Bought a String Machine and Now the Fun Starts

cap217

New User
I have 3 sticks:

Head Youtek Speed MP
Babolat Pure Drive GT
Babolate Pure Drive Roddick 2012

I also have a bunch of string, am new to tennis, and a string machine. Keeping a log here and comments are welcome.



The first racket I had was the Head and strung it at 55lb with Pro Hurricane Tour 16g. I didnt know any different so this was my "standard" feel and everything. Then I noticed that I couldnt hit quality backhands and I was demoing an APDGT and bought one with babolat addiction's and HATED it. I sold it and got a 2011 PDGT and liked it. It had RPM blast 17g but they went dead. I liked the power so I bought a PDR 2012 and that had TONS of power. I bought it with PHT 17g at 54 and the spin was good and the power was maybe too much.

So, I wanted to get away from poly bc my arm started to hurt and wanted to find comfort and spin.


I strung the head with Gamma Syn Gut that came with the machine at 55lb and I actually like the results. But NO SPIN at all... Good power and feel though.

Next I strung the PDGT with Tecnifiber Red Code 17g mains at 55 and Babolat Nvy cross 16g at 58. The results = NO SPIN but good feel and ok power. Nothing great here.

Since I am new, what should I have expected from the PDGT string set up?

Also, I used to want POWER POWER POWER but now after playing matches I realize that I have way more than enough power and I need control and spin on my shots. How do I get there?
 

loosegroove

Hall of Fame
I'm sure someone is going to say it, so it might as well be me. If you've only been playing 6 months, there is no way you "keep up" with 4.5 and 5.0 players. And for a synthetic gut, I thought Gamma had fine spin production. A full bed of fresh poly such is the way to go for less power and more spin. Though I don't know that many new players who should be using poly, because they don't have the strokes or racket head speed to reap the benefits.
 
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Up&comer

Hall of Fame
6 months... I play matches with 4.5 and 5.0s and keep up but get beat 2-6 1-6

Echoing the above poster, if you have been playing 6 months you can't keep up with a true 5.0 or 4.5 unless you have a god given talent and work for several hours a day.

As far as strings, the best way to get control and spin is technique. Yes, strings can help, but technique is king. I'd get a basic synthetic gut and learn good solid fundamentals before string experimentation. Gamma synthetic gut without wearguard is probably my favorite, others like pro supex spiral flex, others forten sweet or gosen og sheep micro. Any of those will be fine.
 

OldFedIsOld

Professional
I had a friend who was a natural athlete, played varsity baseball and soccer, and who was also naturally gifted with the eyes of a hawk and the ability to look a stroke and break it down and replicate it after a few times hitting. There are people who are naturally gifted and could play at a 4.5/5.0 level in only a month, don't doubt rare genetic occurrences.
 

cap217

New User
I made this thread to find out about strings...

As for my play, I am very good and started in December. I am not at all saying I beat 4.5+ players at all but I can play a match and not look stupid. I get beat 1-6 2-6 or something like that. I cant prove this, nor should I have to bc I am not claming anything here except that I can keep up with very good players.


PS

I played college baseball and I am a 3 hdcp golfer so I am an athlete to some extent.
 

cap217

New User
Echoing the above poster, if you have been playing 6 months you can't keep up with a true 5.0 or 4.5 unless you have a god given talent and work for several hours a day.

As far as strings, the best way to get control and spin is technique. Yes, strings can help, but technique is king. I'd get a basic synthetic gut and learn good solid fundamentals before string experimentation. Gamma synthetic gut without wearguard is probably my favorite, others like pro supex spiral flex, others forten sweet or gosen og sheep micro. Any of those will be fine.

I did work at tennis for hours a day when I started and want working during the winter. I did everything I could to learn. I get obsessive about hobbies.

I had my serve clocked at 129 at the highest and I didnt know what I was doing. I still cant get my serves in at all.
 

OldFedIsOld

Professional
I did work at tennis for hours a day when I started and want working during the winter. I did everything I could to learn. I get obsessive about hobbies.

I had my serve clocked at 129 at the highest and I didnt know what I was doing. I still cant get my serves in at all.

129mph without any coaching, how tall/big are you?
 

Muppet

Legend
Polyester strings need to be strung at least 10% (5 to 10 lbs.) lower than a multi or syngut string. And multis and synguts can provide spin with good technique.

I'm not trying to be insulting, but it's possible that the higher level players took the edge off their games to be able to play with you. You may be a 3.0 at best after playing for 6 months.
 

arche3

Banned
I did work at tennis for hours a day when I started and want working during the winter. I did everything I could to learn. I get obsessive about hobbies.

I had my serve clocked at 129 at the highest and I didnt know what I was doing. I still cant get my serves in at all.

Well if you played baseball at the college level I can see you with a live arm. So yeah you can probably bomb a serve no doubt. Even with shoddy form.
 
D

Deleted member 232704

Guest
I did work at tennis for hours a day when I started and want working during the winter. I did everything I could to learn. I get obsessive about hobbies.

I had my serve clocked at 129 at the highest and I didnt know what I was doing. I still cant get my serves in at all.

Did the serve actually touch the floor? Guessing not. :)
 

cap217

New User
My serve goes in about 1/5 at best. Do others play me easier? Probably, i dont know but i tell them to play hard and dont hold back.

Again, i am not saying i am great or anything so i dont understand. I do want to make a video though and see whats going on. I am also going to get a coach. Problem is that i dont know many people at all that play tennis. That was never a sport i considered playing.

I am 6' 2'' and 215.

Back to strings. I need more spin to make up for my technique. I dont produce enough spin to really attack the ball from the baseline in and keep it in.
 

Rafa4Ever

Rookie
...you can make it to 4.5 within 6 months. Granted you need to play every single day for 3-4 hours and get coaching almost as often, but it definitely can be done. I don't see why there is so much doubt
 

MayDay

Semi-Pro

kiteboard

Banned
How to get the best string job for your game: by Kiteboard

The best string job depends on how each person plays, the frame they use, the style they use, their own preferences. The object is to match the frequencies of string and frame so that they achieve the best pocketed feel for their game. Any sting job creates a “pocket”. This pocket determines everything we feel after impact.
The ball is only on the bed for 4-7/1000th /sec., yet, the frame wobbles with a lot of vibration when string causes it to vibrate/and move with the pressure of the outgoing shot on the string bed. This pressure is the force of impact, and that varies with player skill and player power, frame mass, RA ( ra is just stiffness or stiffness measurement of any given frame when bent with a given force and measured in terms of racquet analysis), string stiffness/elasticity/molecular distribution all differ from string to string and sometimes even within the same reel the same string varies. Talk to John Isner about how he used to snap Technifibre redcode more often in the first section of the reel than the last section of the reel! (Plays with Kirschbaum pro line II/redcode hybrid now.)

All that feel you get is from the vibration after the impact, not during the impact. That is due to the very short impact duration. The impact is too short to feel by itself. The strings stretch, sing, vibrate, and so does the frame, stretch, sing and vibrate, but for a far, far longer time than the ball stays on the bed. Blink your eyes. Now see how many times you can blink them in one second: One-thousand-One. About 3-4 times? The ball would have left the string bed about 80 times per blink! So if the ball only stays on the string bed for such a short time, why is there such a huge difference in the way the shot feels?
Every string job feels different, even with the same string, same stringing machine, same tension, same stringer. Why is that?
As the frame is taken off the stringing machine, the string immediately begins to lose tension. No two frames are exactly alike either. Some strings lose way more than others, in a way faster time. Rpm blast is one of these although it’s listed as a stiff string at 280 by RSI: http://www.racquetsportsindustry.com...ctor_2012.html

Any stringer will tell you that although rpm is listed as stiff, it feels soft when hit with, and it loses tension way too fast: RPM loses 17.37 lbs lost in 24 hrs. from a base of 62lbs strung on a 120 mph test. But, the tested and given stiffness rating does not always equate to controlled feel as a stiff string. Some strings listed as stiff don’t feel, nor play that way. And some strings listed as stiff have less control than the softer ones do. And gut is softer than almost all strings, yet has the most control when hybrid with a great poly cross. Why is that?

So if string loses tension so fast, even when not being hit with, how can any string job feel the same unless the frames are strung at the same time, with the same method? The answer is: they can’t. Although it takes a sensitive player to feel it, any frame strung first will lose tension faster and feel looser than the frame strung last, given a similar time hitting with each in the same time frame. The rates of vibration on each frame will also differ slightly as the string jobs loosen up, the frames themselves differ slightly, and their effect on the individual racquet frame will differ as well. The amount the string stretches, or elongates: will also effect what we call “trampoline”, or shots going too far long and out of the court. Here is an elongation table used by top stringers: This table shows just how much a given string will stretch, over a time with the same weight attached to each string for the same amount of time, and each string tested is struck with the same amount of force, and the stiffer strings vibrate at a higher frequency, yet, don’t necessarily lose tension slower on a linear scale than the softer lower vibrating string do, such as ashaway Kevlar 16g, which loses 27% tension over night compared to 8% for vs gut, yet, ashaway is 764 on stiffness, and vs gut is 109, which is way less vibration/frequency and is therefore way softer than ashaway kevlar. The reason why top stringers consult with it is to see which string should be strung at a lower/higher rate to match in a hybrid combination.
http://www.stringway-nl.com/en/TAonl... 10-2011.pdf elongation pdf But it does not tell the whole story to those interested in matching hybrids frequency wise.

Rate of vibration and how that affects feel/control/power/durability: Some of the vibration factors are : size or thickness of string expressed in mm, stiffness expressed in a number given by rsi ratings based on the individual string vibratory rate on test, tension, frame RA, frame size, frame lay up. Frames are hand made, and no two are exactly alike. That is why you prefer one frame over another over and over again: it vibrates more to your liking even though all the frames are supposedly identical, they never are.

How to achieve the most control in a given set up: Usually the softer strings have a lower rate of vibration, like gut, or synthetic gut. Although gut has the best tension loss numbers, synthetic gut does not hold tension well, and its rate of vibration changes rapidly compared to gut as it becomes looser faster than gut does and does not hold tension nearly as well. Tension is lost faster with harder hitters, and with those who use a more open string pattern and a stiffer frame at a higher tension strung. A string becomes looser as it loses tension and elongates/stretches out and its rate of vibration always lowers in pitch, so a set up that causes faster tension loss will need to be restrung faster. Gut loses tension less quickly than any other string although it is among the softest strings made. As syn gut stretches out, it embeds more, at impact, and more depth occurs. This does not mean more dwell time on the string bed. What difference is 1/1000th of a second going to make, anyway? This is partly why so many singles players change string jobs so often, while doubles players, who hit way fewer shots, serve only every fourth game, versus every other game, don’t spend money on string jobs, choosing to string only one frame per tournament rather than one every 8 games, as is often the case. Singles is far more competitive, more prize money, and more ego on the line than doubles so the doubles players don’t spend as much on string jobs.

No string has better hybrid control than gut, although a full gut job in today’s stiffer frames has too much trampoline and too many shots go out long because of the increased power and elongation and stiffer frames that impart more force at impact, such as the Babolats... The elongation tables will show you the tested numbers for each string type. That is why so many hybrid poly with gut, to dampen down gut’s elongation/trampoline issues. The stiffer strings in a hybrid job, whether in main or in cross, are strung at a slightly lower tension, to match vibratory rates with the lower vibrating, softer string. The higher rate of stiffness, the higher frequency of vibration with both frames and string and string tension as well….. So the poly is really there just to bring up the gut’s vibratory rate and dampen down its trampoline issues. Lower vibratory rates of any hybrid string job applies more force to the ball at impact, as the lower rate will allow the ball to sink further into the string bed before recoiling outwards. A great poly/poly hybrid for control is l-tec os premium 16g/4s 17g squoval shaped string as cross, and tour bite 18g/l-tec 4s. The l-tec 4s is a good cross for many different mains due to its pocketing effect.

If I were you, I'd string a couple frames with the same mains, and change the crosses only from l-tec 4s for power, to Volkl cyclone 18g for control.
 
You will now end up buying all sorts of strings and having a great time trying all the different variations but be warned, your wallet will be lighter but TW will love you for all the strings you have purchased from them :).
 

Wuppy

Professional
A true 5.0 would double-bagel a 6-month player every time. To be a real 5.0 you (IMHO) had to have played as a youth. People trained in childhood to play a sport will dominate people who weren't every time.

I was trained to play golf as a youth, was captain of my high school team, played against Tiger Woods a few times as a junior and teen. I went out on the range for the first time in about a year and a half the other day and was crushing drives and hitting the ball great. After not touching a club in 18 months.

My point is, when it's ingrained into your head in youth, you will always be good. No way a 5.0 would lose a game to a 6-month noob, no matter how much natural athletic ability he has, unless the 5.0 was just goofing off.
 

Up&comer

Hall of Fame
I need more spin to make up for my technique. I dont produce enough spin to really attack the ball from the baseline in and keep it in.

That's just it. Without sound technique, it will always feel that way. I know 4.5 players who play with full multi in the low fifties with long strokes who still keep the ball in (you can talk to Mikeler).

Poly won't truly give you benefits until you have fast racket head speed and good technique. You can get plenty of spin with any string. I recently played with a 4.5 and forgot my rackets. I borrowed my opponent's aerostorm strung with Prince synthetic and still beat him soundly.
 
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cap217

New User
That's just it. Without sound technique, it will always feel that way. I know 4.5 players who play with full multi in the low fifties with long strokes who still keep the ball in (you can talk to Mikeler).

Poly won't truly give you benefits until you gave fast racket head speed and good technique. You can get plenty of spin with any string. I recently played with a 4.5 and forgot my rackets. I borrowed my opponent's aerostorm strung with Prince synthetic and still beat him soundly.

I see the truth in this and need to work on my game and myself to produce spin. I am just hoping there was something to at least help my spin. The PDR 2012 with 17g PHT strings had a lot of spin for sure so maybe thats the choice for now.
 

Up&comer

Hall of Fame
I see the truth in this and need to work on my game and myself to produce spin. I am just hoping there was something to at least help my spin. The PDR 2012 with 17g PHT strings had a lot of spin for sure so maybe thats the choice for now.

You said hurricane hurt your arm. If that is the case, stay away from it. If you really want spin and have arm issues, you could try head intellitour or full rip control.
 

cap217

New User
You said hurricane hurt your arm. If that is the case, stay away from it. If you really want spin and have arm issues, you could try head intellitour or full rip control.

can I hybrid with RIP control? I dont have any here so I woul dhave to order it.

I do have a lot of Gamma stuff that came with the machine though. I also have Lux Savage Lime.
 

Up&comer

Hall of Fame
can I hybrid with RIP control? I dont have any here so I woul dhave to order it.

I do have a lot of Gamma stuff that came with the machine though. I also have Lux Savage Lime.

Lux savage is a bad idea. Anything polyester or co polyester is a bad idea if you have arm problems. I'd stick with the gamma synthetics.
 
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