building muscle and protein shakes & bars for older guys

[heycal]

Thanks, guys. My testorone levels are not great, but that's nothing new. Been low for many years.

I agree that everyone is different, and I guess it can't hurt for me to try a couple of months of increasing my weight lifting load by 25% more reps as I've been doing for a weeks now (20 twice a week to 25 twice a week), which also means I've been in the gym longer , and increase my protein by 15 or 20 grams a day. It may or may not be enough to see a difference, and if does just make me fatter instead of build more muscle, I can just stop it. So it seems a worthwhile experiment for a couple of month with no real downside. (Assuming the increased weight load doesn't aggaravate injuries, which is always a real possibility in my case.)

 

[onehandbh]

Have you tried black soldier fly larvae for protein?

http://heilufood.com/about-heilu-1/

 

[heycal]

Reporting back after a couple of months... Since I first posted, I've increased my workout load from 20 sets twice a week to 27 sets twice a week. I've tried to add more protein, but only averaging maybe 10 extra grams a day. Injuries aside, something seems to working on some level. While my weight is the same, a friend commented that I somehow look a tad bigger or more fit lately. So my plan is to keep going, but be more diligent about increasing protein to least 20 grams a day instead of 10, mostly through whey protein shakes mixed with low fat milk and canned tuna.

 

[Soul]

Good luck. Hope you make gains in the near future.

What worked for me, going from 150lbs to around 190lbs at one point was, starting at the age of 40, was working out till my muscles gave out (Often times I'd do slow lifting burns), lots of rest, ate healthy and ate frequently, and I sun bathed from time to time. I had read that sunbathing can increase testosterone levels. I'd also read that most gains are made in the summer time, for most.

 

[heycal]

Good luck. Hope you make gains in the near future.
I sun bathed from time to time. I had read that sunbathing can increase testosterone levels. I'd also read that most gains are made in the summer time, for most.

First I'm hearing about the sunbathing and testosterone link, and increased gains in the summer. Interesting.

A general protein question for those here: one frequently reads that the body can't handle more than about 30 grams of a protein at a time. Perhaps the rest just makes you fat or something. Yet the 8 oz chicken breast or 8 oz lean beef I regularly eat for dinner has at 50 or 60 grams, depending on what you read. Plus I'm getting a few more grams from whatever side dishes I may be eating. So my questions are thus:

1) Am I eating too much protein in one shot, at least at the one meal? Particularly given that I only weigh 145 lbs? It's always hard for me to shed the last little bit of love handles/spare tire, which I had always always attributed to a bit too many cheat meals and a fondness for Coca Cola, but maybe it's too much protein causing the problem, or at least contributing to it?

2) Do you guys believe in this "more than 30 grams is too much at once" theory, and if so, how do you avoid it? I know smaller and frequent meals are the general recommendation, but do you all of you follow it for that, and for this reason?

 

[richardc-s]

First I'm hearing about the sunbathing and testosterone link, and increased gains in the summer. Interesting.

A general protein question for those here: one frequently reads that the body can't handle more than about 30 grams of a protein at a time. Perhaps the rest just makes you fat or something. Yet the 8 oz chicken breast or 8 oz lean beef I regularly eat for dinner has at 50 or 60 grams, depending on what you read. Plus I'm getting a few more grams from whatever side dishes I may be eating. So my questions are thus:

1) Am I eating too much protein in one shot, at least at the one meal? Particularly given that I only weigh 145 lbs? It's always hard for me to shed the last little bit of love handles/spare tire, which I had always always attributed to a bit too many cheat meals and a fondness for Coca Cola, but maybe it's too much protein causing the problem, or at least contributing to it?

2) Do you guys believe in this "more than 30 grams is too much at once" theory, and if so, how do you avoid it? I know smaller and frequent meals are the general recommendation, but do you all of you follow it for that, and for this reason?

I personally don't believe in the whole 30g protein thing.

I average 200-225g protein per day as I do a lot of weight training and want to maximise muscle growth. That's normally split between around 4 meals, so an average of 50-60g protein per meal. If I could only absorb 30g per meal that would mean I only get 120g protein per day. I'm currently 240lbs 18% body fat, I doubt I could have put on this much muscle mass eating just 120g protein per day!

Just my opinion/common sense thoughts on the matter.

I'm sure splitting your intake into lots of small meals is beneficial, although I think the main thing is to get the right amount in full stop.

 

[Soul]

First I'm hearing about the sunbathing and testosterone link, and increased gains in the summer. Interesting.

?

Yeah, sun exposure can help raise testosterone levels. There are several articles on this on the net. If you try it, best to not wear sunglasses but instead to wear a hat. The bright light from the sun apparently signals to the brain to increase testosterone levels.

In days before antibiotics, sun exposure was used to help fight infections along with other conditions such as jaundice in babies. It was called heliotherapy. Sun exposure was best known for helping those with TB infections. Sometimes noted of sun exposure for male patients with infections is that many became muscular without working out.

 

[heycal]

Yeah, sun exposure can help raise testosterone levels. There are several articles on this on the net. If you try it, best to not wear sunglasses but instead to wear a hat. The bright light from the sun apparently signals to the brain to increase testosterone levels.

In days before antibiotics, sun exposure was used to help fight infections along with other conditions such as jaundice in babies. It was called heliotherapy. Sun exposure was best known for helping those with TB infections. Sometimes noted of sun exposure for male patients with infections is that many became muscular without working out.

I guess the trick is to hope you get the benefits of sun with getting skin cancer, huh? I have mixed feeling about the sun. I do believe it can help with vitamin D and such, or so I read, and now I'm hearing testosterone too, and a tan can make you look good, but so many warn about the dangers of the sun, not to mention it makes you look older from skin damage, and who wants that?

I personally don't believe in the whole 30g protein thing.

I average 200-225g protein per day as I do a lot of weight training and want to maximise muscle growth. That's normally split between around 4 meals, so an average of 50-60g protein per meal. If I could only absorb 30g per meal that would mean I only get 120g protein per day. I'm currently 240lbs 18% body fat, I doubt I could have put on this much muscle mass eating just 120g protein per day!

Just my opinion/common sense thoughts on the matter.

I'm sure splitting your intake into lots of small meals is beneficial, although I think the main thing is to get the right amount in full stop.

I agree that many smaller meals is better, but who wants to live like that diligently? I don't.

Anyone else routinely take in more than 30 grams in one shot and have zero problems with fat gain?

 

[Ramon]

Anyone else routinely take in more than 30 grams in one shot and have zero problems with fat gain?

I eat 4 meals/day and normally eat between 30-50 grams of protein at each meal. I'm trying to get 180 grams/day. It's not unusual for some elite strength athletes to eat 100 grams of protein in one meal. I've seen and read several articles that debunked the 30 gram limit. You can go on YouTube and find several discussions on the subject. If your concern is whether or not you'll gain fat, the bottom line is you'll gain fat if calories burned is less than calories in.

 

[heycal]

I eat 4 meals/day and normally eat between 30-50 grams of protein at each meal. I'm trying to get 180 grams/day. It's not unusual for some elite strength athletes to eat 100 grams of protein in one meal. I've seen and read several articles that debunked the 30 gram limit. You can go on YouTube and find several discussions on the subject. If your concern is whether or not you'll gain fat, the bottom line is you'll gain fat if calories burned is less than calories in.

I hope that's the bottom line.... How much do you weigh? Remember, I'm a 55 year old semi-lazy 145 lb guy. I obviously can't eat like an elite athlete. But I'll feel better knowing the 30 grams at once thing is a myth, if it is.

I guess if one wants to eat steak and such and not exceed that, you'd need to stick to the 3 oz "size of a deck of cards" serving recommendation. Seems a paltry amount to me.

 

[Ramon]

I hope that's the bottom line.... How much do you weigh? Remember, I'm a 55 year old semi-lazy 145 lb guy. I obviously can't eat like an elite athlete. But I'll feel better knowing the 30 grams at once thing is a myth, if it is.

I guess if one wants to eat steak and such and not exceed that, you'd need to stick to the 3 oz "size of a deck of cards" serving recommendation. Seems a paltry amount to me.

I'm 53 years old, 5'10" tall and weigh 183. The 180 grams/day goal for me is 1 gram per pound of bodyweight. I train 4-5 times/wk, and each session is about 90 minutes of mostly weight training. I don't look like a bodybuilder, but I'm not fat either. I carry more muscle than the average person my size. My PR's are 350 squat, 275 bench, and 425 deadlift. I eat good amount (between 2500-3000 calories/day), but I can do that because of how I train. If I didn't train that way but ate the same, I would be a fat 220 in no time.

 

[Soul]

I guess the trick is to hope you get the benefits of sun with getting skin cancer, huh? I have mixed feeling about the sun. I do believe it can help with vitamin D and such, or so I read, and now I'm hearing testosterone too, and a tan can make you look good, but so many warn about the dangers of the sun, not to mention it makes you look older from skin damage, and who wants that?


I agree that many smaller meals is better, but who wants to live like that diligently? I don't.

Anyone else routinely take in more than 30 grams in one shot and have zero problems with fat gain?

Sounds like your mind if made up, which is fine with me. For me the trick I suppose is to not get to much sun exposure. 10 minutes twice a week is about what I do. It's worked well for me, and hasn't aged my skin. Others I know that do similar look young also. As for cancer, naturally a concern that comes up. Something not other mentioned often is that in studies sun exposure has been found to lower the risk of developing internal cancers. A little on that can be read here:

https://drmalcolmkendrick.org/2018/01/12/what-causes-heart-disease-part-44/

excerpt:

....Enough of the fear of the sun and malignant melanoma. I don’t wish to get dragged any further onto the playing field of the anti-sun brigade. Instead, here is a list of benefits that have been found from increased sun exposure. I am giving you the most positive figures here (these are relative risk reductions).:

• 75% reduction in colorectal cancer
• 50% reduction in breast cancer
• Non-Hodgkin’s lymphoma 20 – 40% reduction
• Prostate cancer 50% reduction
• Bladder cancer 30% reduction
• Metabolic syndrome/type II diabetes 40% reduction
• Alzheimer’s 50% reduction
• Multiple sclerosis 50% reduction
• Psoriasis 60% reduction
• Macular degeneration 7-fold reduction in risk
• Improvement in mood/well-being.6,7

Well, what do you know. If you raise your gaze from malignant melanoma there is a world of benefits associated with greater exposure to the sun. With all these benefits, you would expect to see a real improvement in life expectancy. Does this happen?

Indeed, it does. There have been a series of studies in Denmark and Sweden looking at the benefit of sunshine. One of them, which looked at overall life expectancy, concluded that avoiding the sun was as bad for you as smoking.

‘Non-smokers who avoided sun exposure had a life expectancy similar to smokers in the highest sun exposure group, indicating that avoidance of sun exposure is a risk factor for death of a similar magnitude as smoking. Compared to the highest sun exposure group, life expectancy of avoiders of sun exposure was reduced by 0.6-2.1 years.’’8

This was a twenty-year study. If average life expectancy is around eighty years, we can safely multiply those figures by four, to work out that a decent amount of sun exposure can add somewhere between three, to eight years, to your life expectancy. Let’s call it five.

But it is not just cancer, diabetes and Alzheimer’s that are reduced by sunbathing. Sun exposure is also particularly good for the cardiovascular system, mainly because it increases nitric oxide levels. This, in turn, reduces blood pressure, and the risk of developing blood clots. It also protects the endothelium, and has significant benefits on lowering blood pressure and suchlike9.

Not only that, but lying in the sun is free and enjoyable. So, who could possibly ask for anything more?...

 

[heycal]

For me the trick I suppose is to not get to much sun exposure. 10 minutes twice a week is about what I do. It's worked well for me, and hasn't aged my skin. Others I know that do similar look young also.

10 minutes twice a week?? That sounds like too little sun to me, not too much. I easily get more than that, and I'd think everyone who is not a vampire gets at least that much if not much more. Maybe this is a typo? If not, I'd think it means 98% of the population is already following your program and presumably seeing the same gains as you, even girls!

I'm 53 years old, 5'10" tall and weigh 183. The 180 grams/day goal for me is 1 gram per pound of bodyweight. I train 4-5 times/wk, and each session is about 90 minutes of mostly weight training.

Wow, that is some workout routine. I admire you discipline, and am surprised your body can handle that much at your advanced age.

 

[Soul]

10 minutes twice a week?? That sounds like too little sun to me, not too much. I easily get more than that, and I'd think everyone who is not a vampire gets at least that much if not much more. Maybe this is a typo? If not, I'd think it means 98% of the population is already following your program and presumably seeing the same gains as you, even girls!

heycal

You must be mistaken, I doubt 98% of the population sunbaths 20 to 30 minutes a week.

 

[heycal]

heycal

You must be mistaken, I doubt 98% of the population sunbaths 20 to 30 minutes a week.

Perhaps I should have clarified, or asked you to. Sorry. There's no question in my mind that the vast majority of the population gets 20 minutes of sun exposure a week. But I would agree that a fair number of them don't get that in at least 10 uninterrupted time blocks, but rather pick up a few minutes here and there as they go about their day. So maybe you're saying it's not 20 minutes a week that one needs to reap any benefits, but sustained exposure for at least 10 minutes at time a couple of times a week?

 

[Soul]

It isn't just a matter of being outside. You want to strip down, exposure the chest. Since I live at the beach, that idea as I practiced it was to strip down to a swimsuit.

As mentioned I took the idea from reading I had done about heliotherapy or sun exposure therapy used in the past. It worked for me. As I would joke with others, I lifted, ate well, spent time in the sun, and surprisingly I grew quickly to a decent size.

It's obviously not an idea you are comfortable with, which I'm fine with.

 

[heycal]

As someone who spends far more than 10 minutes at a shot many times a week in the sun, albeit mostly clothed, it would be a stretch to say I'm "uncomfortable" with the idea. If I were a rabid anti-skin cancer type, I wouldn't be doing what I already do. I'm just seeking further information and clarification on it all.

 

[Ramon]

Wow, that is some workout routine. I admire you discipline, and am surprised your body can handle that much at your advanced age.

When you get to be in your 50's, strength is your last bastion of physicality. Speed, quickness, mental alertness, endurance, and stamina will all decline before strength. I figure that if I keep my legs and back strong I'll extend my ability to get around on my own when I get older.

 

[heycal]

I figure that if I keep my legs and back strong I'll extend my ability to get around on my own when I get older.

Well, that's a scary thought! Forget about looking good right now -- we gotta worry about whether we'll be using a walker sooner rather than later. Yikes...

 

[onehandbh]

Well, that's a scary thought! Forget about looking good right now -- we gotta worry about whether we'll be using a walker sooner rather than later. Yikes...

Chuck Norris doesn't need a Walker because he's a Texas Ranger.

 

[Balaji_R]

Not sure if discussed before, is creatine good for tennis players who also go to gym thrice a week to lift weights via compound movements, say push ,pull, leg routine. Creatine is one supplement that works as many say and it cheaper as well. But then some dont recommend it equating it to half steroids and weight gain (through water retention).

 

[Ramon]

Not sure if discussed before, is creatine good for tennis players who also go to gym thrice a week to lift weights via compound movements, say push ,pull, leg routine. Creatine is one supplement that works as many say and it cheaper as well. But then some dont recommend it equating it to half steroids and weight gain (through water retention).

Creatine itself is not bad for tennis players. Creatine gives you more strength and energy, and that is obviously a good thing for tennis players. However, if you focus on weight training more than tennis, that could be detrimental to your tennis. I think that if tennis is your main focus and weight training is looked at as an accessory, you're fine.

 

[Crocodile]

Any older guys here do weight-training and supplement that with either ready-made protein shakes or protein bars? Do they really help build and maintain muscle? At 55 years old, 5'10, and 145 lbs, I'm losing some muscle mass and want to reverse that if possible. In addition to increasing my protein intake from my current average of 100 grams a day through food like canned tuna or whatever, I'm wondering about the pros and cons of these on-the-go shakes and bars, and which ones may be the best. (Not interested in whipping up my own with powder at home, even though I'm sure it's probably a better option.)

I'm no fan of most of these things sold in health food shops in the form of protein powder and shakes.
I'd go with the most natural organic diet you can find and eat that instead and maybe some Iso Whey weight management of something more natural then that.
Find a place that grows stuff organic that had just berm picked off the tree or ripped out of the ground and eat that. Buy fresh fish and salmon and grill it.

 

[heycal]

I'd go with the most natural organic diet you can find and eat that instead and maybe some Iso Whey weight management of something more natural then that.
Find a place that grows stuff organic that had just berm picked off the tree or ripped out of the ground and eat that. Buy fresh fish and salmon and grill it.

I absolutely won't do any of that. I don't doubt it's good for you, but so are many things I don't want to do. I'm willing to make modest adjustments in lifestyle and diet for modest gains, but you'll have to pry the daily 12 oz Coca Cola and weekly donuts out of my cold dead hands.

 

[Hmgraphite1]

I absolutely won't do any of that. I don't doubt it's good for you, but so are many things I don't want to do. I'm willing to make modest adjustments in lifestyle and diet for modest gains, but you'll have to pry the daily 12 oz Coca Cola and weekly donuts out of my cold dead hands.

I'm learning to have just one handful or doritos. A quarter bag probably not that good for me.

 

[heycal]

I'm learning to have just one handful or doritos. A quarter bag probably not that good for me.

I try that too. Just now I stopped after 4 slices of pizza, 3 donuts, and 2 cokes. I could have eaten more, but then, I could have eaten less... (I don't eat like this every night, but maybe 2 nights out of 7.)

Wished you'd brought up Doritos earlier, hermaphrodite1. I would have gotten some of those too if I'd thought of it.

 

[richardc-s]

I try that too. Just now I stopped after 4 slices of pizza, 3 donuts, and 2 cokes. I could have eaten more, but then, I could have eaten less... (I don't eat like this every night, but maybe 2 nights out of 7.)

Wished you'd brought up Doritos earlier, hermaphrodite1. I would have gotten some of those too if I'd thought of it.

I like to go by the 80/20 rule with my eating... 80% is 'good stuff', 20% is whatever I fancy.

So for example I will have scrambled egg for breakfast, tuna and rice for lunch, chicken and potato for dinner, then some ice cream for desert. All in all its a good solid diet but the small amount of 'cheat' food is enough to satisfy me and keep me sane.

The trick (and hard bit) is making sure the bad food is not too big in quantity!

 

[heycal]

Yes, it's a challenge to limit the quantity of bad food. What I'm trying to remember when on the verge of eating too much now is that not only is it fattening, it makes me feel awful for the rest of the night. Sluggish, tired, etc. My body can't handle it as much, and it's just not fun to feel that way for hours afterward. That fifth slice of pizza or the third donut can send you into a unpleasant carb coma for the rest of the night.