In praise of Kevlar/ZX hybrid!!!

graycrait

graycrait

Legend
@tomato123,
The PP100P was to me what I call a dead racket. I think if I were younger with big strokes with lots of racket head speed the PP100P would be a great racket strung with poly. I needed some help therefore the Nat Gut/Zyex. I believe it was 58/58. That racquet is now in the classifieds by the guy I traded it to: https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/fs-ft-prince-phantom-100p.612640/

I'm having a lot of fun right now with my 10.6oz low RA Head Graphene XT Extreme Lite. That racket's low flex is something I can live with.
 
2nd Serve Ace

2nd Serve Ace

Hall of Fame
filipegrg said:
I'm interested in test this setup on my new racquet: Head Radical Tour Oversize "Candycane"

The racquet not arrived for me yet, i just hit with this one more than a decade ago, don't remember fully the racquet feeling and power, i just remember that at the time this frame felt very stable... more than anything else that i played at the time... but i don't remember clearly the power level of the frame... i'm returning to Tennis this year, my current level is 4.0 maybe 4.5 maximum.

What string tension you guys can suggest for this setup on my racquet?

I'm a little lost because besides the racquet have a low RA (mid 50's) is a 107sq + tight string pattern.


Many thanks!
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I use a Blade 104, which is a similar size, flex and string pattern.

The thing with OS rackets ime is they lose tension pretty quick, so a good prestretch on the Kev/ZX is a must.

That radical OS does have great stability due to high TW for sure, but it is a hard racket to serve big with. I don't know if that's a critical part of your game or not.

For tension maybe do 64/50 for topspin or 60/54 for flatter hitting. The Kevlar is a very limp string, and it doesn't want to stay in place without some extra tension on it.
 
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tomato123

Professional
Hi @Shroud I chanced upon your youtube video of your hitting session with the Phantom 100 (the one with O ports I think?) - were you using your standard kev/poly setup and weighted up? I've been borderline obsessively fascinated by the Phantom racquets the last few days and I'm curious to know your thoughts on the frame and how you think it would play with Kevlar setup with high SW.
 
Shroud

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
tomato123 said:
Hi @Shroud I chanced upon your youtube video of your hitting session with the Phantom 100 (the one with O ports I think?) - were you using your standard kev/poly setup and weighted up? I've been borderline obsessively fascinated by the Phantom racquets the last few days and I'm curious to know your thoughts on the frame and how you think it would play with Kevlar setup with high SW.
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You poor poor man. My vids are some kind of torture regime.

That was completely stock and was a demo racquet. Even had the 1/4 tiny handle that was tearing up my hand. Strings were multi and prince control sonething or other.

It was a noodle. Not for shroud. Though i could see it being made much better by weight and kevlar. It would still be soft and made even softer by added weight. That would be heaven for some. In that vid the lightness was messing up my stroke so weight would help for sure. Worth a try if you like a softer flex

Also inhave it in my head that oports make the racquet weak and high tension will kill the racquet. But i had a 100l warrior that I strung at 86/86 kev/poly. It survived.

I am not the best player and the smaller number of variables i have to account for the better. So why would i want the strings to move alot which has to vary on every ball? I had the Prince lightening that was awesome but i ditched it because while not oports it had the stupid oval grommets and the string bed was too soft and givy for me.

Anyhow if you like it soft the Phantom is great. My partner who has an Angell love affair seemed to really like one of the phantoms and may switch back to the prince
 
T

tomato123

Professional
I think I read somewhere that the 18 gauge ashaway kevlar doesn't hold tension as well as the 17 or 16? If so, how much of a decline in tension maintenance are we talking with the 18g on a 18x20 midsize frame? Will it lose playability relatively quickly and become like dead poly?
 
Shroud

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
tomato123 said:
I think I read somewhere that the 18 gauge ashaway kevlar doesn't hold tension as well as the 17 or 16? If so, how much of a decline in tension maintenance are we talking with the 18g on a 18x20 midsize frame? Will it lose playability relatively quickly and become like dead poly?
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My 2 cents is that off the stringer all the gauges are pretty much the same. But the 18g gets notched sooner and loses tension as its notched. Since it has less material it happens faster. Dead in terms of poly is jot precise so I am not sure what exactly you mean but I dont think kev ever ends up like poly. Ymmv
 
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tomato123

Professional
Shroud said:
My 2 cents is that off the stringer all the gauges are pretty much the same. But the 18g gets notched sooner and loses tension as its notched. Since it has less material it happens faster. Dead in terms of poly is jot precise so I am not sure what exactly you mean but I dont think kev ever ends up like poly. Ymmv
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Ah, makes sense. I was just curious about the extent the playability gets affected as it loses tension over time, and dead poly was the closest comparison I could think of for point of reference (e.g., decline in feel, control, etc.) Seems like it's a bit different though?
 
OldschoolKIaus

OldschoolKIaus

Hall of Fame
OldschoolKlaus said:
After reading this whole thread, I got curious and ordered at a pack of kev zx for my Duel G 330 :)
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Bwhoa, strung it at 42/48.
Kevlar mains, zx crosses (crossfire ZX package)
Stringing itself is ... different ^^

I tested it in a 3 hours clay practise session.
For the first 20 min, it felt slightly stiff (but already far more comfortable than poly or poly/multi), then settled and for the remaining time it offered me great control and ball pocketing.

As I am new to kevlar, is this normal? Little fraying after 3 hours?
Kevlar mains/zx crosses
New:
https://imgur.com/cCdCBxV
After 3 hours:
https://imgur.com/c6M5Of5
 
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Shroud

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
OldschoolKlaus said:
Bwhoa, strung it at 42/48. Stringing itself is ... different ^^

I tested it in a 3 hours clay practise session.
For the first 20 min, it felt slightly stiff (but already far more comfortable than poly or poly/multi), then settled and for the remaining time it offered me great control and ball pocketing.

As I am new to kevlar, is this normal? Little fraying after 3 hours?
New:
https://imgur.com/cCdCBxV
After 3 hours:
https://imgur.com/c6M5Of5
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Glad you tried it.
Thats a softer kevlar with the blue stripe.

Why higher cross tension? This thread is just the opposite

Also it is super hard to tell from the picts but that wear pattern looks like the kevlar is in the crosses and zx is in the mains? Maybe its just the softer kevlar but thats not a normal wear pattern for me at least
 
OldschoolKIaus

OldschoolKIaus

Hall of Fame
Shroud said:
Glad you tried it.
Thats a softer kevlar with the blue stripe.

Why higher cross tension? This thread is just the opposite

Also it is super hard to tell from the picts but that wear pattern looks like the kevlar is in the crosses and zx is in the mains? Maybe its just the softer kevlar but thats not a normal wear pattern for me at least
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Not the allmighty kevlar everybody is talking about? :-(
It's form the Crossfire ZX package.

I'm not used to prestretch (often recommended), so i figured to go higher at cross and wait for some tension loss. Maybe sounds weird, but works for me with (crazy-stretching-during-stringing) synth gut in crosses ...

Oh, totally forgot to mention it: kevlar mains and zx crosses ^^
 
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Username_

Username_

Hall of Fame
tomato123 said:
I think I read somewhere that the 18 gauge ashaway kevlar doesn't hold tension as well as the 17 or 16? If so, how much of a decline in tension maintenance are we talking with the 18g on a 18x20 midsize frame? Will it lose playability relatively quickly and become like dead poly?
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Shroud said:
My 2 cents is that off the stringer all the gauges are pretty much the same. But the 18g gets notched sooner and loses tension as its notched. Since it has less material it happens faster. Dead in terms of poly is jot precise so I am not sure what exactly you mean but I dont think kev ever ends up like poly. Ymmv
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thicker gauge notches slower

deader/dead kevlar just means lesser/minimal snapback
 
OldschoolKIaus

OldschoolKIaus

Hall of Fame
Update on my kevlar/zx experiment:

After 5h of playing, something magical happend. The stringbed went super butter. Never felt more connected to the ball, control as superb and with great confidence comes great matchplay.
Maybe that's something I could have achieved from the first minute if I prestreched zx the first place ... (interesing point).

Now if this feeling stays for quite some time (15h and more?), I found my perfect string setup.
 
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travlerajm

Talk Tennis Guru
OldschoolKlaus said:
Update on my kevlar/zx experiment:

After 5h of playing, something magical happend. The stringbed went super butter. Never felt more connected to the ball, control as superb and with great confidence comes great matchplay.
Maybe that's something I could have achieved from the first minute if I prestreched zx the first place ... (interesing point).

Now if this feeling stays for quite some time (15h and more?), I found my perfect string setup.
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If you didn't prestretch, the zx will probably continue to lose tension. Lucky for you, the tension hit your sweet zone along the way, but as it continues to drop, it may get too soft before long.
I would suggest prestretching (stretch extra 24" on 20-ft segment) so that tension will be stable, and then drop the reference tension of zx crosses by 15 lbs or so (and adjust from there if needed).
 
OldschoolKIaus

OldschoolKIaus

Hall of Fame
travlerajm said:
If you didn't prestretch, the zx will probably continue to lose tension. Lucky for you, the tension hit your sweet zone along the way, but as it continues to drop, it may get too soft before long.
I would suggest prestretching (stretch extra 24" on 20-ft segment) so that tension will be stable, and then drop the reference tension of zx crosses by 15 lbs or so (and adjust from there if needed).
Click to expand...

Thank you for your input!
 
C

Chas

Rookie
OldschoolKlaus said:
Thank you for your input!
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I get my racquets strung with Kevlar/Zx @ 55/45 with no pre-stretch. I've been doing that for a couple of years. In all cases, the tension drops a bit over the first 2-3 hours of play. After that it stays the same for the rest of the string's life (a month or so of competitive play - longer in the off season). I think that's been verified by others too. Both Kevlar & ZX have a fairly steep initial drop in tension and then fairly unusual tension stability over their life.

My other point is, from my own experience at least, the tension of the Zx cross has little effect on the feel and playability of the stringbed. It's dominated by the Kevlar. So as long as the Kevlar slides smoothly over the Zx it doesn't seem to matter of the Zx is a few pounds lower or higher in tension.

Ymmv, but for me there's no need or benefit to pre-stretching.
 
T

travlerajm

Talk Tennis Guru
Chas said:
I get my racquets strung with Kevlar/Zx @ 55/45 with no pre-stretch. I've been doing that for a couple of years. In all cases, the tension drops a bit over the first 2-3 hours of play. After that it stays the same for the rest of the string's life (a month or so of competitive play - longer in the off season). I think that's been verified by others too. Both Kevlar & ZX have a fairly steep initial drop in tension and then fairly unusual tension stability over their life.

My other point is, from my own experience at least, the tension of the Zx cross has little effect on the feel and playability of the stringbed. It's dominated by the Kevlar. So as long as the Kevlar slides smoothly over the Zx it doesn't seem to matter of the Zx is a few pounds lower or higher in tension.

Ymmv, but for me there's no need or benefit to pre-stretching.
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The other major benefit of prestretching zx is that it becomes much easier and faster to string - no waiting for it to stretch on each pull - so the prestretching actually saves time and effort.
It’s also much less likely to break during the stringing process once it’s prestretched.
 
OldschoolKIaus

OldschoolKIaus

Hall of Fame
Thank you guys for all your input.

I guess I just have to figure what approach works best for me. So far, no-prestretch is very good, but next time I'll will try some prestretching.
 
V

VijayThat

New User
I read the thread and got curious. I've strung up my RF97A at 60/40 pre-stretched and after two practice sessions I really do like it. It sounded too good to be true but it does seem to give me easy spin and then the confidence to unleash some extra power. Really nice connection. I've been dabbling a fair amount with strings but I can see why some people have been staying with this combination. If I still like it after a few matches and I get the stability in performance that's been suggested then I can see myself sticking with it too. Just as well since I bought a reel of each!
 
Shroud

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
VijayThat said:
I read the thread and got curious. I've strung up my RF97A at 60/40 pre-stretched and after two practice sessions I really do like it. It sounded too good to be true but it does seem to give me easy spin and then the confidence to unleash some extra power. Really nice connection. I've been dabbling a fair amount with strings but I can see why some people have been staying with this combination. If I still like it after a few matches and I get the stability in performance that's been suggested then I can see myself sticking with it too. Just as well since I bought a reel of each!
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@USPTARF97 will not approve of that!
 
V

VijayThat

New User
Shroud said:
@USPTARF97 will not approve of that!
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Well I have developed some tendon issues recently but I don't feel like these sessions have really aggravated it. I found it comfortable, and if anything easier on my arm than the soft polys I've been using. I think partly the control is helping me to swing and use the racket weight rather than tensing up. I'll see if that continues ...
 
OldschoolKIaus

OldschoolKIaus

Hall of Fame
Little update:

After quite good results with my first test (no prestretch), I strung my second racquet with kev+/zx. This time, I prestretched both strings and went up with tension up to 48/46.

I played 3h practise on Friday and 2.5h (one single as well as one double match in national ITN amateur league) yesterday. The string setup played a bit stiff for a few minutes on friday and for the remaining time there was a smooth, buttery feel with great control and no sign of tension loss.
 
topspn

topspn

Legend
I have a pack of crossfire zx that’s been laying around for more then a year. It is finally going into either one of my K7s or Pure Storm Tours today @55/45lbs..GULP o_O
 
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tomato123

Professional
I have a set of Monogut ZX Pro that I was planning on using as a cross with Natural gut but I have a couple 16 gauge Ashaway Kevlar packs that I think will put on with the ZX instead when my full poly expires. But with my new frame I've never used Kevlar/ZX yet I'm wondering what tension would be recommended for a 93 sq inch 18x20 frame? (Prince Phantom 93P) I remember travelerajm mentioned somewhere that dense patterns especially need a high tension differential but I'm wondering if 15~20lb differential would suffice. My preferred setup with this racquet so far has been 45lbs full poly. Already dreading the extended stringing time but if it ends up playing well it would definitely be worth it since I'm equally not thrilled about restringing full poly every 2-3 weeks.
 
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topspn

topspn

Legend
So what can I expect in terms of feel from crossfire zx in my K7. I am stringing @55/45 and some of you might say go for more differential but i want to try first. So far from what i read, I expect comfort (I really hope so), good control, great spin potential but what about feel? I am hoping for crisp and a connected feel or am I asking for to much? :D a mushy feel will be very disappointing as i can't stand mushy
 
bkfinch

bkfinch

Semi-Pro
topspn said:
So what can I expect in terms of feel from crossfire zx in my K7. I am stringing @55/45 and some of you might say go for more differential but i want to try first. So far from what i read, I expect comfort (I really hope so), good control, great spin potential but what about feel? I am hoping for crisp and a connected feel or am I asking for to much? :D a mushy feel will be very disappointing as i can't stand mushy
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The mushy experience I referred to in the other thread was when I strung mains/cross in low 40s, after a week it was finished. But Kev/ZX always starts really nice and crisp.

I prefer the deader feel of kev/poly but ball pocketing isn’t as good as with ZX. I think the feel is more if you will like kevlar or not. I think kevlar is great. Careful if you prestretch the ZX on the machine, it has broken on me a few times. Hence why ppl do manual prestretch.

Edit: the hybrid has great comfort, spin potential, control and surprisingly power. Absolutely more powerful than full poly. The feel and touch are probably what would be more divisive.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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D

drak

Hall of Fame
VijayThat said:
Well I have developed some tendon issues recently but I don't feel like these sessions have really aggravated it. I found it comfortable, and if anything easier on my arm than the soft polys I've been using. I think partly the control is helping me to swing and use the racket weight rather than tensing up. I'll see if that continues ...
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Yeah I had some wrist area issues from the Kev/ZX that developed slowly over a few years, also developed some shoulder soreness when I played more than a couple times a week. I recently switched to GUT/POLY at 61/46 and like it a lot, way more comfort, a bit less spin/control (stil good though) but more power with quite a bit more pop on serve and great feel on volleys. Sweetspot also seems significantly larger. What I am amazed at so far is how well it is lasting, already at 10-12 hrs and little sign of wear, I am using 15L Gut with 16 gauge Revolve crosses. Likely will restring the revolve crosses after next hit. BTW I usually got about 20-25 hrs of good playability from the Kev/ZX, there was a good bit of movement in my 98S so the Kev would fray and break. I am surprised how little movement there is in the Gut/Poly even in the 98S, this is likely really helping the gut last and the consistency of playability has been excellent, but Revolve is usually good for 12-15 hours of consistent play so I'll just restring the crosses soon. My wrist and shoulder feel great with the Gut mains.
 
A

ashridge

Semi-Pro
I'm going on 16 hours now with 15l Tonic mains x Outlast 17 poly crosses at 60x45 in a Prince Graphite II with a pretty open 14x18 pattern. I hit a good amount of spin, and so far I have been very impressed with the durability of the Gut mains. They are fraying some in the sweet spot, but not terrible, and notching isn't bad. I think they may last a while yet. As you noticed, the mains always snap back to straight. Spin is very good. Looking forward to trying a Gut/poly hybrid set-up in what is currently my main racquet, a Volkl VS8 with 16x18, tighter pattern. I'd imagine the Gut mains will last even longer in that racquet. I have re-strung the Outlast crosses once, by the way. Stringbed was starting to launch some balls at about the 10-12 hour point. After I put fresh poly crosses in, control returned immediately.

drak said:
Yeah I had some wrist area issues from the Kev/ZX that developed slowly over a few years, also developed some shoulder soreness when I played more than a couple times a week. I recently switched to GUT/POLY at 61/46 and like it a lot, way more comfort, a bit less spin/control (stil good though) but more power with quite a bit more pop on serve and great feel on volleys. Sweetspot also seems significantly larger. What I am amazed at so far is how well it is lasting, already at 10-12 hrs and little sign of wear, I am using 15L Gut with 16 gauge Revolve crosses. Likely will restring the revolve crosses after next hit. BTW I usually got about 20-25 hrs of good playability from the Kev/ZX, there was a good bit of movement in my 98S so the Kev would fray and break. I am surprised how little movement there is in the Gut/Poly even in the 98S, this is likely really helping the gut last and the consistency of playability has been excellent, but Revolve is usually good for 12-15 hours of consistent play so I'll just restring the crosses soon. My wrist and shoulder feel great with the Gut mains.
Click to expand...
 
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tomato123

Professional
Decided to go with 65/40 on my Prince 93P and my guess is that 65 on this frame will be similar to going 70lbs on a 97 or 98 sq inch frame. Right off the stringer I compared racquet lengths with my gut/poly frame and there was no noticeable difference, so even at 25lb differential there was no significant hoop squash, which I like and if this works out, it makes me feel okay about raising the tension more next time. Also confirms travelerajm's assertion that smaller head size frames are more resistant to squashing. And with 16 gauge kevlar and 17 gauge monogut zx, it looks super dense on the 18x20 pattern, so I'm interested to see how it will play. Unfortunately I won't be able to play tennis for a week or so because I'm preparing to move and resting my knees from playing way too much tennis the past few weeks, but will report back once I get back out to the courts.
 
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tomato123

Professional
Played a couple hours from my Thursday night men’s clinic with the Kevlar/zx combo on my prince phantom 93p. With 16 gauge Kevlar and the midsize 18x20 pattern that stringbed is really dense! But the tension differential at 65/40 really came through and the control and spin was excellent. At best I was hitting penetrating and heavy ground strokes with great plowthrough and at worst I was hitting awkwardly high arching balls that still stayed in. Also forgot how much I like hearing the “thwack”sound when I hit with this combo.

Having played with gut/poly for the past couple months and coming back to kev/zx, my biggest takeaway and feeling is that both are spin friendly setups, but gut/poly requires me to close the racquet head a bit to compensate for the higher launch angle and perhaps the kev/zx requires me to open the racquet head a bit more to compensate for the lower launch angle. The latter style of hitting feels easier and more natural to me (maybe bc I have a easternish fh grip) and I think because of this, the kev/zx allows me to get away more with not having optimal footwork or timing on each shot, while the gut/poly performs better and produces some awesome ground strokes when I am on point with my form and footwork. I think it also kind of gives a perspective on what you hope the racquet can do for you and what you need to do on your end with your form and technique.

I’m also happy to know firsthand that string gauge doesn’t seem to affect spin potential as much when you have enough tension differential to produce good snapback, even on a dense racquet like the Prince 93p. I’m interested in taking this idea to the gut/poly setup by doing something like a 15l tonic and a stiff poly at something like 60/45, but I’m wondering if gut/poly is already a slippery setup to begin with,does too much freedom on the mains reach a certain point of diminishing returns or even hurts the stringbed performance? My concern is that the high differential really only serves the Kevlar well to let it move freely while gut/poly at that kind of tension differential will just cause the launch angle to sky rocket and lose control because it is too lively.
 
2nd Serve Ace

2nd Serve Ace

Hall of Fame
I think the differential is mostly about promoting snapback for the Kevlar main, since it's such a limp string, it needs the frame squash to help promote snapback.

If I was doing a gut main again, definitely would do a big time prestretch and get like 10" elongation on a half set. Snapback is very good with gut/poly, so it's all about controlling that high launch!

Sent from my SM-T560NU using Tapatalk
 
graycrait

graycrait

Legend
I hit again with this 32 yr old who had all the right lessons as a kid, ranked junior, college player, etc. He plays with with 18x20 Head Microgel Rad MP strung with Ash Kev x Zyex at 62/62. This kid likes to say to me, wanna see some spin, "Jeez." I wish he wouldn't do that. Then he laughs when he hits his favorite serve, short in the box, high kicker to the fence. When I say high, I mean well over your head heading off court. I had him try a couple of other rackets and string, but he says, "Can't beat these 18x20 MG Rad MPs with Kevlar." I have half a notion to buy a used one of those rackets string it with gut/poly and give it to him to see what he thinks.
 
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travlerajm

Talk Tennis Guru
kevlar/zx still my gold standard for all-around do-everything stringbed: massive spin, feel, trajectory control, comfort, consistency, longevity of playability, durabilty. Get the tensions right, and nothing beats it.

For singles, my main stick at moment is Yonex Vcore 100 Lite (similar to APD Team), leaded up to 360 SW and shortened to 26.75". Kevlar 16g / ZX Pro black, prestretched 90/47. Probably 40+ hours and going strong.
 
C

comeback

Hall of Fame
drak said:
Yeah I had some wrist area issues from the Kev/ZX that developed slowly over a few years, also developed some shoulder soreness when I played more than a couple times a week. I recently switched to GUT/POLY at 61/46 and like it a lot, way more comfort, a bit less spin/control (stil good though) but more power with quite a bit more pop on serve and great feel on volleys. Sweetspot also seems significantly larger. What I am amazed at so far is how well it is lasting, already at 10-12 hrs and little sign of wear, I am using 15L Gut with 16 gauge Revolve crosses. Likely will restring the revolve crosses after next hit. BTW I usually got about 20-25 hrs of good playability from the Kev/ZX, there was a good bit of movement in my 98S so the Kev would fray and break. I am surprised how little movement there is in the Gut/Poly even in the 98S, this is likely really helping the gut last and the consistency of playability has been excellent, but Revolve is usually good for 12-15 hours of consistent play so I'll just restring the crosses soon. My wrist and shoulder feel great with the Gut mains.
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Hey Drak, just curious, Why not use ZX in the crosses with the NG instead of poly?
 
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drak

Hall of Fame
comeback said:
Hey Drak, just curious, Why not use ZX in the crosses with the NG instead of poly?
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Tried it once - way too springy/powerful, poly does a nice job of taming guts inherent power and a smooth Poly adds very good spin potential, and as I have said it is lasting amazingly well (15L mains) in my 98s spin racket
 
topspn

topspn

Legend
So I finally used the pack of crossfire zx that has been laying around for 1 1/2 years. The kevlar name always made me feel like i’d be crazy to try. I have finally tried it and bought a few more packs. I listened to having a differential tension but couldn’t do some of the crazy differentials of 85/45 and such. I persuaded myself to try 55/45lbs on a K7 and a Beast 98. I normally would string full poly @48-50lbs on those frames. Pretty nice setup actually with comfort and crisp feel. I didn’t think power was that bad but heavy spin was addictive and so much control over launch angle. Just hit a couple of hours so far but looking forward to playing a match today if the freaking rain stops.
 
topspn

topspn

Legend
I also tried same setup 55/45 crossfire zx on a beast 98 yesterday. Similar to K7, played crisp but comfortable. The amount of touch is actually decent and after a bit of playing, handled touch shots well. Some people mentioned that power level goes down with this hybrid but i didn’t necessarily find that to be true. Compared to a decent poly of course, i didn’t sense the drop off and was able to hit big and serve big. And yeah, really enjoyed the kick i got off this string. If it lasts with same playability for 40hrs or so that’s a huge plus.
 
M

marsh

Semi-Pro
Have you modified your K7 at all? I've had a hard time finding the right tension for this hybrid in that racquet.
 
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tennisbike

Professional
travlerajm said:
kevlar/zx still my gold standard for all-around do-everything stringbed: massive spin, feel, trajectory control, comfort, consistency, longevity of playability, durabilty. Get the tensions right, and nothing beats it.

For singles, my main stick at moment is Yonex Vcore 100 Lite (similar to APD Team), leaded up to 360 SW and shortened to 26.75". Kevlar 16g / ZX Pro black, prestretched 90/47. Probably 40+ hours and going strong.
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Hi Travlerajm: Do you use a Stringmeter? I am dying to know what the readings are on your high tension differential setup. I suspect that the actual differential is not as out of the world as you think. My pet theory is that if one is willing to restring the cross string, the cross tension can be used to tune the string bed. Too loose, restring cross tighter. Too stiff, loosen cross by 5 lbs. The result will most likely change the main tension more and just a little or not noticible on the cross tension.
 
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travlerajm

Talk Tennis Guru
tennisbike said:
Hi Travlerajm: Do you use a Stringmeter? I am dying to know what the readings are on your high tension differential setup. I suspect that the actual differential is not as out of the world as you think. My pet theory is that if one is willing to restring the cross string, the cross tension can be used to tune the string bed. Too loose, restring cross tighter. Too stiff, loosen cross by 5 lbs. The result will most likely change the main tension more and just a little or not noticible on the cross tension.
Click to expand...
I don't use a stringmeter. But with kevlar/ZX, you are right that the actual tension differential is not that high after you remove frame from the stringer (because kevlar is 4x stiffer than zx, meaning that 90/40 = [40 + (90 - 40)/(4 + 1)] = 50 lb equivalent). I always max out my kevlar mains at 90 lbs (highest my dropweight goes), then adjust the cross tension to match the pattern density of the frame. On a few occasions, when the tension gets to soft, I place frame back on stringer, unweave crosses, then reweave with same ZX string at higher cross tension. I've found ZX can be re-used over and over again this way. If I don't have enough to finish all the crosses, I just use some saved scraps for the last couple of crosses.
 
T

tennisbike

Professional
As much as you experiment, and I admire you for what you have been doing, I do suggest that you make a small investment on Stringmeter.

Ok, it is time for me to actually start with the Kevlar/ZX trial leaving the string ends unclipped. To allow for retensioning of ZXP, what kind of knot do you use? (I envision a single half hitch with a short piece of scrap string through the loop? Would that hold? ) Or do I use the "shoe lace" knot as Ricardo? suggested once some time ago?
 
T

travlerajm

Talk Tennis Guru
tennisbike said:
As much as you experiment, and I admire you for what you have been doing, I do suggest that you make a small investment on Stringmeter.

Ok, it is time for me to actually start with the Kevlar/ZX trial leaving the string ends unclipped. To allow for retensioning of ZXP, what kind of knot do you use? (I envision a single half hitch with a short piece of scrap string through the loop? Would that hold? ) Or do I use the "shoe lace" knot as Ricardo? suggested once some time ago?
Click to expand...
I don't leave string ends unclipped. I just snip at the knot and don't worry about whether length will be long enough. Easy to just tie off and add a piece to finish up.
 
rockbox

rockbox

Semi-Pro
I finally tried crossfire zx today and really like it. I strung it at 55 in the mains and 53 in the crosses in my pure drive. I really liked it but it was still a little to powerful. I have to play around with the tension a little bit. I really like the comfort and the consistent feel when striking the ball. Personally, its more comfortable than my VS/kirshbaum hybrid setup and definitely more comfortable than cyclone tour.
 
2nd Serve Ace

2nd Serve Ace

Hall of Fame
rockbox said:
I finally tried crossfire zx today and really like it. I strung it at 55 in the mains and 53 in the crosses in my pure drive. I really liked it but it was still a little to powerful. I have to play around with the tension a little bit. I really like the comfort and the consistent feel when striking the ball. Personally, its more comfortable than my VS/kirshbaum hybrid setup and definitely more comfortable than cyclone tour.
Click to expand...
You might also give the zx black color a try in the cross. It's supposed to be a little lower on power.

Have to get a full set of it, though, and cut in half b/c black is not an option with the crossfire hybrid ashaway sells.

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk
 
T

tennisbike

Professional
Finally has something real to share..

Just strung a modded, Prince Triple Threat Bandit OS with Ashaway Crossfire ZX. Main 60 lbs, cross 45 lbs. (Right off the pack w/o pre-stretching)
String meter data:

Main: 30-53-60-60-53-50-45-44|45-50-55-56-65-58-50-30
Cross: 32-35-33-32-32-32-31-31-30-32-31-32-32-32-32-33-32-30-20

Hoop: LxW, (in cm) was 34.6 x 25.9, now off stringer 34.35x26.2

Stringing note:
  1. Kevlar + feels like a thin rope. End already pre-cut to a decent about 30 degree point. On the Bandit threading through last tie-up hole not a problem. The softness makes knot tying nice without the bent section outside the frame while tying poly.
  2. ZX very stiff, probably among the stiffest to weave, but able to slip through grommet holes very nicely, easy to grip/weave with fingers.
  3. Decided to use Alvin's starting knot. Only pulling by hand one side at a time, the knot looks big, loose and untidy. Not wanting to put starting clamp on it, I pulled the first cross and let it be.
  4. Pulling ZX, after initial stretch it seemed to "let go" then tighten up. Once after straightening the string, threading the next cross, the drop weight stays level. It did not seem to creep further. I wonder if I am going to have another big tension lost. I shall find out.
  5. I left the ZX tail unclipped, thinking perhaps I might have to retension it again.
  6. Total mass: 364 gram
  7. Just bouncing a ball, the string bed felt pretty good, whatever that means. Whereas the gut/poly I strung felt a little mushy, this one feels more lively.
For comparison: Prince NXG OS, 60 lbs Ashaway Liberty
Main: 30-41-55-50-53-52-52-47|49-55-55-54-53-55-53-45
Cross: 35-32-34-33-30-32-31-30-32-34-35-35-36-37-35-36-34-34-24

At 15lb reference tension differential, the actual tension differential at the center is actually no greater than 60/60 SG. Now I am curious how 20 or 30 lbs tension different will look.

All the speculation.. I shall have a chance to hit a little today and report back.
 
Shroud

Shroud

G.O.A.T.
tennisbike said:
Finally has something real to share..

Just strung a modded, Prince Triple Threat Bandit OS with Ashaway Crossfire ZX. Main 60 lbs, cross 45 lbs. (Right off the pack w/o pre-stretching)
String meter data:

Main: 30-53-60-60-53-50-45-44|45-50-55-56-65-58-50-30
Cross: 32-35-33-32-32-32-31-31-30-32-31-32-32-32-32-33-32-30-20

Hoop: LxW, (in cm) was 34.6 x 25.9, now off stringer 34.35x26.2

Stringing note:
  1. Kevlar + feels like a thin rope. End already pre-cut to a decent about 30 degree point. On the Bandit threading through last tie-up hole not a problem. The softness makes knot tying nice without the bent section outside the frame while tying poly.
  2. ZX very stiff, probably among the stiffest to weave, but able to slip through grommet holes very nicely, easy to grip/weave with fingers.
  3. Decided to use Alvin's starting knot. Only pulling by hand one side at a time, the knot looks big, loose and untidy. Not wanting to put starting clamp on it, I pulled the first cross and let it be.
  4. Pulling ZX, after initial stretch it seemed to "let go" then tighten up. Once after straightening the string, threading the next cross, the drop weight stays level. It did not seem to creep further. I wonder if I am going to have another big tension lost. I shall find out.
  5. I left the ZX tail unclipped, thinking perhaps I might have to retension it again.
  6. Total mass: 364 gram
  7. Just bouncing a ball, the string bed felt pretty good, whatever that means. Whereas the gut/poly I strung felt a little mushy, this one feels more lively.
For comparison: Prince NXG OS, 60 lbs Ashaway Liberty
Main: 30-41-55-50-53-52-52-47|49-55-55-54-53-55-53-45
Cross: 35-32-34-33-30-32-31-30-32-34-35-35-36-37-35-36-34-34-24

At 15lb reference tension differential, the actual tension differential at the center is actually no greater than 60/60 SG. Now I am curious how 20 or 30 lbs tension different will look.

All the speculation.. I shall have a chance to hit a little today and report back.
Click to expand...

(Right off the pack w/o pre-stretching)
picard-facepalm.jpg
 
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