is this correct?

[randomname]

I was taking a lesson the other day and my coach said a few things that seemed to go against what I thought was good technique (although I did see improvement by following his advice) and I was just wondering what everyone here thought about it. first off, he said I rotated into the shot too much, on both of my shots I tended to start out with my shoulders squared up with the ball and ended with the opposite shoulder facing the net (so on my backhand my right shoulder starts out facing the net and at the end my left shoulder is facing the net.) instead he had me so I would square up my shoulders at the start of the swing but stopping the rotation with my shoulders parallel with the baseline.

 

[The Gorilla]

no .

 

[shindemac]

no. usually it's shoulder over shoulder.

 

[Steady Eddy]

Does it matter? I remember some tennis guru guy was very critical of Bjorn Borg's form. "He takes the racquet back too far", etc. But he seemed to do well with it. I would think that the ball goes where it goes because of the angle and speed of the racquet when it hits the ball. If that's right, you have nothing to worry about. But if your aim is off, good form won't redirect it into the court.

People are different. If it feels right to you, that might mean that it is right for you. A coach might not like it because it isn't his way. But that doesn't mean it can't work.

 

[The Gorilla]

no, seriously, I don't mean to be rude steadyeddy but you have to turn your shoulders, that's where your power comes from.

 

[dave333]

You need to turn your shoulders perpendicular to the net on the takeback but he don't have turn a full 180 degrees.

 

[Steady Eddy]

Yes, but he and his coach seem to be discussing his follow through only. The 180 degree rotation described seems to be exagerated, but at this point the ball is already on its way, the exagerated follow-through can't affect it.

 

[User Name]

that doesnt seem to make much sense to me

 

[10nisDude~]

it depends if ur a two handed back and u start with ur right shoulder then ending up with ur left shoulder then ur coach or instructor was right. There was unnecessary turnin and u wud waste time...u shud be parallel to the net when u follow through in order to quickly go back into the court...cuz the game is too fast these days...

 

[Solat]

it depends if ur a two handed back and u start with ur right shoulder then ending up with ur left shoulder then ur coach or instructor was right. There was unnecessary turnin and u wud waste time...u shud be parallel to the net when u follow through in order to quickly go back into the court...cuz the game is too fast these days...

yeah i think this too

you should be side - on with shoulders in prep and finish square, if you over-rotate you tend not to be driving forward thru the ball enough

 

[BreakPoint]

On a 1HBH, you should start with your right shoulder pointing towards the net and end with your right shoulder still pointing towards the net - hardly any shoulder rotation at all.

Watch these:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9az5qWcLOTk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZncVNX4vIOM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iz3NW9ZED-I

 

[The Gorilla]

On a 1HBH, you should start with your right shoulder pointing towards the net and end with your right shoulder still pointing towards the net - hardly any shoulder rotation at all.

Watch these:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9az5qWcLOTk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZncVNX4vIOM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iz3NW9ZED-I

what?, he should hit his one hander with only his arm?
edberg used massive shoulder rotation for all his shots and always finished with his shoulders parallel to the baseline:

http://edberg.free.fr/videos/edberg_chang_rg96/edberg_19_retour_revers_ralenti.mpg

 

[habib]

what?, he should hit his one hander with only his arm?
edberg used massive shoulder rotation for all his shots and always finished with his shoulders parallel to the baseline:

http://edberg.free.fr/videos/edberg_chang_rg96/edberg_19_retour_revers_ralenti.mpg

First, why must you always twist what people say and add your words into their statements? I fail to see where BreakPoint suggested using only the arm. If you're doing this intentionally, you're a troll. If you're dong it unintentionally, you need to read things more carefully and not jump to immediate conclusions. As we all know, the shoulder pulls the arm forward, but in the ideal case, the shoulders then stop and don't open up any further until well after contact - which isn't using 'massive shoulder rotation' to generate power.

Second, your video is a little inconclusive in that Edberg appears to be hitting the backhand in motion and from a mildly open stance (pay attention to where his legs are at the start of the clip, when you can still see them, and the orientation of the hips later), which would of course change the mechanics, and also result in a less-than-ideal swing.

 

[The Gorilla]

First, why must you always twist what people say and add your words into their statements? I fail to see where BreakPoint suggested using only the arm. If you're doing this intentionally, you're a troll. If you're dong it unintentionally, you need to read things more carefully and not jump to immediate conclusions. As we all know, the shoulder pulls the arm forward, but in the ideal case, the shoulders then stop and don't open up any further until well after contact - which isn't using 'massive shoulder rotation' to generate power.

Second, your video is a little inconclusive in that Edberg appears to be hitting the backhand in motion and from a mildly open stance (pay attention to where his legs are at the start of the clip, when you can still see them, and the orientation of the hips later), which would of course change the mechanics, and also result in a less-than-ideal swing.

if you don't move your shoulders then you can only be using your arm.

http://edberg.free.fr/videos/edberg_chang_rg96/edberg_13_attaque_de_revers.mpg

 

[habib]

if you don't move your shoulders then you can only be using your arm.

http://edberg.free.fr/videos/edberg_chang_rg96/edberg_13_attaque_de_revers.mpg

And yet again you're completely misinterpreting what I said. :roll:

 

[The Gorilla]

I don't care what you said to be perfectly honest

 

[Geezer Guy]

I was taking a lesson the other day and my coach said a few things that seemed to go against what I thought was good technique (although I did see improvement by following his advice) and I was just wondering what everyone here thought about it. first off, he said I rotated into the shot too much, on both of my shots I tended to start out with my shoulders squared up with the ball and ended with the opposite shoulder facing the net (so on my backhand my right shoulder starts out facing the net and at the end my left shoulder is facing the net.) instead he had me so I would square up my shoulders at the start of the swing but stopping the rotation with my shoulders parallel with the baseline.

Sometimes, to correct a particular problem you may have, a coach will have you over-correct to the opposite extreme. Once you get over your first little glitch, he can correct you back to normal.

If he's a well credentialed coach that gets good results for most of his students, I'd just go along with what he teachs and not get second opinions from folks you don't even know on the internet.

That would include me, I guess.

 

[habib]

I don't care what you said to be perfectly honest

Ah, well I guess that's a pretty good cop out for your chronic issues with reading comprehension and critical thinking. Good luck with that.

 

[habib]

To the OP: Having the shoulders reverse position by the end of the follow-through is not uncommon nor incorrect. However, if you watch most pros hit the ball, their torso rotates about 90 degrees from being perpendicular to the net, to being parallel to it, at which point their arm comes around, and only after contact, on the followtrhough itself, does the body rotate the rest of the way.

This may be what your coach was trying to instill, if you're overrotating prior to contact.

 

[The Gorilla]

To the OP: Having the shoulders reverse position by the end of the follow-through is not uncommon nor incorrect. However, if you watch most pros hit the ball, their torso rotates about 90 degrees from being perpendicular to the net, to being parallel to it, at which point their arm comes around, and only after contact, on the followtrhough itself, does the body rotate the rest of the way.

This may be what your coach was trying to instill, if you're overrotating prior to contact.

this guy has a bad backhand himself, just thought I'd throw that out there.
take everything he said with a large grain of salt.

 

[habib]

this guy has a bad backhand himself, just thought I'd throw that out there.
take everything he said with a large grain of salt.

Ah, so we've moved past reading incomprehension and into the arena of denigration, have we? Speaks volumes about your maturity level, especially since your comments are based on a single video taken from a bad angle. I'd be interested to see how I'd play against you. Speaking of which, where are the videos displaying your brilliant form? For some reason, I've seen none. Wonder why that could be?

Not to mention that, just because my backhand isn't where I'd like it to be, doesn't mean I don't understand how it SHOULD work, which is clearly where your problem lies. In any case, I thought you didn't care what I said? Heh.

 

[The Gorilla]

Ah, so we've moved past reading incomprehension and into the arena of denigration, have we? Speaks volumes about your maturity level, especially since your comments are based on a single video taken from a bad angle. I'd be interested to see how I'd play against you. Speaking of which, where are the videos displaying your brilliant form? For some reason, I've seen none. Wonder why that could be?

Not to mention that, just because my backhand isn't where I'd like it to be, doesn't mean I don't understand how it SHOULD work, which is clearly where your problem lies. In any case, I thought you didn't care what I said? Heh.

well let's see, you didn't understand the concept of hand height being the true indicator of the height of your backswing, indeed you stated that:

It really doesn't look like my backhand starts low enough, which probably explains why I overhit so many backhands when I try to rip it

not to mention the way you jump backwards, quite dramatically, when hitting it, and you think that despite not being able to hit a backhand properly and having serious fundamental flaws in it and in your movement you should stand less than a foot behind the baseline.

yes, you are indeed a tennis guru, I take my hat off to you sir

 

[habib]

well let's see, you didn't understand the concept of hand height being the true indicator of the height of your backswing, indeed you stated that:

In reference to the lowest point of the backhand (ie: right before coming up to hit the ball), not in terms of backswing. [/quote]

not to mention the way you jump backwards, quite dramatically, when hitting it, and you think that despite not being able to hit a backhand properly and having serious fundamental flaws in it and in your movement you should stand less than a foot behind the baseline.

yes, you are indeed a tennis guru, I take my hat off to you sir

So, in your first comment, you exhibited once more a serious error in comprehension. In your second, you've exhibited the fact that you haven't seen my updated video, taken from a better angle, using a higher backswing and longer stroke, standing on the baseline, and not jumpnig backwards when hitting backhands. Fantastic. I hope you can keep this pace up for some time, but Forest Gump may get jealous.

PS: Where are your videos again?

 

[The Gorilla]

why the hell would anyone post a video of themselves, this is the internet, some psycho could take a disliking to you and track you down.

 

[habib]

why the hell would anyone post a video of themselves, this is the internet, some psycho could take a disliking to you and track you down.

It would probably be easier for someone to track you down through the IP address through which you post rather than a video which doesn't even necessarily need to show your face. Good reason, though. I sure hope no psychos track me down. :roll:

Lol.

 

[The Gorilla]

It would probably be easier for someone to track you down through the IP address through which you post rather than a video which doesn't even necessarily need to show your face. Good reason, though. I sure hope no psychos track me down. :roll:

Lol.

I wouldn't be so confidant about that.

 

[habib]

I wouldn't be so confidant about that.

In the interests of prudent planning, I just now typed up a letter to my lawyer proclaiming you as a chief suspect in case I expired by anything less than a natural reason in the near future. Don't post any videos of your strokes or else my lawyer will be able to track you down, psycho style.

 

[BreakPoint]

what?, he should hit his one hander with only his arm?
edberg used massive shoulder rotation for all his shots and always finished with his shoulders parallel to the baseline:

Then just ask yourself this one question: "Why is Federer's 1HBH so much better than yours?"

You rotate your hitting shoulder upwards. You DO NOT turn your shoulders/torso so that both of your shoulders end up parallel to the net before you've completed your follow-through. The power comes from the shoulder rotation (within its socket), NOT the shoulder turning.

Did you even see those 3 videos of Federer's 1HBH in slo-mo?

 

[Vision84]

Just ignore The Gorilla. He concluded from Breakpoint's links that you are only supposed to hit with the arm and that isn't how to hit a backhand. That means Federer must use an incorrect technique and is still #1 in the world. Boris Becker is also wrong as he says in the third video that "This is how you are supposed to hit a backhand". :roll:

Edit: People really need to stop posting in the tips/instruction section if they have no clue what they are talking about but pretend they do.

 

[The Gorilla]

Then just ask yourself this one question: "Why is Federer's 1HBH so much better than yours?"

You rotate your hitting shoulder upwards. You DO NOT turn your shoulders/torso so that both of your shoulders end up parallel to the net before you've completed your follow-through. The power comes from the shoulder rotation (within its socket), NOT the shoulder turning.

Did you even see those 3 videos of Federer's 1HBH in slo-mo?

I never said that and you are now changing your original statement.

 

[The Gorilla]

Just ignore The Gorilla. He concluded from Breakpoint's links that you are only supposed to hit with the arm and that isn't how to hit a backhand. That means Federer must use an incorrect technique and is still #1 in the world. Boris Becker is also wrong as he says in the third video that "This is how you are supposed to hit a backhand". :roll:

I didn't even look at the video, I just read his words and responded to them.

Edit: People really need to stop posting in the tips/instruction section if they have no clue what they are talking about but pretend they do.

you don't say

 

[BreakPoint]

I never said that and you are now changing your original statement.

No? This is exactly what you said:

what?, he should hit his one hander with only his arm?

Yes, in the sense that the arm rotates within the socket that's connected to your shoulder. But it's the shoulder rotation and the weight moving into the shot that gives it power. Opening up and turning your shoulders just makes you flail at the ball and makes you lose directional control of your shot.

 

[BreakPoint]

you don't say

Yes, he does say. I thought you knew how to read.