Pancho Gonzales
- Thread starter Emelia21
- Start date
Thankyou, I would like more info on him please, can anyone please tell me more?
hoodjem
G.O.A.T.
What year was that?
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the other Pancho
I watched beat Jimmy Conners in the Pacific Southwest tournament when Jimbo was starting to own everybody on the planet.. he just made it look so easy... big slice serve,slowly moving forwards to volley,never rushing... returned most serves with a slice backhand doing a simple block and follow-through move.... he condensed his service motion as he got older to take the racket back with a abreviated side out rather than a smooth downwards backswing takeaway... he was pretty big and lean and could reach almost any lobs with a 2 step back and jump kick... and his long arm reach was hard to past... the only one who figured how to beat him when he came to the net was Pancho Segura... he would play a short ball infront of him then go right into his body next.. no one else ever figure that out ... he was a marvel to watch when he was serving well,and that was almost everytime he stepped onto the court.... I heard he died broke and A. Agassi had to pay for his funeral because he was still married to AA's sister,Rita... too bad...
I watched beat Jimmy Conners in the Pacific Southwest tournament when Jimbo was starting to own everybody on the planet.. he just made it look so easy... big slice serve,slowly moving forwards to volley,never rushing... returned most serves with a slice backhand doing a simple block and follow-through move.... he condensed his service motion as he got older to take the racket back with a abreviated side out rather than a smooth downwards backswing takeaway... he was pretty big and lean and could reach almost any lobs with a 2 step back and jump kick... and his long arm reach was hard to past... the only one who figured how to beat him when he came to the net was Pancho Segura... he would play a short ball infront of him then go right into his body next.. no one else ever figure that out ... he was a marvel to watch when he was serving well,and that was almost everytime he stepped onto the court.... I heard he died broke and A. Agassi had to pay for his funeral because he was still married to AA's sister,Rita... too bad...
From what i saw and read, Pancho was the older day Sampras, maybe mentally even tougher and better looking. Looked like a movie star (with a scar on his face), a bit like Peter Lawford, the guy from the 'Rat Pack'. Excelled on fast indoor, hard and grass courts. His serve was one of the best in history, and made him tough to beat. As So Cal rightly says, his bh was merely a slice. In his younger days, his forehand should have been his major weapon from the ground. There probably were technically more rounded players in his prime (Sedgman, Hoad, Rosewall), but his self-confidence and will to win made him the best. Was a loner and a quite cocky and arrogant guy, who tried a bunch of tricks on the court, to disturb the rhythm of the other guy.
His outsider position based probably on his mexican backround and the fights and feuds, he had with the amateur tennis establishment around Perry Jones, and later with the pro king, Jack Kramer. He thought that pro tennis couldn't go along without him, and he was right. When he rested somewhere at a patrol station, and a phone rang, he went there to get the call. He loved riding fast cars, and had stormy relationships with many women. Jenny Hoad tells some stories about him and his second (and third time) wife, with wild scenes and even brawls.
His outsider position based probably on his mexican backround and the fights and feuds, he had with the amateur tennis establishment around Perry Jones, and later with the pro king, Jack Kramer. He thought that pro tennis couldn't go along without him, and he was right. When he rested somewhere at a patrol station, and a phone rang, he went there to get the call. He loved riding fast cars, and had stormy relationships with many women. Jenny Hoad tells some stories about him and his second (and third time) wife, with wild scenes and even brawls.
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Rabbit
G.O.A.T.
Wikipedia said:
Gonzalez was 41 years old when he won the Howard Hughes Invitational. There was a documentary made on this by Gene Scott. In it, Gonzalez was shown to still be a force and still be tempermental. I think the final against Ashe was a best of 5 and in that Gonzalez won one set 6-0.
The match mentioned above occured two years later against a 19-year old Jimmy Connors.
Wikipedia said:
Laver at the time was two years off his 1969 Grand Slam and 33 years old. I think the ability of these players to play at what is now considered ancient is a testament to playing with wood/gut and natural surfaces.
Wikipedia said:
Simply amazing.
Wikipedia said:
This is the match mentioned above by SoCal10s. SoCal10s is a lucky person indeed to have witnessed Gonzalez at any point. I wish I could've seen him play live. The fact that Gonzalez beat Connors from the baseline given Connors' ability to hit the ball is remarkable. Connors must have been a little on the psyched side...
I was lucky to see and recall a bunch of great tennis... I watch Rod Laver beat Ren Rosewall while he lost the 1st 6-1,they played at the LA Sports arena and the crowd started to chant ROCKET <ROCKET,and Laver came alive,I hthink he pounded Rosewall 6-0,6-0 after that.. then he celebrated by drinking beer... I was a ball boy and carried his bag to the court and he gave me his broken racket,too bad I later trashed it...
But Pancho ,I was more familar with because he was close friends with my old coach Pancho Segura.. the 2 Panchos had sons who they asked the other one to teach because they couldn't control each other's son... it was the funniest thing to watch how the 2 dads hated to be on the court with their own son... they too much of a perfectionist and demanded nothing less from their own kids,but the friend could sort of be easier on the other kid.. I remember Pancho(both of them) used to bet on everything ... Pancho G would take bets with Bobby Riggs against young up-coming punks like Jimbo and tare them apart.. they all hang out all the time and cussed a lot... and Pancho S would always have the last word in... he is a real character ... and the best tennis mind ever...and Pancho G was the best tennis physical ever.. Pancho S would tell me how strong PG was even when he was in his 40's he said the PG would only work out lifting bottles of beer.. PG was just thug strong from growing up in the inner city of LA .. PS always said the PG was just born strong...
Rabbit
G.O.A.T.
Yeah, do a search on YouTube....there's a 6-7 minute deal from a special.
As a side note, Robert Redford was a top ranked junior in California. During one tournament, he was tapped to warm Gonzalez up. On court, Redford (who plays leftie) decided to show Gonzalez he could hit with him, and possibly hit harder. Redford kept hitting long in an effort to impress Gonzalez. After about half a dozen missed balls, Gonzalez barked "Just hit the damn ball in the court!" Redford said that calmed him down...
As a side note, Robert Redford was a top ranked junior in California. During one tournament, he was tapped to warm Gonzalez up. On court, Redford (who plays leftie) decided to show Gonzalez he could hit with him, and possibly hit harder. Redford kept hitting long in an effort to impress Gonzalez. After about half a dozen missed balls, Gonzalez barked "Just hit the damn ball in the court!" Redford said that calmed him down...
Yeah, do a search on YouTube....there's a 6-7 minute deal from a special.
As a side note, Robert Redford was a top ranked junior in California. During one tournament, he was tapped to warm Gonzalez up. On court, Redford (who plays leftie) decided to show Gonzalez he could hit with him, and possibly hit harder. Redford kept hitting long in an effort to impress Gonzalez. After about half a dozen missed balls, Gonzalez barked "Just hit the damn ball in the court!" Redford said that calmed him down...
Thanks, I have just watched it, shame it was only 6mins long, would love to view the whole doc. I never knew about Robert Redford :shock:
Thanks again
joe sch
Legend
Tennis Channel showed the Pancho Gonzales special and hopefully they will show it again. It was excellent how it really showed Pancho's true character and he was pretty much pissed off to even be giving the interview since he was more serious about winning the ongoing retirement tournament. His friend Sequra was even doing the interviewing. Some more great footage of the Gonzales skills can be seen on the Kings of the Court video. Too bad there is soo little video of the GOAT contenders before the Laver era. Along with one of the greatest Serve/Volley games ever, Gonzales had amazing speed to go along with his tall powerful body.
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Kirko
Hall of Fame
Rabbit and Joe like always summed up perfectly his style and importance, my in put : he defended well, had pretty good volleys and that amaxing serve coul hit all serves off one location eg. american twist and slice also. he was a very nice guy also! I lived in las vegas for a long time and I knew him. he always greeted me in that thunder-clap voice "how you doin Kirk"! I have two posters form the Allan King Classic and he was able to get all the players to sign them for me guys like Borg, Connors, Solomon, Dibbs and the rest. terific guy !!!!!
Mahboob Khan
Hall of Fame
Guess what? I learned to play tennis from Pancho Gonzales' Book. I simply followed the instructions and the associated pictures in that simple to follow Book. With time I kept on perfecting my shots.
I am an ITN-3, #2 in the world in 55+ age group. Here is the link. I am sure PG must be feeling proud in his grave:
http://www.oncourtassessment.com/leaders.php?sex=M&agemen=55&agewomen=0&countryid=0
Happy New Year,
Mahboob Khan
I am an ITN-3, #2 in the world in 55+ age group. Here is the link. I am sure PG must be feeling proud in his grave:
http://www.oncourtassessment.com/leaders.php?sex=M&agemen=55&agewomen=0&countryid=0
Happy New Year,
Mahboob Khan
Mahboob Khan
Hall of Fame
Pancho Gonzales taught me how to play tennis without ever seeing me oncourt and I am number 2 in the world in my age group 55+. I am 58 in the world in the Open category, and number 3 in the world in 45+. You got the link.
Good day,
Mahboob Khan
Good day,
Mahboob Khan
joe sch
Legend
Hi Mahboob,
Which of Panco Gonzales books did you learn from ?
I read his "The Complete Tennis Book" and found his story in the "Man with a Racket" very interesting. The books that were most formulative for my tennis game were Pancho Segura book "Championship strategy: How to play win" and Bill Tildens "Match Play and the Spin of the Ball".
Joe
Mahboob Khan
Hall of Fame
I don't remember the name!
joe sch
Legend
Pancho did write some excellent articles for Tennis Magazine. I really enjoyed some of the tour matches that Gonzales help announce. His insights were very interesting and many observations that only top players would have experienced.
hoodjem
G.O.A.T.
I guess I'll bring up that article which posits that Pancho is the GOAT: http://www.neta.com/~1stbooks/PG_.htm
One point it makes that seems implausible was that Pancho was the world's no. 1 player for 14 years!
"No one, including the likes of Tilden, Budge, Kramer, Laver, et al., had won more than nine No.1 rankings – except for Gonzalez, who won 14!! This is not for occasional amateur or pro slam titles. That is for an unbroken string of No. 1 world rankings!"
One point it makes that seems implausible was that Pancho was the world's no. 1 player for 14 years!
"No one, including the likes of Tilden, Budge, Kramer, Laver, et al., had won more than nine No.1 rankings – except for Gonzalez, who won 14!! This is not for occasional amateur or pro slam titles. That is for an unbroken string of No. 1 world rankings!"
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Pancho had a darker and a brighter side. One very positive factor was, that he often helped youngsters with sound advice. People like Arthur Ashe, Connors or Pasarell tremendously learned their trade by listening to him. On the court however, he didn't knew relatives. Fred Stolle tells a story about his first pro match with Gorgo in Australia in 1967. Before the match, Pancho claimed that the net was too high. It was again measured and it was of course correct. But Fiery Stolle was so upset, that he himself thought, the net was too high, and consequently served all his serves into the tape.
the green god
Professional
I also learned how to play from this book. If anyone wants to learn how to serve this is the book. Simple, effective, and no wasted motion. Still see this book all the time in used book stores.
Steady Eddy
Legend
When Jimmy Connors was dominating and Gonzales was past his prime, Gonzales beat Connors in a match from the baseline. Gonzales seems to have had a mean personality, but he also seems to have more natural tennis ability than anyone I've heard of.
I read that somewhere,... I know that Pancho G was teaching Andre's sister,Rita for a long time when she was young from 12-16 years old... all the Agassi kids did lessons with Pancho Segura but Gonzales lived in Vegas and that was second best... so when Rita got older,she fell for Pancho ,I guess, and they married... I knew the Agassi family and Rita was about 16 and matured real fast living in Vegas and Pancho G. had to be around 50+ then... so I guess Mr. Agassi was a bit pissed to say the least when this happened.. strange things happens in Vegas... as they say ; "what happens in Las Vegas,stays in Las Vegas"
joe sch
Legend
I will need to look into this article reference ... I though Gonzales was #1 for 7 or 8 years including like 7 straight US Pro & 4 Wembly Pro championships. He surely proved his dominance with many wins over the following other GOAT contenders: Kramer, Segura, Sedgman, Laver, Rosewall, and Hoad.
the green god
Professional
Serve and volleys, no doubt. Groundstrokes are a whole other animal. Grips and swingpaths are completely different in today's game at the top level. On the local and regional level I have seen plenty of older player's with old school strokes handle younger players with modern strokes.
Thanks, I did a bit of digging and came up with this:
http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1026099/index.htm
That Price article is one of the best tennis articles i read for a long time. Another good article on Pancho and his rivalry with Hoad in 1958 is by Dave Anderson (i think) in Bud Collins Total Tennis, extracted from an old paper Sports magazine. That other Online editing by Hernandez, mentioned by Hoodjem, is made by a relative of Gonzales and is for great parts unreliable.
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hoodjem
G.O.A.T.
Ahhh! I wondered if there might be some bias on the part of the author to explain his "lack of objectivity" in the article.
Knowing that David Hernandez is a relative of Pancho's explains a great deal.
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Rabbit
G.O.A.T.
Well, this isn't quite true. Connors was 19 and hadn't yet hit the world stage. Gonzalez was past his prime, way past it. The match you're referring to occurred in 1971 which was a couple of years before Connors broke through. Gonzalez was 41 though and it was amazing that he could beat Connors.
