mini tennis warm up good or bad?

[joe sch]

So I usually warm up playing mini tennis. But recently i havnt played mini tennis and it seems easier to keep my stroke full and long with lots of racket head speed from the baseline. imo when I play mini tennis I get tentative with my strokes because I'm trying to keep the ball in the service box. I also don't use a lot of racket head speed warming up because were so close. Has anyone else experienced this? Please let me know how you feel about mini tennis.

MT is Good !
Great transition to baseline hitting.
Idea is to warmup focus, muscles, timing & touch.
Try to topspin both FHs and BHs.
Dont forget to do volleys back and forth.
Many who dont like it, dont have the skills to comfortably hit toppers and volleys from the service line in MT.
Can even play MT games to challenge your footwork and touch.

 

[PittsburghDad]

An example?

An example of what bro? How to use YouTube. Go look it up. Henin is easy to find. There's multiple. Federer video is out there as well.

 

[PittsburghDad]

"I can't play mini tenns" is a litmus test of whether or not you have solid strokes. It's just the way it is. You don't have to like it. Alot don't. But anyone with strokes can do it.

 

[Curious]

An example of what bro? How to use YouTube. Go look it up. Henin is easy to find. There's multiple. Federer video is out there as well.

You must have a different youtube from mine. Can't find any videos of Federer doing mini tennis.

 

[PittsburghDad]

You must have a different youtube from mine. Can't find any videos of Federer doing mini tennis.

Sorry you can't find the Fed one. It's there. I'm assuming you saw Justine do it. Or have been to a pro tourney and seen them all do it.

 

[Curious]

Sorry you can't find the Fed one. It's there. I'm assuming you saw Justine do it. Or have been to a pro tourney and seen them all do it.

Oh Ok it wasn't my youtube then! Federer doesn't do it. That's why I underlined his name when I quoted your post.

 

[PittsburghDad]

No. He does it. There's video of him doing it. And I've seen him do it at practice. As well as Nadal. Stan. Radwanska. Monfils. Sock. Just the ones I've personally seen. Including Roger.

Sorry you can't find it. Though your inability to find stuff in no way affects it's validity. You would agree with that I'm sure.

 

[PittsburghDad]

Oh Ok it wasn't my youtube then! Federer doesn't do it. That's why I underlined his name when I quoted your post.

Didn't realize you underlined. My goodness that changes everything. My deepest apologies. Your right mini tennis is awful and pros can't do it. The power of the underline...

 

[Morch Us]

Probably you found the key there. Yes, transitioning mindset is important. Whether you are gradually extending the court, or going directly to baseline after mini-tennis. You still are not going to baseline and start with full 100% strokes. More than the space involved, at baseline, just do less than your 20% swing shots at first, and gradually increase it. Consistency is top priority at the first shots even from baseline.

Transition is probably the key that I have overlooked in all that time.

 

[Curious]

Calm down man.

 

[PittsburghDad]

Calm down man.

I'm calm. You?

 

[Curious]

I'm calm. You?

Yup, we're all good then.

 

[heninfan99]

"If you stand flat footed and just slice it's a waste."

But that is my groundstroke ... I need to warm it up.

Now now I know you can do more than that

 

[PittsburghDad]

Yup, we're all good then.

Whew. So glad we are "all good". That's a relief.

 

[PittsburghDad]

You must have a different youtube from mine. Can't find any videos of Federer doing mini tennis.

Just curious how old you are. Your emoji game is strong. And oddly....I don't know....teenagerish maybe. Whatever. Xoxoxoxoxoxo. Lates....

 

[Morch Us]

I think there are three broad categories of players who don't like mini tennis.

1. Folks who just don't have any control on placing the ball. They cannot keep the ball in the limited space mini tennis allows. The love the extra extra space the full court provides, where most uncontrolled shots would be a good looking shot (or even winners on warmups).

2. Folks who "think" they got the capability to time the ball perfectly from baseline over and over, and think they have have pinpoint accuracy on depth & height from baseline from first shot.

3. Folks who actually got the capability to time the ball perfectly from baseline over and over, and have pinpoint accuracy on depth & height from baseline from first shot.

If you are category 3, you are wasting your time listening or reading to my crap. I am not eligible to advice you.
If you are category 1 or 2, you wont get any benefit from mini-tennis, till you get into the right mindset. So skip it till you reach there.


By the way, on an actual match situation. Mini tennis is a great way to force some of those opponents who wont give you any rhythm at baseline, even on warmup, either because of pace/heaviness/placement of their shots. By forcing them to play mini tennis, you reduce their options for pace/placement/spin. In fact against those opponents, just do mini tennis and volley and skip the baseline warmup completely (since you are not getting any benefit).

 

[ChaelAZ]

I do a lot of it, and I like it. No detrimental effects for me.

 

[heninfan99]

Do you have any players better at mini tennis than baseline tennis?

I prefer a warm up where players hit soft volleys close to the net as the initial warm up, moving to mini tennis then to more full-court hitting. The reason for this is that the soft volleys allow players to hit far more shots with far less swinging action, (blocking at best!), allowing the arm, hand, wrist, and fingers, to warm up under the least amount of stress as well as hit more balls in a row. Also, players don't work on or hit enough volleys in my opinion, so this little warm up increases the volley experience over time.

As mentioned, many who try to do mini tennis start dinking the ball to keep it in play. This is because they don't have the stroke patterns mastered to hit soft topspins and resort to the more rudementary pattern of 'gravity reliant' tennis...one of the best ways to become a dinker for life.

Yet, mini tennis CAN be a fabulous drill/game/exercise for players to develop softer hands while hitting topspin shots. And, of course, done right, using a very short back swing, hitting the ball correctly with the topspin needed to execute the mini game effectively, is indeed a great way to practice warming up or other times too.

Anything that gives the student/player means to become more familiar with what the racquet is doing will improve their ability to hit balls with command.

 

[mad dog1]

Just curious how old you are. Your emoji game is strong. And oddly....I don't know....teenagerish maybe. Whatever. Xoxoxoxoxoxo. Lates....

From his videos, he appears to be around 35-45 years old.

 

[PittsburghDad]

From his videos, he appears to be around 35-45 years old.

That's big time emoji work from a middle ager.

 

[NuBas]

That's big time emoji work from a middle ager.

Dude the guy asked you to provide a link to a video that you said you saw and not only did you not provide the video but go and start arguing with him @Curious . Are you that lazy to search for the video?

C'mon man your forum game needs to step up

 

[PittsburghDad]

Dude the guy asked you to provide a link to a video that you said you saw and not only did you not provide the video but go and start arguing with him @Curious . Are you that lazy to search for the video?

C'mon man your forum game needs to step up

I'm not doing his leg work. And I'm not arguing. I'm respecting his emoji game.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

I'm not doing his leg work. And I'm not arguing. I'm respecting his emoji game.

I'm a fan of MT. But I've never seen a video of Federer doing it. That's not reducing the perceived value to me of MT, just that I agree with @Curious about lack of evidence.

For example, here is a longish video of a Federer practice with plenty of pre-hitting drills and nowhere do I see MT. It could have been edited out but I doubt it; if they included footage of him tossing a tennis ball back and forth with his coach, why not include MT.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

I'm a fan of MT. But I've never seen a video of Federer doing it. That's not reducing the perceived value to me of MT, just that I agree with @Curious about lack of evidence.

For example, here is a longish video of a Federer practice with plenty of pre-hitting drills and nowhere do I see MT. It could have been edited out but I doubt it; if they included footage of him tossing a tennis ball back and forth with his coach, why not include MT.

Video:

 

[ByeByePoly]

I'm a fan of MT. But I've never seen a video of Federer doing it. That's not reducing the perceived value to me of MT, just that I agree with @Curious about lack of evidence.

For example, here is a longish video of a Federer practice with plenty of pre-hitting drills and nowhere do I see MT. It could have been edited out but I doubt it; if they included footage of him tossing a tennis ball back and forth with his coach, why not include MT.

I've never seen video of pros warming up with mini tennis. I have seen Henin hit soft warm up groundies from between the service line and baseline. I just assumed what Hennin was doing was common among the pros.

If this mini discussion stirs Googling ... if someone finds the video of Gilles Simon playing mini tennis points ... please post it. I have tried a couple of times to find it again, and could not. It was frickin awesome. You don't think of Gilles as a touch/hands player ... but he was crazy good.

There is another great one with Djokovic, but they are playing a game where they have to bounce it over (hit into ground). Crazy long athletic point.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

I've never seen video of pros warming up with mini tennis.

Do you mean pros warming up with other pros or pros warming up with their hitting partner?

 

[ByeByePoly]

Do you mean pros warming up with other pros or pros warming up with their hitting partner?

Both ... I've never seen a pro mini tennis in the service boxes, other than a couple of challenge mini tennis fun videos. If it was standard pro to pro pre-match ... we would see it on TV. I'm sure pros do all kinds of pre-match drills with their coach/hitting partners that we don't see. If they mini before going to match court, there has to be video of it. My eyes and brain are ready to "absorb" it if someone posts the video.

But seriously ... if someone finds the Gilles mini tennis video ... this mini discussion will pay off in entertainment.

 

[PittsburghDad]

Ok so pros don't warm up with mini tennis. Ok.... Even though there is video of them doing it. Including Roger and Henin. I'm not going back to find videos I saw five years ago when a coach I respected was telling me how good it was for kids. And I didn't believe. So I did my research. Or just go to a pro tourney. You have to have the skills to have good strokes. Period.

Are you really arguing that it's not a skill you need. There no chance you're arguing that, right?

 

[ByeByePoly]

Part of this might be differences in what we think mini tennis is. I think of USTA warm up between the service lines. Both opponents up close to their service line.

I don't consider the following mini tennis. Henin is being fed balls from her hitting her partner from deeper in the court.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

Both ... I've never seen a pro mini tennis in the service boxes, other than a couple of challenge mini tennis fun videos. If it was standard pro to pro pre-match ... we would see it on TV. I'm sure pros do all kinds of pre-match drills with their coach/hitting partners that we don't see. If they mini before going to match court, there has to be video of it. My eyes and brain are ready to "absorb" it if someone posts the video.

Bite your tongue:

 

[ByeByePoly]

Bite your tongue:

I watched that as my punishment ... multiple times.

 

[heninfan99]

 

[Curious]

Some people are a little more sarcastic, aggressive, inconsiderate than others. That's life, anyway.
This forum taught me a lot also about nontennis things. Seeing all sorts of attitudes, maybe the beauty of variety to an extent, then the personality issues, gave also great insight to see my own deficiencies and faults in both tennis and attitude. I'm maturing up here at age 51 for those really curious to know. and thanks @mad dog1 for the age estimate.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

I watched that as my punishment ... multiple times.

What were we talking about? Oh yeah, mini-tennis. Yeah, that's why I found that video...

 

[ByeByePoly]

That is an example of something different than the mini tennis I see in USTA. Maria took a step or two back... I see everyone right up on the line like s&v Bouchard's example. I would like to see the feed position of Maria's hitting partner. I notice Maria does this for a very short time ... and then moves back.

Putting aside the difference between drilling and helping your timing (on your own time) and match warm up (shared time) ... I see some practice utility in Mari's and not Bouchards. Bouchards 2hbh ts mini is a contrived stroke which has nothing to do with match strokes. You are never going to hit a stroke that way, or even many strokes from that position in the court. I will let others debate if the contrived exercise is a test of skill level and baseline ability, or a predictor of beating your opposing mini participant.

I don't need mini to warm up. I hit easy controlled strokes from the baseline and gradually take bigger cuts.

So the question for me would be do I find these examples as useful drills.

Bouchard ... No ... practicing contrived strokes do not serve a purpose for me at my stage in tennis. If you are a beginner ... anything inside the service lines will help you with hand eye, reflexes, touch, volley (btw ... volley drill here awesome for everyone).

Maria ... Yes.

I have actually stood where Maria is (and a little deeper) working on my 2hbh conversion. You tend to learn full strokes at the baseline earlier than the off-pace, short, control cc ts angle, low bounce, etc. I have hand fed myself balls inside the baseline (not the easiest thing with 2hbh ... tossing hand has to find grip quickly) and hit various controlled non-full strokes. The difference is they are real strokes, hit from positions in the court that actually happen in matches.

Putting a finer point on my mini disagreement:

1) when we meet for a match we warm up together, drills and getting your timing right is on your time. If you can't walk to the baseline and hit your groundstrokes over the net, 5 minutes of mini isn't going to fix that.
2) I don't want to warm up that way ... you do. We have been warming up fine for decades. You might win the argument and force everyone to mini for you ... but we will hate you and your family. I'm frickin kidding ... I always give in and mini and do not hate anyone ... much.

One thing does occur to me. The next time I find myself confronted with mini peer pressure, it would seem a reasonable compromise to request to mini (middle-eee) further off the service line. At least from there it's easy, soft real strokes.

For those that think your mini 2hbh ts from the service line is a predictor of your baseline stroke ... exhibit BBP one summer day. My mini 2hbh ts was on fire. I was hardly missing ... and I was mini brushing the heck out of the ball. Look at me ... anyone with such control and full strokes even in the mini box is going to rock and roll from the baseline. I'm pretty sure I missed every 2hbh dtl that match. Funny thing was I never was presented the chance to hit my dtl 2hbh from the service line. I know ... somehow this is all because "I just can't mini GOOD".

Maybe we could hire mini stand-ins ... USTA teammate apprentices.

 

[ByeByePoly]

What were we talking about? Oh yeah, mini-tennis. Yeah, that's why I found that video...

We all know why you found the video. As far as I'm concerned your ttw status just went up. Not at @Bender rarified air status ... but solid.

My previous post is not going to please some ... I should get some more Bouchard videos ready to distract the angry mob. Man ... when did mini tennis become such a religion? Tennis life was so much simpler in my day ... and we walked 10 miles to school in the snow.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

We all know why you found the video. As far as I'm concerned your ttw status just went up. Not at @Bender rarified air status ... but solid.

My previous post is not going to please some ... I should get some more Bouchard videos ready to distract the angry mob. Man ... when did mini tennis become such a religion? Tennis life was so much simpler in my day ... and we walked 10 miles to school in the snow.

You forgot to mention it was uphill...both ways.

 

[ByeByePoly]

You forgot to mention it was uphill...both ways.

That was my follow up if someone challenged the story. And then bread bags for shoes. 3 moves ahead.

 

[Morch Us]

Then you need more practice. But please don't confuse yourself. Warmup and practice are two totally different things.

I'm pretty sure I missed every 2hbh dtl that match

 

[ByeByePoly]

Then you need more practice. But please don't confuse yourself. Warmup and practice are two totally different things.

"Warmup and practice are two totally different things"

Exactly what I have been saying. Others are saying "mini skills = your stroke skills" and "mini prepares their timing for the match ... and spacing".

I already posted I know how to warmup in this thread

https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...rm-up-good-or-bad.339738/page-3#post-11665264

 

[mad dog1]

Some people are a little more sarcastic, aggressive, inconsiderate than others. That's life, anyway.
This forum taught me a lot also about nontennis things. Seeing all sorts of attitudes, maybe the beauty of variety to an extent, then the personality issues, gave also great insight to see my own deficiencies and faults in both tennis and attitude. I'm maturing up here at age 51 for those really curious to know. and thanks @mad dog1 for the age estimate.

You look younger than 51 in the vids!

 

[Morch Us]

If you already learned how to time your shots (by practice over the years or months), and then you already have the muscle memory/brain/feel on what it is. Then on your match day, you just need to remind your muscle/brain on what it is, that is warmup (and where mini helps). I assume you understand that, but just not agree with the wording "preapares" which kind of hints practice.

mini prepares their timing for the match

 

[heninfan99]

That is an example of something different than the mini tennis I see in USTA. Maria took a step or two back... I see everyone right up on the line like s&v Bouchard's example. I would like to see the feed position of Maria's hitting partner. I notice Maria does this for a very short time ... and then moves back.

Putting aside the difference between drilling and helping your timing (on your own time) and match warm up (shared time) ... I see some practice utility in Mari's and not Bouchards. Bouchards 2hbh ts mini is a contrived stroke which has nothing to do with match strokes. You are never going to hit a stroke that way, or even many strokes from that position in the court. I will let others debate if the contrived exercise is a test of skill level and baseline ability, or a predictor of beating your opposing mini participant.

I don't need mini to warm up. I hit easy controlled strokes from the baseline and gradually take bigger cuts.

So the question for me would be do I find these examples as useful drills.

Bouchard ... No ... practicing contrived strokes do not serve a purpose for me at my stage in tennis. If you are a beginner ... anything inside the service lines will help you with hand eye, reflexes, touch, volley (btw ... volley drill here awesome for everyone).

Maria ... Yes.

I have actually stood where Maria is (and a little deeper) working on my 2hbh conversion. You tend to learn full strokes at the baseline earlier than the off-pace, short, control cc ts angle, low bounce, etc. I have hand fed myself balls inside the baseline (not the easiest thing with 2hbh ... tossing hand has to find grip quickly) and hit various controlled non-full strokes. The difference is they are real strokes, hit from positions in the court that actually happen in matches.

Putting a finer point on my mini disagreement:

1) when we meet for a match we warm up together, drills and getting your timing right is on your time. If you can't walk to the baseline and hit your groundstrokes over the net, 5 minutes of mini isn't going to fix that.
2) I don't want to warm up that way ... you do. We have been warming up fine for decades. You might win the argument and force everyone to mini for you ... but we will hate you and your family. I'm frickin kidding ... I always give in and mini and do not hate anyone ... much.

One thing does occur to me. The next time I find myself confronted with mini peer pressure, it would seem a reasonable compromise to request to mini (middle-eee) further off the service line. At least from there it's easy, soft real strokes.

For those that think your mini 2hbh ts from the service line is a predictor of your baseline stroke ... exhibit BBP one summer day. My mini 2hbh ts was on fire. I was hardly missing ... and I was mini brushing the heck out of the ball. Look at me ... anyone with such control and full strokes even in the mini box is going to rock and roll from the baseline. I'm pretty sure I missed every 2hbh dtl that match. Funny thing was I never was presented the chance to hit my dtl 2hbh from the service line. I know ... somehow this is all because "I just can't mini GOOD".

Maybe we could hire mini stand-ins ... USTA teammate apprentices.

Nah, that's mini tennis. There is no rule you can't take a step back. Haas is the same.

 

[ByeByePoly]

Nah, that's mini tennis. There is no rule you can't take a step back. Haas is the same.

Then we have detente ... mini lovers take a couple of steps back, and BBP and other mini haters take a couple steps inside the baseline.

What should we tackle next ... world peace?

 

[heninfan99]

Then we have detente ... mini lovers take a couple of steps back, and BBP and other mini haters take a couple steps inside the baseline.

What should we tackle next ... world peace?

I think that pros or people that play just about everyday for a living prolly don't need as much stroke warm up.
For me I have to kind of re-learn my strokes if I play once a week.

 

[S&V-not_dead_yet]

Then we have detente ... mini lovers take a couple of steps back, and BBP and other mini haters take a couple steps inside the baseline.

What should we tackle next ... world peace?

We should warm up first with mini-world peace.

 

[ByeByePoly]

1. I think that pros or people that play just about everyday for a living prolly don't need as much stroke warm up.

For me I have to kind of re-learn my strokes if I play once a week.

"For me I have to kind of re-learn my strokes if I play once a week."

Hey ... this means you "learned" them. I fall back into bad habits so fast I wonder if I ever learned them. My lastest frustration is getting caught on baseline FHs with little shoulder turn. My 11.6 oz racquet can feel heavy to me. When I have a full shoulder turn my FHs feel effortless and the racquet feels light. When I get caught without shoulder turn and therefore have nothing to uncoil ... the racquet feels heavy. I have "learned" what swing thought works for me. If I think "hit my FHs with my shoulder" ... it works because I can't hit with a shoulder without turning it back. Like hitting a nail with a hammer. So there I am ... facing avg rec player pace at the baseline with ALL day to turn my shoulders ... and still don't many times in a set. I think I need electrodes attached {insert location of your choice} that fire with weak shoulder turns.

FYI ... when I work on my full shoulder turn in mini tennis, my opponents wet themselves a little.

 

[zalive]

Then we have detente ... mini lovers take a couple of steps back, and BBP and other mini haters take a couple steps inside the baseline.

What should we tackle next ... world peace?

World piece, yess...world pi*s is doable, too.

 

[NE1for10is?]

The whole point of mini tennis is to get the body warmed up and injury prevention, otherwise it can be quite a shock to the joints and muscles to start hitting full out and running for shots at the baseline. I don't know of many players who do any kind of warm up before stepping onto the court, so mini tennis is a good way to get the blood flowing and the joints and muscles warmed up a bit. If you don't do some kind of warm up, no matter what age you are, you are setting yourself up for injury for sure.

 

[ByeByePoly]

The whole point of mini tennis is to get the body warmed up and injury prevention, otherwise it can be quite a shock to the joints and muscles to start hitting full out and running for shots at the baseline. I don't know of many players who do any kind of warm up before stepping onto the court, so mini tennis is a good way to get the blood flowing and the joints and muscles warmed ups a bit. If you don't do some kind of warm up, no matter what age you are, you are setting yourself up for injury for sure.

I found out something interesting when I started light hits after 2 months off from TE. I immediately went to mini tennis ... thinking it would be the best way to start. FHs hurt quite a bit. FH volleys even worse. I was about to bag it and just go home ... but decided to take some full swings from the baseline. On that first swing, I expected pain. Surprisingly, the discomfort was minimal on full swings unless I mishit ( don't want to hit near tip with TE ... not good). My takeaway is you actually may be getting more arm/wrist/elbow impact from the block/non-full swings.

I haver never run around a lot at the baseline or taken big cuts at the start of warm up. Nice relaxed hits ... and if opponent hits to wide I let it go. I do often hop on the treadmill for a couple of minutes before I head out the door for a singles match. I used to also do some shoulder resistance band stretching before I left the house, but not lately. I have rarely had any wrist issues, but I think a good pre-match for that is the left/right racquet rotation you often see pros do when they meet at the net before a match. Also pull hand back and hold stretch, and then forward (flexion) and hold stretch.

Lately ... I wonder if a long walk might be a better pre-match than the treadmill or pre-match stretching. I am trying to remember to stretch after matches.