Doc Hollidae
Hall of Fame
Yes I mean low flex as in low RA.
Prince Phantom
- Thread starter joekapa
- Start date
Yes I mean low flex as in low RA.
Seth
Legend
Can't imagine what Prince had in mind? The specs of the Phantom are in the same ballpark as the o3/Ozone/EXO3 Tour 100 line. Those frames were regulars on the ATP Tour and very popular recreationally. Low-powered for sure, but very playable racquets.
That jump in the dividing line has some folks worried IMO. Racquets are trending to a stiffer and tinnier composition. Just look at HEAD's demolition of the Radical and Prestige lines. I'm glad to see Prince staying true to the Tour 100 lineage.
yonexRx32
Professional
Lengthening the racket will only affect the way you swing it, not its physical properties (stability, flexibility, torsional or otherwise). Hence, if the racket has issues, they will persist.
Bladerunner
New User
I Agree. I would add that it is not a very low powered racquet... It is not the most powerful one but it is definitely not among the most low powered racquets.
loosegroove
Hall of Fame
If it's similar to the Tour 100 16x18, but with a little more pop, it will be a-okay in my book.
tennis1111
Semi-Pro
It has just a bit more pop so you will like it.
I played third match with Phantom today and I decided to switch! Feel, serves and volleys are so much better with Phantom then with Tour 100 16*18.
I managed to improve my timing with Phantom and groundstrokes are better now. Will try to add just one or two grams of lead to improve swingweight.
jmacdaununder2
Legend
I agree that the more head light the racquet is the more suitable it is for lengthening; extending the length one inch automatically moves the balance point one inch towards towards the head - minus the weight of the extension. If the racquet is quite head light to begin with, it's quite easy to add a little weight to the head after lengthening, but not as easy to lower the balance point by adding weight to the handle. I find - depending of course, on the racquet's original weight - if the original unstrung balance is much over 31/31.5cm, the amount of weight that is needed in the handle to reduce the clubby/hammer feeling ups the static weight beyond what I can comfortably use, especially in doubles. I doubt the Phantom would be suitable for extending however, as I find lengthening racquets also makes them feel more flexible, and this new racquet apparently feels somewhat noodle like already, although the Textreme would presumably help in this regard. Maybe the non-ported Phantom is a candidate...FWIW my 28" Tour 98" esp feels too whippy to control, presumably due to a combination of the low ra and the esp pattern, and feels somewhat clubby; my 28" TT95 is great, other than the 95" head at 28" can sometimes make it feel like I'm putting with a three wood, especially considering the 320g original weight.
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ollinger
G.O.A.T.
yes, the specs are inline with products they no longer make and which apparently had a not very large following. I don't think it's a coincidence that at every level, from pro tour to college to serious recreational players, its' the PDs, Aeros, and Blades one sees everywhere, not Bowflex noodles of the type Prince is bringing out. And the ported racquets may have had a small following but mostly one heard complaints about lack of control, string breakage, difficulty stringing, cracking, etc. We're already reading here that the Phantom is a tough racquet to hit a winner with, so for all you pushers...................
graycrait
Legend
I sort of put the collegiate players in the 1 percenter group, serious rec players - means what? 5.0+, so I wonder how many pro tour to "serious" rec players there are? Is the "accumulation" of one percenters really that much of a profit margin?
Anyone have a clue what rackets make the most money world-wide? It wouldn't surprise me to hear something 29.99 at Wal Mart.
so you think prince should just make another 69-72 RA racket and compete against the hundreds available now?
392Hemi
Professional
ollinger
G.O.A.T.
Absolutely. And hire some capable marketing/advertising people. Head is an Austrian company, Babolat is French, Wilson is owned by Fins, so Prince needs to wrap itself in the flag a bit more, as the company owned by a group based in Omaha, Nebraska, smack in the middle of the country. Incredible to me that the company that wrapped itself in the American flag is Babolat, with its stars and stripes version of the Aero and its "Jack Sock for President" co--marketing.
markwillplay
Hall of Fame
Lemme just say that the ports do NOT take away from control. That is simply not true. Some don't like the fellowship of them, bUT I play with the tour 18 20 and it has excellent control for a 100 inch head. I also think that the ports are one of the few new technologies that makes a real difference. For my money, the combination of ports and 18 20 pattern are great. Soft feel but great control. I have played many sticks over the years and for this 46 year old arm and shoulder, the flexy with ports thing is great.
langdon0555
Semi-Pro
Looks like the phantom isn't coming out for a while still...at least as far as TW selling them.
JohnBPittsburgh
Hall of Fame
That sucks 
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Yeah, because we all know tennis players choose rackets based on the location of the home office of the company. Are Prince rackets made in America? I'd keep you day job and not pitch your plan to Prince.
ollinger
G.O.A.T.
companies that have filed for bankruptcy in the past aren't always greeted with open arms by suppliers. You've perhaps noticed almost no tennis bags or grommets available here from Prince.
I whole heartedly agree with this. I think some people might FEEL a lack of control due to the port feel. But I use the 18x20 as well. I think it's very pin point with control. That and the head mass for plowthrough, it's solid. I'm expecting although 16x18, the dense middle strings of the Phantom will make it play like the 18x20 on sweetspot hit shots.
djNEiGht
Legend
Strung up with synthetic gut 17g at 55# w power pads. Played a couple sets of doubles as well as a session of live ball.
*Likes
swings fast
ample spin
comfortable
ample power
1st and 2nd serves
cosmetics
*dislikes
too light in stock form
bumper guard is 1 inch too short compared to my other racquets
stringing o-ports
too muted and didn't feel the pocketing or feedback I prefer
volleys a bit lively (blame tension?)
Racquet was easy to swing due to it's light sw and balance. I would like to add some lead and leather to it to get the stability. Maybe just shy of 12 oz. Not crazy spin with current string but I was very happy with it. I liked the comfort and didn't not feel any elbow aggravation. I had a good serving night (for the most part) and I got comfortable real quick with this racquet. Such a beautiful racquet. You know how clothing fads often cycle back after a couple decades? Well imagine the POG minus the cross bar with some modern flare. This could suit a modern players game that has foundation in classic tennis. I have read that some feel there isn't enough power but I found it ample. Could be because I most often play with an 18x20.
This is a platform racquet IMO. Room to lead up (although the o-ports might limit lead placement). I do not abuse my racquet or hit slices that cause me to scrape the ground very often. I do hit a lot of half/pick up volleys though. My grommets/bumpers even on my oldest racquets are still in good shape and not hitting the frame material. This racquet's head guard though seems to end 1 inch short. Sad to say the beautiful racquet now has scratches on the frame.
Stringing o-ports for me started off with the 50/50 pattern and then the sharpie/dowel approach. I don't get to clamp as close to the frame this way. I tried getting boomerangs at one time but didn't pursue after a while. I can only hope that I'll find the right tension and just make sure I do the same thing each time for consistency.
I didn't get the ball pocketing feedback that I'm accustomed to. Could be due to tension and string type but I don't think that is really it. I found the flex high in the hoop like a Head Flex Point says it would. Maybe a more uniform flex would give me the feedback I desire. Looking at the frame you would think that there would be tons of flex in the throat but I found it more in the hoop.
My volleys that I would hit at net level or lower while getting pummeled by the baseline junior would often go long or sit up. I tried to adjust and had some success.
Will continue to venture on with this racquet. Trying to decide on next string and tension to try out next now that I have a foundation on what this racquet is for my game.
*Likes
swings fast
ample spin
comfortable
ample power
1st and 2nd serves
cosmetics
*dislikes
too light in stock form
bumper guard is 1 inch too short compared to my other racquets
stringing o-ports
too muted and didn't feel the pocketing or feedback I prefer
volleys a bit lively (blame tension?)
Racquet was easy to swing due to it's light sw and balance. I would like to add some lead and leather to it to get the stability. Maybe just shy of 12 oz. Not crazy spin with current string but I was very happy with it. I liked the comfort and didn't not feel any elbow aggravation. I had a good serving night (for the most part) and I got comfortable real quick with this racquet. Such a beautiful racquet. You know how clothing fads often cycle back after a couple decades? Well imagine the POG minus the cross bar with some modern flare. This could suit a modern players game that has foundation in classic tennis. I have read that some feel there isn't enough power but I found it ample. Could be because I most often play with an 18x20.
This is a platform racquet IMO. Room to lead up (although the o-ports might limit lead placement). I do not abuse my racquet or hit slices that cause me to scrape the ground very often. I do hit a lot of half/pick up volleys though. My grommets/bumpers even on my oldest racquets are still in good shape and not hitting the frame material. This racquet's head guard though seems to end 1 inch short. Sad to say the beautiful racquet now has scratches on the frame.
Stringing o-ports for me started off with the 50/50 pattern and then the sharpie/dowel approach. I don't get to clamp as close to the frame this way. I tried getting boomerangs at one time but didn't pursue after a while. I can only hope that I'll find the right tension and just make sure I do the same thing each time for consistency.
I didn't get the ball pocketing feedback that I'm accustomed to. Could be due to tension and string type but I don't think that is really it. I found the flex high in the hoop like a Head Flex Point says it would. Maybe a more uniform flex would give me the feedback I desire. Looking at the frame you would think that there would be tons of flex in the throat but I found it more in the hoop.
My volleys that I would hit at net level or lower while getting pummeled by the baseline junior would often go long or sit up. I tried to adjust and had some success.
Will continue to venture on with this racquet. Trying to decide on next string and tension to try out next now that I have a foundation on what this racquet is for my game.
First time seeing those Prince Beast "Eye" dampener. Quite nice!
mad dog1
G.O.A.T.
Nice sofa! That's what you want to highlight in the picture, right?
djNEiGht
Legend
Nice sofa! That's what you want to highlight in the picture, right?
ahahah...sofa is a low RA and plays pillow like
mad dog1
G.O.A.T.
Brilliant!
a polite way of saying that a presumed player's racquet has some real shortcomings.
Then again, most pro stock racquets are also platform racquets.
haqq777
Legend
Update on my Phantom. Went with hybrid of Luxilon Natural Gut mains and Red Code Wax crosses (54/51) and had absolutely no issues with power whatsoever like I was anticipating. I do think the stick needs weight in the hoop as I was getting pushed around quite a bit by a H.S senior who sometimes hits with me.
Few quick observations:
1. Very muted. Hardly got feedback upon contact that I'm used to.
2. Low grade paintjob compared to other brands. I mean stick looks great being glossy and all and with the green accents, but upon close up you can tell more. I could see a small paint bubble/mark near throat area and felt it if I ran fingers over it and I hadn't even strung it at that point.
3. Has a weird hoop flex which took sometime for me to get used to.
4. Definitely needs weight in the hoop area. Not stable for my liking.
5. Very quick through the air.
6. The short bumper guard on top is a little too small. I haven't gotten any scratches yet but I will pretty soon when I have to dig out those nasty drop shots.
Will update more when the hybrid breaks (can see notching already) and when I string it up with low tension full poly.
Few quick observations:
1. Very muted. Hardly got feedback upon contact that I'm used to.
2. Low grade paintjob compared to other brands. I mean stick looks great being glossy and all and with the green accents, but upon close up you can tell more. I could see a small paint bubble/mark near throat area and felt it if I ran fingers over it and I hadn't even strung it at that point.
3. Has a weird hoop flex which took sometime for me to get used to.
4. Definitely needs weight in the hoop area. Not stable for my liking.
5. Very quick through the air.
6. The short bumper guard on top is a little too small. I haven't gotten any scratches yet but I will pretty soon when I have to dig out those nasty drop shots.
Will update more when the hybrid breaks (can see notching already) and when I string it up with low tension full poly.
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Jay Winzenz
New User
How does the Phantom compare to your TC97?
Then again, pro stock racquets aren't really intended for sale to the public as ready-to-use items
skydog
Professional
I hit against the wall with one today 16g Kevlar @ 57 lbs and 16g ZX @ 50 lbs, it works just fine in the Phantom. As the Phantom is a bit light for my tastes, it will need some lead to really make it work for me. Not expecting it to kick the 104 out of the bag.
skydog
Professional
Wilson Blade 104 (2015) modified. 380g 10 points HL. Kev/ZX.
graycrait
Legend
I tried to like the Blade 104, both black/silver and black/green, but gave up. Gave away to younger players my 104s and 98 Blades. I can't find anything that feels as "familiar" as Prince POG/PCG graphite. I was feeding balls to a very academically smart and athletic 3.5 the other day. He kept talking about he can't find the perfect racket. I told him I spent from 1973 -1998 in the Army and if I can't have a pistol of any type tossed to me save my life then what is the point of learning the fundamentals? Same thing with a tennis racket.
djNEiGht
Legend
Well let me add to it. This is a platform racquet for this weekend warrior
haqq777
Legend
Thanks for your service. And excellent analogy. Sounds like something my dad would say too (also ex army, commissioned in 1972 - corp of Engrs).
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djNEiGht
Legend
Tc97 in the specs I have it in
Better at net and volleys and touch/finesse shots (I'm pretty rough around the edges)
That's about all I will say at this time as I need to get used to it as well as figure out tension
McLovin
Legend
Agree.
Haven't looked that closely yet.
Agree
Agree
Agree
Haven't noticed yet.
Looks like you, me, and @djNEiGht all have the same impressions. I've only had two hits with it so far, singles outdoors and doubles indoors. Very muted, flexy, and quick/whippy. In stock form I found it too low powered for me. Maybe some lead in the hoop would give me a little more 'oomph'. Mine is strung w/ 1.15mm Hyper-G (which looks awesome in this frame, BTW) at 45lbs.
OASN...a friend of mine is a die-hard Prince user (has 4 original Graphite LBs and 3 of the new ones). He played a set with it and loved it. He plans on buying a few when they come out & having them extended to 28".
haqq777
Legend
Yep, I had been doing some detective work on it before mine arrived so I knew it would be low powered for me hence I took the necessary precaution and went with a gut/poly hybrid. Solved the power issue really. It is about to break any moment though and I have a set of full set of Cyclone standing by. I'm thinking 40 lbs after reading your feedback on Hyper-G at 45lbs.
P.S: Hyper G would def look awesome in this stick, no doubt. Not Prince related, but I have a couple of Wimby edition PDs that I use Hyper-G in and have green Volkl V-Tack overgrips on them. Look incredible.
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@haqqani1777, @McLovin,
Good to hear that it is ultra-muted. I like frames like that, because my sensitive arm feels everything.
At any rate, if you could describe the "weird hoop flex," I would appreciate it. Is this something the Tour and Exo3 Tour did not have?
Good to hear that it is ultra-muted. I like frames like that, because my sensitive arm feels everything.
At any rate, if you could describe the "weird hoop flex," I would appreciate it. Is this something the Tour and Exo3 Tour did not have?
McLovin
Legend
Haven't hit w/ the Tour or Exo3 Tour, so I can't compare it to those. I know w/ the Pacific X Force Pro No 1, there was a ton of flex in the throat. I could feel it on contact. This has flex, but it feels as if its higher up in the frame.
And again, its not necessarily a 'bad' thing, its just unexpected when you start hitting w/ it.
Note that I have no statistical data to support this, its just how it feels on contact.
haqq777
Legend
Sorry but I have never hit with EXO3 and have only hit with Tour 100 16x18 a couple of times so I will leave it someone who is capable of a better comparison than myself.
I can tell you that the flex is more towards the hoop. At first looking at the thin beam I thought the racquet would have a more of a throat flex (it is a really thin beamed stick) but you feel the flex in the upper hoop on ball impact.
tennis1111
Semi-Pro
Flex is different compared to EXO3 but feel is much better.
Didn't have any problems with flex.
djNEiGht
Legend
@haqqani1777 @McLovin
I thought the paint looked great...but yes after a closer look i saw/felt some flaws. I liked the large carbon weave on the throat. On the inside of the throat though I could feel some bumps. You could see a slight "orange peel" feature.
I don't know if the paint quality is low but I did hit my wrist watch goofing around. There was a bee buzzing near by and I just swatted blindly at it in the most manly fashion. I hit my wrist watch all in one smooth panic-esq motion. My watch survived but the hoop has a ball point pen tip sized scratch. I also added another scratch while cutting a knot...this one really bummed me out.
I thought the paint looked great...but yes after a closer look i saw/felt some flaws. I liked the large carbon weave on the throat. On the inside of the throat though I could feel some bumps. You could see a slight "orange peel" feature.
I don't know if the paint quality is low but I did hit my wrist watch goofing around. There was a bee buzzing near by and I just swatted blindly at it in the most manly fashion. I hit my wrist watch all in one smooth panic-esq motion. My watch survived but the hoop has a ball point pen tip sized scratch. I also added another scratch while cutting a knot...this one really bummed me out.
I suppose the racquet could use an additional layer of clear coat.
What a bummer. Quality going down on all the racquets.
McLovin
Legend
jmacdaununder2
Legend
Still wondering if the racquet is too flexible to successfully extend to 28"; quite interested to find out the viability of doing so re this and other Phantom.
