Steve0904
Talk Tennis Guru
Yes we know Nadal has never liked the good tennis. Tell us something we don’t know.
Nadal v Thiem final would be farcical
- Thread starter Beckerserve
- Start date
Yes we know Nadal has never liked the good tennis. Tell us something we don’t know.
Amritia
Hall of Fame
I’ve always admitted WTF is an important tournament.
It’s not as nearly as important as Slams but way more important than any Masters 1000.
I think for Rafa, his CV has enough wins from a variety of places that means one gap isn’t much of a big deal. Olympics Singles is a good one, as it’s only played once every 4 years.
Imo if Nadal wins another event that helps his CV, I hope it’s the USO.
Some people say AO, but I don’t see the big significance of having 2 slams at every event. Once you’ve won all Slams, is it really a big deal?
USO would be good as it would mean he’s joint top record USO open era wins.
Amritia
Hall of Fame
He said in post match interview today he was sad he lost. Clearly not insignificant.
Beckerserve
Legend
20-17 fella. Could and should have been 19-19. And federer now also has the last laugh over Novak. I like Novak, gutted he lost today but i saw his decline coming as i told u 2 months ago.Nah bud.
Beckerserve
Legend
20-17 fella. Could and should have been 19-19. And federer now also has the last laugh over Novak. I like Novak, gutted he lost today but i saw his decline coming as i told u 2 months ago.Nah bud.
Beckerserve
Legend
Well he is hardly going to say he is not bothered publicly is he!. He hates losing in practice. Pretty sure 2020 will be fondly remembered for him.
Steve0904
Talk Tennis Guru
You and I are very much aligned in our beliefs then. Right down to Nadal winning another USO being more significant for him in the long run.
Amritia
Hall of Fame
Yes winning the 20th Grand Slam was epic.
Beckerserve
Legend
Seriously you like indoor tennis? Forget who you support. Just genuinely interested as to what you like about indoor tennis. Not criticising just genuinely interested.
Beckerserve
Legend
My issue with wtf is the format. At least tomorrow we have a final that means something. I cannot stand the final between two players who played RR.
Amritia
Hall of Fame
Do you say the same thing if it happened in football World Cup or Champions League?
Amritia
Hall of Fame
@Steve0904 enjoys indoor tennis so much he watches the French Open 2020 final on repeat.
Beckerserve
Legend
World cup yes. I hate group stage.
For me you either have a league format or knockout.
So we could say have a league format at WTF where everyone plays once. That would be cool.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
A shocker like Djokovic's loss? Djokovic hasn't won this event in 5 years and he doesn't need to. He has 5 of them and has the consecutive record for winning 4 in a row. I don't know why you are bringing up Djokovic in an argument about WTF because it's an argument you will surely lose.
Beckerserve
Legend
Djokovic needed this event way more than Nadal.
Hitman
Bionic Poster
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
This is laughable. Nadal needed this wayyyy more than Djokovic.
StrongRule
Talk Tennis Guru
Djokovic would actually break a record had he won here. Nadal wouldn't achieve anything.
Hitman
Bionic Poster
Steve0904
Talk Tennis Guru
You’re acting like someone liking indoor tennis is a shocking thing. Many people like indoor tennis. It’s not all serve botting. I also like tennis played on clay and grass and outdoor HC too. I just wish someone would beat Nadal at RG so it wasn’t such a foregone conclusion every year.
Hitman
Bionic Poster
No, he would only equal it.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Djokovic would have tied the record not break it. The difference between 5 and 6 is a bit trivial when he's won 7/14 big events 5 or more times.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Steve0904
Talk Tennis Guru
Now that you mention it, I did tape it and watch it more than once. I enjoyed Nadal’s win that day, and respected his level of play.
Amritia
Hall of Fame
Nice. Weird how @FO he played poorly all tournament but stepped it up for the SF, while @o2 he played well during the week but dipped his level (esp first serve percentage) for SF. Previous record clearly affecting mentality.
Will be good to have Roger back for AO. Hopefully fit and healthy. If he has fully recovered, 2021 may actually be a 'strong era' type season. Djokovic, Nadal, Federer, Thiem, Medvedev. If most of them are on form, you could have an absolute cracker of a Grand Slam.
Amritia
Hall of Fame
One question though, if it was his age, how did he manage to win the 3rd set tiebreak against Schwartzmann? That match was longer and more gruelling than this one.
I'm not sure if it was endurance, or just bad strategy. He said in post match conference that he wasn't injured which is good news.
He certainly did employ bizarre tactics with the overuse of net approaches. He sliced too much all match. 1st serve percentage was also very low throughout.
Beckerserve
Legend
Lol. You miss the point. 2020 turned out perfect for Nadal. Djokovic needed WTF more than ever before. His aura is fading badly. Unless of course he has given up eclipsing Nadal and Federer?
Beckerserve
Legend
20-17 is a reality. Not sure how you are disagreeing?Nah bud.
Beckerserve
Legend
You seem a tad touchy. It has been 6 weeks since RG final bud. You yourself said WTF was a big deal for Nole. Is this more goal post shifting lol.Don't mind my good friend Dean. It's a force of habit.
Keizer
Hall of Fame
Nobody (him included) thinks additional WTFs are going to add much to his legacy. Equaling Fed on WTF count means nothing if he doesn't win more slams.
Beckerserve
Legend
Which he failed to do. Oh well. Always next year. Been an awesome year of tennis. Agree? ☺
Beckerserve
Legend
Agreed. However on this board some of his more blinkered fans have been claiming the WTF is the GOAT determinant. Not equalling Federer obviously presents a quandry now. They have sort of run themselves into a cul de sac.
Keizer
Hall of Fame
It's not a GOAT determinant if you've won 5. Not having won a single one is a different story. I don't know that it's a GOAT determinant, but Nadal's winning this WTF would've added more to his legacy than Djokovic's winning it would've added to his.
Beckerserve
Legend
No. A 5th USO, 2nd AO or a 3rd W or another FO will add way more to Nadals legacy. Even the players cannot remember who won the WTF in recent years. Both Nadal and Djokovic forgot Murray won it in 2016. To me that says it all.
Djokovic needed the WTF badly to re-establish some sort of aura after what has been a terrible 2020 post lockdown.
Keizer
Hall of Fame
Why are you strawmanning -- I never said anything about slams. All I said is that WTF is a box to check. Obviously if he broke the tie it would add more to his legacy.
I couldn't care less about Nadal or Djokovic winning slams. I'd rather neither of them, nor Federer, won any more slams. I was glad for today's results.
Steve0904
Talk Tennis Guru
Of course a slam win means more. Everyone knows that. But pretending like this was more important for Djokovic who has 5 WTF titles vs Nadal who has 0 is laughable.
And obviously the WTF isn’t a GOAT determinant. Nadal doesn’t need it if he wins the slam race which is likely, but it is a mark against him on his career. A mark he could’ve gotten rid of with no Djokovic to stop him, but he didn’t, and the person most unhappy about it is Nadal himself. I can guarantee you that regardless of what he might say in a book.
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Beckerserve
Legend
Last 4 years the roll of honour has been Murray Dimitrov Zverev and Tsitispas. The total number of slams won between them post 2016 is 0.
Keizer
Hall of Fame
Makes it even more embarrassing that your boy hasn't won it then, no?
Beckerserve
Legend
You miss the point. Djokovic was mouthing off about going unbeaten all season. He was unlucky in NY. He got humiliated in Paris. He absolutely had to win WTF to restore that fear factor. But he got schooled by medvedev and lost to a poorly playing Thiem. On his best surface indoors.
For Nadal it is his worse conditions. Yes it is disappointing for him to lose but irrelevant moving forward as his aura is still there.
I am basing all this on the basis Djokovic still believes he can get the most Majors. If not then yes you are right.
Steve0904
Talk Tennis Guru
Obviously Djokovic still believes he can win the slam race. It’s called having belief in yourself. A common thing for an elite athlete of Djokovic’s caliber.
And unless I missed something I wouldn’t say he mouthed off all year about going unbeaten. His fanboys yes, but he never said much. He was asked what, one question on it and gave a PC answer.
Beckerserve
Legend
I am sure he mentioned going unbeaten all year as a goal. If i am mistaken i take it back. As for his fanboys, to be fair on here there are only 2, their opinions are worthless.
I only judge Djokovic off his comments.
Swingmaster
Hall of Fame
Knowing how OCD Nadal is, it must bug him considerably that he hasn’t won a WTF. To retire without one would be an incredibly hard pill for him to swallow.
Beckerserve
Legend
He wont care that much. If he did he would not have skipped it so many times.
He is an average indoor player. A man has got to know his limitations. Would be nice to win but i am certain 20 majors compensates and an OG
Steve0904
Talk Tennis Guru
Well if he mentioned it as a goal it only makes sense. Wouldn’t that be the ultimate goal of any tennis player after all?
Beckerserve
Legend
Yes of course but none actually openly state it as a goal.
I am mindful of course that djokovic is often misquoted so if i am wrong i apologise.
Anyway should be a good match tomorrow. Hope Thiem wins. Like a bit of topspin
Swingmaster
Hall of Fame
But knowing how competitive that guy is, a WTF has to be important. Imagine if Federer didn’t have a French Open on his resume. That would eat at him forever, even though clay isn’t his best surface. Grand slams are more important than WTFs, but still, it sucks. Im not a Nadal die hard, but I wanted this one for him. Had it on his serve, too!! Sheesh. But oh well. Maybe next year. It’s good to have things to overcome. He may not be good indoors, but he’s good enough to win one.
Steve0904
Talk Tennis Guru
Beckerserve
Legend
Medvedev played a great return game. Plus Nadal serve is a liability anyway indoors.
Federer has never beaten Nadal at RG or won an OG. I suspect those two facts outweigh Nadal not winning WTF albeit for both they will be very minor irritations of little note.
If you are looking for major frustrations then look at Djokovic. 20-20-17 was not how it was supposed to be at the end of 2020.
Beckerserve
Legend
Should be really good. And for me the right final given they topped the groups.No need to apologize. I hope for a great match tomorrow as well.
Swingmaster
Hall of Fame
True, they will all have some “what might’ve beens.” Hopefully they can just forget about all the stupid numbers and enjoy the memories. Who gives a crap about a few bad bounces.
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