

[jonolau]

Mongo, Santa Maria ...

 

[NoBadMojo]

Ok, for good or bad, I am jumping back in.

AndrewD, I have never a seen you make a post that was disrespectful, or insulting. I also have rarely disagreed with one of your opinions. This post is beneath you.

.

This is a valid point. For someone of Andrews' caliber to post something like this <even tho obviously true> it is an indication of the really adverse effect Breakpoint has on this forum...Andrew has clearly had enough of him..message in there for anyone choosing to listen.

 

[oldguysrule]

We have seen the way you have strongly attacked or defended certain racquets and brands in this forum, and that's fine. Each one of us is entitled to our personal opinions.

However, no matter how much you claim to be objective in your reviews, the fact that you have strong views and a personal dislike for most Volkl racquets already puts a discount on half of what you say in your reviews regardless of how positive or negative the review. The fact that you hold these views would already plant a seed of doubt in your subconcious mind and may affect your decisions/findings with or without your conscious knowledge.

You may not see this fact yourself, but people in this forum perceive it differently. It is akin to asking a judge who has publicly aired his anti-abortion views to preside over an abortion case because even if he claims to be objective there is a clear conflict of interest.

Please think about this carefully before replying.

I have to respond...This is ridiculous. You could direct this post at 90% of the reviewers here. Everyone has strong views and personal dislikes. Did you even read his reviews? Please think carefully before posting something like this again.

Does anyone here have a shred of common sense? (I should include myself in this because I am still here reading and posting)

Also, please forgive the bluntness. You are probably a fine individual.

 

[BreakPoint]

You state that McEnroe's technique has not changed. He is however using very different frames. So you don't have to change your technique, to play with a modern big-headed, high powered frame, at least.

It does make me wonder if you ever tried a pure drive.

Yes, I have tried a Pure Drive. And like I said, who knows what's really under the paintjob of McEnroe's Maxply McEnroe. Besides, how many of us here have the talent, timing, and eye-hand coordination of John McEnroe?

 

[jonolau]

I have to respond...This is ridiculous. You could direct this post at 90% of the reviewers here. Everyone has strong views and personal dislikes. Did you even read his reviews? Please think carefully before posting something like this again.

Does anyone here have a shred of common sense? (I should include myself in this because I am still here reading and posting)

Also, please forgive the bluntness. You are probably a fine individual.

No worries, oldguysrule, at least you have provided a complimentary bandaid along with the slash of your blade.

I have already said what I wanted to say, and that has been removed by TW staffers along with the other nonsense he was spewing, so that is fine by me.

I do not wish to perpetuate this any longer. But if you would like an explanation, please feel free to drop me an email as I would like to show some respect to TW and not post personal views here.

Jon

 

[BreakPoint]

However, no matter how much you claim to be objective in your reviews, the fact that you have strong views and a personal dislike for most Volkl racquets already puts a discount on half of what you say in your reviews regardless of how positive or negative the review. The fact that you hold these views would already plant a seed of doubt in your subconcious mind and may affect your decisions/findings with or without your conscious knowledge.

Does anyone else find the above post by jonolau make any sense at all? Or did you laugh until it hurt like I did?

Here's a self-confessed Volkl lover accusing a reviewer of being anti-Volkl and biased against Volkl because he's been giving Volkl racquets the top rating in almost all of his reviews over the past two years.

That's like saying that movie critic must be anti-Spielberg because he's been giving every Spielberg movie thumbs up and 5 stars out of 5. Clearly he's got a conflict of interest and is not being objective in his reviews.

 

[jonolau]

Does anyone else find the above post by jonolau make any sense at all? Or did you laugh until it hurt like I did?

Here's a self-confessed Volkl lover accusing a reviewer of being anti-Volkl and biased against Volkl because he's been giving Volkl racquets the top rating in almost all of his reviews over the past two years.

What you said in your reviews were definitely different from the views and comments you made in previous threads which were eventually deleted by TW ... for some strange reason it involved flaming by you.

Your previous posts in this thread were also deleted by TW for good reason, but yet you persist in flaming me with a new post ... grow up.

 

[NoBadMojo]

Hey, we got out once...why are we back?

May I respectfully suggest that you make a bigger deal out of BP than he actually is. Yes, I can see how he might get under your skin. But, he didn't follow you into this thread. And, you mentioned him several times in your early posts in this thread without a response from him. Let him have his opinion regarding "player's racquets". It is his opinion and you should recognize it as a valid opinion. I am not suggesting you tolerate insults, just that there might be fewer of them from both of you if you didn't argue over a difference of opinion.

btw, I noticed you got a kick out of one of my shorter posts. Feel free to use it when you deem it appropriate.

see my post 233 and 235.

 

[jonolau]

Now, oldguysrule, what were you saying about making a bigger deal out of BP than he actually is?

 

[BreakPoint]

jonolau,
Why do you continue to post "without your own conscious knowledge"?

Please think about this carefully before replying.

 

[jonolau]

Here's a self-confessed Volkl lover accusing a reviewer of being anti-Volkl and biased against Volkl because he's been giving Volkl racquets the top rating in almost all of his reviews over the past two years.

That's like saying that movie critic must be anti-Spielberg because he's been giving every Spielberg movie thumbs up and 5 stars out of 5. Clearly he's got a conflict of interest and is not being objective in his reviews.

How ironic. You go about giving your so called top ratings to certain Volkl models in those reviews, but in the TT forum, you state your strong dislike for the brand. I find this rather hypocritical. Your ego has blinded you to this obvious fact.

I already stated that I like Volkl for its comfort and feel, but does not mean I only use and own Volkl. As I stated in a previous post which you have conveniently chosen not to quote, I own many other brands and will be buying new non-Volkl racquets. So, once again your emotions have blinded you to more obvious facts.

 

[jonolau]

jonolau,
Why do you continue to post "without your own conscious knowledge"?

Please think about this carefully before replying.

So, you like it so much that you had to plagiarise it?

Please feel free to do so.

By the way, you're most welcome.

 

[BreakPoint]

"If only you could see yourself from an outsiders point of view, jonolau."

 

[jonolau]

Ha ha, you crack me up! Thanks for the laughs.

 

[andrew_b]

after trying out many frames i think im going to be going with a tweener (a 100 in or so). but im wondering that if so many of you guys use player's rackets that are demanding and that every shot you hit has to be perfect form or else it will not be the shot you want. when instead you could use an easy to use tweener or forgiving frame and not have to be as precise but still get good results (?).

I'm not sure if a 200G is considered a demanding frame, but I use it because I like the balance, weight, and feel of correctly struck shots.

Do I like the fact that if a volley is slightly mis-hit the ball goes *nowhere*? Of course not. But those times are rendered insignificant compared to how it feels for me the rest of the time.

It's about what works for me, what feels good and what I like. Pride has nothing to do with it.

 

[cabernetjunkie]

"If only you could see yourself from an outsiders point of view, jonolau."

I'm looking from an "outsiders point of view" and it looks to me he is spot on.

 

[BreakPoint]

...but in the TT forum, you state your strong dislike for the brand.

Where have I EVER said I "strongly dislike" Volkls? Show me. I dislike certain racquets, like everyone else does, I do not dislike brands.

I already stated that I like Volkl for its comfort and feel, but does not mean I only use and own Volkl. As I stated in a previous post which you have conveniently chosen not to quote, I own many other brands and will be buying new non-Volkl racquets.

So you're flaming me because I do not happen to like the "Volkl feel"? You don't play with other brands on a regular basis and I've seen your strong disdain for the Head FXP Radical. That's fine, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but doesn't that make you hypocritical to flame me because I don't use a Volkl on a regular basis? And what does that have to do with my reviews?

Since you hate the Head FXP Radical, does that mean you would be incapable of writing a comparative review of several racquets which includes a Head racquet?

 

[jonolau]

Where have I EVER said I "strongly dislike" Volkls? Show me. I dislike certain racquets, like everyone else does, I do not dislike brands.

So you're flaming me because I do not happen to like the "Volkl feel"? You don't play with other brands on a regular basis and I've seen your strong disdain for the Head FXP Radical. That's fine, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but doesn't that make you hypocritical to flame me because I don't use a Volkl on a regular basis? And what does that have to do with my reviews?

Since you hate the Head FXP Radical, does that mean you would be incapable of writing a comparative review of several racquets which includes a Head racquet?

I'm not going to be drawn into another senseless argument with you. Just note that I haven't flamed you, but you have been doing so in previous posts which have been deleted.

Nice try with the strong words on the FXP Rad Tour. Unlike you, I'm not interested in writing comparative reviews. That's what sets it apart.