ForehandRF
Legend
Djokovic is better on hard and grass than any of those guys so no wonder Federer was unable to have a similar success against him.
Fed has been just EPIC against 3 of his trickiest matchups since the racquet change!
- Thread starter UnforcedTerror
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DSH
Talk Tennis Guru
Tennis_Hands
Banned
So for Federer, Nadal is merely a racquet problem, he could solve the hi-bouncing ball to the backhand with the bigger racquet head; but Djokovic truly is a match-up problem.
Federer should've made the switch much earlier. But his old-racquet forehand was such a beauty, I think that's why he delayed and delayed!
Federer should've made the switch much earlier. But his old-racquet forehand was such a beauty, I think that's why he delayed and delayed!
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Roddick85
Hall of Fame
Ironically, Federer had better "numbers" against Djokovic with the 90 than he did with the RF97A.... 
The racquet change may have decreased the amount of mishits and compensated for the decline in firepower, it also made his backhand slice less effective and his forehand isn't what it used to be either. No matter how you spin the numbers, it only tells half the story. When I think about Federer's career, his best moments for me will always be associated to the 90.
The racquet change may have decreased the amount of mishits and compensated for the decline in firepower, it also made his backhand slice less effective and his forehand isn't what it used to be either. No matter how you spin the numbers, it only tells half the story. When I think about Federer's career, his best moments for me will always be associated to the 90.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Since 2015, the pecking order is:
1. Stan
2. Thiem
3. Federer
4. Nadal
5. Murray
This is in order of how well they have performed against Novak in slams.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
1. Peak Nadal destroyed Federer in 3 sets at the AO 2014 with Federer using the new big racquet. Also, Federer since 2017 onwards has been facing a much older and slower Nadal. Federer was not facing peak Nadal, so him beating Nadal in his 30s doesn't mean he would beat younger and faster Nadal. Take into account that Nadal's main strength always was his defense and velocity, both of which largely decrease with age and it is noticieable on faster courts like the AO or WB. Federer also has 0 victories over Nadal in outdoor hard courts since 2017. It was only one good year in the H2H. Since 2019, they are 1-1 in the H2H
2. Nadal destroyed Federer in 3 sets at RG 2019. No evidence that Federer solved Nadal's matchup on clay at RG. At the USO Federer has never beaten Nadal either, and at the AO Federer has a losing H2H 1-3. The only Slam where Federer leads the H2H over Nadal is WB, which means Federer never solved his H2H with Nadal.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
Nadal lost 3 Slam matches against Novak since 2015, while Federer has lost 5 Slam matches against Novak since 2015. Federer is not ahead of Nadal in Slam meetings against Djokovic since 2015.
And since 2014, Nadal is 1-3 against Novak in Slam meetings, while Federer is 0-6 in Slam meetings.
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Depends on surface.
On clay, Nadal.
On any other slow, high bouncing court, Djokovic.
On a fast court, don't be silly .. there are no fast courts.
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
ATG should commit suicide for losing to 38 year old and all their records must be expunged
Sport
G.O.A.T.
33 years old Rod Laver lost to 41 years old Pancho Gonzales. Hope Rod doesn't read your message.
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
Are you rating Nadal as above Laver or below ?
MeatTornado
Talk Tennis Guru
I do agree that this has been the most important change in their dynamic, not the racket. Rafa's still one of the faster guys on tour, but he definitely came back down to Earth, putting him on more even footing with Federer. And Rafa being forced to be more offensive basically plays right into Federer's hands, because Roger will like his chances against anyone on tour if the match comes down to a shootout of offense.
The rest I don't really agree with, but to each their own.
SamprasisGOAT
Hall of Fame
Spot on
HetTheGreaterer
Banned
Iirc, there was another 4015bat indian wells 2018 final.Also, he's had only one 40-15 "incident" with the new racquet. Before the change, he had two 40-15s. Obvious improvement is obvious.
Which imo started the cascade of failures for resurgent federer. He was nowhere as confident in his new game afterwards, and didn't hit the ball with same conviction either.
Third Serve
Talk Tennis Guru
Technically two if we count that Delpo match. There's plenty more if we consider 15-40 on return as well as 40-15 on serve.Also, he's had only one 40-15 "incident" with the new racquet. Before the change, he had two 40-15s. Obvious improvement is obvious.
Lew II
G.O.A.T.
Federer in his peak lost FOUR SLAMS to 19/20 yo
Lew II
G.O.A.T.
Federer is specialized at losing to babies:
beard
Legend
tennisaddict...
Is that all you can say after getting rect...
You must be politician in real life...
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Why since 2014? Novak became the dominator again in 2015.
Nadal lost fewer slam matches because he didn't meet Novak in slams enough, compared to Federer, which again puts a dent in the argument of how Nadal and Djokovic have been each other's competition in the last few years.
Federer has performed better against Novak in slams with only 1 match ending in straights and being 1 point away from winning another match. Nadal has been destroyed in 2 of their 3 slam matches and the third isn't closer than Wimb 2019.
stringertom
Bionic Poster
The h2h would be much more “solved” if The Nadal hadn’t conveniently “injured” himself vs Cilic at AO’18 (assuming Edmund hadn’t beaten him) and Khachanov at IW’19, no?
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Well, Nadal is still 5 years younger. Shouldn't Federer be worse at 35+ than Nadal at 30+?
I understand where he's coming from, but it simply does not apply in this case since Federer is 5 years older, not younger.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
So you're telling me that without his speed, Nadal has got nothing on Federer? But I thought he was supposed to be the more complete player.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Federer is 5 years older than Nadal. Get off your high horse. If Nadal is older and slower, Federer is even more so.
This argument does not hold when Federer himself is older, not younger.
McGradey
Hall of Fame
Ironically, Federer had better "numbers" against Djokovic with the 90 than he did with the RF97A....
The racquet change may have decreased the amount of mishits and compensated for the decline in firepower, it also made his backhand slice less effective and his forehand isn't what it used to be either. No matter how you spin the numbers, it only tells half the story. When I think about Federer's career, his best moments for me will always be associated to the 90.
Yep. The big exception being the 2017 comeback AO win over Nadal.
He had total mastery over the 90. It was like his wand that he could wave in whatever manner he needed to at any given moment; it's just that using the small racquet also meant he had a fatal flaw against Nadal.
ForehandRF
Legend
He also started to be overpowered by the likes of Berdych with the PS90.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
You'll have to remind me, what has Wawrinka done against Djokovic in the last couple of years?
Hitman
Bionic Poster
He won the last three slam meetings, which is the best anyone has done against Djokovic in recent years in the slams. Thiem has gone 2-1 in the last three slam meetings also, placing him second. The only two players to have beaten Djokovic multiple times in recent years in slam matches.
TearTheRoofOff
G.O.A.T.
I have now experience that allows me to foresee the shots of my opponent before he even though about them, so I can leisurely stroll to the place where I have to hit the ball, take a sip from the conveniently placed on a table for the purpose drink, and then, after having hit the ball, move to the next spot. Everyone should try it. Experience changes everything.
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
Federer in his peak lost FOUR SLAMS to 19/20 yo
Stats show more slams won at 19-20 than at 38
You fail
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
tennisaddict...
Is that all you can say after getting rect...
You must be politician in real life...
He couldn’t give a reply as you may have noticed
If Nadal is the GOAT or to be GOAT , he should do better than Laver
A person being hailed as ATG and would be GOAT has no excuses to lose to 38 year old like so many times. This applies to Djokovic as well who got embarrassed at YEC
Lew II
G.O.A.T.
When did Djokovic lose a slam to a 38yo?
How many of the current top100 are 19 years old?
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
When did Djokovic lose a slam to a 38yo?
How many of the current top100 are 19 years old?
He was embarrassed at YEC and it is a huge stain to his resume
Clearly shows what their h2h would be if they were the same age or imagine if Fed was 6 years younger
Lew II
G.O.A.T.
Wow that crucial Round Robin match is something that really satisfied you
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
Wow that crucial Round Robin match is something that really satisfied you
Novak lost YE 1 and that too at the hands of a crippled old man . Embarrassed is a mild word
Lew II
G.O.A.T.
Djokovic would have had to win the semifinal and the final too to be the YE #1. Federer was not the main reason he was not #1.
You're just overrating one of the wins Federer had over Djokovic because you know that Djokovic dominated in the most important matches of the rivalry:
Slam finals 4-1
Slam semis 7-4
YEC finals 2-0
Masters finals 5-3
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
Nothing is more worse than losing to 38 year old
Maybe Djokovic will better it later this year ?
Lew II
G.O.A.T.
@tennisaddict
H2H adjusted by importance: 32.5 to 17.5
H2H adjusted by importance: 32.5 to 17.5
Ultimate Tennis Statistics - Roger Federer vs Novak Djokovic
Roger Federer vs Novak Djokovic at Ultimate Tennis Statistics
www.ultimatetennisstatistics.com
tennisaddict
Bionic Poster
@tennisaddict
H2H adjusted by importance: 32.5 to 17.5
Ultimate Tennis Statistics - Roger Federer vs Novak Djokovic
Roger Federer vs Novak Djokovic at Ultimate Tennis Statisticswww.ultimatetennisstatistics.com
Cry all you want
The last thing anyone wants is to be humbled by an invalid , for all practical purposes
Lew II
G.O.A.T.
I think you're the one who is crying lately.
OldschoolKIaus
Hall of Fame
lol poor birdman
Tennis_Hands
Banned
@tennisaddict
H2H adjusted by importance: 32.5 to 17.5
Ultimate Tennis Statistics - Roger Federer vs Novak Djokovic
Roger Federer vs Novak Djokovic at Ultimate Tennis Statisticswww.ultimatetennisstatistics.com
When I said that you WORK to have Djokovic give you a purpose, I didn't mean that you have to clock overtime.
Doctor/Lawyer Red Devil
Talk Tennis Guru
Forgot that one. I singled out Novak though as he was left out in favor of Berdych in the trickiest three match ups in OP.
Roddick85
Hall of Fame
When you look at Federer's style, it's much more suited to the 90 than the larger/powerful frames. Federer is about control, insane angles, touch, shot making and precison. Sure he had more firepower when he was younger, but I never considered him a "power base liner" among the likes of Tsonga, Berdych or Wawrinka. The RF97 surely gave him more firepower but he also struggled to control that power at times, especially in 2014.
We all know he had to make the switch because of Nadal. The H2H was embarrassingly 10-23 at the time.
But after the switch, Nadal has to fear Fed's backhand, but Djokovic has no fear of Fed's forehand.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
Stan's last Slam victory against Djokovic was back in 2016 though, not in the last couple of years.
Hitman
Bionic Poster
Stan's last Slam victory against Djokovic was back in 2016 though, not in the last couple of years.
2019 USO fourth round, my friend.
How does that change the narrative of what I am saying though, when I am talking about the last couple of years? It is clear I am talking about from 2015 to 2019.
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