Safin vs Wawrinka - who is the better player?

god mode Safin vs Stanimal...who had the higher peak play?

  • Safin

    Votes: 57 51.4%

  • Wawrinka

    Votes: 54 48.6%
  • Total voters
    111
Druss

Druss

Hall of Fame
Wawrinka and Safin are similar in some ways. Both have incredible high peak levels, high enough to challenge peak/prime Federer, Nadal or Djokovic. Both are unpredictable/inconsistent, beating ATGs to win a slam one tournament, only to lose to challenger level players the next, frustrating as a fan of either. Both have Open Era Top 3 GOAT BHs (1 DHBH/1 SHBH), as well as similar career win/loss %. Both won similar number of ATP titles (15/16), and also made 4 slam finals and winning Davis Cup. Wawrinka won one more slam, but Safin makes it up with 4 more Masters titles, so achievement-wise, it's very similar.

Who has the better:

Serve - Safin
FH - Wawrinka
BH - Safin
Volleys - Safin
Overheads - Safin
Movement/footwork - Wawrinka (clay), Safin (HC), parity (grass)
Mental strength - Wawrinka

Some of their best tournaments:
Safin - A0 '05, Paris Bercy '02 (I think), USO '00, AO '02 (how he lost that final is tennis' biggest mystery) and WTF '04 (lost a tight SF to Fed which included a massive TB - had his chances to close out the 2nd set then it's anyone's guess who'll win in the 3rd - Hewitt would have been toast in the final either way).

Wawa - AO '14, RG '15, MC '14 and AO '13 (had his chances to close it out vs Djoker but choked, could have won the whole thing had he won that match).

Putting bias aside, I have to go with Safin as the greater of the two. Just watch the USO final 2000 how he dismantled Sampras, or any of his GOATing matches and you'll know were i'm coming from.

What are your thoughts?
 
vive le beau jeu !

vive le beau jeu !

Talk Tennis Guru
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ibbi

ibbi

G.O.A.T.
Counting against Safin is the fact he lost a slam final to Johansson, but counting against Stan is that even after finding his best tennis he has still managed to remain the Penfold to Federer's Dangermouse. God mode Safin had no master, while Stanimal never blew an opportunity the way Safin did that year down under. I'd probably give the edge to Safin, just because I think slightly more of 00 Sampras and 05 Federer on those surfaces than I do 14 Nadal and 15/16 Djokovic on those. Plus, I think 2 of Stan's 3 slam wins are slightly, slightly overrated, especially the third one. Where as both of Safin's are god tier legit. That run to the final in 04 too. Holy moly.
 
T

TennisSprout

Rookie
Well, Safin was a threat to everyone including Federer when he was on fire while Wawrinka never ever challenged a peak/prime Federer. Wawrinka might have 3 slams mainly because of his good match up with Djokovic, while Safin won 2 of his majors beating 2 candidates of GOAT.

I vote for Safin, although I will always appreciate Wawrinka's winning over Djokovic at 2015 FO final, which had kept Djokovic from winning a CYGS and kept some of his fanboys at bay.
 
U

User123

Hall of Fame
Bukmeikara said:
Did you watch the match? How exactly did he choke? Why every tight loss has to be considered as a choke?
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Not every tight loss is a choke. But AO 2013 clearly was. Wawrinka was blowing Djokovic off the court in the first set and a half, then when he was 5-3 and 30-0 up in the second set he suddenly became an unforced errors machine. In the fifth set he also was a break up, but lost serve with errors. If Wawrinka had the mentality of RG 2015 or USO 2016 he would have won this match, most likely in straight sets.
 
Druss

Druss

Hall of Fame
J011yroger said:
You should be tried for crimes against humanity for saying Stan had a better forehand than Marat.

Shame.

J
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Lol! It was a tough call that one, but I didn't want to look biased, besides Safin's FH was extremely erratic....those curses in Russian were heard outside the stadiums he played thanks to that FH.
 
H

HuusHould

Hall of Fame
TennisSprout said:
Well, Safin was a threat to everyone including Federer when he was on fire while Wawrinka never ever challenged a peak/prime Federer. Wawrinka might have 3 slams mainly because of his good match up with Djokovic, while Safin won 2 of his majors beating 2 candidates of GOAT.
Click to expand...

I agree with most of this, but think it's a stretch referring to Hewitt as a GOAT candidate!
 
H

HuusHould

Hall of Fame
I'd say Stan's the better player by a whisker when you take into account the mental side of the game along with all round shot capabilities, but I think Marat has the higher peak level, again only just and mainly due to having a bigger serve and being physically stronger.
 
aman92

aman92

Legend
This is an extremely difficult question... Safin peaked at a much earlier stage in his career reaching No 1 at 20, but Wawrinka peaked much later. I guess peak for peak they are pretty much the same, so it all boils down to whether you value the World No. 1 ranking of Safin or the extra slam of Stan. I'll go with the extra slam, hence Wawrinka
 
X

Xavier G

Hall of Fame
Wawrinka has an extra Slam, Safin made no.1 and had possibly an even higher peak level.
Stan has the edge career-wise as he's developed more consistency and can win more. Marat was wildly inconsistent and a bit of a headcase on the court, but was maybe even more dangerous when 'on' than Stan is.
 
heninfan99

heninfan99

Talk Tennis Guru
Safin had the highest peak play I've ever seen but it was only for a match. Yes, the 2000 US Open Final.

They are close but the edge in mental strength is the decider for me and I pick The Stanimal. Let's be real, he sent Djokovic into hiatus and buckled Nadal.
 
mike danny

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Mainad said:
Stan obviously edges Safin in the Slam count but Safin made the semi-finals of all 4 Slams vs 3 for Stan. Also Safin has 5 Masters 1000 titles vs 1 for Stan and was ranked #1 whereas Stan's highest ranking is #3. Overall, I give the edge to Safin.
Click to expand...
Plus, I feel like Safin could beat anybody when playing well. Stan can't beat Federer.
 
MasturB

MasturB

Legend
When both are in the zone I’m hard pressed to pick one. Safin has a better backhand slice than Wawa. Other than that, if they’re in the zone their offensive forehands and backhands can reach god tier.

When Stan is playing well his serve can be just as big as Safin’s was.
 
Mainad

Mainad

Bionic Poster
mike danny said:
Plus, I feel like Safin could beat anybody when playing well. Stan can't beat Federer.
Click to expand...

Stan beat Federer in the quarter-finals of RG in straight sets on his way to winning the title, and also beat him in the final of Monte-Carlo, the same year he won the AO.
 
mike danny

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Mainad said:
Stan did beat Federer in the final of Monte-Carlo, the same year he won the AO, but I take it you mean at the Slams?
Click to expand...
Yes the slams. Mainly the off clay ones, where Fed thrives. I don't see Stan pulling off what Safin did at the 2005 AO.
 
Sport

Sport

G.O.A.T.
mike danny said:
Wawrinka would never come close to world no.1 though. :oops:
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Safin was only 9 weeks as #1. Juan Carlos Ferrero was also 8 weeks as #1 and nobody considers him better than Wawrinka. I'm sorry but 9 weeks as #1 is definetely not as relevant as a Grand Slam. 3>2.
 
Mainad

Mainad

Bionic Poster
mike danny said:
Yes the slams. Mainly the off clay ones, where Fed thrives. I don't see Stan pulling off what Safin did at the 2005 AO.
Click to expand...

I amended my earlier post before you had time to see it because I had forgotten about 2015 RG. I don't think it can be overlooked just because it was on clay as Fed is a very accomplished claycourter as we know.
 
NatF

NatF

Bionic Poster
Mainad said:
I amended my earlier post before you had time to see it because I had forgotten about 2015 RG. I don't think it can be overlooked just because it was on clay as Fed is a very accomplished claycourter as we know.
Click to expand...

Accomplished yes but he was nearly 34.
 
mike danny

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Mainad said:
I amended my earlier post before you had time to see it because I had forgotten about 2015 RG. I don't think it can be overlooked just because it was on clay as Fed is a very accomplished claycourter as we know.
Click to expand...
Accomplished yes. If that win came between 2005-2011, I would view it highly.

But Fed in 2015 was already far past it in BO5 on clay. He had already acquired losses to Tsonga and Gulbis at RG before 2015. So he was beatable by many.
 
tennisaddict

tennisaddict

Bionic Poster
Wawrinka is a Berdych , Tsonga level player who made good of the wonderful opportunities that opened for him .

Let us not make the mistake of comparing him with Safin.

But he can be compared with Andy when it comes to majors
 
mike danny

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Mainad said:
Well, Stan was 30 so that kind of even things out for me and don't forget that being over 30 hasn't stopped Fed from winning Slams!
Click to expand...
It has on clay. That's why Fed is skipping it.

Fed at 30 also had a great RG run. But Stan didn't face that version in 2015.

Let's see how well Stan plays in 2019.
 
NatF

NatF

Bionic Poster
Mainad said:
Well, Stan was 30 so that kind of even things out for me and don't forget that being over 30 hasn't stopped Fed from winning Slams!
Click to expand...

Stan at 30 is quite different to Federer at 34. One was at the zenith of his clay prowess the other was several years past it. On HC and grass I'd agree with you but not on clay.
 
Mainad

Mainad

Bionic Poster
tennisaddict said:
Wawrinka is a Berdych , Tsonga level player who made good of the wonderful opportunities that opened for him .
Click to expand...

Which, by definition, makes him anything but a Berdych-Tsonga like player!

tennisaddict said:
Let us not make the mistake of comparing him with Safin.
Click to expand...

It's perfectly valid to compare them given Stan has won more Slams but, as I said earlier, I give the edge to Safin because of his overall career.

tennisaddict said:
But he can be compared with Andy when it comes to majors
Click to expand...

Of course he can, just like he can with Safin but, again, I give the edge to both because of overall career achievements.
 
mike danny

mike danny

Bionic Poster
tennisaddict said:
Wawrinka is a Berdych , Tsonga level player who made good of the wonderful opportunities that opened for him .

Let us not make the mistake of comparing him with Safin.

But he can be compared with Andy when it comes to majors
Click to expand...
Hmmm, funny since Tsonga had exactly the same opportunity as Stan at 2015 RG, but failed to take it. And now that bothers him.

Even Cilic is a better opportunist than Berdych. Berdych had exactly the same opportunity at 2014 USO, but threw it away.
 
Fabresque

Fabresque

Legend
Safin has a better backhand than Wawrinka? Ok. Wawrinka has a better forehand than Safin? Now this is going too far.

You’re entitled to an opinion but come on, this seems like a complete reversal.
 
D

Deleted member 307496

Guest
2nd Serve Ace said:
I'm being silly, but the year end #1s were Kuerten, Hewitt, Hewitt, Roddick.

All good players, but still!

Sent from my SM-T310 using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
And today we have world beaters like Zverev and Thiem deep within the top 10, lmao!
 
abmk

abmk

Bionic Poster
safin at AO, USO, indoors IMO.
stan at the FO.

not too much to choose b/w them on grass (stan's been more consistent, but he didn't make it to the semi like safin did in 08 , taking out djokovic along the way)
 
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