Player's Racquets for Players Only... Why?

[Winners or Errors]

I've been following this board with interest for a few months, having just gotten back into tennis over the summer, and something baffles me. Why are some people obsessed with what level player should be playing with what racquet?

Back when I started playing tennis, I had a wood racquet. I did migrate to graphite fairly quickly, and played with a Black Max, followed by a Kneissl White Star Pro, and then a Lendl GTX Pro (OK, it was a medium I picked up in Germany and could never really get around, but it was cool and I remain a Lendl fan so I'd play with it once in a while for grins). I never really worried about whether or not the racquet was designed for my level, and I don't believe it would make much difference. At the time, as a kid, I didn't really have the resources to go out and by a Wilson Pro Staff 6.0, but I did hit with them and thought they were great racquets. I can't remember ever hitting with a racquet with a more solid feel.

Fast forward 20 years, and now there seems to be an obsession with hitting the right racquet for your game, as if beginners or intermediate players should not dare to pick up a "player's" racquet for fear of ridicule.

Are some of you simply trying to help people maximize other's enjoyment of tennis? Is there some other reason? Just curious. I think I may purchase one of those new Wilson Sampras frames, and by the definition of many on this board, I certainly don't have the game for it...

 

[Kal-El 34]

Dude if you can hit it, go for it. It's your racquet nobody can tell you what feels best to you. Just don't get one cuz it has Pete's name is on it and you think it will make you a better player. I've only been on here a short while (I think this is post #3 for me). I think that's what people get annoyed at is when people get a racquet because of who uses it thinking it will make them better when really they can't hit it at all & would be better off with something different. I could be wrong though

 

[Winners or Errors]

Dude if you can hit it, go for it. It's your racquet nobody can tell you what feels best to you. Just don't get one cuz it has Pete's name is on it and you think it will make you a better player. I've only been on here a short while (I think this is post #3 for me). I think that's what people get annoyed at is when people get a racquet because of who uses it thinking it will make them better when really they can't hit it at all & would be better off with something different. I could be wrong though

Fair enough. I could care less if it has Pete's name on it because I always liked the racquet, but I can see how it may be annoying to have a prima-donna on the court who thinks he or she is good because of the racquet... Of course, I don't really think it's a big deal if someone isn't playing with their ideal racquet, so long as they like what they are playing with. I can see how some would think the point of tennis is to always win, but at this point that's not really why I play (though it is nice to play well and win on occasion ;-))

Given that it wasn't that long ago that all of us played with sub 70 sq in wooden racquets, it is interesting how things are in tennis today.

 

[flogpro2252]

I think there is also a group of people that will tell you that you aren't "maximizing your potential" if you play with a racquet that is "above" your skill level. I used to play exclusively with PS 6.0 85's even though I was probably a 4.0 level player. I liked the way they felt and didn't care much whether I could play better with something more forgiving. Bottomline, it's your dough, buy the racquet you want and enjoy it. Don't let anyone tell you what is good or bad for your game.

 

[themitchmann]

I think people should try racquets that will challenge them to improve their game. Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't, but at least you can see for yourself. Some racquets are so powerful that they hinder good technique, in which case I would recommend trying a stick that you'll have to swing the right way to get any pop on the ball. But if your strokes are a disaster, then sometimes that challenging racquet can get you hurt (well, really it's the stroke that gets you hurt, but you know what I'm saying).

 

[drakulie]

I've been following this board with interest for a few months, having just gotten back into tennis over the summer, and something baffles me. Why are some people obsessed with what level player should be playing with what racquet?

It's something called "control". Since they have none in their real lives, they feel they may get some by distorting and posting all sorts of non-sense on the boards. Somehow, it probably makes them feel better about their crappy lives. Unfortunately, lots of posters fall for their BS.

Enjoy the new wilson frame, and let us know your thoughts.

 

[zapvor]

its designed for players, but you dont have to be one. i am nowhere near good enough to be using one, but i love my player's racket, so that's what i play with.

 

[baek57]

don't buy into the hype about racquets designed for your level. all that kind of talk is on these boards.

 

[nickarnold2000]

Fair enough. I could care less if it has Pete's name on it because I always liked the racquet, but I can see how it may be annoying to have a prima-donna on the court who thinks he or she is good because of the racquet... Of course, I don't really think it's a big deal if someone isn't playing with their ideal racquet, so long as they like what they are playing with. I can see how some would think the point of tennis is to always win, but at this point that's not really why I play (though it is nice to play well and win on occasion ;-))

Given that it wasn't that long ago that all of us played with sub 70 sq in wooden racquets, it is interesting how things are in tennis today.

As others have said, buy what you want but hopefully you can demo first. The 70" wood racket doesn't really apply in this day and age because the ball speed as increased so much. For me, I play with whatever gives me the best chance to win at tournaments whether it's a players frame or not. IMO there is a reason why TW gives basic level guides for certain frames ie. suitable for 4.0 and over. However, maybe you're the exception.

 

[drakulie]

there is a reason why TW gives basic level guides for certain frames ie. suitable for 4.0 and over.

It's called marketing. It's a simple marketing ploy. By giving the buyer "ownership" over a certain title (in this case a NTRP), the buyer feels a sense of "belonging to a certain group", and therefore is more likely to purchase the item.

 

[Irvin]

I like going to a golf superstore near my home to try rackets. They carry them all and have courts you right there you can hit on. Pick up a stick and go bang on the wall right beside the tennis center if you want.

I went from a wood racket to a Wilson ProStaff and I am not sure if I was playing with what others thought was the 'Right' stick for me but I was always playing with the one I liked the best. I have played with a lot of sticks but the ones I always liked the best were the player sticks. I went up to 102 inch frame one time for more power but those rackets did not last too long and now I am back down to 95 inch.

Now granted my style fits the stick I use. I have a good tempo, long back swing, and follow through and can provide all the power I need. Maybe that is why I like the player sticks.

Irvin

 

[jmverdugo]

Im with the play with whatever you want group, I also beleive that the most of the problems of "normal" tennis players are not in the racket selection and no racket will fix those problem, just a good coach and a lot of practice, oh and of course the will to improve.

However if we are talking about competitive tennis, where all these kids have really good technique and form, you can see that sometimes a racket can make a difference.

 

[jrod]

...Are some of you simply trying to help people maximize other's enjoyment of tennis? Is there some other reason? Just curious. I think I may purchase one of those new Wilson Sampras frames, and by the definition of many on this board, I certainly don't have the game for it...

While I think its true that certain racquets are harder to use than others, the final decision on which racquet a player selects is theirs alone. I've tried many racquets over the past 6+ years after I got back into tennis, starting with Prestige, Wilson Pro Staff 95, Babolat Aeropro, Roddick Pure Drive, k90, Fischer M Pro 98 #1 and now BB11 mid.

At the beginning I really had no clue and picked something that I thought was "elbow friendly". Well it wasn't really, at least for my game. The move to the Pro Staff 95 was accompanied by some coaching to correct flaws on my backhand side that were causing tennis elbow. The lighter swingweight allowed me to make contact out in front more often which led to better results and less issues with my elbow.

My Babolat phase was one of experimentation where I really wasn't sure what I was looking for, but it was brought on by the disapperance of the Pro Staff 95 from the retail outlets. During this phase I started to understand what I liked and disliked about a stick. I found the Aeropro to be great from the ground but lacking a little in power. The Pro Drive made up for lack of power from the baseline, but lacked touch and feel, particularly at the net. I also didn't like the stiffness of the frame. So I was learning.

Enter the k90: Now I knew full well this stick was likely beyond my capacity to fully appreciate (4.0 player at the time). Small sweet spot, heavy, demanding, blah blah blah... I tried it and absolutely loved the feel of it, both at the baseline and net. I used it over a couple of years and worked with a couple of different pro's to help improve my consistency. The demanding nature of the k90 actually caused me to improve my game. This was a net positive of using a demanding stick that I worked hard at...it didn't just happen automatically.

As my game improved I started to play better players who were hitting shots that were more challenging. I also played a lot of doubles where maneuverability of the stick was becoming more important than it was when I was playing less accomplished players. I realized that the k90 was working fine for me in singles (all court player), but I was struggling in doubles during fast volley exchanges.

Enter Fischer MPro#1 98: I found the stick to have great control and it was very soft. The balance was perfect but I felt it was lacking in power so I added some lead while maintaining the balance. After about a year of playing with this I came to depend on the stick for doubles only and resorted to using the k90 for singles. Better depth on groundies from the k90, better maneuverability from the Fischer for dubs.

I've just settled on a BB11 mid to replace these 2. It suits my game both for dubs and singles. It's as good as the k90 from the ground (perhaps better as its more forgiving) and its actually better than the Fischer all around. Swingweight is perfect for my game.

All of these frames I used over the years are also used by the pros. Some are more "players" frames than others, and some are more suited to lower level players. The point is you need to find what works for you independent of the "label" applied. That labeling is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is to understand what you are looking for in a racquet, and then try and find that in the sea of choices.

It's also important to realize that this can take some time, but the search is often fun and instructive. It's also important to recognize that as your game changes and develops, your preferances may also change. My recommendation is to find a frame that works well for you and forget about what stigma is attached to it. Be open minded and learn to adapt.

 

[raiden031]

I agree that it is stupid. I think alot of it is insecurity of the players who criticize. They feel if they limit inferior players to crappy racquets, those players will never surpass them in skill. If they encourage inferior players to play with good racquets, then they are threatened. Truth is that practice and experience have more effect on a player than the racquet. But to some extent the racquet makes a difference, but only when going from one spec to a nearly opposite spec.

I think it is foolish for say a 3.0 power hitter to play with a granny stick. They don't need more power, at 3.0 they probably need alot more control (Any player that hits the ball hard needs a more control-oriented racquet). Likewise it is not a good idea for a 4.0 pusher to be using a player's racquet (even if it is designed for 4.0 and above), because they will need more power due to their pushing style.

Bottom line, the racquet should be more about style of play than anything else.

 

[LanEvo]

yea, just hit with that u like, like for me i like my K90, its hits great and everything

 

[jtms]

I don't think most people really pay attention to all of that. I don't know if you are a golfer, but I equate player's frames to muscle back or blades and oversized racquets are more like cavity backs. Granted a pro, like they do on the PGA tour play from huge muscle backs which would be considered hackers clubs to small blades that only experts would hit. Reality, if you can hit it go for it. Most "player's frames" are typically heavier, have smaller heads, and are more control oriented. Most beginner to intermediate players are looking for a big sweet spot and a light racquet, and I think this is why some racquets are labeled "players sticks" and others are not.

The reality is a good player can play with anything. Back in the day, my coach went to Walmart a couple of days before a big national tourn. he was playing and bought 3 cheapo Dunlop racquets. He won nationals with ease. Granted he was a highly ranked ATP pro, but this goes to show a good player can play with anything ,

 

[Staiger]

I agree that it is stupid. I think alot of it is insecurity of the players who criticize. They feel if they limit inferior players to crappy racquets, those players will never surpass them in skill. If they encourage inferior players to play with good racquets, then they are threatened. Truth is that practice and experience have more effect on a player than the racquet. But to some extent the racquet makes a difference, but only when going from one spec to a nearly opposite spec.

I think it is foolish for say a 3.0 power hitter to play with a granny stick. They don't need more power, at 3.0 they probably need alot more control (Any player that hits the ball hard needs a more control-oriented racquet). Likewise it is not a good idea for a 4.0 pusher to be using a player's racquet (even if it is designed for 4.0 and above), because they will need more power due to their pushing style.

Bottom line, the racquet should be more about style of play than anything else.

Exactly ! , You just have to find a racquet that is suitable for yourself . Once you got a rough idea of the weight , stiffness and balance of the racquet you wanted you can just mix and match and demo it all and see which one suit you (of course the price as well) . TBH , I found all this new technologies the company developed onto the racquet completely gabbage (dont get me started on that Cortex system ) !

 

[Winners or Errors]

I like going to a golf superstore near my home to try rackets. They carry them all and have courts you right there you can hit on. Pick up a stick and go bang on the wall right beside the tennis center if you want.

I went from a wood racket to a Wilson ProStaff and I am not sure if I was playing with what others thought was the 'Right' stick for me but I was always playing with the one I liked the best. I have played with a lot of sticks but the ones I always liked the best were the player sticks. I went up to 102 inch frame one time for more power but those rackets did not last too long and now I am back down to 95 inch.

Now granted my style fits the stick I use. I have a good tempo, long back swing, and follow through and can provide all the power I need. Maybe that is why I like the player sticks.

Irvin

Well, I have to confess that I like mid-sized player's sticks for five reasons:
1. I like to hit out, and find that when I am going for shots it is much easier to keep shots from a lower powered stick in the court...
2. It seems a lot easier to hurt myself when swinging a lighter stick, because I can really snap my arm quickly into positions that take more time with a heavier stick.
3. I hit a one handed backhand, and have noticed since switching that it is much easier to hit topspin backhands with my heavier but significantly more headlight older midsized sticks. This may be technique related, but my technique was built with those older sticks.
4. I tend to be ahead on my service returns with the lighter sticks - of course, I haven't played against any huge servers either...
5. I've noticed that it is harder to produce a good stroke at half speed with a lighter racquet (perhaps some lead tape would help here... of course eliminating the weight difference ;-))


Item #3 may keep me away from sticks like the new PS88 because of the balance point, but have me looking with interest at some of the newer sticks that have a very headlight balance, like the PK Redondo Mid, the RDS001 Mid, etc.

FWIW, I played for a few years with a Prince Precision Equipe MidPlus, and it was just too darned powerful strung loose, and too darned hard on my arm strung tight - pretty darned stiff frame. Right now, I am waffling between my now 20 year old Dunlop Max Impact Mids (headlight, midsized, flexible enough, low powered, 12+ oz) and the new sticks I picked up, the Volkl Tour 9 V-Engine 18x20 (less headlight, mid-plus, oddly stiff and flexible, higher powered, 11+ oz). I like the extra power of the Volkl's, but if I can't spin my topspin backhand I can't keep the ball in the court, which is much more difficult for me in doubles than singles - pressure thing, then I won't play with them long term.

Rather than pick up yet another stick, I may simply put some lead tape under the grip on the handle to add weight and change the balance in the Volkl's. Perhaps that will give me the benefit of less stress on the serve and the ability to whip the backhand through for topspin. No other strokes have been a problem with the racquet and the added 8 or so square inches does seem to help with mishits.

 

[bad_call]

It's called marketing. It's a simple marketing ploy. By giving the buyer "ownership" over a certain title (in this case a NTRP), the buyer feels a sense of "belonging to a certain group", and therefore is more likely to purchase the item.

i couldn't find a racquet for "junk ballers" so i'm making due with a couple of Volkls. pretty easy on the arm since throwing junk can get laborious at times.... :neutral:

 

[plasma]

players racquets improve the technique (yes I said it) and stroke production of any player. Advancement beyond 4.5 and solid performance is what players racquets are for. I reccomend players racquets for intermediates looking to advance. In a perfect world, there would only be 85 prostaffs,

 

[Pushmaster]

I've played my share of 5.0-5.5's and it's surprising how many play 10-10.5 oz sticks, and they do damn well with them too. One guy I played who was ranked 1# USTA 35+ in my region played a 9.0 oz Wilson Sledge Hammer, and believe me he was a terrific player. A "players racquet" is anything that a really good player happens to have in his hand, and specs has nothing to do with it.

 

[Dark_Angel85]

well.. true.. i feel that if you like it and the racquet feels great, who gives a darn snooze about what sort of racquet you're swinging with..

on the other hand, most of the time, a player's racquet refers to someone who demands certain qualities from it i.e. headlight and slightly hefty. sometimes a smaller headsize as well...


but that is just for people to refer... at least that's what i think

 

[bad_call]

I've played my share of 5.0-5.5's and it's surprising how many play 10-10.5 oz sticks, and they do damn well with them too. One guy I played who was ranked 1# USTA 35+ in my region played a 9.0 oz Wilson Sledge Hammer, and believe me he was a terrific player. A "players racquet" is anything that a really good player happens to have in his hand, and specs has nothing to do with it.

was this guy a "pusher" type player?

 

[Djokovicfan4life]

It's called marketing. It's a simple marketing ploy. By giving the buyer "ownership" over a certain title (in this case a NTRP), the buyer feels a sense of "belonging to a certain group", and therefore is more likely to purchase the item.

Great post. Couldn't agree more. It's the same thing with poly strings. Everyone switches to poly so that they can be considered "big hitters".

 

[Pushmaster]

was this guy a "pusher" type player?

No, not at all. Heavy topspin off both wings, big serve. I play a POG and hit a heavy ball myself, he had no trouble at all with it even with a 9oz "granny stick".

 

[Azzurri]

If you are over 30. You will remember that every frame when you were growing up (in todays specs) would be a players frame..

Its sad that these boards and the kids of today have been taken over by the tweener smart mouth generation...

I guess in todays world. If you play a players frame you are either a try hard, or an old guy that doesn't know anything...

yes, the boards are infested with some really absurd posters.

welcome!

 

[msc886]

racket for playing level is BS. racket for technique and playing style is more suitable

 

[bad_call]

racket for playing level is BS. racket for technique and playing style is more suitable

now that's more like it.

 

[sureshs]

racket for playing level is BS. racket for technique and playing style is more suitable

Yeah and advanced players have better technique and a definite playing style

 

[mikeler]

I'm a 5.0 that just switched from a 10.5 oz racket to a 9.5 oz racket. It has helped my game tremendously.

 

[vandre]

I agree that it is stupid. I think alot of it is insecurity of the players who criticize. They feel if they limit inferior players to crappy racquets, those players will never surpass them in skill. If they encourage inferior players to play with good racquets, then they are threatened. Truth is that practice and experience have more effect on a player than the racquet. But to some extent the racquet makes a difference, but only when going from one spec to a nearly opposite spec.

I think it is foolish for say a 3.0 power hitter to play with a granny stick. They don't need more power, at 3.0 they probably need alot more control (Any player that hits the ball hard needs a more control-oriented racquet). Likewise it is not a good idea for a 4.0 pusher to be using a player's racquet (even if it is designed for 4.0 and above), because they will need more power due to their pushing style.

Bottom line, the racquet should be more about style of play than anything else.

ty raiden, this is the best post i've ever read on this board! well done, sir!