Mikeler's Multis

mikeler · Aug 28, 2012

Power Player said:
Thanks. I am hoping I can stick with the full poly at 40 because it plays really well and I can get some nice poly reels for good prices. I really love the control I can get with it. I have syn gut at 52 and it is a little trickier to control.

I tried Discho Microfibre at 50, 54, 57 and 60 pounds. It played best at 54, then 57, then 60 and 50 was the worst. I'm still surprised I'm playing with a full multi at that low of a tension but it is working for me with this string.

ahk27 · Aug 28, 2012

mikeler said:
I tried Discho Microfibre at 50, 54, 57 and 60 pounds. It played best at 54, then 57, then 60 and 50 was the worst. I'm still surprised I'm playing with a full multi at that low of a tension but it is working for me with this string.

What racquet do you use with the microfibre?

maggmaster · Aug 28, 2012

Pro Kennex 7G

mikeler · Aug 28, 2012

maggmaster said:
Pro Kennex 7G

This is correct. I do use Head bumper guard tape and Yonex Supergrap overgrip but otherwise the racket is in stock form.

Woolybugger · Aug 28, 2012

Mikeler, love this thread and I've come back to it many times for the reviews. You put us on to Discho microfiber and my kid loves it. He's still trying to decide between Xcel, NXT, Premier LT and Microfiber, both 16 and 17 gauge. He plays a power baseline game, moderate spin and breaks strings in about 10 days (18 hours).

mikeler · Aug 28, 2012

Woolybugger said:
Mikeler, love this thread and I've come back to it many times for the reviews. You put us on to Discho microfiber and my kid loves it. He's still trying to decide between Xcel, NXT, Premier LT and Microfiber, both 16 and 17 gauge. He plays a power baseline game, moderate spin and breaks strings in about 10 days (18 hours).

Tell the kid he has to spring for the difference in $$$ if he chooses Xcel, NXT or Premier LT. :twisted:

Power Player · Aug 28, 2012

mikeler said:
I tried Discho Microfibre at 50, 54, 57 and 60 pounds. It played best at 54, then 57, then 60 and 50 was the worst. I'm still surprised I'm playing with a full multi at that low of a tension but it is working for me with this string.

54 sounds perfect. My racquet has a lot of flex but it can get boardy if I go past 55#s.

mikeler · Aug 28, 2012

Power Player said:
54 sounds perfect. My racquet has a lot of flex but it can get boardy if I go past 55#s.

What is the stiffness of your frame?

Power Player · Aug 28, 2012

62. I know I have said this about the EXO, but you would probably really dig this one.

mikeler · Aug 28, 2012

Power Player said:
62. I know I have said this about the EXO, but you would probably really dig this one.

That would probably be as low as I'd want to go. The original PST was around that flex.

Power Player · Aug 28, 2012

yeah next time Im up there just grab one from me if you want to try it. I have one with full syn gut..kind of a low tension but you will at least get the idea of how it plays. It is definitely not noodly. Actually I hope you dont like it because your twist serve will be absolutely sick with this thing..lol.

mikeler · Aug 28, 2012

Power Player said:
yeah next time Im up there just grab one from me if you want to try it. I have one with full syn gut..kind of a low tension but you will at least get the idea of how it plays. It is definitely not noodly. Actually I hope you dont like it because your twist serve will be absolutely sick with this thing..lol.

The twist serve is getting harder to hit with age. I'm out for a few days, did something to my lower back last weekend. Maybe I'll see you out there next week sometime.

Power Player · Aug 28, 2012

cool..I have been working on my backhand and have my strings setup again how I like, so maybe you will see an improvement.

Ramon · Aug 28, 2012

mikeler said:
The twist serve is getting harder to hit with age. I'm out for a few days, did something to my lower back last weekend. Maybe I'll see you out there next week sometime.

Take it easy with the twist serve. The twist serve took my shoulder out for 2 months. I came back a few days ago, and I'm still feeling it! I might have to hit dink serves for a while.

mikeler · Aug 28, 2012

Ramon said:
Take it easy with the twist serve. The twist serve took my shoulder out for 2 months. I came back a few days ago, and I'm still feeling it! I might have to hit dink serves for a while.

I know what you mean. The shoulder just is not as loose as in my youth.

SVP · Aug 28, 2012

mikeler said:
The twist serve is getting harder to hit with age. I'm out for a few days, did something to my lower back last weekend. Maybe I'll see you out there next week sometime.

Just got back from vacationing out there in Orlando. Weather is hot and humid but I guess there is something about the area that draws people to it.

Overheadsmash · Aug 28, 2012

mikeler said:
I know what you mean. The shoulder just is not as loose as in my youth.

Don't know how old you are, but I'm 45 and have been playing three years. After 6 months, left knee started getting a little stiff. I started taking a liquid that has glocosamine, condroitin, and some other thing and let me tell you my joints feel great - loose and flexible. Not kidding - no wonder I see it sold all over the place.

Play on Har Tru in summer and soft indoor courts in winter. Just an FYI.

Power Player · Aug 28, 2012

SVP said:
Just got back from vacationing out there in Orlando. Weather is hot and humid but I guess there is something about the area that draws people to it.

You want to come here between oct-may. That is why people live here. It is perfection. The summers here suck and many of us locals escape to the beach or go elsewhere when possible.

mikeler · Aug 29, 2012

SVP said:
Just got back from vacationing out there in Orlando. Weather is hot and humid but I guess there is something about the area that draws people to it.

You can't beat the Southern California climate. I will say that if you are not close to the ocean, everyone there tells you it is a dry heat. Sure you don't sweat as much but the sun beats on you all day long. Here you get a lot of clouds in the summer especially in the afternoon. Like PP said, October through May is why people live here.

The cost of living here is much lower and no state income tax. The tennis scene in Orlando is really good IMHO.

Overheadsmash said:
Don't know how old you are, but I'm 45 and have been playing three years. After 6 months, left knee started getting a little stiff. I started taking a liquid that has glocosamine, condroitin, and some other thing and let me tell you my joints feel great - loose and flexible. Not kidding - no wonder I see it sold all over the place.

Play on Har Tru in summer and soft indoor courts in winter. Just an FYI.

I took that for awhile but I was doing all sorts of other treatment for my Golfer's Elbow so I could not tell how much of a factor it was. Maybe I need to get back on it while I'm not doing anything else to see how well it works on it its own.

Power Player said:
You want to come here between oct-may. That is why people live here. It is perfection. The summers here suck and many of us locals escape to the beach or go elsewhere when possible.

Exactly. I just escaped for 2 weeks to Germany and will head up to Maine in September.

NASA · Aug 29, 2012

SteveI said:
8 Hours is quite fast for me. I break other 17Gs in 15 hours or so.. or they go dead. X-1.. I got about 15 hours, OG 17..about the same. Since in was one string job... not really enough data to conclude that the Rip 17 will not hold up for me. However, many have reported that as you say the "RIP 16 is way more durable than 17". Still at $6.00 a set..worth the effort to try both. Since I string my own.. and like to do a hybrid with syn gut, a string job is appox $4.00. Well worth the effort for a string that works for me.

Thanks again..
Steve

Steve, I wish I could last 15 hours, can you share your set up, including the syng gut you use and crosses or mains? I have gotten different opinions on this as well. Thank you

PrincessAdam · Aug 29, 2012

Have you tried eagnas feeling? I used Babolat addiction in crosses with kirschbaum in mains, but switched to the eagnas string and liked it 10x better.

mikeler · Aug 29, 2012

PrincessAdam said:
Have you tried eagnas feeling? I used Babolat addiction in crosses with kirschbaum in mains, but switched to the eagnas string and liked it 10x better.

I have not, you can check out post #1 in this thread for all the multifilament strings I've tried with links to a review.

Up&comer · Aug 29, 2012

Going to Maine eh? Just be careful. There are two seasons, the winter and the fourth of July.

mikeler · Aug 29, 2012

Up&comer said:
Going to Maine eh? Just be careful. There are two seasons, the winter and the fourth of July.

That's not true I've heard they have 4 seasons like everyone else. Early winter, winter, late winter and next winter!

sphinx780 · Aug 29, 2012

i've heard early winter is quite nice on sunny days, around 2pm.

mikeler · Aug 30, 2012

sphinx780 said:
i've heard early winter is quite nice on sunny days, around 2pm.

I'm banking on it!

KenC · Aug 31, 2012

Hey Mikeler! As you know, I did some damage to my arm and it got me thinking again about strings. My personal holy grail string is Xcel Premium 17 which is very soft, holds tension well, has medium power and spin and lasts at least 6 hours of hard play. I also like NRG2 but the durability is low. X-One feels too stiff in my racquet for some reason. These strings cost me about €25 (~$30) a stringjob. Since I break strings like every other day cost is a factor and I now use XR1 17 which is still rather soft with acceptable playability and durability for almost half the price. I tend to like XR1 because I don't really notice any changes in tension or power until it is just about to break. Its sort of a 'string it and forget about it' string.

I wonder if I can get a softer string that performs better than XR1 for around the same cost or even lower? You have me interested in Discho Microfibre. Do you think the 17g has any noticeable advantages over XR1 17 other than the lower cost? Discho Multifibre vs. XCel 17?

What about Mantis Comfort/Pro's Pro Hitec Multifibre? Will the tension loss drive me crazy? How is durability?

A friend this summer told me it is worth trying out the Pro's Pro Gutex and Kingut, as well as the Hitec Multifibre. The price is great, but I need high performance over the life of the string. What do you think of these compared to XR1 and XCel?

Note that I use the PSLGT which has a tight string pattern that yields a rather stiff stringbed if not strung around 50lbs with a soft string. This is why I prefer 17g strings. I occasionally use my PSTs and use the 16g with them.

Rock on with your playtests!

mikeler · Aug 31, 2012

KenC said:
Hey Mikeler! As you know, I did some damage to my arm and it got me thinking again about strings. My personal holy grail string is Xcel Premium 17 which is very soft, holds tension well, has medium power and spin and lasts at least 6 hours of hard play. I also like NRG2 but the durability is low. X-One feels too stiff in my racquet for some reason. These strings cost me about €25 (~$30) a stringjob. Since I break strings like every other day cost is a factor and I now use XR1 17 which is still rather soft with acceptable playability and durability for almost half the price. I tend to like XR1 because I don't really notice any changes in tension or power until it is just about to break. Its sort of a 'string it and forget about it' string.

I wonder if I can get a softer string that performs better than XR1 for around the same cost or even lower? You have me interested in Discho Microfibre. Do you think the 17g has any noticeable advantages over XR1 17 other than the lower cost? Discho Multifibre vs. XCel 17?

What about Mantis Comfort/Pro's Pro Hitec Multifibre? Will the tension loss drive me crazy? How is durability?

A friend this summer told me it is worth trying out the Pro's Pro Gutex and Kingut, as well as the Hitec Multifibre. The price is great, but I need high performance over the life of the string. What do you think of these compared to XR1 and XCel?

Note that I use the PSLGT which has a tight string pattern that yields a rather stiff stringbed if not strung around 50lbs with a soft string. This is why I prefer 17g strings. I occasionally use my PSTs and use the 16g with them.

Rock on with your playtests!

I only used XR1 in 16g and thought it was rather average. The Mantis Comfort and Hi-Tec Multifibre are not very durable so I would not be concerned about tension loss. The Gutex was pretty nice. The Discho is quite similar to Xcel Premium. Who knows, maybe it is the same string in disguise. I like 16g multis more than 17g multis but I understand why you are using the 17g in that stick.

Ramon · Aug 31, 2012

I think MCS is closer to 17g than 16g, even though it says 16 on the package. I had to adjust my clamps so it wouldn't slip. That's probably one of the reasons it is not so durable.

mikeler · Aug 31, 2012

Ramon said:
I think MCS is closer to 17g than 16g, even though it says 16 on the package. I had to adjust my clamps so it wouldn't slip. That's probably one of the reasons it is not so durable.

Yes, it does run small for a 16g. It also stretches like elongates like crazy when you pull further reducing the gauge.

Ramon · Sep 1, 2012

MCS less than 5 hours

After 4.5 hours of play with Mantis Comfort Synthetic the outer coating has worn off and the string is hanging on by a thread. Just one more well-placed hit, and it's gone. I put the MCS racquet back in my bag and finished my session with Klip Legend, which had 22+ hours on it and 2 months sitting in the closet.

My overall assessment of MCS is still the same. It's a great string for groundstrokes, but I don't care for the soft feeling at the net, and it could use a bit more power for serves and putaways. There was significant string movement after the initial break in period, too.

I just had my grip replaced with Wilson Shock Shield. The combination of MCS, Shock Shield grip, and a Pro Kennex Kinetic frame is like butter. You would need extremely bad form to get tennis elbow with this combination! Too bad the MCS doesn't last long.

Picking up the Klip Legend strung racquet reinforced my thinking that natural gut is the way for me to go. No multifilament I tried can come close to lasting this long and still playing like a fresh set. However, I still need a backup when the weather dictates, and I have plenty of sets of multifilament lying around that I intended to test and/or play, so those will be my backups.

naturallight · Sep 1, 2012

This discho microfibre is a pretty good string, thanks for the tip. Very comfortable. Good power and pretty decent spin.

mikeler · Sep 2, 2012

Ramon said:
After 4.5 hours of play with Mantis Comfort Synthetic the outer coating has worn off and the string is hanging on by a thread. Just one more well-placed hit, and it's gone. I put the MCS racquet back in my bag and finished my session with Klip Legend, which had 22+ hours on it and 2 months sitting in the closet.

My overall assessment of MCS is still the same. It's a great string for groundstrokes, but I don't care for the soft feeling at the net, and it could use a bit more power for serves and putaways. There was significant string movement after the initial break in period, too.

I just had my grip replaced with Wilson Shock Shield. The combination of MCS, Shock Shield grip, and a Pro Kennex Kinetic frame is like butter. You would need extremely bad form to get tennis elbow with this combination! Too bad the MCS doesn't last long.

Picking up the Klip Legend strung racquet reinforced my thinking that natural gut is the way for me to go. No multifilament I tried can come close to lasting this long and still playing like a fresh set. However, I still need a backup when the weather dictates, and I have plenty of sets of multifilament lying around that I intended to test and/or play, so those will be my backups.

So the Shock Shield replacement grip does make a noticeable difference?

naturallight said:
This discho microfibre is a pretty good string, thanks for the tip. Very comfortable. Good power and pretty decent spin.

Glad you are enjoying it.

Nostradamus · Sep 2, 2012

Mike, do you think there is some advantage of using 18 gauge multi strings versus 17 G. obviously durability is an isssue but if you are just cutting it out after 4 hours, that does not matter. I know 18G gives you more feel and spin but it seem like control isn't as good for odd reason ?

mikeler · Sep 2, 2012

Nostradamus said:
Mike, do you think there is some advantage of using 18 gauge multi strings versus 17 G. obviously durability is an isssue but if you are just cutting it out after 4 hours, that does not matter. I know 18G gives you more feel and spin but it seem like control isn't as good for odd reason ?

I don't like thinner multis in general. They always seem springier to me.

Ramon · Sep 2, 2012

mikeler said:
So the Shock Shield replacement grip does make a noticeable difference?

Yes, it seems to do the job. My racquets are noticeably more comfortable with it, but it does have its idiosyncracies. It's as heavy as leather, which I like because I want it to counterbalance my lead tape in the head. It comes on a bit sloppy. Both my grips had blemishes on the sides which affected appearance, but that's only cosmetic, and I use overgrips anyway. It increases grip size by about half a size. By the time I put an overgrip on it, my 4-1/2" grip feels like 4-5/8", but it compresses so it's not like a hard 4-5/8". You lose a little feel, which you always get with something that absorbs vibration, but I played well with it so I won't complain. TW had a good deal on the white color, so I figured I'd try it and get leather if I didn't like it. So far, I think I'll keep it.

Nostradamus · Sep 2, 2012

mikeler said:
I don't like thinner multis in general. They always seem springier to me.

Does springier mean negative ? does it feel like you lose some control with this effect ? i would assume that would mean more power.

Nostradamus · Sep 2, 2012

Mike, What do you think about this NEW string called Xcel blue ? is this same string as Xcel premium ? i don't think it is. It is $1 more than the white Xcel. and babolat claims they improved the durability ? does this mean this blue version plays different too ?

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/Babolat_Xcel_17_String_Blue/descpageACBAB-BXCS17B.html

mikeler · Sep 2, 2012

Nostradamus said:
Does springier mean negative ? does it feel like you lose some control with this effect ? i would assume that would mean more power.

It means less control.

Nostradamus said:
Mike, What do you think about this NEW string called Xcel blue ? is this same string as Xcel premium ? i don't think it is. It is $1 more than the white Xcel. and babolat claims they improved the durability ? does this mean this blue version plays different too ?

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/Babolat_Xcel_17_String_Blue/descpageACBAB-BXCS17B.html

Never heard of it.

mikeler · Sep 2, 2012

Ramon said:
Yes, it seems to do the job. My racquets are noticeably more comfortable with it, but it does have its idiosyncracies. It's as heavy as leather, which I like because I want it to counterbalance my lead tape in the head. It comes on a bit sloppy. Both my grips had blemishes on the sides which affected appearance, but that's only cosmetic, and I use overgrips anyway. It increases grip size by about half a size. By the time I put an overgrip on it, my 4-1/2" grip feels like 4-5/8", but it compresses so it's not like a hard 4-5/8". You lose a little feel, which you always get with something that absorbs vibration, but I played well with it so I won't complain. TW had a good deal on the white color, so I figured I'd try it and get leather if I didn't like it. So far, I think I'll keep it.

Hmm, that may be too thick for my needs.

Nostradamus · Sep 2, 2012

Mike, this may have been discussed already. but the new Babolat Xcel is supposed to be same as Xcel premium of old. but now they say they added the durability to it and now selling it as Xcel. Is this really the same string and play the same ?

http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/Babolat_XCel_17_String_Natural/descpageACBAB-NBXCEL17.html

Deleted member 120290 · Sep 3, 2012

Discho Microfibre vs Gut/Poly

This is for Mikeler, Ramon and anyone else who has used Microfibre (MF) and gut/poly...I recently aggravated my elbow by playing with APDGT (idiotic move.) So now when I play with my MG Rad Pro strung with Tonic/4s my elbow, shoulder and wrists are still sore. I'm wondering if going with full bed MF will be much better for my arm. So going from gut/poly to full bed MF:

1. How much spin will I lose?
2. How much will I benefit in terms of arm comfort?

Also are you guys getting a reel of MF or SP Micronite, or just using sets?

Up&comer · Sep 3, 2012

TenFanLA, you will lose some of the spin, but the comfort will be noticeably better. I don't use the string currently, so maybe others can chip in about reels or sets.

Ramon · Sep 3, 2012

TenFanLA said:
This is for Mikeler, Ramon and anyone else who has used Microfibre (MF) and gut/poly...I recently aggravated my elbow by playing with APDGT (idiotic move.) So now when I play with my MG Rad Pro strung with Tonic/4s my elbow, shoulder and wrists are still sore. I'm wondering if going with full bed MF will be much better for my arm. So going from gut/poly to full bed MF:

1. How much spin will I lose?
2. How much will I benefit in terms of arm comfort?

Also are you guys getting a reel of MF or SP Micronite, or just using sets?

I love how gut/poly plays, but after about 3-4 hours my wrist and hands started feeling a numbness that I recognized before. A soft, full bed multi like Microfibre is much easier on my arm for the entire time I use it (about 10 hours). However, I think I'm switching to full gut while I use a multi or syngut as a backup for bad weather and for casual play. The most durable multis will last me no longer than 10-12 hours before they either break or become less playable. Klip Legend has 23 hours on it and 2 month in the closet and still plays like a champ!

I'll be honest, you will lose a lot of spin coming from gut/poly to Microfibre. You'll lose spin anytime you don't include poly in your stringbed, and Microfibre is not the best multi for spin. PPA has slightly better spin, but it loses its initial comfort after a few hours, so I'd favor Microfibre if arm comfort is important. I also like Kirschbaum Touch Multifibre. I tried it in 16 gauge, but I've heard it still lasts long in 17 gauge, and 17 gauge usually gives you extra bite/spin, so that might be one you can try.

If you don't mind paying for it, full gut will give you a better combination of spin, feel, and dwell time than any multi, and for me the durability and lasting playability makes up for the price. It does have more power, but I've been able to handle it fine. Klip Legend is $27 and passes for me as clearly better than econogut. I'm going to try Pacific Classic at some point to see how it compares.

Deleted member 120290 · Sep 3, 2012

If I could get 23 hrs out of full gut, I'd take that over full multi anyday. However I'm only getting 8-10 hrs from gut/poly (before gut main snaps) so I don't know how many hours that translates into for full gut. Stringing and maintaining full gut is a real PITA. But I guess it could be worth it for arm's sake. Is there much difference between full gut and full multi in terms of spin, or is it negligible?

Ramon · Sep 3, 2012

TenFanLA said:
If I could get 23 hrs out of full gut, I'd take that over full multi anyday. However I'm only getting 8-10 hrs from gut/poly (before gut main snaps) so I don't know how many hours that translates into for full gut. Stringing and maintaining full gut is a real PITA. But I guess it could be worth it for arm's sake. Is there much difference between full gut and full multi in terms of spin, or is it negligible?

Full gut will last longer because it won't have poly crosses sawing through it. How much longer will depend on several factors. I only tried gut/poly with econogut because I was experimenting, and that's a far cry from quality gut. For me, the difference in spin versus synthetic multi is enough to make up for the extra power. You get more dwell time with gut, so you get more time to add spin and more control over the extra power.

You paid a premium for L-Tec, so I'm guessing you can afford to spring for full natural gut one time.

mikeler · Sep 3, 2012

TenFanLA said:
This is for Mikeler, Ramon and anyone else who has used Microfibre (MF) and gut/poly...I recently aggravated my elbow by playing with APDGT (idiotic move.) So now when I play with my MG Rad Pro strung with Tonic/4s my elbow, shoulder and wrists are still sore. I'm wondering if going with full bed MF will be much better for my arm. So going from gut/poly to full bed MF:

1. How much spin will I lose?
2. How much will I benefit in terms of arm comfort?

Also are you guys getting a reel of MF or SP Micronite, or just using sets?

I was playing against a better player today who hits heavy spin with full BHBR. His ball has a little more action but I had a few shots today where I really made him adjust to the ball after it landed. I think poly gives ME only 5% to maybe 10% more spin. I can make up for the spin with more pace on serves and more power when I flatten out shots.

Deleted member 120290 · Sep 3, 2012

Ok, I've just strung up a MG Rad Pro with full Tonic BF 57/57. What a PITA to string and maintain! Hopefully it will be worth the hassle and the $$. I may have to stick with this setup until at least my arm feels better.

Ronaldo · Sep 3, 2012

TenFanLA said:
Ok, I've just strung up a MG Rad Pro with full Tonic BF 57/57. What a PITA to string and maintain! Hopefully it will be worth the hassle and the $$. I may have to stick with this setup until at least my arm feels better.

What is BF??????????

Ramon · Sep 3, 2012

TenFanLA said:
Ok, I've just strung up a MG Rad Pro with full Tonic BF 57/57. What a PITA to string and maintain! Hopefully it will be worth the hassle and the $$. I may have to stick with this setup until at least my arm feels better.

Let us know how it goes with Tonic Ball Feel. The only bad thing I heard about it is that is has the same coating as the new VS, which makes it stiffer than the old VS. I imagine it's still quite playable and arm-friendly. I wonder how the stiffness would compare to Klip Legend or Pacific Classic.

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