Who of the younger generation will win a GS first?
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Cenarius
Guest
Either Chung or Zverev.
clout
Hall of Fame
LOL at most of them being called the "younger generation."
Nishikori is 29...the same age that Federer stopped regularly winning slams at and the same age where both Nadal and Djokovic began initially falling off the cliff
Raonic will turn 28...the age where most begin to show signs of declining
Dimitrov is 27...the same age Pete Sampras last finished in the top 2
Thiem will turn 25...Nadal and Borg had already won 10 slams, while Fed had 9. In other words, if Thiem is really that good he should be on or near the top right now
The last time I considered any of Dimitrov, Raonic and Nishikori "young players" was around 2013/14 and even then they were already in the mid 20's, an age where they should've been near the top at the very least. All of them will be at least 28 by next year, which is the age where most tennis players (including the GOATs such as Fed, Rafa, etc.) begin to start going down, NOT up. I also mentioned Thiem's situation above.
As for the actual "younger guys" they still have a chance to be good. I don't think Kyrgios will consistently win due to his personal nature, but I think he'll win a slam eventually if he GOATs up through his natural talent for one tournament. Zverev should be the best but his absolute peak imo would be a Becker/Edberg like career (or in other words, Rafa's non-clay career), which I'm sure Sascha would sign up for all day, everyday. I honestly don't expect much from Edmund, and Coric could end up like Ferrer or Chang at best. Chung and the Greek Freak have a ton of potential but they're still ways away from tasting slam success.
Nishikori is 29...the same age that Federer stopped regularly winning slams at and the same age where both Nadal and Djokovic began initially falling off the cliff
Raonic will turn 28...the age where most begin to show signs of declining
Dimitrov is 27...the same age Pete Sampras last finished in the top 2
Thiem will turn 25...Nadal and Borg had already won 10 slams, while Fed had 9. In other words, if Thiem is really that good he should be on or near the top right now
The last time I considered any of Dimitrov, Raonic and Nishikori "young players" was around 2013/14 and even then they were already in the mid 20's, an age where they should've been near the top at the very least. All of them will be at least 28 by next year, which is the age where most tennis players (including the GOATs such as Fed, Rafa, etc.) begin to start going down, NOT up. I also mentioned Thiem's situation above.
As for the actual "younger guys" they still have a chance to be good. I don't think Kyrgios will consistently win due to his personal nature, but I think he'll win a slam eventually if he GOATs up through his natural talent for one tournament. Zverev should be the best but his absolute peak imo would be a Becker/Edberg like career (or in other words, Rafa's non-clay career), which I'm sure Sascha would sign up for all day, everyday. I honestly don't expect much from Edmund, and Coric could end up like Ferrer or Chang at best. Chung and the Greek Freak have a ton of potential but they're still ways away from tasting slam success.
justasport
Professional
Dominic Thiem will win one first at RG
Slightly D1
Professional
This USO, just watch...
Beacon Hill
Hall of Fame
Why are neither Leo or Lenny on the list?
Enceladus
Legend
I would also like to see this match on hard. Maybe we can see it in Toronto.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
What the hell overrating? You are the one underrating Nadal. Nadal has 11 RG titles, Thiem 0.
Nadal was 31 and destroyed Thiem in 3 straigth sets in the RG SF last year. Nadal was 32 this year and destroyed Thiem in 3 straigth sets in the RG final. So I don't get your logic of how Nadal will suddenly lose by just passing from 32 to 33. It's only one year of difference, Nadal will be only 33 not 40. First Thiem needs to win 1 or 2 sets against Nadal at RG and make a competitive match. Then maybe he will be a serious candidate.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
Roddick would do nothing today. He only won 1 GS in the pre-Big 3 era, against Ferrero. Nowadays, he would have no chance to catch a GS.
Decline of form comes really fast in tennis. Yes, Nadal won this year's final in straight sets but in no way he destroyed Thiem in that match. A few bad points here and there and Thiem could win the first set-and who knows what would have happened after that. The second set was also decided by one break. Thiem may find it hard to beat Nadal in RG final but if they meet earlier and Nadal doesn't play well enough then Thiem can definitely beat him.
If you forgot Thiem was destroyed by Djokovic in RG 2016. What happened when they met a year later in RG?
Sport
G.O.A.T.
1. I don't get that logic. Nadal already faced Thiem earlier at RG 2017, in the SF. Yet, the result was the same, Nadal won in 3 straight sets. The same happened this year in 2018. So two consecutive victories in straight sets are by no means coincidence or luck. Thiem has no chance to defeat Nadal at RG 2019 or 2020.
2. Fallacy of bad anallogy. Djokovic has 1 RG and Nadal 11 RG. To compare a player with 11 RG with one who only has 1 RG, is like comparing a lion with a hyena. The lion is a different specie and much stronger than a hyena. Analogously, Nadal is a "different specie" of player and much stronger than Djokovic on clay.
By the way, Djokovic was a shadow of himself in 2017, the worst year of his career. Pretty sure he will defeat Thiem at RG 2019 if they meet.
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Yes as Federer and Serena still going strong at 37 shows, LOL! People need to realize tennis is an older persons game now.
And that came right after 2016, right? Which only proves my point that decline comes fast. We have no idea how Nadal will play in the 2019 clay season.
abmk
Bionic Poster
that's because he had to deal with peak/prime Federer for his entire prime.
Nowadays, he won't have to.
If Roddick hit his prime in 2016, he'd win probably have 2 slams atleast. (would def. be favorite for USO 2016 atleast )
You are just clueless thinking he wouldn't have a chance to win a GS now.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
Wrong. It disproves your point, since Djokovic came back in the 2018 grass season. Djokovic in 2017 was like Nadal in 2015: facing the worst year of his career. With Djokovic back to his level, Thiem has no chance to defeat again Djokovic at RG, let alone Nadal.
Nadal is not that old. He is 32. Decline comes fast at age 37 like Federer, no in Nadal's age. Many players like Ken Rosewall, Bill Tilden, William Larned and Federer have won their GS ater their 35th birthday.
Taking under consideration Nadal destroyed Thiem both at RG 2017 and RG 2018 in straight sets, Thiem will have to wait at elast until 2021 to win RG.
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Sport
G.O.A.T.
Roddick won 0 GS between 2004 and 2009, while he was 22-27. So Federer and Nadal were too much for him. It proves he just took advantage of a weak era in 2003. Nowadays, he would have no chance to win a GS against the Big 3.
abmk
Bionic Poster
Nadal had absolutely nothing to do with Roddick not winning a slam in 2004-09.
Roddick-Nadal only met once in a slam in 2004-09 - USO 2004 - where prime Roddick destroyed baby Nadal.
It was all Federer - peak federer from 2004-07 and prime federer in 2008-09.
While federer is good in 2017-18, it ain't prime Federer. and Roddick would absolutely have his shot vs 2017-2018 Federer.
And obviously Roddick matches up clearly better vs Nadal/Djokovic & even Murray than he does vs Federer.
prime Roddick was certainly better than the Djokovic who showed up in USO 16.
about even with Murray in Wim 16.
And djoko of course was not that relevant in slams from AO 17 to RG 18.
Roddick did not take advantage of anything in 2003 USO.
he beat an in-form Nalbandian in the semi and Ferrero in the final (who had beaten Hewitt and Agassi back to back to get to the final).
Roddick also faced Henman and Ljubicic in earlier rounds - both clearly highly tricky opponents in early rounds.
Get some clue before sprouting BS like Nadal had anything to do with Roddick not winning slams in 2004-09 or that Roddick took adv. of weak era in 03.
I don't see any logic in your words. Nadal already was on a decline in 2015-2016. He came back to form, but he can decline again at any moment. And he didn't look great in RG 2018.
NatF
Bionic Poster
How many times did Nadal beat Roddick in slams during that period?
Federer being too much for him proves he took advantage of a weak era?
You're legit one of the worst posters I've ever come across...
Roddick was not beating 2017 Federer anywhere. 2018 is more realistic but Federer would still have the big mental advantage.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
1. Federer has never been as dominant on grass as Nadal on clay. Yet Federer won his last Wimbledon at age 36, and Nadal is only 32.
2. Nadal destroyed Thiem, his biggest clay rival, both at RG 2017 and RG 2018 in straight sets.
3. The logical conclusion is that there is no reason to suspect Nadal will stop winning RG in 2019 or 2020. After 2020, we will see if he has declined enough to allow Thiem or others to win RG.
abmk
Bionic Poster
we're assuming a prime starting from 2016 for Roddick. So Federer wouldn't have the mental advantage over here.
Also, Roddick would have his shot on the faster AO surface in 2017.
Wim 04 final Roddick rattled peak Federer in 2004. What makes you think he wouldn't do better vs 2017 Wim Federer ?
Roddick in Wim 03 was playing well on grass as well. Only serving went down in the SF vs Federer. But otherwise, 2003 Roddick in general would his shot as well vs 2017 Wim Fed.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
Federer stopped Roddick in 2004-2007, and then Nadal peaked in 2008. So it's not like Roddick would have won GS in 2008-2009 anyway.
Roddick was lucky not to face peak Nadal at Wimbledon. Nadal destroyed peak 25-year-old Roddick in straight sets at Queens 2008.
The same applies to the 2009 AO. Had Roddick faced peak Nadal, he would have no chance.
Nadal's most dominant RG run was in 2008, then he lost in RG 2009. You can never know. Saying Nadal is a lock to win 2 more RG titles is not very logical right now.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
You wanna bet? There is no doubt Nadal will win 2 more RG titles, if not 3.
abmk
Bionic Poster
he came very close to it in Wim 09 ...but then again >>> you have zero clue.
again, load of cr*p. You've already been corrected on this, but still continue the BS ?
prime Roddick vs prime Nadal at Wimbledon would be close.
this one, I'll give you.. Nadal is clearly favored over here.
But then Roddick's 2 best slams are Wim and USO.
He'd have his shot at the USO.
I don't see any Roddick beating 2010 or 2013 USO Nadal. In other years it is a different story.
abmk
Bionic Poster
I'd favour 2010 USO Nadal over any version of Roddick at the USO, but not USO 2013 Nadal.
Nadal's form dipped in the SF/F of USO 2013.
he did just enough vs Gasquet in the semi and was too much under the pump/passive in sets 2 and 3 of the final.
We'll see who is right. I have to be realistic though.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
Del Potro >>>>>>> Roddcik.
At least Del Potro won his GS defeating Fedal like a real man. Roddick just "vultured" 1 GS against Ferrero, in the pre-Big 3 era.
Roddick only won 1 US Open against Ferrero (a clay specialist) and was #1 only 13 weeks in the pre-Fedal era. Those days his maximum rival was Ferrero, the previous #1 from whom he took the #1. Federer won his first Wimbledon but was still a baby on HC.
Meanwhile, the legendary Del Potro utterly destroyed peak Nadal 3-0 at the US Open 2009. Then he beated a healthy 28-year-old Federer in the final. Roddick could only dream of doing that.
Del Potro "almost" beated Federer at the 2012 Olympics on grass (4 hours and a half). Then he defeated peak Djokovic at the 2012 Olympics SF to win the Bronze Medal. Roddick has 0 Olympic Medals.
In 2016, Del Potro defeated Djokovic and Nadal to reach the Olympics final. Subsequently, he won the Silver Medal. Again, Roddick could only dream of doing so.
In 2018, Del Potro defeated Federer in the IW final. How many times has Roddick beated Federer in a final? ZERO.
Roddick has more Masters 1000 than Delpo (4>1). But Roddick just "vultured" in the pre-Fedal era his 3 first Masters 1000, winning all of them on HC against Coria (a clay specialist) and Fish (a nobody). The only one meritory is his 2010 Miami, where he beated Nadal in the SF.
In addition, Olympic Medals >>>>> Masters 1000. Olympic games are played every four years, meaning a player can only participate there 3 or 4 times at most. But a player can participate like 15 or 16 times in a particular Master 1000. It is much more difficult to win an Olympic Medal than a Master 1000. An Olympic Silver Medal (which Del Potro has) is equally relevant as a final at the WTF (which Roddick lacks).
Nadal served really well in USO 2013 though. He was broken just 4 times in the tournament, 3 of them in the final. For sure his game was worse in the final because he played Djokovic. He would feel a lot more confidence if he faced Roddick instead.
Sport
G.O.A.T.
So what is you bet? Nadal winning 0 RG from now?
I have no idea. Right now I don't think too much about RG 2019.
abmk
Bionic Poster
Again, more cluelessness.
Read a bit. I told you before : Roddick beat Nalbandian as well in the semi (+ 2 tricky early round opponnts in Ljubicic and Henman)...if you still call that vulturing, you are beyind an idiot.
Ferrero was playing really well at the USO . that's why he beat Hewitt and Agassi back to back >>> but then again, you don't have a clue.
Ferrero was inconsistent on HC in general, but was getting better on it and could play well on HC , when in form.
Del potro "destroyed" a Nadal who couldn't serve in USO 2009 SF. prime Roddick would've beaten that Nadal convincingly as well. Maybe Nadal would've won a couple more games , but nothing more. (prime versions of either of them would've beaten Nadal in USO 2009 form, even if he were serving better).
Roddick came close to beating Federer in Wim 09 final where he was clearly better than in USO 09 final. If he faced USO 09 final form federer instead, he'd have beaten him.
------------------------
Federer was no baby on HC in 2003. He was just inconsistent.
yeah, Delpo beat 2018 federer in IW final. Did roddick get to face 2018 federer, you fool ?
Re : Masters 1000 : again, if you had a clue , you'd know Roddick beat Federer in Canada 2003 semi (and denied him #1 ranking) and then Nalbandian in the final.
Roddick could only dream of beating Djokovic and Nadal back to back ? LOL. he already did in Dubai 2008. He beat both of them in straight sets. >>> but then you don't have a freakin' clue.
Also Roddick is 5-4 vs Djokovic and 3-5 vs Nadal off clay.
Oh and importantly, Roddick has 5 slams finals overall (including USO 2003 win) to only 1 for Delpo.
And of course Roddick was YE #1 in 2003.
Delpo had potential to be better/greater than Roddick, but injuries cut that short.
So in reality, he isn't.
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Peters
Professional
I still think Zverev has the all round game to win slams, he just needs to go for the kill a hell of a lot more during matches. His game drifts away too often.
I'd put him ahead of Thiem who I find a strange player to watch/evaluate.
As for the rest, Nishikori needs a physical miracle to get deep into a 2nd week of a slam these days. If that miracle occurs then he goes top of the list.
Edmund has a top forehand but I'm not seeing enough improvement on his return of serve, too often he's out of position at the start of the rally and can't utilise his FH. But if he could sharpen up a bit, don't completely rule him out. His trajectory in the rankings is good.
I'd put him ahead of Thiem who I find a strange player to watch/evaluate.
As for the rest, Nishikori needs a physical miracle to get deep into a 2nd week of a slam these days. If that miracle occurs then he goes top of the list.
Edmund has a top forehand but I'm not seeing enough improvement on his return of serve, too often he's out of position at the start of the rally and can't utilise his FH. But if he could sharpen up a bit, don't completely rule him out. His trajectory in the rankings is good.
Jaitock1991
Hall of Fame
Probably someone we don't know the name of yet.
vladap
Professional
seconded
King No1e
G.O.A.T.
ForumMember
Hall of Fame
Current next gen will end up being Lost Gen -2.. next GS from younger generation will be won by someone who is currently 14-15 of age..
hoodjem
G.O.A.T.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
Thiem: what are those several big titles?
Kyrgios: overrated and sucks. Getting trashed by Nishikori on grass sealed it for me.
Chung: incredibly weak serve. Unless he improves that, he won't win a single ATP title, let alone a slam.
Druss
Hall of Fame
OMG Sport, posts like this make you look clueless and a tennis ignoramus. If you wanted to be taken more seriously, I suggest not posting this rubbish.
Do you realise 2004/09 Roddick at Wimbledon was as good (if not a tad better) than any version of Murray there?
Now didn’t Murray win 2 Wimbledon titles, one of which in a p*^s weak draw?
D
Deleted member 307496
Guest
Murray only had to go through Benjamin Becker, Lu, Robredo, Youhzny, Verdasco and Janowicz before getting a dead tired and poorly motivated Djokovic in the final.
So that draw was weak too.
Druss
Hall of Fame
IIRC verdasco and Janowicz were playing quite well that Wimby. The Pole almost did the Baghdatis.
D
Deleted member 307496
Guest
Verdasco was ranked 50 something in the world and Janowicz has done nothing of note since. Biggest opponent Janowicz even beat to get to the SF was Almagro, who was ranked 15th.
Everyone else was unseeded or a journeyman who's done pretty much nothing since.
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