I'm calling it now: Fully fit Del Potro will not be a huge threat to Nadal

[yellowoctopus]

No one today is a huge threat to Nadal.
At least not consistently and predictably. The odd upset can still happen, though.

Agree with this opinion. The downside to Nadal, at his current peak of his career, is there are number of people who could beat him in all surfaces. The chances of these defeats or vulnerability to lower raking players are spread inconsistently through a larger pool than that of Mr. Federer at his peak.

i really am not convinced that Del Potro will be to Nadal what Nadal is to Federer ie his achilles heel.

My point above exactly. Mr. Federer at his peak, only have Nadal to contend with; whereas with Mr. Nadal at his current peak has to deal with a roulette of a larger number of players that can beat him in all the surfaces, including clay. One can also factor in the more frequent injuries of Nadal (more than Mr. Federer at his peak) as part of the roulette analogy.

I'm not sure which is better: more people who can inconsistently beat you, or a single player that has a winning record against you.

We will just let their career records decide that. Meanwhile, I believe both are having a time of their lives. And as a tennis fan, I appreciate both players.

 

[pound cat]

No one has seen DelPotro win a match in a year. He may be a real one slam wonder.

Read some recent articles about him. He doesn't seem too confident.

 

[meg0529]

No one has seen DelPotro win a match in a year. He may be a real one slam wonder.

Read some recent articles about him. He doesn't seem too confident.

Do you blame him? He had a stellar year, and now he's not able to win anything. It's sort of like Rafa's 2008-early 2009 run. Only even while he was in his slump rafa was winning, making semis and what not. So yes his confidence was hurt, but Delpo must be feeling really really down right now. Next year will be a huge test for him, if he can bring himself to bounce back. I don't understand if he's 100% healthy, why he didn't just truck out the rest of the year. So many tourneys he could have played, what's the difference between doing that and practicing on his own at home? This way he might score some wins and build that confidence. It's the only way! I think it was a bad decision to stop till next year. Just my 2 cents.

 

[nguyen320]

well we still got murray...

 

[Chris Rizutto]

Anyone who thinks Del Potro can beat Nadal on clay or grass is kidding themselves. We'll talk when he cane get past to the final of the French or get past the 2nd round of Wimbledon. Del Potro couldn't even beat choking Federer at the French Open.

Can you remove your head from Nadals butt for a minute to absorb this. Federer is one of the top 10 best clay courters of all time. Del Potro will be back.

 

[meg0529]

Can you remove your head from Nadals butt for a minute to absorb this. Federer is one of the top 10 best clay courters of all time. Del Potro will be back.

Yes and Nadal is easily the top 5. The argument is valid, if he can't beat fed on a bad day, he will have trouble beating Nadal.

 

[Chris Rizutto]

Yes and Nadal is easily the top 5. The argument is valid, if he can't beat fed on a bad day, he will have trouble beating Nadal.

Del Potro has nowhere near peaked and he will beat Nadal many times in big matches over his career.

 

[meg0529]

Del Potro has nowhere near peaked and he will beat Nadal many times in big matches over his career.

After reading some of these old threads, I have to say why not! Anything is possible!

 

[nadal_slam_king]

I agree best of 3 wins mean nothing, hence Rafa's Master's wins are meaningless.

Murray is proving this by racking up Masters Shields and losing 6 straight sets to Federer in slams and 6 straight Wimbledon sets to Rafa. So relative to slams this is true, Masters share no correlation.

 

[nadal_slam_king]

Del Potro has nowhere near peaked and he will beat Nadal many times in big matches over his career.

He'd beat 2009 Rafa in big matches, yes.

 

[Omega_7000]

2009 DelPotro will destroy current Nadal on everything except clay! All the *******s better pray that DelPo doesn't regain his 2009 form, or Nadal's time at the top won't last too long...

 

[Talker]

When Del Potro lost to Fed at the FO he was still getting better, he probably could have won that match if not for his fitness. He was very close to being a 2-time slam winner last year while not at his peak.

 

[Mustard]

2009 DelPotro will destroy current Nadal on everything except clay! All the *******s better pray that DelPo doesn't regain his 2009 form, or Nadal's time at the top won't last too long...

Keep dreaming.

 

[Omega_7000]

^^^ LOL Looks like I touched an insecure *******s nerve! :lol:

When Del Potro lost to Fed at the FO he was still getting better, he probably could have won that match if not for his fitness. He was very close to being a 2-time slam winner last year while not at his peak.

True. The best thing about him is that he does not fear Federer or Nadal & lifts his game when he faces these two on the big stages...Goes to show that he is a big occasion player. If he can manage to regain his form, he will be a force to reckon with!

 

[Nadalfan89]

He won a grand slam, in a year where Nadal was injured and Federer had already won everything else he wanted to win, and half assed the final.

Don't forget that mugs like Ferrero and Roddick has slams...

 

[Mustard]

^^^ LOL Looks like I touched an insecure *******s nerve! :lol:

Are you serious? :lol:

I have every confidence that Nadal can overcome any match-up issues he has with del Potro, that is assuming that:

1. Nadal does have a match-up problem with del Potro, which is not at all certain
2. If del Potro can get back to his 2009 form.

 

[Mustard]

Don't forget that mugs like Ferrero and Roddick has slams...

An absolute ridiculous adjective.

 

[Nadalfan89]

An absolute ridiculous statement.

Sorry I offended those all time greats that are Ferrero and Roddick...

 

[Mustard]

Sorry I offended those all time greats that are Ferrero and Roddick...

They've both won a major, which is more than the vast majority of players. Keep things in perspective.

 

[Nadalfan89]

They've both won a major, which is more than the vast majority of players. Keep things in perspective.

Yet they are no match for players like Federer and Nadal, so claiming that because DelPo has a slam, he's somehow a threat to the top players is stupid.

 

[Talker]

True. The best thing about him is that he does not fear Federer or Nadal & lifts his game when he faces these two on the big stages...Goes to show that he is a big occasion player. If he can manage to regain his form, he will be a force to reckon with!

That's one thing I like about Del Potro, he just plays his game and seemingly doesn't seem to care who he's playing or if he's ahead or behind.
Nadal or Fed won't get any free 'choking' points from him.

Most players try all their career to have that kind of mental game.

 

[Messarger]

2009 DelPotro will destroy current Nadal on everything except clay! All the *******s better pray that DelPo doesn't regain his 2009 form, or Nadal's time at the top won't last too long...

With all due respect, i really dont think so, and in fact whatever that you just written was the reason i made this thread.

 

[Messarger]

Surely the fact that Del Potro is 6' 6" is enough proof that he can handle the topspin? The ball is directly in his hit zone as it jump up, making it easier to deal with. He can also hit through Nadal better than most others, making it harder for the Spaniard to employ his defensive skills to win the point.

They said the same thing about Berdych, Soderling, and to a lesser extend Tsonga. The thing is, Nadal on the hardcourts does not rely too much on his defensive skills nowadays to win the point. Like what i said in the first post, i see Nadal making Del Potro hit on the run a lot the next time these two play so that Del Potro would have lesser time to set up and hit his fearsome forehand. Also, Nadal's forehand on the hardcourts is no longer that super top spin thingy that was just waiting to be punish.

 

[nadal_slam_king]

They said the same thing about Berdych, Soderling, and to a lesser extend Tsonga. The thing is, Nadal on the hardcourts does not rely too much on his defensive skills nowadays to win the point. Like what i said in the first post, i see Nadal making Del Potro hit on the run a lot the next time these two play so that Del Potro would have lesser time to set up and hit his fearsome forehand. Also, Nadal's forehand on the hardcourts is no longer that super top spin thingy that was just waiting to be punish.

I agree, Rafa's topspin forehand over the years was fully a topspin shot, whereas this year it's become flatter and especially at the US Open where Rafa the tactician knows that his topspin isn't that much of a weapon on the US Open surface. Rafa 2010 in terms of forehand and serve is a completely different to Rafa 2009.

 

[Cesc Fabregas]

2009 DelPotro will destroy current Nadal on everything except clay! All the *******s better pray that DelPo doesn't regain his 2009 form, or Nadal's time at the top won't last too long...

You think Del Potro would beat Nadal on grass? Haha Del Potro is terrible on grass, he can't get past the 2nd round at Wimbledon.

 

[batz]

An absolute ridiculous adjective.

Absolutely surely?
Sorry for the pedantry, but this recent convention for using absolute when absolutely is meant does my bonce in.

Adjectives modify nouns and pronouns, not other adjectives. Adjectives are modified by adverbs. Ridiculous is an adjective.

 

[Clay lover]

Why sweat? Time will tell.

 

[viduka0101]

2009 DelPotro will destroy current Nadal on everything except clay! All the *******s better pray that DelPo doesn't regain his 2009 form, or Nadal's time at the top won't last too long...

I'm actually ''praying'' that DelPo comes back fully fit as soon as possible
and I can't wait for another match with him and Nadal,I love watching the top players at their best
I think what you were trying to say was:''Me and the rest of the *******s are praying that DelPo comes back fully fit because he's one of the few(3 or 4) players that can trouble a healthy Nadal and I just want Nadal to loose soooooooooooo badly.''

 

[viduka0101]

Sorry I offended those all time greats that are Ferrero and Roddick...

geez you have such high standards,not everyone can be Canada's Davis Cup alternative

 

[nadal_slam_king]

Rafa deserved the chance to face an unfit Del Potro this year, just as Del Potro faced an unfit Rafa last year. I was hoping Del Potro didn't give up in his comeback so soon, was very disappointing.

 

[meg0529]

I'm actually ''praying'' that DelPo comes back fully fit as soon as possible
and I can't wait for another match with him and Nadal,I love watching the top players at their best
I think what you were trying to say was:''Me and the rest of the *******s are praying that DelPo comes back fully fit because he's one of the few(3 or 4) players that can trouble a healthy Nadal and I just want Nadal to loose soooooooooooo badly.''

LOL. Well said.

 

[ChopShot]

They said the same thing about Berdych, Soderling, and to a lesser extend Tsonga. The thing is, Nadal on the hardcourts does not rely too much on his defensive skills nowadays to win the point. Like what i said in the first post, i see Nadal making Del Potro hit on the run a lot the next time these two play so that Del Potro would have lesser time to set up and hit his fearsome forehand. Also, Nadal's forehand on the hardcourts is no longer that super top spin thingy that was just waiting to be punish.

Your point of course conveniently ignores the fact that Del Potro has very little in common with Berdy and Söderling, and even less with Tsonga. Berdych and Söderling both struggle with Rafa because of their absolutely atrocious movement. Not because Rafa's shots bounce out of their strike zone vertically, but laterally. They're just too slow. Tsonga, on the other hand, has an entirely different problem. He's a headcase. The one time he got his act together, he made Rafa look like a bumbling idiot, on slow HC.
Del Po has none of these problems. As stated before, and as proven by his amazing runs last year, he has a fantastic mental game, playing exactly the way he wants regardless of his opponent. Secondly, he moves, and even more importantly, he hits extremely well on the run. That's not saying he'll be Rafa's nemesis and nightmare, but if anyone has half a chance to be to Nadal what Nadal is to Federer, it's Delpo. A healthy one, at that.

 

[ChopShot]

Rafa deserved the chance to face an unfit Del Potro this year, just as Del Potro faced an unfit Rafa last year. I was hoping Del Potro didn't give up in his comeback so soon, was very disappointing.

Listen, if you're going to rail off the same BS about Nadal being injured every time he's lost convincingly, then I guess I'll just claim from here on that all of Federer's losses to Nadal happened because Uncle Toni coached illegally. Face the truth - even a healthy Nadal, with his old HC game, would have recieved an almighty ass-whooping from Delpo on that day.

 

[nadal_slam_king]

Listen, if you're going to rail off the same BS about Nadal being injured every time he's lost convincingly, then I guess I'll just claim from here on that all of Federer's losses to Nadal happened because Uncle Toni coached illegally. Face the truth - even a healthy Nadal, with his old HC game, would have recieved an almighty ass-whooping from Delpo on that day.

Go and argue with Rafa's doctor, you know the one that said after the US Open that Rafa was playing with a 15mm torn stomach muscle. Rafa was losing to everyone in 2009. He was losing to Djokovic too. And in 2008 Rafa beat Djokovic in the Olympics on fast hardcourt. So even younger Rafa was a darn good hardcourt player.

 

[Messarger]

Your point of course conveniently ignores the fact that Del Potro has very little in common with Berdy and Söderling, and even less with Tsonga. Berdych and Söderling both struggle with Rafa because of their absolutely atrocious movement. Not because Rafa's shots bounce out of their strike zone vertically, but laterally. They're just too slow. Tsonga, on the other hand, has an entirely different problem. He's a headcase. The one time he got his act together, he made Rafa look like a bumbling idiot, on slow HC.
Del Po has none of these problems. As stated before, and as proven by his amazing runs last year, he has a fantastic mental game, playing exactly the way he wants regardless of his opponent. Secondly, he moves, and even more importantly, he hits extremely well on the run. That's not saying he'll be Rafa's nemesis and nightmare, but if anyone has half a chance to be to Nadal what Nadal is to Federer, it's Delpo. A healthy one, at that.

With the regards to the comparison with Tsonga, Soderling, Berdych, i was pointing out the fact that they are all tall hitters who are hence able to neutralize Nadal's (excessive) spinny forehand.

As far as Del Potro's mental game is concern, he's still needs to come through tight matches on a more frequent basis. Winning your first major final in 5 sets is an amazing feat, but in tennis it's consistency that really matters. I have no reason to believe that he wont do so in future, but that does not take away the fact that he needs to do it.

As far as movement is concern, watch this. Nadal Del Potro US Open final 1:45 into the clip, i could already give you 5 instances where Del Potro lost his footing when pulled out wide. That's not to say that his movement is terrible or anything, but when he does not have time to set up his shots they are generally hit with less power. I forsee Nadal using this tactic a lot to neutralize Del Potro's big hitting.

I agree that he will give Nadal a tough match. I just cant agree with people saying that he at 100% will "destroy" or "crush" a healthy Nadal.

 

[Messarger]

Go and argue with Rafa's doctor, you know the one that said after the US Open that Rafa was playing with a 15mm torn stomach muscle. Rafa was losing to everyone in 2009. He was losing to Djokovic too. And in 2008 Rafa beat Djokovic in the Olympics on fast hardcourt. So even younger Rafa was a darn good hardcourt player.

Hi nadal_slam_king, let's not go over the whole "Was Nadal injured last year?" thing again. Time will tell if he was really injured when he is able to win more majors at 100%.

 

[abmk]

Rafa deserved the chance to face an unfit Del Potro this year, just as Del Potro faced an unfit Rafa last year. I was hoping Del Potro didn't give up in his comeback so soon, was very disappointing.

yes, rafa's injury , which only disturbed his serving, did not affect his ground game at all vs delpo who was out for nearly 9 months, very comparable ... LOL, heights of desperation ...

abdominal injury or not , delpo would have def nadal that day

 

[ashitaka2010]

Rafa deserved the chance to face an unfit Del Potro this year, just as Del Potro faced an unfit Rafa last year. I was hoping Del Potro didn't give up in his comeback so soon, was very disappointing.

Man, this is pathetic.

Here's a guy who is smiling and satisfied with his tournament
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iex_pUPk3Ac

...and here, a guy who is probably depressed.
http://www.fuebuena.com.ar/?p=10195

Now, as suggested in an other thread, you should think again before posting nonsense. Or at least try to be funny....................(good luck with that)

 

[meg0529]

Man, this is pathetic.

Here's a guy who is smiling and satisfied with his tournament
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iex_pUPk3Ac

...and here, a guy who is probably depressed.
http://www.fuebuena.com.ar/?p=10195

Now, as suggested in an other thread, you should think again before posting nonsense. Or at least try to be funny....................(good luck with that)

Rafa looks SO hot there =D

and yes he looks happy.

 

[Legend of Borg]

They said the same thing about Berdych, Soderling, and to a lesser extend Tsonga. The thing is, Nadal on the hardcourts does not rely too much on his defensive skills nowadays to win the point. Like what i said in the first post, i see Nadal making Del Potro hit on the run a lot the next time these two play so that Del Potro would have lesser time to set up and hit his fearsome forehand. Also, Nadal's forehand on the hardcourts is no longer that super top spin thingy that was just waiting to be punish.

The huge difference between Del Potro and the players you listed is mental fortitude. There's no way to measure how mentally strong a player is, but based on observation I think it's safe to say Del Potro does not crumble easily under pressure. Didn't he DF his way out of the third set during last year's USO, against none other than Federer? Ended up winning the match. I think he's in a completely different category compared to Tsonga, Berdych and Soderling.

 

[Messarger]

The huge difference between Del Potro and the players you listed is mental fortitude. There's no way to measure how mentally strong a player is, but based on observation I think it's safe to say Del Potro does not crumble easily under pressure. Didn't he DF his way out of the third set during last year's USO, against none other than Federer? Ended up winning the match. I think he's in a completely different category compared to Tsonga, Berdych and Soderling.

Hi Legend of Borg, the comparison with Berdych and Soderling was to highlight that they are all tall players who are more able to handle Nadal's top spin, but Nadal doesnt hit with that much spin on the hard court as seen in this year's US Open. Del Potro does seem like a player who plays well under pressure, but as i said earlier one match doesnt mean anything in the grander scheme of things. He has to win those kind of matches more to be really cement himself as a mental giant, and i see no reason why he wont be able to do so assuming he's 100% healthy.

 

[ChopShot]

With the regards to the comparison with Tsonga, Soderling, Berdych, i was pointing out the fact that they are all tall hitters who are hence able to neutralize Nadal's (excessive) spinny forehand.

As far as Del Potro's mental game is concern, he's still needs to come through tight matches on a more frequent basis. Winning your first major final in 5 sets is an amazing feat, but in tennis it's consistency that really matters. I have no reason to believe that he wont do so in future, but that does not take away the fact that he needs to do it.

As far as movement is concern, watch this. Nadal Del Potro US Open final 1:45 into the clip, i could already give you 5 instances where Del Potro lost his footing when pulled out wide. That's not to say that his movement is terrible or anything, but when he does not have time to set up his shots they are generally hit with less power. I forsee Nadal using this tactic a lot to neutralize Del Potro's big hitting.

I agree that he will give Nadal a tough match. I just cant agree with people saying that he at 100% will "destroy" or "crush" a healthy Nadal.

Bold: You're absolutely right, but what was so amazing about Del Potro during his late-year run of form was the consistency he showed. First making the semis of RG, then winning USO, and then getting to the final of the WTF. He did have fallings out in between, but actually most of them came after his injury.
Italics: While that's an entirely valid point, it's not exactly what I was pointing to. The difference between Del Potro as compared to Berdy and Söderling is that Del Potro is fast (ridiculously so) for a 6'6 tall guy. The fact that he slips a couple times is rather more attributable to the fact that he is well, huge, and doesn't exactly stop very well. But he stops a heck of a lot better than most everybody else, and in difference to Berdy and Söderling, those shots hit off balance aren't Hail Mary's. He actually swats them back IN with quite decent depth. Also, he seems to get how you play Nadal. I remember watching the Wimby final this year and asking myself why the heck Berdy wasn't pounding Nadal's forehand like everyone else that ever beats him does. Mutatis mutandi during the USO. If you watch the semi from '09, DelPo was unleashing a world of hurt on Nadals forehand, and getting short balls for his efforts.

 

[Messarger]

Bold: You're absolutely right, but what was so amazing about Del Potro during his late-year run of form was the consistency he showed. First making the semis of RG, then winning USO, and then getting to the final of the WTF. He did have fallings out in between, but actually most of them came after his injury.

Yeah, that was a great '09 by him, but it's only 3/4 of a season at most. Considering that Federer and Nadal have been consistent for like 8 and 5 years respectively, Del Potro still have some work to do to be labelled as "consistent".


Italics: While that's an entirely valid point, it's not exactly what I was pointing to. The difference between Del Potro as compared to Berdy and Söderling is that Del Potro is fast (ridiculously so) for a 6'6 tall guy. The fact that he slips a couple times is rather more attributable to the fact that he is well, huge, and doesn't exactly stop very well. But he stops a heck of a lot better than most everybody else, and in difference to Berdy and Söderling, those shots hit off balance aren't Hail Mary's. He actually swats them back IN with quite decent depth.

Getting the ball in with decent depth is one thing, but depth alone will not be able to trouble Federer and Nadal. By making Del Potro hit on the run, some of the pace is taken off his shots which would then allow Nadal to go on the offensive. He's not going to beat Del Potro by playing his clay game.

Also, he seems to get how you play Nadal. I remember watching the Wimby final this year and asking myself why the heck Berdy wasn't pounding Nadal's forehand like everyone else that ever beats him does. Mutatis mutandi during the USO. If you watch the semi from '09, DelPo was unleashing a world of hurt on Nadals forehand, and getting short balls for his efforts.

Well, Nadal's forehand last year compared to this year is like two different shots. I thought he was taking the ball a fraction earlier, which made it more difficult for Berdych to pound it. Although it'll be interesting to see Nadal's response had Berdych tried to.

responses in bold.

 

[ChopShot]

You're right about the fact that Nadal's forehand then and now are two entirely different shots. But the takeback isn't. And the takeback is what gets Nadal in trouble when people give it a pounding. And about the depth thing - even Nadal and Fed will make more errors than winners if they try outhit DelPo off of deep shots, no matter the pace. The fact is that DelPo is very good at resetting points, or turning them around to his favor with sudden huge shots off either wing.

 

[Messarger]

You're right about the fact that Nadal's forehand then and now are two entirely different shots. But the takeback isn't. And the takeback is what gets Nadal in trouble when people give it a pounding. And about the depth thing - even Nadal and Fed will make more errors than winners if they try outhit DelPo off of deep shots, no matter the pace. The fact is that DelPo is very good at resetting points, or turning them around to his favor with sudden huge shots off either wing.

If he can throughout the course of a 5 set match consistently pull off huge winners off both wings when he's on the dead run, then he definitely deserves to win. It would mean that he is playing at a superb level. I'm just saying that i can forsee Nadal making him run, rather than allow him time to set up his shots. Even if Del Potro resets the points, the advantage would then go to Nadal who is probably the most consistent player in long exchanges.

 

[Omega_7000]

If he can throughout the course of a 5 set match consistently pull off huge winners off both wings when he's on the dead run, then he definitely deserves to win.

What a revolutionary idea...You will win if you hit winners consistently. How does Nadal manage to win matches without pulling off winners consistently?

I'm just saying that i can forsee Nadal making him run, rather than allow him time to set up his shots.

I can foresee DelPo pounding on Nadal's forehand from both wings & taking away Nadal's time from setting up his whiplash forehand.

 

[Speranza]

Anyone who thinks Del Potro can beat Nadal on clay or grass is kidding themselves. We'll talk when he cane get past to the final of the French or get past the 2nd round of Wimbledon. Del Potro couldn't even beat choking Federer at the French Open.

Can you remove your head from Nadals butt for a minute to absorb this. Federer is one of the top 10 best clay courters of all time. Del Potro will be back.

Watson: Not much chance of this happening whilst Bud, Nadalfan etc. have theirs jammed tightly behind him in the same butt. :shock:

 

[_maxi]

Anyone who thinks Del Potro can beat Nadal on clay or grass is kidding themselves. We'll talk when he cane get past to the final of the French or get past the 2nd round of Wimbledon. Del Potro couldn't even beat choking Federer at the French Open.

Shut uppppp. How can you even posstt????? censure yourself, your historial is 0-50 vs this forum.

 

[nadal_slam_king]

Hi nadal_slam_king, let's not go over the whole "Was Nadal injured last year?" thing again. Time will tell if he was really injured when he is able to win more majors at 100%.

I'm not going on about it, Rafa's doctor went on about it. Do you call any fact a fallacy if it doesn't support your opinion?

Crazy.

 

[nadal_slam_king]

yes, rafa's injury , which only disturbed his serving, did not affect his ground game at all vs delpo who was out for nearly 9 months, very comparable ... LOL, heights of desperation ...

abdominal injury or not , delpo would have def nadal that day

LOL only disturbed his serve? How do you explain that? A TORN stomach muscle. Anyway, Rafa wasn't playing well in 2009 before the stomach muscle problem and also after it had healed. He never played well in 2009, and you are kidding yourself if you think he was anything like 2010 Rafa.