Little 4 - Who has the mental edge?

[Aabye5]

Who has the mental edge among the little 4 (Medvedev, Rublev, Tsitsipas, Zverev)?

My first thought would be Zverev, but after that third set in the Cincy semis, you could argue either way.

You could make an argument that it's Medvedev because he has an extra Grand Slam final over the Tsitsipas and Zverev.

You could also say that Tsitsipas is in their head space with his antics.

Rublev probably shouldn't be included in this list, but does it help him that he's still undefeated in a Slam final ?

 

[Mainad]

Rublev probably shouldn't be included in this list, but does it help him that he's still undefeated in a Slam final ?

It would probably help him even more if he had actually appeared in a Slam final.

 

[augustobt]

No one.

Without the big 3 (or just Djokovic, now that Rafa and Rogi are out of energies) and thiem those four can beat each-other with no clear favorite.

 

[The Guru]

The little 4 is Tsonga, Ferrer, Berdych, and Cilic. Not the Next Gen. That being said Med seems the most clutch imo. Also why is Rublev over Berrettini at this point?

 

[Deleted member 771911]

Meddy

 

[Third Serve]

The little 4 is Tsonga, Ferrer, Berdych, and Cilic. Not the Next Gen. That being said Med seems the most clutch imo. Also why is Rublev over Berrettini at this point?

The little 4 should have actually been Tsonga, Ferrer, Berdych, and Soderling but mono messed things up.

 

[Jokervich]

Medvedev can't handle losing. He's a good frontrunner though (only lost to Rublev because he hit the camera and injured himself).

Zverev is just erratic all round. Often chokes winning positions. Throws in double faults regularly. Has made some comebacks in matches though.

Tsitsipas chokes winning positions repeatedly. Choked like 7 match points in last years US Open to Coric, choked the French Open final, choked to Zverev yesterday. Djokovic destroyed him mentally after that RG final, which shows he can't get over big losses. Uses Twitter and social media too much, which shows he still has a child's mindset and hasn't matured mentally into an adult.

Rublev was smashing his racquet/bag and getting annoyed against Medvedev yesterday. Can't seem to handle even small things going against him.


So on balance, I have no idea

 

[beltsman]

Zverev because when he's on, he wins. Match is on his racquet.

 

[One]

The little 4 should have actually been Tsonga, Ferrer, Berdych, and Soderling but mono messed things up.

No, it should be Delpo instead of Sod.

 

[Arak]

It would probably help him even more if he had actually appeared in a Slam final.

That makes it the two of us. I’m also undefeated in a slam final.

 

[dumb-person]

I like Andrey but no way he is above Berrettini.

 

[WhiskeyEE]

No, it should be Delpo instead of Sod.

Should have been both. And if Stan got his crap together a bit earlier, it could have been Tsonga, Del Potro, Soderling, and Wawrinka.

 

[Mainad]

Should have been both. And if Stan got his crap together a bit earlier, it could have been Tsonga, Del Potro, Soderling, and Wawrinka.

Wawrinka should actually be in a Big 5 along with the other 4 winners of multiple Slam titles. This puts him ahead of Del Potro and way ahead of Tsonga and Söderling.

 

[junior74]

I think Zverev will be the most successful of Mug4. He probably has the best game overall.

 

[BeatlesFan]

Well, we can obviously toss Zverev and Tsitsipas right off the bat. Both choked slams finals while up 2-0 in sets. That's world class choking. But then we have Med choking away the AO final against an opponent who claimed a 60 meter "abdominal tear" which apparently would have killed other mortals. He still couldn't get over the finish line.

So Rublev wins by default. Never has choked a slam final (because he's not good enough to get to one).

 

[liriel]

I wonder if coaches/sport psychologists are any good because it doesn't seem so. It's a bit off topic but Swiatek's psychologist made a name for herself when Iga won RG but after that win Iga started losing, cried the most out of anyone, couldn't handle the pressure. Daria suddenly is quiet now.

 

[WhiskeyEE]

Wawrinka should actually be in a Big 5 along with the other 4 winners of multiple Slam titles. This puts him ahead of Del Potro and way ahead of Tsonga and Söderling.

If we are just going by slams, then Murray is nowhere near the Big 3. Which means there is no Big 4 anyway.

And, given the hypotheticals I mentioned, Wawrinka is not conclusively ahead of Del Potro or Soderling. My post was based on what could have or would have been. Not what did happen. Del Potro in particular IMO was more talented than Stan.

 

[MeatTornado]

Clearly none of them. It's been very rock-paper-scissors between Med, Zed and Titts. Rublev doesn't even register at their level yet for this discussion.

 

[Zetty]

The little 4 should have actually been Tsonga, Ferrer, Berdych, and Soderling but mono messed things up.

The throne was supposed to be Soderking's

 

[Mainad]

If we are just going by slams, then Murray is nowhere near the Big 3. Which means there is no Big 4 anyway.

Big 3 is the set of all current players who have won double digit Slams; Big 4 is the set of all current players who have won multiple Slams and been ranked #1 which includes Murray; Big 5 is the set of all current players who have won multiple Slams which includes Wawrinka. None of these sets are mutually exclusive.

And, given the hypotheticals I mentioned, Wawrinka is not conclusively ahead of Del Potro or Soderling. My post was based on what could have or would have been. Not what did happen. Del Potro in particular IMO was more talented than Stan.

How on earth do you try and rate what COULD have been over what DID happen?

 

[El_Yotamo]

It's very dynamic, surface-dependent, and even tournament class-dependent. Atm here's what I see:

Zverev has the edge against Rublev everywhere so far

Medvedev has the edge against the other 3 off clay, while on clay they all have the edge against him

Tsitsipas has the edge against Zverev on clay while Zverev has it off clay

Tsitsipas has the edge against Rublev everywhere except at 500 events (and maybe also on grass)

 

[duaneeo]

The one who's beaten a Big-3 in a final.

 

[WhiskeyEE]

Big 3 is the set of all current players who have won double digit Slams; Big 4 is the set of all current players who have won multiple Slams and been ranked #1 which includes Murray; Big 5 is the set of all current players who have won multiple Slams which includes Wawrinka. None of these sets are mutually exclusive.



How on earth do you try and rate what COULD have been over what DID happen?

Those are arbitrary distinctions. Fedalovic have all won 20 slams. Murray and Wawrinka have won 3. If we are going just by slam count, then they are far closer to Del Potro than Fedalovic.

I responded to a poster who stated what he thinks 'should have been' without injuries/medical issues. The relevant variable we were considering was talent.

 

[Mainad]

Those are arbitrary distinctions.

Still accurate.

Fedalovic have all won 20 slams. Murray and Wawrinka have won 3. If we are going just by slam count, then they are far closer to Del Potro than Fedalovic.

True but I take into account a player's whole career achievements, not just the Slams.

I responded to a poster who stated what he thinks 'should have been' without injuries/medical issues. The relevant variable we were considering was talent.

Not a fan of coulda, woulda, shoulda. I prefer to deal in facts.

 

[mr tonyz]

Well, we can obviously toss Zverev and Tsitsipas right off the bat. Both choked slams finals while up 2-0 in sets. That's world class choking. But then we have Med choking away the AO final against an opponent who claimed a 60 meter "abdominal tear" which apparently would have killed other mortals. He still couldn't get over the finish line.

So Rublev wins by default. Never has choked a slam final (because he's not good enough to get to one).

No mere mortal could have an abdominal tear quite that long!

 

[NoleIsBoat]

If Zverev is ‘on’ he is unstoppable on any HC.

 

[socallefty]

The ‘Little 4’ plans, Djokovic Laughs!

- old Srdjan proverb

 

[6august]

Thiem Medvedev Zverev Tisisipas seems to be a more serious new Big 4.

Thiem is the toughest because he has 1 Slem.

 

[SonnyT]

For the moment, it's like women's tennis: anyone can win, and anyone can lose.