Why hasn't Federer done for tennis what Tiger has done for golf?

[davey25]

Golf is a demanding and great game in many ways, but as an actual sport it is lame. What other so called "sport" could have someone like this win TWO majors:

Even his closest competitors like Mickelson and Els are fat unathletic hogs who would look like fools playing a sport like tennis or any sport other than golf. He stands out so much by merely being a competent athletic who is physically fit in that tour of hippos.

 

[fed_rulz]

I don't know which part of India you are from. But Tiger Woods and golf do have a marketable presence in parts of that nation. Tiger is not huge in all parts of Asia, but overall he is very marketable in that region particularly for an American athlete.

sorry, you're wrong on all counts. Tiger is virtually an unknown to the masses in India. Tennis gets more TV time than golf in India. Again, USA =/ rest of the world.

 

[BigServer1]

Tennis internationally is very popular, but from a US perspective it's not that special (though it's gaining in popularity, albeit slightly).

Woods made American kids want to play golf. That's why in the US he seems like the biggest athlete ever. Internationally, Soccer and Tennis stars are as big of a deal as Tiger Woods.

 

[skuludo]

Is Tiger Woods popular again after that ordeal?

Did he get some of those sponsors back?
Is Tiger still a big risk to invest money in?

 

[kOaMaster]

im afraid to admit this but, universally Shane Warne is more well known than Roger Federer.........cricket is the second most popular sport after soccer

eh...? no!?

could maybe believe it with the people, but not countries. I mean, who in europe, america and africa is interested in cricket except england and egypt?
like ice hockey is pretty popular in europe and america, but nowhere else in the world.
basketball I consider as another "big" sport because it's popular all over the world, in every country. like football and tennis is too.

there are few sports that catch everyones attention on this globe. there are events like the super bowl, tour de france, football world/european cup, tennis majors (wimbledon), rugby's six nations/tri nations tournament, baseball world series, olympic icehockey/basketball titles, nba finals.

 

[bolo]

Good question. It seems like tiger really elevated golf but tennis seems like it's more or less in the same place as in 2003 before federer really took off.

It would be interesting to know how many new viewers/casual players each player has brought into the sport. I never watched golf before tiger and now if I am flipping channels and I see woods playing in a GS I end up staying on that channel every now and then.

 

[DRII]

sorry, you're wrong on all counts. Tiger is virtually an unknown to the masses in India. Tennis gets more TV time than golf in India. Again, USA =/ rest of the world.

Sorry but you're wrong. Several big name companies used Tiger in their advertising in India. I know Accenture has in the past!

 

[DRII]

Tennis internationally is very popular, but from a US perspective it's not that special (though it's gaining in popularity, albeit slightly).

Woods made American kids want to play golf. That's why in the US he seems like the biggest athlete ever. Internationally, Soccer and Tennis stars are as big of a deal as Tiger Woods.

Tiger Woods is the biggest athlete ever in terms of advertising and marketing deals. Not just in America but globally.

 

[athiker]

sorry, you're wrong on all counts. Tiger is virtually an unknown to the masses in India. Tennis gets more TV time than golf in India. Again, USA =/ rest of the world.

And golf gets more TV time in the U.S. and therein probably lies the reason.

It seems like you can catch a golf tournament on TV almost every weekend...regular TV. I spent over a decade not catching a single Tennis match that I recall. Though I'm sure the slams were on...so 4 times a year...but even those are just on ESPN2 and for just the last few rounds. I've watched plenty of American Football, Basketball, a little baseball and even soccer.

I have watched a ton of tennis the last 2 years but only b/c I work from home, started playing again and have DirecTV and The Tennis Channel. Time Warner cable in our area does not even carry the Tennis Channel. I hate to admit it, but 2 years ago I'd never heard of Roger Federer, Nadal, etc. Living in America I had heard of the Williams sisters and maybe Andy Roddick for his serving. I'd certainly never heard of the Byran Brothers...#1 in the world and from the U.S. no less.

Now I never miss a chance to watch Federer play as well as a few other of my favorites and I Tivo a lot of matches. People need to have the opportunity to see top players play regularly to get much affinity for them or the sport. Most other sports come into people's homes via the glowing box on a regular basis.

 

[Ledigs]

Sorry guys "footballers" are not popular in the US. Beckham is only known cause of posh spice and cause he's a babe

 

[Ledigs]

Also look at Feds entourage. Anna wintour? Gavin rossdale??? Please. He needs to associate himself with better folks

 

[JRad]

Maybe Roger has done something for tennis besides boosting its rating or becoming a "billionaire athlete." The health of a sport shouldn't be measured in how much money you can milk out of the masses or how many poseurs crowd the courts to be seen in the latest outfits. I think Federer's game has been good for professional tennis. He shows that brute power isn't enough. To be the best, you have to master a variety of shots. I think that's good role model for young players. I think he has for the most part conducted himself with dignity and in a way that bring honor to the sport. I'd rather Federer represent tennis to a smaller number of people than Connors and MacEnroe being the public face of tennis to a tennis crazed nation.

 

[Ledigs]

Well said. I think he'd be more popular if he looked like beckham.

 

[valiant]

eh...? no!?

could maybe believe it with the people, but not countries. I mean, who in europe, america and africa is interested in cricket except england and egypt?
like ice hockey is pretty popular in europe and america, but nowhere else in the world.
basketball I consider as another "big" sport because it's popular all over the world, in every country. like football and tennis is too.

there are few sports that catch everyones attention on this globe. there are events like the super bowl, tour de france, football world/european cup, tennis majors (wimbledon), rugby's six nations/tri nations tournament, baseball world series, olympic icehockey/basketball titles, nba finals.

I think he meant by number of people. India and pakistan do make up huge total.Also in africa its kenya,south africa ,zimbabwe and namibia which are more into cricket. Never heard egypt.

 

[valiant]

I think Tiger has been marketed well. Those who dont play golf or even watch it know Tiger woods.

I am not sure who is more popular in my country. But I see more people playing tennis than golf.

 

[mandy01]

Also look at Feds entourage. Anna wintour? Gavin rossdale??? Please. He needs to associate himself with better folks

What do you mean by 'better folks'? :roll:

 

[forthegame]

You mean, like, how golf is waiting and thumb-twiddling wondering when the brightest star in their firmament will return to enliven the sport? No thanks.

There are a million other athletes that are eminently watchable and bankable if the Fed is AWOL. Let Tennis stay true!

 

[35ft6]

He isn't American.

This is a record. This thread was resolved in less than 3 minutes. Haha.

 

[abmk]

Sorry but you're wrong. Several big name companies used Tiger in their advertising in India. I know Accenture has in the past!

I am from India and like people have already pointed out before , Tiger woods is NOT popular in India . Now stop talking about without having a clue about reality :roll:

 

[Defcon]

Can we please please stop calling goddamn golf players athletes ??!! When you can't even walk across a field of grass you're not really playing a sport.

Golf attracts armchair wannabes glued to the golf channel who spend 1000's on the latest whizbang titanium clubs and a million useless gadgets to improve their swing while stuffing their face full of cheetos.

The weekend tennis warrior needs nothing more than a old sneakers and a used racket. You have to go out and run and actually move.

You can tell which 'sport' is designed for marketing. The only thing golf is good for is golf movies - strangely enough they are all pretty good.

 

[Carsomyr]

Perhaps its because that brand would be weak, at least weaker than Beckham or Woods due to lack of looks, charisma, attitude, being an anglo derivative, or no prescribed narative, etc.

The point is, this represents some sort of weakness on Federer's part. I know alot of Federer loyalist don't want to hear that!

And if I really wanted to irritate Fed fans, i would say this weakness should at least be discussed when GOAT status is brought up.

But I digress...

:lol:

So this is what the whole thread's about? Federer isn't GOAT because he's not as popular in America?

:lol:

 

[35ft6]

Golf is a demanding and great game in many ways, but as an actual sport it is lame. What other so called "sport" could have someone like this win TWO majors:

Even his closest competitors like Mickelson and Els are fat unathletic hogs who would look like fools playing a sport like tennis or any sport other than golf. He stands out so much by merely being a competent athletic who is physically fit in that tour of hippos.

This is why tennis is considered more of an elitist sport than golf in America. Fat dudes can see themselves in several of the golfers.

 

[Wilander Fan]

I cant believe no one is addressing this. The ONLY reason Tiger is so public is because he is a successful black pro golfer. This is a marketer's wet dream because he can access the traditional golf fans as well as a whole new demographic of blacks previously unreachable to him. Its also an American thing. Cross marketing is the name of the game in advertising in America. Everything is America from movies to consumer goods is sold with a cross market twist to try and capture white and black demographics.

Its not necessarily the fact that blacks are such huge purchasers as much as they can carry the younger demographics in simply because of they associate with them. They figured this out with Jordan who was a transcendental sport figure in a way no one has been since.

Fed is the GOAT in tennis but hasnt made the impact in pop culture because the marketers are not pushing him. IMO he has done more as a sportsman than Tiger. If Tiger were white, he would be practically invisible but he is pushed hard by marketers. In America, the advertisers control pop culture.

 

[Wilander Fan]

This is why tennis is considered more of an elitist sport than golf in America. Fat dudes can see themselves in several of the golfers.

Golf is not a sport. It is a game like checkers or darts or skipping rocks.

 

[35ft6]

^ It's a sport. But probably not an athletic contest.

 

[35ft6]

I cant believe no one is addressing this. The ONLY reason Tiger is so public is because he is a successful black pro golfer.

What do you mean only? He's on his way to becoming the best golfer of all time. It's only a matter of time before he overshadows Nicklaus completely.

 

[David L]

Tiger Woods is the biggest athlete ever in terms of advertising and marketing deals. Not just in America but globally.

No, this is because he has huge appeal in America. I mean, take football, proper football. This is the most popular sport in the world, yet many players who would be considered household names to the rest of us, are practically unknown in America. Take your American sports. Some of your biggest American stars can earn ridiculous amounts, yet still remain practically unknown to the rest of the world. For example, Kobe Bryant, LeBron James, Brett Favre, Peyton Manning etc. Even one of the biggest sporting events in America, the Super Bowl, barely registers outside of that country, but this does not prevent huge amounts of money changing hands, because the American market is so large and the flow of capital so big.

 

[David L]

If Tiger were white, he would be practically invisible but he is pushed hard by marketers. In America, the advertisers control pop culture.

Not true. If Tiger were white, he would be even more revered amongst white people and less so amongst black people. The black market would be gone, but the white market would be even bigger than it currently is, provided he was not some fat oaf. Make him the same as he is now, but white, and he would still be big, just in a different way.

You are right that his appeal amongst black and white people makes him unique in America, but I do not believe his appeal amongst black people is as large as one would imagine, because he has not really tried to appeal to this group and most black people probably still prefer the sports they followed before Tiger came along. Eminem is in a similar situation, being good in an area that is more commonly associated with a different demographic. This gives him access to an untapped market in the white community, and the already converted in the black and white communities, but he would still be pretty big without the new converts.

 

[Wilander Fan]

Not true. If Tiger were white, he would be even more revered amongst white people and less so amongst black people. The black market would be gone, but the white market would be even bigger than it currently is, provided he was not some fat oaf. Make him the same as he is now, but white, and he would still be big, just in a different way.

You are right that his appeal amongst black and white people makes him unique in America, but I do not believe his appeal amongst black people is as large as one would imagine, because he has not really tried to appeal to this group and most black people probably still prefer the sports they followed before Tiger came along. Eminem is in a similar situation, being good in an area that is more commonly associated with a different demographic. This gives him access to an untapped market in the white community, and the already converted in the black and white communities, but he would still be pretty big without the new converts.

My evidence for my assertion is Wayne Gretzky. A decent consensus for him being GOAT but he was not pushed hard by marketers and is fairly anonymous now. You can argue the popularity of the NHL but the NBA was not that popular before Jordan. It was a distant 3 behind MLB and NFL and now it has arguably passed MLB. The Tiger Woods thing, to be honest, bothers me a bit because I think golf is a joke and no one deserves that kind of praise for playing that game. It should be more in line with 8 ball championships in terms of popularity although 8 ball is more entertaining.

 

[David L]

Yeah but thats not the issue,

the issue is why, why has Federer not been as developed as a brand and is not as well known.

Perhaps its because that brand would be weak, at least weaker than Beckham or Woods due to lack of looks, charisma, attitude, being an anglo derivative, or no prescribed narative, etc.

The point is, this represents some sort of weakness on Federer's part. I know alot of Federer loyalist don't want to hear that!

And if I really wanted to irritate Fed fans, i would say this weakness should at least be discussed when GOAT status is brought up.

But I digress...

If Federer were British, he would be much bigger in England than Beckham. The same would be true in America. Also, unlike Federer, Beckham courts fame. He loves being famous and buys into the whole celebrity industry. He's happy to do all those half-naked modeling gigs and be seen at the right events. He also married someone who was famous in her own right, so you had the union of sports world fame and pop music fame. Before he got involved with a spice girl, he was less widely known. There are many footballers who play the game better than him, including in England, but it's his activities unrelated to sports which have propelled his name outside the football world.

 

[joeri888]

I thought the OP was talking about doing something FOR tennis and FOR Golf. How is making a huge brand of yourself good for tennis? He needs to make tennis famous, not himself.. American people are selfcentered. Tennis in Europe is bigger than ever.. Sweden is probably the only country in which tennis has decreased in popularity over the last 10 years.

Federer has done great.

 

[David L]

My evidence for my assertion is Wayne Gretzky. A decent consensus for him being GOAT but he was not pushed hard by marketers and is fairly anonymous now. You can argue the popularity of the NHL but the NBA was not that popular before Jordan. It was a distant 3 behind MLB and NFL and now it has arguably passed MLB. The Tiger Woods thing, to be honest, bothers me a bit because I think golf is a joke and no one deserves that kind of praise for playing that game. It should be more in line with 8 ball championships in terms of popularity although 8 ball is more entertaining.

I don't understand golf's huge appeal either, but it exists. Regarding Wayne Gretzky, I think his anonymity may simply be due to lack of interest in the NHL, as you say. Not all sports enjoy the same popularity.

 

[DRII]

I thought the OP was talking about doing something FOR tennis and FOR Golf. How is making a huge brand of yourself good for tennis? He needs to make tennis famous, not himself.. American people are selfcentered. Tennis in Europe is bigger than ever.. Sweden is probably the only country in which tennis has decreased in popularity over the last 10 years.

Federer has done great.

Try and comprehend the entire dicussion before making illogical generalizations!

 

[joeri888]

Try and comprehend the entire dicussion before making illogical generalizations!

I didn't read it.. But all I know is that the last few posts contained absolutely NO argument about what Tiger did FOR golf.

 

[DRII]

Not true. If Tiger were white, he would be even more revered amongst white people and less so amongst black people. The black market would be gone, but the white market would be even bigger than it currently is, provided he was not some fat oaf. Make him the same as he is now, but white, and he would still be big, just in a different way.

You are right that his appeal amongst black and white people makes him unique in America, but I do not believe his appeal amongst black people is as large as one would imagine, because he has not really tried to appeal to this group and most black people probably still prefer the sports they followed before Tiger came along. Eminem is in a similar situation, being good in an area that is more commonly associated with a different demographic. This gives him access to an untapped market in the white community, and the already converted in the black and white communities, but he would still be pretty big without the new converts.

Young white American males were heavy consumers of Hip-hop before Eminem. He did broaden the appeal for that demo, but he did not create it.

Hip-hop has also become global in its perspective and scope. Its huge and has immence impact.

 

[DRII]

I didn't read it.. But all I know is that the last few posts contained absolutely NO argument about what Tiger did FOR golf.

Tiger has incredibly broadened the appeal of golf and increased its popularity immensly.

I asked why Federer has not done the same for tennis on the same scale. He's been every bit as dominant as Tiger.

 

[AM95]

And how did he do that?
Internationally, I mean?

he went around screwing international women.

 

[dropshot winner]

Is anyone of you seriously watching golf?

I have never seen Tiger Woods play on tv, the only thing I've seen from him were a few best-of-videos on youtube.

 

[DRII]

I am from India and like people have already pointed out before , Tiger woods is NOT popular in India . Now stop talking about without having a clue about reality :roll:

If you're from India, then you know how many media markets exist there and how diverse that nation is. Which state are you from?

I never said he was the most popular athlete in India. However, several big brand companies feel he is known enough to use him in advertising there, Accenture is a prime example (before recent revelations of course).

 

[jamesblakefan#1]

Tiger has incredibly broadened the appeal of golf and increased its popularity immensly.

I asked why Federer has not done the same for tennis on the same scale. He's been every bit as dominant as Tiger.

I think it comes down to one thing - Roger doesn't want it. Roger doesn't want to be a brand like Tiger is. Some people even joke about how much Tiger has sold his soul to Nike and just being a marketing guy. Tiger markets himself to be that transcendent figure. Nike sells him in that way.

Also, Tiger's been around longer and done things in golf that have never been seen before.

Why hasn't Roger been able to do that for tennis? It's simple, he doesn't seek to be that global entity. He just wants to focus on tennis success more than the commercials and other things that go along w/ it.

And has golf really grown as much as you claim? 50% of people who call themselves Tiger Woods fans can't name another golfer on tour. So the PGA on its own hasn't really grown, it's just the Tiger brand brings in a lot of people. If Tiger were to start his own "Tiger Tour", it would probably crush the PGA if handled right.

 

[pame]

Most of the world doesn't have the marketing machine of the US, pure and simple. If this question were really to do with global popularity then people like Tendulkar, Lara, Warne would come out streets ahead of Tiger Woods; and that's only taking into account the 2nd most popular sport in the world -cricket. Shift to football (the one you actually play with your foot), and again you see the difference is US marketing which sets up a kind of false popularity when you look at the actual world figures. Good example is the promotion of baseball finals as "World" Series.

Last listing I came across in sports popularity worldwide (June 2009):

1. Football (the original) - 3.5 billion people
2. Cricket - 2 billion
3. Field hockey - 2 billion
4. Lawn Tennis - 1 billion
5. Volleyball - 900 million
6. Table Tennis - 900 million

 

[malakas]

If you're from India, then you know how many media markets exist there and how diverse that nation is. Which state are you from?

I never said he was the most popular athlete in India. However, several big brand companies feel he is known enough to use him in advertising there, Accenture is a prime example (before recent revelations of course).

what seems to me is that a non-indian is trying to teach indians about their own country only trying to fit in data to support his agenda.:roll:

how many indians do you need coming here to tell you their whole country couldn't care less about woods???

 

[fed_rulz]

what seems to me is that a non-indian is trying to teach indians about their own country only trying to fit in data to support his agenda.:roll:

how many indians do you need coming here to tell you their whole country couldn't care less about woods???

spot-on

 

[DRII]

what seems to me is that a non-indian is trying to teach indians about their own country only trying to fit in data to support his agenda.:roll:

how many indians do you need coming here to tell you their whole country couldn't care less about woods???

I'm not speaking of Indian sentiment. I am talking about advertising and marketing. I know specifically about the Accenture ads featuring Tiger Woods in India because i am studying marketing in my MBA cirriculum and Accenture was one of our regional assignments.

So regardless of what you or Fed-rulz has to say, Accenture obviously felt Tiger Woods was well known enough to use him in their marketing in some parts of India, point blank.

Also, how anyone person could speak for the largest democracy in the world is beyond me. I certainly did not do so. All I know is that Woods has a marketable pressence there. I did not say he was Shah Rukh Khan as far as advertising goes...

 

[pame]

I'm not speaking of Indian sentiment. I am talking about advertising and marketing. I know specifically about the Accenture ads featuring Tiger Woods in India because i am studying marketing in my MBA cirriculum and Accenture was one of our regional assignments.

So regardless of what you or Fed-rulz has to say, Accenture obviously felt Tiger Woods was well known enough to use him in their marketing in some parts of India, point blank.

Also, how anyone person could speak for the largest democracy in the world is beyond me. I certainly did not do so. All I know is that Woods has a marketable pressence there. I did not say he was Shah Rukh Khan as far as advertising goes...

But Accenture sponsors Accenture Match play, so obviously they'd promote golf as opposed to tennis.. and who would they use to promote golf? Daley? Duh. Federer? umm.. he plays tennis, not Accenture Match play golf.

 

[valiant]

Actually that's the only advertisement I remember of woods apart from the gillete with federer. Federer is seen in the rolex commercials.

 

[malakas]

I'm not speaking of Indian sentiment. I am talking about advertising and marketing. I know specifically about the Accenture ads featuring Tiger Woods in India because i am studying marketing in my MBA cirriculum and Accenture was one of our regional assignments.

So regardless of what you or Fed-rulz has to say, Accenture obviously felt Tiger Woods was well known enough to use him in their marketing in some parts of India, point blank.

Also, how anyone person could speak for the largest democracy in the world is beyond me. I certainly did not do so. All I know is that Woods has a marketable pressence there. I did not say he was Shah Rukh Khan as far as advertising goes...

so because one company chose woods you immediate CONTRARY to all witness and evidence availabe come to the conclusion that he must be popular.

Well here are some news to you.Gillete chose Woods to represent them in europe too and nobody in my country had any freaking idea who the heck that dude was.They even had to put on a little subtitle saying :Tiger Woods no.1 golfer.
Maybe you havent' studied enough about WRONG advertising choices.

 

[malakas]

Or maybe I can't speak for my tiny country as well?We're small and homogenised but how heck should I know what 11 million think,right?:roll:

 

[djokovicgonzalez2010]

I'm shocked about popularity of cricket... Certainly not in redneck country...

 

[marcl65]

I'm shocked about popularity of cricket... Certainly not in redneck country...

I'm a little skeptical about those numbers. Especially if they came from a wiki source:

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_most_popular_sport_in_the_world