Help choosing poly cross with gut main

[Purist]

Hi all,

I've been searching and reading for hours and would like a little help. I'm looking for the next poly to cross with gut. I'm using Titan 17g in the mains. I've tried SilverString 17 (first gut/poly hybrid ever, and liked SS) and just tried Luxilon BB Timo 1.22. I can't compare them too much as I used them 9 months apart due to an MCL injury, though I think I prefer the SilverString. I have been stringing at about 57m/53 crosses (it's over 105 degrees in Phoenix, AZ so we need to string a little tighter).

I am using the Dunlop AG 4D 200 (18x20). I played a little bit of college tennis and mix flatter shots with plenty shots with spin and am all court player. I've have had elbow issues since I was 14 and they only went away recently when I learned that it could be helped by softer rackets and strings (I'm playing again for the first time in about 10 years). You can't imagine how happy I am that for the first time IN MY LIFE I can swing at a forehand with 100% effort now.

First goal is tension maintenance, then relatively soft is second. I'm thinking 17g or thinner makes sense. I think I want a lower powered cross to get a little more control. I will never go back to a full bed of anything since the first time that I experienced no string movement and more spin due to this hybrid.

I see the following strings recommended a lot:

Signum Pro Poly Plasma (or Hyperion?)
MSV Co.-Focus
Weiss CANNON SilverString (or Scorpion?)
Topspin CyberBlue?
Pacific Poly X 18
Solinco Outlast 18

Input?

As an aside, I was out of string and tried this combo: Tourna Quasi Gut 16 mains at 57 and Gosen Polylon 17 at 53 (I know, it's junk) and am shocked at how much I liked it. Great spin, little string movement and great control. I experienced no arm pain but would be concerned about it. I thought about trying to come up with a hybrid with a multi main but I guess I don't mind paying for Titan gut and like the tension maintenance (which helps to offset worse than average from a poly) that you get from gut, and of course the feel from gut.

Thanks all.

 

[Steve Huff]

I'm not a poly user by any means, but I did try a few in the crosses with gut in the mains. My preference so far has been Pacific Poly X 18. I string it 4-5# lower than the gut mains. Next, I would have to say Solinco Outlast 18.

 

[Smasher08]

Co-Focus for me. I've also read good things about Silverstring.

Also, hybriding multi mains with a copoly cross like you've done is an interesting experiment. Glad to hear it worked out.

 

[Purist]

Steve, now that's two more strings I'll add them to my first post. Can you tell me why you like them?

Smasher, what tensions? Using a multi main didn't seem too strange to me as it's said that they may be closest to gut. I may try a softer poly in the cross and then keep an eye out for tension loss.

 

[Smasher08]

Smasher, what tensions? Using a multi main didn't seem too strange to me as it's said that they may be closest to gut. I may try a softer poly in the cross and then keep an eye out for tension loss.

It's interesting to me because I don't think I've read about anyone trying multi mains and poly crosses before. I've been thinking of doing that myself for a backup racket to my gut strings, but since I hadn't heard of anyone trying it before I was holding back a little. (I have tried multi crosses with poly mains and didn't think that much of it.)

Re tensions for gut-poly setups I've been doing 51x48 in my Head Microgel Prestige Mid (actually more like an 89" head rather than the 93" advertized). TimothyO has been going even a bit lower than that in his Babs.

I've found it to be great.

 

[ben123]

imo many recommendations on here are pure hype.

also its funny that so many people recommend stringing the gut like 5lbs tighter than the poly (or even more, i often see people on here saying i string 60/52 ..). just think about it.... either you guys string your gut and cut it out after a few days or that doesnt make any sense at all. because the poly will naturally lose more tension than the gut, the poly will have less tension than the gut anyway (especially if you use this hybrid for long time usage - 3weeks+) even if you string both at the same tensions. the pros string the poly only 2-3lbs less but they change their strings frequently. the gut holds its tension MUCH better than the poly. and if you want a longer lasting set up recommending stringing the gut so much tigther sounds stupid.

furthermore i feel the poly going dead in the crosses right away. for me its a setup for rich people who can afford cutting the gut out in a few days. this hybrid is imo for the top players who are sponsored. for any recreational player a full bed of gut at higher tensions will be good enough in every aspect (or a cheaper poly if you have good racquetheadspeed and technique and you string yourself/have a personal stringer).

 

[Purist]

imo many recommendations on here are pure hype.

also its funny that so many people recommend stringing the gut like 5lbs tighter than the poly (or even more, i often see people on here saying i string 60/52 ..). just think about it.... either you guys string your gut and cut it out after a few days or that doesnt make any sense at all. the gut holds its tension MUCH better than the poly. and if you want a longer lasting set up recommending stringing the gut so much tigther sounds stupid.

furthermore i feel the poly going dead in the crosses right away. for me its a setup for rich people who can afford cutting the gut out in a few days. this hybrid is imo for the top players who are sponsored. for any recreational player a full bed of gut at higher tensions will be good enough in every aspect (or a cheaper poly if you have good racquetheadspeed and technique and you string yourself/have a personal stringer).

Ok, I'll bite. Before I invest time in responding to your post, would you be willing to open your mind to the answer? No offense, but if you believe that "many recommendations are pure hype", why spend time in a forum in which people express their opinions about string? The short answer to your first question relates to the different stiffness at impact of the two different strings. People far smarter than I came up with this delta - one person being Roger Federer's stringer. Would you consider him an authority on the subject? Another authority would be John Elliot.

Smasher, there are some people that suggest a method to determine the different tensions for the mains and crosses is to measure the dimensions of the frame before and after stringing. There is a different number of crosses vs. mains so this idea seems interesting. I haven't done that yet with this string combo nor racket yet, but will next time.

 

[ben123]

Ok, I'll bite. Before I invest time in responding to your post, would you be willing to open your mind to the answer? No offense, but if you believe that "many recommendations are pure hype", why spend time in a forum in which people express their opinions about string? The short answer to your first question relates to the different stiffness at impact of the two different strings. People far smarter than I came up with this delta - one person being Roger Federer's stringer. Would you consider him an authority on the subject? Another authority would be John Elliot.

Smasher, there are some people that suggest a method to determine the different tensions for the mains and crosses is to measure the dimensions of the frame before and after stringing. There is a different number of crosses vs. mains so this idea seems interesting. I haven't done that yet with this string combo nor racket yet, but will next time.

you didnt understand me.
i know its because of different stiffnes, larger sweetspot and etc.

but the thing is if you use this setup for more than a week even if you string like 55/55 the poly will lose more tension than the gut and it will naturally have less tension.

and i spend time on this forum because there are actually some people with really helpful and good infos but like i said you have to filter it from those who just like to talk and hype around.

im open minded and i dont want to have an insulting childish discussion with anyone.

 

[Purist]

Cool.

I don't mind stringing my rackets every two to three weeks (and paying about $15 each time for the string combo) after about 10 to 12 hours of play. Having said that, this hybrid feels great for more than 12 hours. And because I know how to string a poly properly (thanks to the thread below), my poly string doesn't lose tension that quickly. Plus, the theoretical loss of control that you describe over those 10 or 12 hours is outweighed by the gains I get from this hybrid.

Check out this thread. I learned more about stringing in the time it took to read this than 30 years of playing on and off and 25 years of stringing (on and off too). I still refer back to it every few months. He'll address everything you mentioned plus a lot more. Specifically, look for the parts where he talks about the (lack of) elasticity of poly strings. Basically, if your desired tension on your poly is 50 pounds, NEVER apply more than about 50 pounds as you pull tension or you've destroyed it. This is where most stringers err when stringing poly.

http://www.stringforum.net/board/showthread.php?t=3250

 

[Niel]

It's interesting to me because I don't think I've read about anyone trying multi mains and poly crosses before. I've been thinking of doing that myself for a backup racket to my gut strings, but since I hadn't heard of anyone trying it before I was holding back a little. (I have tried multi crosses with poly mains and didn't think that much of it.)

Hi Smasher08, I've been using hexy fiber/eagnas poly titanium for a while @ 58lbs 16g. I'd say is very comfy for me with power and control. I don't worry too much about loosing tension, I cut them out after a week of play.

 

[pvaudio]

you didnt understand me.
i know its because of different stiffnes, larger sweetspot and etc.

but the thing is if you use this setup for more than a week even if you string like 55/55 the poly will lose more tension than the gut and it will naturally have less tension.

and i spend time on this forum because there are actually some people with really helpful and good infos but like i said you have to filter it from those who just like to talk and hype around.

im open minded and i dont want to have an insulting childish discussion with anyone.

I take it that you are simply using what you think vs. what you've experienced? I am not a sponsored player. I am not rich. I am notan ex-D1 guy either. I do, however, play gut/Co Focus. Before this, I played WeissCANNON B5E/gut. Why gut? It gives you two things. First, it gives you the playability that you could not have otherwise. While having it in the crosses means that this particular advantage is slim, the second one is not. It allows you to keep the playability for literally "times" longer than with a synthetic. I've played boatloads of stringbeds in all sorts of hybrids, but as soon as I started using gut, there wasn't any turning back.

As it is, I can spend $13.50 a stick on a gut mains/poly cross setup. How? I buy my natural gut in bulk so that I can get it for $20/set. I also own a reel of my poly cross which comes to about $7/set. The math is therefore obvious. While $13.50 is more expensive than say Gosen OGSM at $3.50 a pop, I've played my same sticks for weeks now. I just got back having played the same strings in literally 100 degree weather (this past friday) and just now 62 degree weather. The strings are just as predictable. No other string type is that consistent. The poly is indeed dead, but the gut damps it so well that you can play until it breaks.

 

[Smasher08]

No other string type is that consistent. The poly is indeed dead, but the gut damps it so well that you can play until it breaks.

Well said. The other thought I'd put out there is that it's possible to restring crosses should they ever get unbearable.

I logged in almost 40 hours on my 16g Pac Classic mains setup and if I had my own stringing machine I would've put new crosses in every 20 hours or so.

 

[ben123]

I take it that you are simply using what you think vs. what you've experienced? I am not a sponsored player. I am not rich. I am notan ex-D1 guy either. I do, however, play gut/Co Focus. Before this, I played WeissCANNON B5E/gut. Why gut? It gives you two things. First, it gives you the playability that you could not have otherwise. While having it in the crosses means that this particular advantage is slim, the second one is not. It allows you to keep the playability for literally "times" longer than with a synthetic. I've played boatloads of stringbeds in all sorts of hybrids, but as soon as I started using gut, there wasn't any turning back.

As it is, I can spend $13.50 a stick on a gut mains/poly cross setup. How? I buy my natural gut in bulk so that I can get it for $20/set. I also own a reel of my poly cross which comes to about $7/set. The math is therefore obvious. While $13.50 is more expensive than say Gosen OGSM at $3.50 a pop, I've played my same sticks for weeks now. I just got back having played the same strings in literally 100 degree weather (this past friday) and just now 62 degree weather. The strings are just as predictable. No other string type is that consistent. The poly is indeed dead, but the gut damps it so well that you can play until it breaks.

no i did play with gut poly hybrids. i tried a few different polys most were round and had good tension maintance for a poly. and i still felt when the poly was rly dead and i didnt like the stringbed anymore i more or less hated it.

and to your 13.50$ well even if your combo is cheap if you want to restring often you still have to pay your stringer. or do string yourself?

i was just not so pleased like you guys with that setup. and i used vs gut with for example sppp and other polys. i was all the time happy when i broke the set up because at that time i already hated the stringbed. its maybe good for 2 weeks or something but after that time ...... well that was my experience

I don't mind stringing my rackets every two to three weeks (and paying about $15 each time for the string combo) after about 10 to 12 hours of play. Having said that, this hybrid feels great for more than 12 hours. And because I know how to string a poly properly (thanks to the thread below), my poly string doesn't lose tension that quickly. Plus, the theoretical loss of control that you describe over those 10 or 12 hours is outweighed by the gains I get from this hybrid.

Check out this thread. I learned more about stringing in the time it took to read this than 30 years of playing on and off and 25 years of stringing (on and off too). I still refer back to it every few months. He'll address everything you mentioned plus a lot more. Specifically, look for the parts where he talks about the (lack of) elasticity of poly strings. Basically, if your desired tension on your poly is 50 pounds, NEVER apply more than about 50 pounds as you pull tension or you've destroyed it. This is where most stringers err when stringing poly.

http://www.stringforum.net/board/showthread.php?t=3250

well i cant afford restringing gut twice a month. i dont string myself. but that what you said makes sense if you restring every 2-3weeks. this thread is indeed interesting, i never heard anyone recommending 10year old kids playing with polys or poly hybrids (im asking me if kids have the power and technique to use polys .. even if its at very low tensions). is it no problem for the kids when the poly goes dead? or does he mean that you should restring your 10 year old kid racquet every few days?

 

[Purist]

no i did play with gut poly hybrids. i tried a few different polys most were round and had good tension maintance for a poly. and i still felt when the poly was rly dead and i didnt like the stringbed anymore i more or less hated it.

and to your 13.50$ well even if your combo is cheap if you want to restring often you still have to pay your stringer. or do string yourself?

i was just not so pleased like you guys with that setup. and i used vs gut with for example sppp and other polys. i was all the time happy when i broke the set up because at that time i already hated the stringbed. its maybe good for 2 weeks or something but after that time ...... well that was my experience

well i cant afford restringing gut twice a month. i dont string myself. but that what you said makes sense if you restring every 2-3weeks. this thread is indeed interesting, i never heard anyone recommending 10year old kids playing with polys or poly hybrids (im asking me if kids have the power and technique to use polys .. even if its at very low tensions). is it no problem for the kids when the poly goes dead? or does he mean that you should restring your 10 year old kid racquet every few days?

The only reason that I can come up with for why you didn't like the feel is that your stringer doesn't understand how to string poly strings and/or hybrids. Well, unless you DON'T like feel and spin. I played again last night and this hybrid has basically changed my life. As in, I can play tennis again (solved my elbow problems) and have never felt a racket perform like this. Nonetheless...

Indeed, if you don't string your own rackets this hybrid would cost a fortune and because of the poly probably mandates restringing at LEAST once per month (but this I don't know about since I can't use a full bed of poly and my strings don't last a month anyway).

Anyone with any racket head speed can benefit from poly strings, and I can't picture a ranked junior that doesn't have more than enough racket head speed. Lastly, the answer to your last question can be found here:

http://www.stringforum.net/board/showpost.php?p=13390&postcount=21

Does anyone have any feedback about my list of strings? LOL

 

[pvaudio]

Ben, yes, I am a stringer.

 

[mikeler]

Ben, yes, I am a stringer.

Ben,

See PVAudio's playtest thread below. I think you'll find it pretty useful:

http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=357999

 

[ben123]

The only reason that I can come up with for why you didn't like the feel is that your stringer doesn't understand how to string poly strings and/or hybrids. Well, unless you DON'T like feel and spin. I played again last night and this hybrid has basically changed my life. As in, I can play tennis again (solved my elbow problems) and have never felt a racket perform like this. Nonetheless...

Indeed, if you don't string your own rackets this hybrid would cost a fortune and because of the poly probably mandates restringing at LEAST once per month (but this I don't know about since I can't use a full bed of poly and my strings don't last a month anyway).

Anyone with any racket head speed can benefit from poly strings, and I can't picture a ranked junior that doesn't have more than enough racket head speed. Lastly, the answer to your last question can be found here:

http://www.stringforum.net/board/showpost.php?p=13390&postcount=21

Does anyone have any feedback about my list of strings? LOL

nono i dont say its a bad setup i just think its not so long lasting (for me). at first its alright but later i feel the poly going dead and then i hate it. cant afford to string gut every 2 weeks. thats why i said its a setup for really good players who are sponsored or people who can afford that

 

[mixedmedia]

Ben, just wondering, what tension did you string the gut and poly at in your hybrids? Also, I do agree with you in the sense that I feel some people do use gut/poly to feel as if they are like the pros; however, many have genuinely determined it to be the best setup for them.

Purist, the cross I've settle on for now is Scorpion. It seems to be good for control and tension maintenance but it doesn't feel like one's being robbed of power.

 

[pvaudio]

Mixed, how is Scorpion? I literally dreamed of that setup (I was playing a tournament in my dream lol and I had gut/scorpion....yeah I know I'm strange ), so I'm wondering if it's any good?

 

[ben123]

Ben, just wondering, what tension did you string the gut and poly at in your hybrids? Also, I do agree with you in the sense that I feel some people do use gut/poly to feel as if they are like the pros; however, many have genuinely determined it to be the best setup for them.

Purist, the cross I've settle on for now is Scorpion. It seems to be good for control and tension maintenance but it doesn't feel like one's being robbed of power.

the last time i used this hybrid it was 55 gut 53 poly

 

[The Big Kahuna]

I see the following strings recommended a lot:

Signum Pro Poly Plasma (or Hyperion?)
MSV Co.-Focus
Weiss CANNON SilverString (or Scorpion?)

My playtests on many of these polys as crosses can be found in a number of threads here in the String Forum. Long story short, I am with SMASHER08 on this after trying a number of different polys (all of the ones you noted were among my favorites). For my tastes, the MSV Co-Focus in the 1.18 gauge plays the best. Co.-Focus is an ultra durable co-polyester monofilament string. It offers soft feeling, great power, precise control and improved tension.

Stringforum.net had 57 play tests on this string and 93% were positive (the 8th highest rating of any string - poly or not). Don't string too tight because otherwise you will lose feel. The Co-Focus provides a lot or very low power, depending on the stringing tension. At the tension I strung it, power was sufficient without sacrificing control, which was great.

I was surprised by the great feedback I got from the string, really excellent touch. Spin was really good, and I think the string supports players who are seeking to improve their spin. This string playes a bit more compact than the Poly Plasma. More solid overall.

Solid co-poly without weaknesses. Great value!

Impressions: comfortable, resilient, elastic, crispy, precise.

 

[Pitmiksovic]

I'm using the pro line II but with all the + talk about the MSV i think I'm going to try this next. I worry about the longevity of the 1.18 though. Does it seem to die quicker than the 1.23 or last about the same?

I'm also wondering if anybody has used the pro supex big ace as a cross w/gut mains and how it played and how long the playabilty lasted. I've used it before as a main and in a full bed, thought it was just ok like that but I did think it might make a good cross, but no one seems to mention it. Anyone try it with gut mains?

 

[2Hare]

imo many recommendations on here are pure hype.

also its funny that so many people recommend stringing the gut like 5lbs tighter than the poly (or even more, i often see people on here saying i string 60/52 ..). just think about it.... either you guys string your gut and cut it out after a few days or that doesnt make any sense at all. because the poly will naturally lose more tension than the gut, the poly will have less tension than the gut anyway (especially if you use this hybrid for long time usage - 3weeks+) even if you string both at the same tensions. the pros string the poly only 2-3lbs less but they change their strings frequently. the gut holds its tension MUCH better than the poly. and if you want a longer lasting set up recommending stringing the gut so much tigther sounds stupid.

furthermore i feel the poly going dead in the crosses right away. for me its a setup for rich people who can afford cutting the gut out in a few days. this hybrid is imo for the top players who are sponsored. for any recreational player a full bed of gut at higher tensions will be good enough in every aspect (or a cheaper poly if you have good racquetheadspeed and technique and you string yourself/have a personal stringer).

5 pounds is probably too much. But I would say you should string gut at 2-4 pounds higher. Why? Cus stringing poly too high would increase too much friction for the gut main to slide on. It'll decrease the spin and eat into the gut faster. Gut itself has pretty high sliding frictions especially when used. I think this is the main reason why you should string gut higher, not only because of the stringbed's stiffness.

As for how high you should string it, depends on your racket, speed of your game, and your strings, so there's not really a right answer for everybody. Lower tension tends to create massive spin and high rebound angle even for slower balls and also would last much longer.

 

[mixedmedia]

Ben, okay, just making sure you tried it with a poundage difference.

 

[mixedmedia]

Mixed, how is Scorpion? I literally dreamed of that setup (I was playing a tournament in my dream lol and I had gut/scorpion....yeah I know I'm strange ), so I'm wondering if it's any good?

Haha, I'm really liking it so far for the above reasons, but what I'm really looking forward to is trying it with the WT gut (so far I've only used it with LT). I can give you my experiences in some more detail once I try that setup, if you'd like. Why? Are you thinking of trying it out again? (Or did you never try it with gut mains?) And by the way, how did you know it was Scorpion in the dream?

 

[Purist]

Haha, I'm really liking it so far for the above reasons, but what I'm really looking forward to is trying it with the WT gut (so far I've only used it with LT). I can give you my experiences in some more detail once I try that setup, if you'd like. Why? Are you thinking of trying it out again? (Or did you never try it with gut mains?) And by the way, how did you know it was Scorpion in the dream?

Thanks all. What is WT and LT gut?

 

[mixedmedia]

Sorry, it's Performaxx WhisperTouch and Performaxx Low Tension.

 

[marco forehand]

addressing the op, the best I have found has been Pacific X Force. However, I can see that the cost may be higher then makes sense to some people.
My problem with using a gut/poly hybrid has been that the poly will need to be cut out before the gut. That has NOT been the case with this combination. The DT is down less then 15% after 4 weeks (4 or 5 hits per week). You can tell when its time to cut em out, the ball starts to fly. More often the gut breaks.
The combination of 15L Tonic and 18g X Force is very nice.

 

[Purist]

Thanks all. I am going to try both MSV Co.-Focus (when it gets back in stock) and Weiss Cannon Scorpion (many great reviews).

 

[pvaudio]

Haha, I'm really liking it so far for the above reasons, but what I'm really looking forward to is trying it with the WT gut (so far I've only used it with LT). I can give you my experiences in some more detail once I try that setup, if you'd like. Why? Are you thinking of trying it out again? (Or did you never try it with gut mains?) And by the way, how did you know it was Scorpion in the dream?

Heh I knew it because I gave my reel and gut sets to the stringer at the tournament. Who said you can't dream of being a pro?

 

[mixedmedia]

Hahaha, I've dreamed about it many times, but I wish I could dream about it just once!

 

[jk175d]

imo many recommendations on here are pure hype.

also its funny that so many people recommend stringing the gut like 5lbs tighter than the poly (or even more, i often see people on here saying i string 60/52 ..). just think about it.... either you guys string your gut and cut it out after a few days or that doesnt make any sense at all. because the poly will naturally lose more tension than the gut, the poly will have less tension than the gut anyway (especially if you use this hybrid for long time usage - 3weeks+) even if you string both at the same tensions. the pros string the poly only 2-3lbs less but they change their strings frequently. the gut holds its tension MUCH better than the poly. and if you want a longer lasting set up recommending stringing the gut so much tigther sounds stupid.

furthermore i feel the poly going dead in the crosses right away. for me its a setup for rich people who can afford cutting the gut out in a few days. this hybrid is imo for the top players who are sponsored. for any recreational player a full bed of gut at higher tensions will be good enough in every aspect (or a cheaper poly if you have good racquetheadspeed and technique and you string yourself/have a personal stringer).

I do infact string the gut about 5-7 lbs higher than the poly cross. I've been doing 55/48 and most recently 57/51. Furthermore, because the poly does go dead long before the gut is remotely worn, I often will cut out and restring just the crosses. I've got one frame that's on the 3rd cross. Played with it tonight in fact and it felt great.

It's not hype, gut/poly is by far the best feeling and performing stringjob I've played. It's not as expensive as it looks at first glance either. $4-7 for the crosses about every two weeks. $13-21 for the mains maybe once a month... if that.

 

[parasailing]

All below are strung at 17 gauge and SPPP offered the best combination of power, control, and spin. The other either offer more power, better control, or spin but only SPPP offers all three qualities for me.

1. VS Team with Signum Pro Poly Plasma
2, VS Team with WC Scorpion
3. VS Team with WC Silverstring
4. VS Team with WC B5E
5. VS Team with MSV Cofocus Hex

 

[corners]

Take a look at Babolat Hurricane Feel. On the stiffer side for copoly, but not as stiff as Alu Power.

But it's at the top of the charts for tension loss in TWU's lab tests. It also is the most slippery string TWU has tested.

Should give you match to match consistency and fantastic spin crossed with gut mains.

 

[2Hare]

I do infact string the gut about 5-7 lbs higher than the poly cross. I've been doing 55/48 and most recently 57/51. Furthermore, because the poly does go dead long before the gut is remotely worn, I often will cut out and restring just the crosses. I've got one frame that's on the 3rd cross. Played with it tonight in fact and it felt great.

It's not hype, gut/poly is by far the best feeling and performing stringjob I've played. It's not as expensive as it looks at first glance either. $4-7 for the crosses about every two weeks. $13-21 for the mains maybe once a month... if that.

Wow, you might want to try other poly. What poly did u use?

 

[jk175d]

All below are strung at 17 gauge and SPPP offered the best combination of power, control, and spin. The other either offer more power, better control, or spin but only SPPP offers all three qualities for me.

1. VS Team with Signum Pro Poly Plasma
2, VS Team with WC Scorpion
3. VS Team with WC Silverstring
4. VS Team with WC B5E
5. VS Team with MSV Cofocus Hex

what racquet are you playing with this? I've got a friend who swears by SPPP but we both agree it's not compatable with softer/flexible frames. I tried SPPP 17g as a cross with gut in an EXO3 Tour 100 and it didn't feel good at all. A muted string with a muted feeling frame = far from crisp feeling shots. I could see SPPP working great as a cross in a stiff raqcuet though.

 

[jk175d]

Wow, you might want to try other poly. What poly did u use?

why? I play hard for about 15 hrs/week. I'm ok with getting 20-30 hrs out of poly strings. Seems like most people here talk about getting 10-15.

My favorite poly is Tourbite but its edges diminish the life of the gut so I've been using silverstring instead. But I've got a pack of co-focus to try out next time I change the crosses.

 

[GlenK]

All below are strung at 17 gauge and SPPP offered the best combination of power, control, and spin. The other either offer more power, better control, or spin but only SPPP offers all three qualities for me.

1. VS Team with Signum Pro Poly Plasma
2, VS Team with WC Scorpion
3. VS Team with WC Silverstring
4. VS Team with WC B5E
5. VS Team with MSV Cofocus Hex

I saw you post this the other day. I had Scoprion picked out as my replacement for supersense as a cross as soon as SS runs out. Based on your suggestion I am going to order SPPP. I have not tried it yet but your feedback looks good and it looks like you think it just edges out Scoprion. Thanks for the suggestion. What is the diameter of SPPP? SS is 1.25 and Scoprion is 1.22.

I also saw Jay Cee recommend Lux Timo as a cross for VS. It is also 1.22 and I have a set of it already. Going to give it a shot too.

I love the small smooth co-polys as X's for the VS. That gut just slides so smoothly and generates a lot of easy spin.

 

[2Hare]

why? I play hard for about 15 hrs/week. I'm ok with getting 20-30 hrs out of poly strings. Seems like most people here talk about getting 10-15.

My favorite poly is Tourbite but its edges diminish the life of the gut so I've been using silverstring instead. But I've got a pack of co-focus to try out next time I change the crosses.

haven't tried tourbite in gut/poly yet, but I absolutely hated silverstring in gut/poly. It's so mushy, lower powered, just kill the setup if you ask me. Maybe that's why you have to go so low on the tension of poly. I use Alu power as cross, and my gut main usually break before the setup goes dead so no durability problem.

 

[parasailing]

what racquet are you playing with this? I've got a friend who swears by SPPP but we both agree it's not compatable with softer/flexible frames. I tried SPPP 17g as a cross with gut in an EXO3 Tour 100 and it didn't feel good at all. A muted string with a muted feeling frame = far from crisp feeling shots. I could see SPPP working great as a cross in a stiff raqcuet though.

I agree that if you got a super flexy or muted racquet, it's best to go with a stiffer or crisper string. I also have a exo3 tour but haven't tried it SPPP. If I do, I would up the tension as SPPP is a rather soft copoly.
It currently has Silverstring and it works out well due to the super flexy racquet of the exo3 tour.

I use a Pure Storm Tour GT so it works out well.

 

[parasailing]

I saw you post this the other day. I had Scoprion picked out as my replacement for supersense as a cross as soon as SS runs out. Based on your suggestion I am going to order SPPP. I have not tried it yet but your feedback looks good and it looks like you think it just edges out Scoprion. Thanks for the suggestion. What is the diameter of SPPP? SS is 1.25 and Scoprion is 1.22.

I also saw Jay Cee recommend Lux Timo as a cross for VS. It is also 1.22 and I have a set of it already. Going to give it a shot too.

I love the small smooth co-polys as X's for the VS. That gut just slides so smoothly and generates a lot of easy spin.

The only thing I need to find out is how long SPPP last and how well it plays in colder temperatures in the evening. SPPP feels a bit more solid than Scorpion which has a slight pingy feel to it. I use SPPP 17 gauge which is 1.23mm which is comparable to Scorpion so diameter shouldn't really be an issue. To me it just plays a better.

 

[jk175d]

haven't tried tourbite in gut/poly yet, but I absolutely hated silverstring in gut/poly. It's so mushy, lower powered, just kill the setup if you ask me. Maybe that's why you have to go so low on the tension of poly. I use Alu power as cross, and my gut main usually break before the setup goes dead so no durability problem.

different strokes I guess. I like lux strings but find they go dead very quick. I've found copolys to last longer. Silverstring is very popular as a cross with gut if you judge from threads in the strings forum here. I don't find it mushy at all, SPPP on the other hand....

I go low on the poly tension because that is where polys perform best. ANY Poly over 55 feels terrible to me and imo is not allowing the poly to do its thing properly. The only reason to use poly besides durability if one is a string breaker is to get the benifit of being able to freely take big cuts at the ball and maintain good control. I've found control is actually much better in the upper 40s because of increased spin than in the 50s where the poly feels more springboardy....

Which is why I love the gut/poly hybrid. You get the power and feel of gut at a little higher tension then the low tension poly cross serves to keep that control when you swing fast.

 

[2Hare]

different strokes I guess. I like lux strings but find they go dead very quick. I've found copolys to last longer. Silverstring is very popular as a cross with gut if you judge from threads in the strings forum here. I don't find it mushy at all, SPPP on the other hand....

I go low on the poly tension because that is where polys perform best. ANY Poly over 55 feels terrible to me and imo is not allowing the poly to do its thing properly. The only reason to use poly besides durability if one is a string breaker is to get the benifit of being able to freely take big cuts at the ball and maintain good control. I've found control is actually much better in the upper 40s because of increased spin than in the 50s where the poly feels more springboardy....

Which is why I love the gut/poly hybrid. You get the power and feel of gut at a little higher tension then the low tension poly cross serves to keep that control when you swing fast.

Lux lasts pretty long as crosses for me, not in a full bed though. Like I said could be because the gut main breaks on me in around 10-20 hours of hitting. have you tried it in a gut/poly hybrid?

I've seen a lot of rave about MSV Co-focus as gut/poly crosses, not much about silverstring as crosses though.

 

[GlenK]

The only thing I need to find out is how long SPPP last and how well it plays in colder temperatures in the evening. SPPP feels a bit more solid than Scorpion which has a slight pingy feel to it. I use SPPP 17 gauge which is 1.23mm which is comparable to Scorpion so diameter shouldn't really be an issue. To me it just plays a better.

Thanks.. I'm going to give it a shot as well as the Timo recommendation of Jay Cee. I just wish they hadn't discontinued Supersense. It is awesome as a cross..

 

[jk175d]

Lux lasts pretty long as crosses for me, not in a full bed though. Like I said could be because the gut main breaks on me in around 10-20 hours of hitting. have you tried it in a gut/poly hybrid?

I've seen a lot of rave about MSV Co-focus as gut/poly crosses, not much about silverstring as crosses though.

I first heard about silverstring as a cross with gut after reading a number of raves here. Lately the threads all seem to be about MSV co-focus so that's why I'll be trying that too

I've used Lux Ace as a cross. My experience was the same as when I've used it as a main or full bed in the past, that is that I absolutely loved it at first then 2nd or 3rd time out it was already on the decline. By the end of the week it felt like hitting with a water-logged piece of plywood. I haven't tried other lux strings with gut, but in the past I've used BB and Alu-Rough as full bed and had similar progression as with the Ace.

If I was changing strings for every match or so I would definately consider Lux again. But as it is, co-polys seem to work a lot better for me.

 

[Up&comer]

Just something I've always wondered: does the spin of a gut main poly cross increase over time because the tension of the poly cross drops more than the gut mains?

What I mean is that if you string at 55/52, after a week it would be like 52/45? If you understand what I'm saying.

Any opinions?

 

[The Big Kahuna]

I love the small smooth co-polys as X's for the VS. That gut just slides so smoothly and generates a lot of easy spin.

I agree.

That is why I would leave all ribbon, textured, or hex shaped polys OFF the list for crosses with natural gut mains.

 

[The Big Kahuna]

I have posted this before, but will do so again here as it applies so directly. From an article by Joshua Speckman in Tennis Player Magazine this month:

"Federer is one of the few pros today that played with full natural gut for a significant part of his career. He was pretty good with it too, beating Sampras at Wimbledon in 2001 with a full bed of gut. So why did he add copoly strings to the mix?"

"Spin control," answers Ferguson. "Spin is part of control, and he gains both. Definitely more spin, and with that comes control. And with that control he can string way down low. He strings at 21.5 or 22 kilos (47 or 48.5 pounds)," he adds."


"Federer's setup actually bears some resemblance to spaghetti strings, as that invention also used natural gut in the mains and a synthetic in the crosses. Many players find the combination of extremely elastic gut mains with stiff, hard and slick copoly crosses to be as, or more, spin-friendly than a full bed of copoly, while also being more comfortable, powerful and giving better feel for the ball."

"In string-on-string friction tests, tennis equipment researcher Crawford Lindsey found that gut mains slide with less friction along copoly crosses than any other string or string combination. And he found that - unlike other strings, where notching ramps up friction and disables the snapback mechanism – inter-string friction actually gets lower as the notches get deeper."

"Why? Natural oils seep out of the gut at the notches and lubricate the string intersections. This suggests that a gut/poly hybrid might retain its spin-generating potential for longer than any other string or combination. Well, at least until the gut breaks."

"Surprisingly, the opposite configuration – poly mains/gut crosses – slides much less easily. Lindsey says the two materials are sticky in reverse perhaps because the surface of the gut crosses quickly abrades, pulling up microscopic fibers that get hung up on the copoly mains as they try to slide."