Court speed homogenization blah! It's all a myth... here is the proof!
- Thread starter The_Order
- Start date
Purestriker
Legend
They are still slower than the 80’s. Can we just appreciate that both players are lifetime talents.
There you have it... courts were sped up in the Jawkovic era! Take that Fed fans
*disclaimer - this one is almost as delusional as his Roger 2013 > Roger 2004 due to ELO rating vid
beltsman
G.O.A.T.
There you have it... courts were sped up in the Jawkovic era! Take that Fed fans
*disclaimer - this one is almost as delusional as his Roger 2013 > Roger 2004 due to ELO rating vid
So I guess Federer is the more complete player because he won multiple slams in both fast and slow eras (accordingly to this guy)? Whereas fast court specialist Djokovic needed the courts sped up in order to win more? Makes sense to me
ADuck
Legend
Where is this guy getting all his court speed stats
There you have it... courts were sped up in the Jawkovic era! Take that Fed fans
*disclaimer - this one is almost as delusional as his Roger 2013 > Roger 2004 due to ELO rating vid
ForehandCross
G.O.A.T.
I tend to watch lots and lots of highlights. I have always and I mean always felt that early 2000s courts were faster, and it's not the aspect ratio of the videos, it's how the players react to the ball.
Case in point : 2003 USO F, watched an hour of it last week, and it gave me pure Paris Masters feel. It was almost as if balls sped up upon bouncing.
Case in point : 2003 USO F, watched an hour of it last week, and it gave me pure Paris Masters feel. It was almost as if balls sped up upon bouncing.
Roger was better 2014-2018 than 2004-2008. Just by watching him play...so it doesn't surprise me that ELO rating would confirm that
There you have it... courts were sped up in the Jawkovic era! Take that Fed fans
*disclaimer - this one is almost as delusional as his Roger 2013 > Roger 2004 due to ELO rating vid
initialize
Hall of Fame
Didn’t watch the video but that video creator is literally the dumbest tennis “fan” I’ve ever witnessed. Doesn’t he have an account here as well?
ForehandCross
G.O.A.T.
Let alone 2004-08. Watch any of Fraud's 2012 matches against the big 4 and you will see how much more competent he is from the baseline. Even in losing efforts like 2012 AO SF and YEC F he gave better competition from the baseline than what later years Fraud did on his best days. Later year fraud had stronger service game and forecourt presence maybe, but in baseline era that will never bring success.
Even 2017 Nose wasn't playing the suicidal tennis of 2014-16. He went back to being aggressive off of the baseline.
Nadalgaenger
G.O.A.T.
Do I detect a Serbian accent here? Lol
There you have it... courts were sped up in the Jawkovic era! Take that Fed fans
*disclaimer - this one is almost as delusional as his Roger 2013 > Roger 2004 due to ELO rating vid
Seriously though, entertaining and provocative video. Love it!
What stat reflects « court speed » if there is no official data?
Nadalgaenger
G.O.A.T.
Thé eye test is not a stat
ForehandCross
G.O.A.T.
And Milos Raonic is a club player with lesser intellect and insight about court speeds than a YouTube guy
Burguera know less about courts of 90s and 2000s than some rando with a YouTube account
Fraud must be going senile and his 24-25 year worth of experience must be a less worth than a YouTube account.
ForehandCross
G.O.A.T.
You know what ticks me off when people say stuff like this? You folks have been watching the sport for decades. Dedicated hours and hours to watching it.
You don't need numbers to tell you something that is so intuitive. Trust me as someone going into the field of data science, numbers can be impacted by millions of things and be less insightful than even an immature eye test.
I agree, I think 2012er was better than 2004-2009erer too.
I think the main reason is competition increased with the other big 4 and it made Fed improve.
Kralingen
Talk Tennis Guru
LOL this is the guy who made the Federer Djokovic era comparisons and that “Nadal still fails with all the help”
he does more for TTW than any singular poster tbh.
Pointless though, court speed discussions never go anywhere because there’s no definitive data. Why there isn’t real comprehensive CPI and actual speed measurements released by the tour?
he does more for TTW than any singular poster tbh.
Pointless though, court speed discussions never go anywhere because there’s no definitive data. Why there isn’t real comprehensive CPI and actual speed measurements released by the tour?
Clay lover
Legend
I feel that to defend a certain player's achievements we shouldn't play into the logic outlined by his detractors. Saying surfaces haven't slowed down and Djokodal can also do well on faster surfaces is essentially playing into their hands and conceding that faster somehow = more legitimate.
Instead you should question why does it have to be this way? Tennis is a sport that constantly evolves and changes. Why didn't they say anything about the legitimacy of slams when three of the four slams were on grass? Does that somehow make wins on them less legitimate?
Instead you should question why does it have to be this way? Tennis is a sport that constantly evolves and changes. Why didn't they say anything about the legitimacy of slams when three of the four slams were on grass? Does that somehow make wins on them less legitimate?
The_Order
G.O.A.T.
Yeah I've always felt like that data should be available... it's only released sometimes which really confuses me as to why not just release it every time?
PMChambers
Hall of Fame
Did watch but I assume this is about the 2000s v 2010s. The homogenization is about 2000d onwards vs prior. This is due to,
# Slowing Wimbledon from the 90s to 00s
# Removal of carpet. (Esp End Year)
# Removal of wood (Wembly)
# Increase grit in the US.
# Lesser extent US & AO grass to HC 70s & 80s
Some courts have sped up but the peak speed has been lowered. It's just a few fast courts exist and no v.fast exist [wood&carpet]
Poly has changed tennis more than any surface changes, though the effects compound.
# Slowing Wimbledon from the 90s to 00s
# Removal of carpet. (Esp End Year)
# Removal of wood (Wembly)
# Increase grit in the US.
# Lesser extent US & AO grass to HC 70s & 80s
Some courts have sped up but the peak speed has been lowered. It's just a few fast courts exist and no v.fast exist [wood&carpet]
Poly has changed tennis more than any surface changes, though the effects compound.
Silverbullet96
Hall of Fame
Well if he made a video like that then there's no reason to watch any of his Federer related videos.
Born_to_slice
Legend
Ultimate Tennis Statistics
Ultimate Tennis Statistics and Tennis Crystal Ball match prediction and tournament forecasts
www.ultimatetennisstatistics.com
Because probably less then 1% of fans has any interest in court speed data. Though, that in itself may be because data is not presented transparently.
Backspin1183
Talk Tennis Guru
GOATkovic killing Fred fans with logic again! 
The_Order
G.O.A.T.
85% of statistics are made up
The_Order
G.O.A.T.
GOATkovic killing Fred fans with logic again!
Now Fed fans can change it to them speeding up the courts as the reason he stopped winning...
Born_to_slice
Legend
RS
Bionic Poster
Was Murray better in 2012/2013/2015/2016 than Nadal in 2005/2006/2007/2008?
Silverbullet96
Hall of Fame
Can you tell which ones are made up?
Last edited:
Born_to_slice
Legend
Psychopath spared no expanses manufacturing his public image.
slice bh compliment
G.O.A.T.
Lol, yup.
Nikola Tesla says wassup!
slice bh compliment
G.O.A.T.
^“85 percent” of the population knows this^
68% of the population believes it.
Similar threads
