Wet-weather backup for natural gut?

[Contrapuntal]

This time next week I'll have my first NG/Poly hybrid to play with (hurrah!), and I'm thinking I should set up a backup racquet I can use when it's wet. I play on outdoor 'synthetic grass' (carpet + sand), and unless it's really pouring down it's usually game on.

I gather nothing really has the 'feel' of natural gut, but is there something that won't require too much stroke adjustment if I have to switch over mid-set?

I did read one person's take on it in the gut/poly hybrid thread, but there wasn't really any conversation or follow up. He just said he uses a thicker, lower tension synthetic gut in the mains, with the same poly in the crosses that he uses with NG.

Would that play similarly enough? Would synthetic gut mains be worn away quickly by poly crosses? Is there a better (and still elbow-friendly) alternative?

It'd be great to hear what any of you have tried, what was or wasn't effective, and if there's any kind of science to it.

 

[chrisb]

This time next week I'll have my first NG/Poly hybrid to play with (hurrah!), and I'm thinking I should set up a backup racquet I can use when it's wet. I play on outdoor 'synthetic grass' (carpet + sand), and unless it's really pouring down it's usually game on.

I gather nothing really has the 'feel' of natural gut, but is there something that won't require too much stroke adjustment if I have to switch over mid-set?

I did read one person's take on it in the gut/poly hybrid thread, but there wasn't really any conversation or follow up. He just said he uses a thicker, lower tension synthetic gut in the mains, with the same poly in the crosses that he uses with NG.

Would that play similarly enough? Would synthetic gut mains be worn away quickly by poly crosses? Is there a better (and still elbow-friendly) alternative?

It'd be great to hear what any of you have tried, what was or wasn't effective, and if there's any kind of science to it.

I use gosen sheep 17 and prince syn with duraflex 17 in crosses lasts just fine. I usually restring after 10 to 15 hrs with that combo due to tension loss 50/52 to start

 

[fuzz nation]

I haven't sampled natural gut myself, but I am experimenting right now with a hybrid of 17 ga. syn. gut mains and 1.25mm poly crosses tensioned at 55 M/45 X. This seemed to be worth a try, since I've always liked a full bed of 17 ga. syn. gut, but wondered whether swapping in a poly cross at lower tension could make it easier for the mains to slide against them compared with syn. gut crosses. These strings are Kirschbaum standard syn. gut and Isospeed Baseline poly.

Although a full bed of syn. gut might give me slightly better feel, this hybrid with the soft mains hasn't been half bad in terms of feel and it also seems to give me a mild boost in spin potential and control. I've also recently tried the reverse layout with 1.20mm poly mains and 16 ga. syn. gut crosses - even with everything tensioned at 48 lbs., I wasn't wild about the feel with that setup. The hybrid with the syn. gut in the mains definitely feels better for me.

It doesn't look as though the poly crosses are chewing through the syn. gut mains too fast - no signs of significant notching. I'm not tracking the hours of use on these hybrids, but they don't appear to be wearing any more quickly than a full bed of syn. gut.

While I might use a heavier 16 ga. syn. gut when it's hot in the middle of the summer, that thicker string doesn't give me as much of the feel that I generally like compared with a 17 ga. option. If you want a synthetic alternative to your gut hybrid, you might like the feel of the lighter gauge syn. gut, but maybe not. Feel is tough to nail down from one player to the next. You might also prefer the feel of a synthetic hybrid using multi mains and poly crosses, but I don't really use multis and haven't tried this layout.

I remember somebody here commenting a while ago about his method for preserving natural gut in damp conditions. I'm pretty sure this guy asserted that it's important to treat these strings after play in wet weather to prevent them from drying out and getting brittle. He said that he would rub a little baby oil or something like that on his strings and wipe off the excess after use. No idea if this is a trick that many gut players use with their strings. I've also read here lately from our pals that the coated natural gut available these days is much less affected by dampness.

 

[esgee48]

Try ZX in the mains with a poly cross. ZX is only ~15-20# more in stiffness even after stretching like mad. It is softer than Xcel and its like. You cannot do ZX above 60#, but if you're playing in damp/wet conditions, you probably do not need tensions that high. The ZX will outlast the poly. You other choice is to use a thicker SG like 16 Ga full bed as FN above stated.

 

[neverstopplaying]

I play moslty with gut/poly hybrid, but on wetter days on clay is use poly/Gosen 16ga. syn gut. I find that syn gut or multi in mains only lasts a few hours at best.

For similar comfort and plyability to the gut poly hybrid, I've Genesis Hexonic or Volkl Cyclone work well for me.

 

[Nostradamus]

This time next week I'll have my first NG/Poly hybrid to play with (hurrah!), and I'm thinking I should set up a backup racquet I can use when it's wet. I play on outdoor 'synthetic grass' (carpet + sand), and unless it's really pouring down it's usually game on.

I gather nothing really has the 'feel' of natural gut, but is there something that won't require too much stroke adjustment if I have to switch over mid-set?

I did read one person's take on it in the gut/poly hybrid thread, but there wasn't really any conversation or follow up. He just said he uses a thicker, lower tension synthetic gut in the mains, with the same poly in the crosses that he uses with NG.

Would that play similarly enough? Would synthetic gut mains be worn away quickly by poly crosses? Is there a better (and still elbow-friendly) alternative?

It'd be great to hear what any of you have tried, what was or wasn't effective, and if there's any kind of science to it.

What really happens if it starts to rain and you are using natural gut ?? and you have to play thru the rain

 

[geubes]

I too am trying to find a similar setup, I have gut/poly for the dry and have been playing with syn-gut/poly for the wet and rain.

Using Signum Pro Ultra Power SF and Yonex PTP at 54/50. Probably lasts half the time the nat-gut/poly setup does. Plays very similar to natgut/poly, a little more muted and with a little less zip on the ball. The mains notch pretty quick and the best performance is the first 3 hours, after that it looses tension quickly but still plays well and mains still move back even once notched.

So this week I have some technifibre HDX and Babolat Origin arriving, to see if it gives me anything more / less than the current setup. Not sure which to put in first. If it doesn't work ill happily continue to use Signum Pro/poly as the main for my wet racket.

 

[esgee48]

NG is not water repellent or water resistant. Even though the stuff is coated, water will cause abnormal loss of tension as the gut stretches upon ball impact. If your NG got wet in the old days, that was it. It became spaghetti. Now-a-days, it loses tension much quicker than if it had remained dry. That means loss of control when the strings dry out assuming it has not become unplayable.

 

[rockbox]

I would just find the soft poly like cream to play with and string it low for power and more comfort. It won't have the same feel as gut, but at least you will get the same spin.

 

[Contrapuntal]

Thanks, this is all helpful.

I'm avoiding poly mains for now despite their better durability, but once I'm more confident in my elbow's durability again it might be an option to explore.

ZX sounds interesting, and I've had a read of the other thread on it. It's not available in Australia though, so I'll start with something else first. Do you reckon ZX/Poly is the closest thing to Gut/Poly overall (feel, power, spin etc), or just in terms of softness?

Hearing a few more people using syn/poly it sounds like a reasonable option to start with. Couple more questions:
1) Do you use the same poly cross for syn gut that you use for natural? Or any smooth poly is fine, since it doesn't have to last as long anyway?
2) Do you tension lower for syn gut? If I'm going 54/50 with gut/poly, would 52/48 be roughly equivalent for syn/poly? (setting aside the experiment with much lower crosses that fuzz nation mentioned, something I might need to look into as well!)

 

[esgee48]

I did a ZX/SG combo of 56/56 and the owner has a set of NG/Xcel at 56/56 in his 1st frame. Have not heard back yet. If I see him on the courts, will try to remember to ask.

ZX/poly vs NG/poly SBS/DT depends on the tension. We were shooting for an overall average string stiffness of ~140 with ZX/SG (DT~32?)

 

[Christian Olsson]

I think you should have a look at Origin. According to many the closest thing to gut. Love it myself. Both in hybrid and full bed.


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[Fintft]

Any multi full bed (Right now I have X-One Biphase on a third racquet for rainy days, or serve practice).

 

[bigserving]

Another vote for Babolat Origin. Origin is soft and powerful with good ball pocketing. It maintains it's tension and playability pretty well. It might be a good fit for what you are looking for.

You are right about nothing playing like natural gut.

 

[junior74]

Origin, with a smooth poly cross, or in full bed. Rip Control is a good option, too. Maxim Touch is close to gut feelwise, but can't handle a poly cross.

 

[Contrapuntal]

Well, I've just gone back and read a bunch of threads on Origin, and now I think I'll have to give that a go!

Would it likely last long enough (the 16G) to be worth crossing with Head Hawk (like I'm doing with gut), or would Co-Focus be just about as good? I know durability will vary between individuals... all I have to go by is that I've never broken any of the poly strings I've used.

What tension do you use compared to gut? Most comparisons were with poly, and a bunch of people said they preferred Origin strung a lot higher. On the other hand it's less powerful than gut, so would I want it strung lower? Or... is it better having it a bit less powerful, since it has less spin as well?

Reading about multi/poly hybrids generally, some people suggested having the poly crosses 10lb lower than the mains (like fuzz nation mentioned for his synth/poly hybrid above). Is that what you guys do with Origin? Or should I keep the same 4lb differential I'll have for gut/poly? I know Origin isn't actually a multi, but everyone says it plays like one - makes it hard to know which pieces of collective wisdom cross over and which don't.

 

[chikoo]

What really happens if it starts to rain and you are using natural gut ?? and you have to play thru the rain

You have bigger problems than the gut getting wet

 

[ONgame]

Having to worry about wet weather/humidity is one of the things I don't like about nat gut.
I have one backup strung with multi (NXT control) and it has saved me a couple of times.

 

[Christian Olsson]

Well, I've just gone back and read a bunch of threads on Origin, and now I think I'll have to give that a go!

Would it likely last long enough (the 16G) to be worth crossing with Head Hawk (like I'm doing with gut), or would Co-Focus be just about as good? I know durability will vary between individuals... all I have to go by is that I've never broken any of the poly strings I've used.

What tension do you use compared to gut? Most comparisons were with poly, and a bunch of people said they preferred Origin strung a lot higher. On the other hand it's less powerful than gut, so would I want it strung lower? Or... is it better having it a bit less powerful, since it has less spin as well?

Reading about multi/poly hybrids generally, some people suggested having the poly crosses 10lb lower than the mains (like fuzz nation mentioned for his synth/poly hybrid above). Is that what you guys do with Origin? Or should I keep the same 4lb differential I'll have for gut/poly? I know Origin isn't actually a multi, but everyone says it plays like one - makes it hard to know which pieces of collective wisdom cross over and which don't.

When i had it in hybrid with 4g I had 2 lbs diff. Now I have 3 lbs diff in full bed. It doesn't really play like a multi in my opinion. Although my experience with multi is limited at best. Compared to volkl gripper, origin beats it without trying. Does everything better. Gripper started to fray for me after one session. Only string I really don't like. origin lasts about 15-20 hrs for me before the string breaks bc of notching. Excellent hybrid string IMO.

 

[Crocodile]

Biphase 1.3 is a good back up for gut.

 

[Chipnkick]

Head velocity mains. Slick and maintains tension, cheap enough to warrant use only in wet conditions