Federer's lob... one or two bounces?

One or two bounces?

  • one

    Votes: 79 68.1%

  • two

    Votes: 37 31.9%
  • Total voters
    116
Tennis Fanatic 070

Tennis Fanatic 070

Banned
Clearly one bounce. He framed that lob, so it was lucky.

Btw, what's the point in making a thread and a poll about this? It was meaningless, he lost the set..
 
Bartelby

Bartelby

Bionic Poster
It looked good to me so if there was topspin its illegitimate, underspin legitimate? So Murray would have the answer as well.
 
Fedinkum

Fedinkum

Legend
Two bounces, no doubt. Fed fans, we should have some class.

Edit: op video was not supa slow mo. We in australia saw a supa slow mo by our local tv channel, there were two bounces, the ball bounced up before it tounched the racket face. Jim Couier initally was netural, but after about 4 replay, he leaned towards double bounce.
 
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Zildite

Zildite

Hall of Fame
Zoom and enhance!

jwmOgz0.gif


Exhibit A

K3jm9ik.jpg


Either way its really close and very tough for Mr Pascal to make the call live
 
D

DefensiveTennis

Guest
If you have not seen good footage of it then I will hold back but if you have and you still think it was 1 bounce you are a fool.

2 bounces. End thread.
 
The_Order

The_Order

G.O.A.T.
If anybody honestly thinks it didn't bounce twice then time to get your eyes checked. It was a double bounce.
 
Badger

Badger

Semi-Pro
On first, second and even third viewing I thought it was one bounce. Another view though and it definitely bounced twice, meeting the racket and groundat about the same time. Fed even admitted he didn't know whether or not it bounced twice. To be honest I don't think Murray would have won the third set had it not happened. Kind of spurred him on.
 
sbengte

sbengte

G.O.A.T.
While watching it live, I thought it was a double bounce and I was quite surprised that the point continued because I thought Fed had lost the point. On the replays they showed , it looked like a single bounce though. Too close to call.
 
Bobby Jr

Bobby Jr

G.O.A.T.
It looks like frame and ground at the same time in that really close crossover point where even the player probably wouldn't realise it.

That was two bounces imo but not the sort where you could criticise the player who hit it for being totally aware of the fact (Berdych at Madrid 2012 for example).
 
G

Gimmick

Semi-Pro
Why is a blurry slo-mo more conclusive than watching a regular replay? Even worse is the blurry still shots. I think he framed it at ground level after one bounce.
 
heninfan99

heninfan99

Talk Tennis Guru
The ball definitely hits the ground again but his racquet is on the side of the ball exactly at impact. I believe that's a double bounce.
 
R

rainingaces

Legend
How can a player tell when on the stretch like that?

Federer it's alright he is goat but Delpo gets lynched by the fanboys for the same situation.
 
R

rainingaces

Legend
tipsa...don'tlikehim! said:
The DelPo one was not close, unlike the one today in the Fed match.
Click to expand...

It's not about how close that's not what is being disgust, its about how can you judge it in real time, no replays, running at full speed and looking for your opponents move out of the corner of your eye. The umpire missed it no wonder the player wasn't sure.
 
Badger

Badger

Semi-Pro
Badger said:
On first, second and even third viewing I thought it was one bounce. Another view though and it definitely bounced twice, meeting the racket and groundat about the same time. Fed even admitted he didn't know whether or not it bounced twice. To be honest I don't think Murray would have won the third set had it not happened. Kind of spurred him on.
Click to expand...

Hmm I'm even doubting myself now looking at it again. I really can't even tell anymore. Too close
 
Kalin

Kalin

Legend
The broadcast I was watching here in Asia had a slo-mo replay in HD.

Clearly two bounces, no arguments whatsoever. Very, very easy to see in high-def slo-mo

I am a Fed fan, BTW. Luckily Murray won the set so no lasting damage. If anything, Fed was more affected in the long run.

Again, if anyone has any doubts, find the HD slo-mo; unobstructed view from the side. Very clear view of what happened
 
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D

Deleted member 3771

Guest
Zildite said:
Zoom and enhance!

jwmOgz0.gif


Exhibit A

K3jm9ik.jpg


Either way its really close and very tough for Mr Pascal to make the call live
Click to expand...

Fed did a Del Potro, he knew he scooped it up off the bounce but kept quiet.
 
cknobman

cknobman

Legend
Cant tell almost looks simultaneous.

Either way I don't see how you could make a call on it especially in real time.
 
MAX PLY

MAX PLY

Hall of Fame
Based on the super slo-mo replay, it appears (after watching the replay many, many times) that the ball it both Fed's racquet and the ground at pretty much the same time--nevertheless I think that is a double bounce BUT there's absolutely no way that anyone playing or watching from the umpire's chair in real time could possibly make that call. That circumstance, coupled with the trajectory of the retuned ball by Fed (albeit the frame likely helped), made it reasonable for the umpire to rule a legal strike. I have no idea how anyone (at least anyone who plays tennis with regulation balls at any speed short of puff-lobs) could assume Fed knew he scooped it up and "kept quiet" but I do know that some trolls are just more pathetic than others. It was just one of those things that happens sometimes . . . did not affect the outcome of the match.
 
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martini1

martini1

Hall of Fame
Federer is not cheater. I think if he knew for sure it was a double bounce he would have called it. I also give him the benefit of the doubt.
 
D

Deleted member 3771

Guest
Tennis Fanatic 070 said:
I'm guessing you rooted for Murray? :):)

I am still convinced it was a single bounce, everybody saying it wasn't is either blind or a Fed hater. Enough said.
Click to expand...

You must be blind, almost everyone that answered the tv poll straight after the incident said it bounced twice, only some blind fanatics would say it bounced once.

I went for Federer because I want to see Nadal abuse his backhand again. It's a far easier tactical match v Fed than vs Murray.
 
RoddickAce

RoddickAce

Hall of Fame
Zildite said:
Is it not possible to hit a double bounced ball with backspin? Doesn't really prove anything.
Click to expand...

Agreed. A double bounce or single bounce has 0 direct impact on whether the ball will have topspin or slice.

If a ball bounces once, and you racquet face is angled upwards, it is going to be a slice. If it bounces twice and your racquet face is angled upwards, it is going to be a slice.

If a ball bounces once, and your racquet face is closed, there will be topspin, same for double bounce.

The real explanation of what Fed meant is:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5AyX8F9fE8&t=0m51s

Explained by Robbie Koenig.
 
D

Deleted member 3771

Guest
If you look at the racket, he even did a scoop motion as if he was anticipating to scoop it up off the bounce, which is what he did. Fed adds yet another skillful shot to his repertoire, the scoop lob. This might be the first scoop lob winner in history.
 
T

TennisandMusic

Guest
Zildite said:
Zoom and enhance!

jwmOgz0.gif


Exhibit A

K3jm9ik.jpg


Either way its really close and very tough for Mr Pascal to make the call live
Click to expand...

Clearly two bounces, the ball is below the racquet and compressing in this photo. And in the video you see it bounce before it hits his racquet.

Funny, didn't Federer have a hissy fit in a match against Berdych a few years back because he knew the "physics" of the shot and the only way for the ball to get over the net that way was off the second bounce?

Yup, here it is. Federer the hypocrite I guess. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ofNg0y8w60

It's the exact same case here. So Federer knows it was two.

I now expect tons of threads of outrage on "Federer the cheater." If the members of this board are honest, at least.
 
D

Deleted member 3771

Guest
TennisandMusic said:
Clearly two bounces, the ball is below the racquet and compressing in this photo. And in the video you see it bounce before it hits his racquet.

Funny, didn't Federer have a hissy fit in a match against Berdych a few years back because he knew the "physics" of the shot and the only way for the ball to get over the net that way was off the second bounce?

Yup, here it is. Federer the hypocrite I guess. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ofNg0y8w60

It's the exact same case here. So Federer knows it was two.

I now expect tons of threads of outrage on "Federer the cheater." If the members of this board are honest, at least.
Click to expand...

Fed is no dummy, he knew he scooped it up, he was just desperate for the break so he kept quiet.
 
T

TennisandMusic

Guest
TheNatural said:
Fed is no dummy, he knew he scooped it up, he was just desperate for the break so he kept quiet.
Click to expand...

Well yeah, anyone who plays tennis knows when they hit it off a bounce like that. And you look at the direction of the racquet, he is swinging forward. It's not even a "scoop" it's a push. The vertical height is achieved through hitting it off the bounce, so it's already rising.

So he cheated, plain and simple. I just want to see the outrage. Seriously, all the people saying taking longer than 20 seconds between points is "cheating" NEEDS to be equally foaming at the mouth over this.

I mean...where are all the threads? The vitriol? What about the integrity of the game people! :lol:
 
Last edited by a moderator:
RF20Lennon

RF20Lennon

Legend
If it was two bounces and he hit it right off the bounce there is no way he could have managed that shot. It was one bounce but he got lucky there. It was a lucky shot.
 
T

TennisandMusic

Guest
RF20Lennon said:
If it was two bounces and he hit it right off the bounce there is no way he could have managed that shot. It was one bounce but he got lucky there. It was a lucky shot.
Click to expand...

Uh ... it is clearly and 100% verified two bounces.

You have it in reverse. There is NO WAY to hit that shot off one bounce with that swing path and framing the ball. You can see the ball clearly bounce twice. In the photo the ball is touching the ground as the racquet is about to hit it. In the video you can see the ball hit and start to come up again as he hits it.

Sorry, it is two bounces. I would stake everything I have on it, because there isn't a question.
 
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