Going Back to a Heavy Racquet? Maybe...

[TripleB]

Well, it has taken several years, hundreds of demos, quite a few racquet purchases, and 3.215 million posts, but this summer while I'm off from teaching I'm going to try out demos that are similar to my Prince Original Graphite Mid.

I just don't think there is any "less than 11.4 ounce" racquet that offers the solid response offered by heavier racquets. I first made the move towards a lighter racquet in order to improve my doubles play...the 93 square inch racquet seems to be even smaller at net. But in looking at my doubles game I'm not sure it's gotten any better nor do I think it's gotten any more fun. And the lighter racquets certainly haven't improved my singles game...serves yes, game as a whole, no! So I figure what's the point in continuing to demo/buy/stop using the lighter weight racquets.

In looking at what's out there similar to the POG Mid, including the open (or at least no more than 16 mains) string pattern, I've found the following...some even on closeout:


- Dunlop Aerogel 100 ($100)
- Volkl DNX 10 Mid ($110)
- Yonex RDS001 Mid ($89)
- Dunlop Aerogel 4D 100
- Gamma Tour 330X
- Volkl Power Bridge 10 Mid
- Wilson BLX Six-One 95 16x18
- Yonex RDiS 100 Mid

- Head Youtek Prestige Pro (98 sq in)
- Yonex RDiS 100 Midplus (98 sq in)
- Yonex RDiS 200 Midplus (98 sq in)


Anyone have any experience with any of the racquets mentioned above? If so, what are your thoughts?

I think the only two I've tried are the RDiS 100 MP and the Midplus version of the RDS001.

Thanks...I'll let you know how things turn out demoing smaller 'players' racquets!!!

BTW: thank you for the condolences you sent concerning the passing of my mother...she was a wonderful and amazing woman...the funeral was this morning and it was beautiful...very warm out though (I think God made it that way on purpose, since she had her stroke 7 years ago she had stayed cold no matter the temperature)...again thank you for your thoughts.

TripleB

 

[Deleted member 25923]

When I'm off my iPod I'll let you know about the Ag100

 

[Doubles]

I have played with the DNX 10 mid. It was very stable, and the frame was brilliant at the net. Very flexy, and solid. There wasn't a need for a dampener in the frame. Spin production was suprising from a mid, but the 16x19 pattern had something to do with it I'm sure...

 

[TripleB]

When I'm off my iPod I'll let you know about the Ag100

I look forward to your thoughts on the AG100s.

One question - how does the grip size on the 100's run? I notice they only have 4 5/8" in stock - lately I've been going down to a 4 1/2" with overgrip on most racquets. I'm afraid the 4 5/8" might be a little large (and my luck, no demos of the AG 100).

TripleB

 

[Visene77]

Very very very very difficult to recreate the feel of a Prince racquet. Their materials and manufacturing process create a different racquet.

 

[bluetrain4]

They still Prince Graphite mids new. Why not just purchase those?

 

[coyfish]

Why not just put lead?

 

[Deleted member 25923]

I look forward to your thoughts on the AG100s.

One question - how does the grip size on the 100's run? I notice they only have 4 5/8" in stock - lately I've been going down to a 4 1/2" with overgrip on most racquets. I'm afraid the 4 5/8" might be a little large (and my luck, no demos of the AG 100).

TripleB

It's a great frame, especially on serves. It can be a tad stiff on mishits (def stiffer than the yonex) but from others i've heard it's still not that stiff (like mid stiffness in their opinions). I love the thin beam.

Personally, I feel that the Dunlop grips run a tad larger than others.

 

[TripleB]

They still Prince Graphite mids new. Why not just purchase those?

I've got a pair of the newer 'Tour' POG mids....just thinking of demoing several racquets that are similar to the POG Mid over the Summer just to see how they compare to it.

TripleB

 

[TripleB]

Personally, I feel that the yonex grips run a tad larger than others.

So you feel the Yonex grips are larger than the Dunlop 100 grips...the Dunlop grips run smaller than advertised?

Typically I feel Head and Yonex grips run small, Babolat grips run big, and most others are about correct.

Thanks.

TripleB

 

[Viper]

I've also been debating this switch. I've been a mid to 95 player most of my life, found the Donnay Pro One OS fell in love, then decided that I wasn't improving because of my racket, so I switched to frames more my level. I've been trying out so many tweeners it's crazy. I hit with my Donnay today though, and loved the heft of the racket. I'm going to try stringing up my Volkl PB8 (my tweener of choice) with a syn. gut to see if it changes anything, but if it doesn't, I'm back to the Donnay.

 

[Steve Huff]

BBB, you and I have been on these boards a long time, and you were demo rackets upon end way back then. I'm not saying that's bad (I like to demo cars just for the fun of it), but find one, play with it, hit with another when someone asks you to try theirs (or when opportunity presents itself). Then, if something feels interesting, demo it. You're going at it too often, too blindly. Don't rely on the specs so much. Just ask people if, when you hit with them, you can try their racket. Narrow it down a bit first. All the opinions in the world aren't worth the paper they're written on--and on these boards, that ain't much.

 

[backhand]

^^^^Yeah, but as someone who joined about the same time as you and B, I seem to recall saying something along the same thing lines to him back then. And several times since. Took me a long time to realize some of us like to search for holy grails more than find them. (And there's some long cultural traditions that argue the search is more significant than the finding, anyway...) B enjoys all this. Simple as that.

This isn't the pro tour, y'know. B doesn't need to to make a living at it, use the same stick he learned on with a new PJ every few years, worry about a new version altering his mechanics slightly.

But that brings up something, B: Have you considered going back to the future? Seriously. Are you certain that the list you have will produce a better stick than your real POG? Or than my candidate, a PT280/630? The more racquets I demo, the less I'm certain they're better in the ways I care about than several classics that still can be found new, or in nice condition, on the web for about the same, or a bit more, than a new this-year's-wunderracquet. Just a thought...

 

[Donny0627]

I have the BLX 95 16x18. It is the greatest thing Ihave ever hit with...

 

[fuzz nation]

Mornin' all...

Interesting topic here. I won't be a goon and ramble off with all my racquet ponderings, but I do wonder just how much our individual choices of frames actually shape our relation to the game. Anyway, along those lines, it's probably fun and informative to try lots of different gear, especially when that curiosity leads to the discovery of a real gem. Hey, it can even turn out that this gem is the racquet you've used all along while wondering if the grass is greener...

I used to be sure that one racquet would be best for me - made sense and most would probably agree with that idea. Then after some demos, buying, selling, trading, learning to string in support of my habit, and maintaining a small stockpile of frames, my perspective has changed.

Pretty much the only thing I want in a racquet is some heft - at least enough to feel stable enough to not get pushed around by the ball. For me, that minimum is something like a Volkl C10 in stock layout. Head-light balance and some extra flex are f-u-n for ripping out the strokes with extra control in a singles setting, but a stiffer alternative with some pop and authority around the net is my night-and-day better option for doubles. Only because I've looked around, I know what works better for me. I'm not competing for my lunch money, but even if I was, I might still be more effective with the right gear for the style of play.

TripleB: I think that one of the Volkl mids should be interesting for you to try out, but I don't think it's a crime to keep some options open. If one frame does it for you, but only on occasion, maybe you'd enjoy having an alternative handy when you need a different personality in your racquet. If there's one frame that "does it all" better than anything else for a given player, I haven't found it for myself - but I'm not worried about it anymore.

 

[slice bh compliment]

...I just don't think there is any "less than 11.4 ounce" racquet that offers the solid response offered by heavier racquets..

TripleB,
Not sure where you came up with the number 11.4, but you speak the truth.

For some, that number is higher. For others the number may be lower, but not much.

I'm all for thinking outside the box and all, but I think the old wisdom is sound. Heavy is good. It's just is. It's stable. If the racquet is balanced well, it's maneuverable. It's powerful. I like the touch and the control of a heavy frame.

Of course, it's subjective...totally a feel thing for individuals. I feel like I could get used to a light racquet given enough time. But why? What are the advantages? This is not a bike race. You have to hit something with the racquet.

Do we allow our equipment to shape our game or vice versa > Chicken/egg situation. Nice question.

Again, it's about feel and how hard your opponents typically hit.

I'd be curious to see what a college coach (or tour coach) would think of your 11.4 number. Maybe they're not tuned into this sort of thing, but I doubt there are a lot of good players using anything lighter.

 

[TripleB]

But that brings up something, B: Have you considered going back to the future? Seriously. Are you certain that the list you have will produce a better stick than your real POG?

Yea...that's what I'm considering now...me and Michael J. Fox - going Back to the Future.

I'm supposed to play this afternoon and will start out using my POG Mid 'Tour'. If so inclined, I may switch over to the Gamma T-7, RDX-500 MP, LM Radical MP, or even the Pure Drive Cortex, for a few games here and there throughout the afternoon...or if playing extremely well with the POG, I may not.

Then if the POG is the best of the bunch I'm going to demo several 'similar' (ie: 11.7+ oz, open pattern, smaller head size?, 7+ points headlight, etc.) racquets during the first couple of week of Summer.

Not necessarily looking for a replacement, just seeing how others compare to the POG Mid and if I can still play with a 'hefty' racquet for a couple hours a day, several days in a row.

Thanks for everyone's input, advice, and help.

TripleB

 

[stevewcosta]

Yea...that's what I'm considering now...me and Michael J. Fox - going Back to the Future.

I'm supposed to play this afternoon and will start out using my POG Mid 'Tour'. If so inclined, I may switch over to the Gamma T-7, RDX-500 MP, LM Radical MP, or even the Pure Drive Cortex, for a few games here and there throughout the afternoon...or if playing extremely well with the POG, I may not.

Then if the POG is the best of the bunch I'm going to demo several 'similar' (ie: 11.7+ oz, open pattern, smaller head size?, 7+ points headlight, etc.) racquets during the first couple of week of Summer.

Not necessarily looking for a replacement, just seeing how others compare to the POG Mid and if I can still play with a 'hefty' racquet for a couple hours a day, several days in a row.

Thanks for everyone's input, advice, and help.

TripleB

Consider yourself among the lucky few. To be able to buy new classic racs. (that you like)at a low price is nearly impossible. I say buy 6 or 7 POG mids and be done with it. I personally couldn't hit a barn door with the thing and find it much more difficult and harsh than the 6.0 85, but if I liked it, I would buy several. To top it all off, the POG mid looks awesome. Hell, I might even try it again.

 

[Deleted member 25923]

So you feel the Yonex grips are larger than the Dunlop 100 grips...the Dunlop grips run smaller than advertised?

Typically I feel Head and Yonex grips run small, Babolat grips run big, and most others are about correct.

Thanks.

TripleB

Whoops, I meant to say Dunlop grips. I editted my post for you.

 

[sargeinaz]

I feel the same way. After moving on to lighter, less headlight sticks, I just dont like how they feel and play. I miss the weight and I feel that while they improved my game on some areas, they hurt in others and overall I just enjoy playing with a heavier racket more. I also learned that 18X20 patterns are not for me. Since none of us get paid, we should play with what we like. Looks like its going to be Fischer M Pro 1 or volkl c10 for me.

 

[TripleB]

Whoops, I meant to say Dunlop grips. I editted my post for you.

I guess that eliminates the AG 100 from my list of possibilities...TW doesn't have a demo and they don't have a grip size to purchase other than the 4 5/8". I appreciate the input...helps a great deal!!!

TripleB

 

[Deleted member 25923]

I guess that eliminates the AG 100 from my list of possibilities...TW doesn't have a demo and they don't have a grip size to purchase other than the 4 5/8". I appreciate the input...helps a great deal!!!

TripleB

No problem. Personally, it can be a bit stiff in some ways, but it also has its merits.

 

[a_2c+]

Try the Wilson N95.

It's pretty forgiving for its size, even when its strung with poly. It's heavy enough to tackle heavy balls, yet light enough for maneuverability.

 

[jb83]

Similarly, I've been looking around for a good substitute for the POG. Mainly because the new version is just not balanced the same as the 4-stripe I favor. The 4-stripe is a precision instrument, whereas the new version feels more like a club. Long story short, whenever I come back to the POG after being away for a while, I always wonder why I left. It's got nice heft, great access to spin, can hit flat, and has that great pure graphite touch that I have not found in newer racquets. As a wise man once said, "It is so choice."

 

[Deleted member 25923]

Personally, I would try out the Volkl c10 pro. it's got more pop than the RDX500 and has the flex. (So i've heard). I wanna try it out.

 

[TripleB]

TripleB,
Not sure where you came up with the number 11.4, but you speak the truth.

The 11.4 ounces came from the Head LM Radical Midplus I've played with in the past. With Rubber Band, Overgrip, and Protective Tape mine weighs in at 328 grams. It's the lightest racquet I've found that gives me a consistently solid feel from all areas of the racquet face. No racquet that I've tried with a weight lighter than the LM Rad MP has given me a truly solid feel.

Yesterday I played 4 sets of doubles and switched to a different racquet after each set.

Warmed up with my POG Mid and Gamma T-7. While the T-7 was more forgiving, the POG Mid won would because it felt so much more solid and because of the extra spin I got. Power advantage actually went to the POG Mid.

So, first set I played with the POG mid. Fantastic hitting groundstrokes and amazing hitting serves (power, spin, control, WOW). Unfortunately I had a hard time finding the center of the racquet face on volleys. Still, overall, a very successful set with excellent control and heavy spin.

Second set I switched over to the Head LM Radical Midplus. I gave up some spin (although not as much as I thought; BB Ace 18 was in the mains) but the racquet is just so solid from all over the court. Volleys felt awesome (didn't seem to miss the sweetspot much), excellent touch, superior control, and just as effective on serves as the POG Mid. On the serve, compared to the POG Mid, I had just as much pop, better control, and only a slight decrease in spin. LM Radical beat the POG Mid.

Third set I went to the Yonex RDX 500 Midplus. The first thing I noticed with the 500 was that my slice returns stayed much lower than with the LM Rad MP. Control on slice shots seemed to be just as good with the 500 as with the LM Rad MP but the Rad gave better control on flat and topspin shots. At net the RDX offered the same solid response of the Head but was a bit slower up there (as it was on groundstrokes). Even though the swingweight of the Head is greater, I think the less weight (14 grams on mine) offered me better maneuverability. I think the touch with the Head was a bit better. I got better kick with the RDX500 MP on serves but overall I liked serving better with the Radical.

The 4th set I went to the Pure Drive Cortex. That lasted about 3 games before I switched to another LM Radical MP (with BB ALU Power strings). The solid feel I got from the other 3 racquets made the PD Cortex feel like plastic. Even the pop I was getting on my serves left with the PDC...or maybe it was because I didn't feel like I could control my serves.

So it seems as though my perfect racquet is a racquet with solid feel that is between 325 and 350 grams...I'm making a demo list as I type { it looks as though there are 10 possibilities right now :mrgreen: }.

Although, the RDX500 MP or LM Radical MP may just be the one!!!

TripleB

 

[slice bh compliment]

^Makes sense.
When you demo, don't be afraid of the Pure Storm Ltd GT and the Prestige mp. There's a Tecnifibre t-fight 325 I'm diggin', too. And if you prefer 16 mains, gotta love the Dunlop 200tou and the Volkl c 10 pro. Sweet sticks, all of 'em. You're on the right track. Just don't settle for something too light/not stable enough/not solidd enough.

Oh, and if you like power: Babolat AeroStorm Tour and Pure Storm Tour GT.

Best wishes, man!
-slice

 

[TripleB]

I'm going to stick with the LM Radical MP for a while...played incredibly well with it in both singles and doubles Thursday night. After 37 years of tennis I finally found a volley and a forehand!!!

TripleB