Serve videos

[kevhen]

Serve up the T
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=11/32507451673.gif&s=x12
Serve outwide
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=11/32507454647.gif&s=x12
Serve going away
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=11/32408540087.gif&s=x12

Here are 3 clips. I have another one I will add where I am more relaxed but I am only hitting the ball between 90-100mph. The T serves are going over 100mph. The one outwide might be around 95mph. My leg kick is rather unusual but it works for me. I started serving hard around age 30 and my shoulder feels stronger and stronger the more I play now. I do try to warm it up slowly. If I hit too many my left knee gets sore from landing on it. I will try to add clips of my slice and topspin serve too some time once I get some good videos of those. Here I am using either an eastern forehand grip or possibly continental as I am just starting to use that more for a little bit of spin and higher serve %. I should show you all my forehand slice sometime too!

 

[ondray]

Is this supposed to be a show off thread?

Cause I can't see anything instructional about your serves.

 

[kevhen]

Sorry, mostly just show off. Another person requested I start a separate thread with the clips. Maybe if I used different angles so you could see the ball toss location and also how I hit the slice serve, it might be more informational. My footwork is different than most, but that may not be a positive thing, but it works ok for me. You can also see that my ball toss doesn't go much higher than my racquet.

 

[cdnaus76]

whats ur rating? 3.5?

 

[joe sch]

Kevhen,
You really are not getting much from your legs and back and not maximizing your height.
You should try to toss strait over head or slightly infront of your body and hit at your full extension, thus maximize your height. Your making contact at the side and swinging your body and rear leg (right) around. Try to use knee bend and explode up into the serve. Try to get your weight and legs going forward into the serve, rather than swinging around. You can get soo much more power by maximizing your height and getting your body weight going competely forward into the service motion. Dont worry about ratings, be concerned with making corrections.
Best wishes, Joe

 

[kevhen]

Oh, the other reason to post is just to show a third type of stance besiedes pinpoint and platform even if it may be inferior. If I were to start over I would use Martin Verkerk as the model since he actually walks into his serve for extra momentum and power but I am not sure that is legal but they never have called him on it.

I have hit 110 on the radar with 2 week old balls. I can probably hit 115-120 when in perfect form with new balls. With a better platform maybe I could hit harder, but I still feel placement and consistency is much, much more important than power. My slice (with eastern backhand grip) although 10 mph slower forces many more errors with all the sidespin and tricky bounce to deal with.

 

[kevhen]

Oh, also when I use more back bend on my hard topspin kick serve, I tend to have back problems and pain by the end of the match and for a day or two later. This serve with no back bend causes no back problems.

I have a 4.0 rating. I play #1 for my club and finished 2nd in doubles in one tournament this summer.
http://national.usta.com/Reports/Te...44904F59F26375FA7948BF6E4D3CF3B2D0&CYear=2005

 

[kevhen]

This one I am most relaxed but only hitting the ball between 90-100mph
http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=11/32609035792.gif&s=x12

I will stop posting these if no one is interested. I could video my slice and topspin serves as well as groundstrokes and vollies. My topspin serve needs the most help of my serves. My backhand volley needs the most help overall. Last night I tried working on it but my two hand swinging volley is still so much better than the one hander.

 

[Mike Cottrill]

Kevhen,
It is always nice to see different techniques. You must have good balance. Just like seeing that guy on TV that can hit golf balls from all sorts of positions. If you can be consistent, with that much pace on the ball and it does not hurt your back, then good and keep it up. What kind of radar gun are you using and how tall are you? There is a guy on the ATP that is all arm on his serve. Not a huge weapon, but good enough to make a living .

 

[kevhen]

The radar gun was at the baseball place I go to and I am not sure of the brand but it was rather large and looked sort of expensive. One guy on our team had his fastball clocked at 86mph, but mine was only 70mph, but my serves ranged from 98mph to 110mph. I hit about 40 serves and had a couple at almost every speed, 110, 109, 108, 107, etc. I need to open up a new can of balls next time, but the radar gun is not up on the shelf anymore. I think I am hitting my hardest right now since I am playing on a fast surface and hitting lots of bombs in matches and lifting more weights now too. In the summer I don't lift as much and play on slower outdoor courts where I use the slice serve more.

 

[takeuchi]

cool videos....you should try to get them in quicktime format though.

You are right about the leg kick looking weird, but hey, if its working for you and the numbers back it up then go at it. It almost looks like a scissor kick. Would you be able to get more coiling and leg drive with a stationary leg?(i am asking)

 

[AbLincoln]

I have a 4.0 rating. I play #1 for my club and finished 2nd in doubles in one tournament this summer.QUOTE]

Please show me more video and pictures of trophies. Just do it. We know you want too.

 

[kevhen]

I have them on quicktime but they took up 15 megs of space for a one minute video. Is there a place that will host large files like that for free?

One other thing, doesn't it look like I hit down on the ball or at the first least, out on the ball? I think others have said that you have to hit up on the ball, but for me that is only true on kick serves.

Good idea on photos of trophies. After playing that 4.5-5.0 #1 DIII kid last night, 4.0 kind of sucks! He did struggle with my serve on that fast surface so that gives me hope since he handled it outdoors too well. He played on a fast surface at LaCrosse so that explains why he is so good at counter punching. He is so skinny though at 6' and 140 pounds. His serve, overhead, and volley are only 4.0 level but his footspeed and backhand are 5.0. His forehand is 4.5.

 

[VGP]

kevhen - I'd mentioned in the other thread about changing your stance, but if your serve works for you that's fine by me.

How's the rest of your game?

 

[AbLincoln]

Good idea on photos of trophies. After playing that 4.5-5.0 #1 DIII kid last night, 4.0 kind of sucks! He did struggle with my serve .

.Take your ear-ring out. That should put some more gas on that high kick-n pirate serve thing.

 

[kevhen]

Those aren't earrings. Those are my ears!

 

[battousai555]

Those aren't earrings. Those are my ears!

LMAOROFL

 

[shindemac]

It looks like you are trying to push off the air with that leg kick. If you can keep that leg grounded, I'm sure you could add a lot more power.

 

[AbLincoln]

Those aren't earrings. Those are my ears!

Dude:

It’s just a game. Relax on the rating thing. Play to have fun & meet people. You’re still a young guy and you could play another 50 years if you want to. I’m afraid that serve-kick is going to end your tennis days by the time your 40. Hire a U of I or Coe player to help you fix that serve-kick. You will be glad you did.

 

[equinox]

Kevhen you have a fantastic flawless service action.

Have you consider entering any futures?

I really beleive you'd have a shot passing the qualies with that monster serve.

 

[VGP]

Kevhen you have a fantastic flawless service action.

Have you consider entering any futures?

I really beleive you'd have a shot passing the qualies with that monster serve.

You're not serious are you? (No offense meant to Kevhen)

 

[equinox]

You're not serious are you? (No offense meant to Kevhen)

Yes, i've seen a SA 45 vet lose 6-0 6-0 twice in qualies. That's the kind off no hoper player one can encounter in qualies, then he has a chance.

Kevhen has a monster serve and better movement than a vet. so anything is possible.

I even joked/considered entering satellite qualies with a mate when i was younger.

 

[kevhen]

I am only holding 50% against 4.5/5.0 college types. Need lethal groundstrokes or volley to back it up. It's too hard to try to ace every serve.

 

[FiveO]

I can't get the videos to play.

Can someone provide a step by step.

 

[Matthew]

I haven't taken the time to read all the replies so I dunno if anyone suggest this or not, but you are entering the court with the wrong foot it looks like and turning your hips too much. Your back foot should enter the court behind your front foot, that way you'll be getting more of your body into the shot and not just a bunch of rotation.

It also looks like you are practically standing on one foot to serve... Instead of picking your back foot up and swinging it around in the air, try sliding it forward and having the front foot stay planted, bringing the back foot next the front foot.

 

[Prince_of_Tennis]

Cool Videos.

 

[Jay27]

First of all, stepping into the serve does not generate more power (Tennis channel--Nov 23, 2005). Second of all, your serve is far from perfect. You have no set to launch no coil, and no pronation. I would also like to place a wager that you can't hit 110 mph. If you can, then that's great. But, just think if you did it more correctly. You could certainly achieve more. I think you need to focus on the the point to point method of serving (since you're already moving your back leg). Learn to pronate when you go up after the ball (That, my friend, is where you're power will be generated--so long as you have a good toss and the rest of your serve is correct. I do applaud you on getting good at doing it in an awkward and more incorrect style, but the bad part is that you won't improve to your maximum potential. If you watch the pros, you'll see that they all have different styles, but they all achieve the set to launch position, they all go up after the ball (as if throwing a baseball into the air), and they pronate once they strike the ball. Once you accomplish those things, then I think you'll be able to hit the 115 to 120 bomb you were thinking you could hit. I hope this doesn't offend you...I'm only trying to help you out a little. When I saw your videos, I wasn't impressed. In fact, they would be the videos I would show amateur players and explain that this is not what to do. Have a good day!

 

[JaisBane]

I have them on quicktime but they took up 15 megs of space for a one minute video. Is there a place that will host large files like that for free?

Use rapidshare.de or megaupload

One other thing, doesn't it look like I hit down on the ball or at the first least, out on the ball? I think others have said that you have to hit up on the ball, but for me that is only true on kick serves.

I'd need to see the position of the racket at contact to say for sure, but most likely your wrist is bent enough so that your racket face is vertical. One thing that I can say for certain is that you have a significant amount of over-rotation and you don't achieve the full racket drop position. While this would normally cause a loss in power, if you can hit 115mph then your jack-knife method is obviously making up for that. What I would worry about, though, is accuracy, disguise, and recovery time. You look unbalanced with your weight moving to the right and your right leg crosses over your left as you recover. A good returner would pick-up on this and start hitting wide to your forehand side. Your toss also varies drastically when hitting wide and down the middle making it fairly easy to read. Your serve looks far stronger than the avg 4.0, though.

Do you have any videos of your second serve and slice? I'd like to see how effectively you can hit topspin with that motion and how your slice serve differs from your flat and topspin serves. As for your footwork, it looks like Safin's Jumping Backhand to me. The difference is that over-rotation can work to your advantage on the 2hander, but it's usually a negative when serving.

 

[KickServer]

It looks like you're serving to the wrong side of the court in half the videos, but it just may just be me. Those serves were so fast I couldn't really see the ball.

 

[kevhen]

I am on the deuce side serving to the deuce side. I am sure I could add more pace with better technique, but at this point would need to take a couple steps backward in order to maybe someday go forward and am not willing to do that until my serve becomes a weakness.

I do notice the university guys get more and later hip rotation from a platform stance which adds to their pop on the serve. I have seen them clocked at about 115mph. I was accurately clocked at 110mph. I am 6'4 so the height helps with being able to hit down on the ball and extra arm whip leverage.

If other 4.0s have videos of their serves, I would love to see them. I can shoot some video of my kick and slice when I get some free time. I think my kick suffers due to lack of balance with my leg kick. I could work on changing my kick to use a platform stance for more stability and control since I don't need as much power when hitting the kicker. My slice is very similar to my flat but use eastern backhand instead of eastern forehand and chop through the ball a little bit more.

 

[vin]

If other 4.0s have videos of their serves, I would love to see them.

Well, I'm technically still a 3.5 according to the USTA computer, but I consider myself more of a 4.0.

If you go to the 5th post in this thread on the TennisPlayer board, there's 3 quicktime video attachments of my serve from when I was working on it over the summer.
http://www.tennisplayer.net/bulletin/showthread.php?t=268

If you read through the thread, you may pick up a few good tips I got from some people. You over rotate even more than I do, which has been a problem for me, so maybe some of them will be applicable. If you're a member of TennisPlayer, read the Your Strokes article John did on my serve. It focuses mostly on balance and over rotation.

 

[kevhen]

I tried last night to use a platform stance when hitting topspin serves but I couldn't hit with much power this way. It was easier for balance but just felt limiting. I don't think using pinpoint will help either since balance isn't a problem for me with my one foot style of serve. It would take alot of work to redo my serve and get the proper timing and technique down. Right now it's still my strength and a couple levels ahead of my groundstrokes so I will leave it alone.

I did hit some slice serves from outwide in the deuce court and got one to land in the box and then it took it's second bounce on the court next to mine just inside the singles court in the corner. My opponents usually do have to have one foot in the next court's doubles alley when returning these and I measured the distance between courts and there is like 10-11' between doubles alleys so the ball moved about 20' to the left and about 20' ahead after the bounce. How much movement do the rest of you get on your slice serve. This is a fast surface where the ball skips ahead farther. On a slower surface I think I can get the ball to go even wider. Alot of my wide slice serves were actually hitting the back netting before the second bounce, but that doesn't happen on slower hard court, not even when going up the T.

I will videotape some of these slicers if anyone is interested in seeing them.