Nadal had an abdominal tear at that US Open.
The difference is Delpo still had his two big weapons, serve and forehand, after the surgeries. On the bh he was slicing more which the top players could exploit. Thiem’s forehand is about 80% of what is was at his peak. I think that has played with his mind knowing that he can’t count on it to finish points. Thiem’s bh looks great.
Thiem does not hit harder than Del Potro. His swing is wilder but Del Potro's forehand is leagues ahead of Thiem's in power. Thiem's forehand has never impressed me. He doesn't create angles well, partly because he stands so far back and his wild swing doesn't produce all that scary of a forehand most of the time. But BH side, yes, Thiem hits harder. I don't think it's so obvious, based on swing alone, why one athlete gets hurt but another doesn't. Del Potro was actually hurting his left wrist, which theoretically shouldn't be subjected to that much strain because you have the help of another hand and his backhand isn't some violent swing.
Agreed on Del Potro but I would say Thiem's forehand is less than 80% of what it was.
I don't know about that. Thiem's forehand was huge when he was at his best and he was pound for pound the hardest hitter on tour for a while. He could average above 80 mph on the forehand and backhand.
I think you might be talking just in terms of pace, which Del Potro might be ahead in. But I believe that's because Del Potro hits a significantly flatter ball than Thiem, not because he "hits harder", if that makes sense. Thiem aside from generating a lot of pace, generates very close to Nadal level of topspin, which I feel takes more power in your stroke than what Del Potro does. It's just my theory.
I won't dispute your numbers but I found Del Potro's power so much more effective. The minute he got a forehand, he put his opponents on the defensive. Thiem needs many shots to start getting ahead, but at the same time, he wasn't using his spin to create angles like Nadal. And he stood so far back that most of his forehands weren't that punishing by the time it got over the net.I think you might be talking just in terms of pace, which Del Potro might be ahead in. But I believe that's because Del Potro hits a significantly flatter ball than Thiem, not because he "hits harder", if that makes sense. Thiem aside from generating a lot of pace, generates very close to Nadal level of topspin, which I feel takes more power in your stroke than what Del Potro does. It's just my theory.
I'm pretty surprised by Delpo having Thiem's number like that. 4-0 i H2H. For some reason I haven't seen so many Delpo games, just remember his awesome forehand.
Bad matchup for Thiem it seems but he really choked away that 2017 USO match. No way he should have lost that.
Who beat them at their slam? Nadal only lost 3 match at RG. Djokovic didn't lose much either at AO.
Don’t care if it’s not their favorite surface you got to give him credit for beating Rafa and Novak in a major. He came very close to beating Novak at the AO in 2020.
But he is all time big tournament choker. Don't trust him.
He didn’t choke those FO finals to Rafa. Just beaten by a superior player. You can make the case at the AO final where he was up 2 sets to 1.
Murray is amazing when compared to Delpo. Need to stop overrating out of SYMPATHY.
I'm with you on this. I don't find him to be a choker but he wasn't necessarily clutch either. To me, Thiem is the modern day Muster, and not just because he's Austrian. He didn't have the big serve to get easy points and had to wear down his opponents. He didn't have the weapons and accuracy to win easy against Tier 2 players like Gasquet, Tsongas and Ferrer and against the Big 3, he had to be humming on all cylinders to compete against them. It's just very hard to keep that up. Nadal's game isn't fundamentally better in most respects but Nadal's forehand was much more dangerous, capable of jerking even Djokovic around and hitting winners and Nadal is so much better at coming forward and finishing a point off at the net. And we're not even talking about tennis smarts - Thiem wasn't an idiot on the court but he wasn't a creative genius either.
He honestly didn't choke in those ATP Finals though. He was just very unlucky and got slightly outplayed both times. Both Tsistipas and Medvedev played at high levels to win. He severely underperformed in Masters finals though except the one he won, and didn't play well in the USO final although he won. Best level he probably ever played on hardcourt though was at the 2020 AO.
It's not. He made it so hard to win against him, pushing the big 3 very hard multiple times despite all his injuries that made him weaker. Beating prime Rog in a slam final, also. He had room to grow and reach their level on paper, but injuries kept him from doing it.
Murray kept going at it. I wouldn't discount his Wimbledon 2016 title. He was in finals of AO2016, RG2016 (huge for him) and Wimby 2016. 3 slam finals in a row. He was going to win somewhere at the end. Delpo had not even won a masters 1000 title till 2018. 1 slam at age 19. I don't understand the obsession with Delpo.
Beating Kyrgios ->Tsonga -> Berdych -> Raonic on grass is a respectable draw to me. Not terribly difficult but not bad.His 2016 run was a joke with a useless clown like RaoMUG in the final, why did you bring that up?
DP was already Jack Sock by that time, which part of not having a BH you do not understand? That's the reason why Tsonga never won a slam. Ooooh Merry reached the AO final! Good for him, too bad he lost it as usual. 5 years of healthy tennis and all he could get was a dozen of runner up plates and a couple of slams when Fedal wasn't around. Far from being the legendary superior player you're making him out o be. Again, Nole made him relevant, Fedal would've taken care of him as usual.
I don't think he is legendary player. He is legendary in comparison to Del Potro. Murray who isn't the ATG, even he is much better than Delpo.His 2016 run was a joke with a useless clown like RaoMUG in the final, why did you bring that up?
DP was already Jack Sock by that time, which part of not having a BH you do not understand? That's the reason why Tsonga never won a slam. Ooooh Merry reached the AO final! Good for him, too bad he lost it as usual. 5 years of healthy tennis and all he could get was a dozen of runner up plates and a couple of slams when Fedal wasn't around. Far from being the legendary superior player you're making him out o be. Again, Nole made him relevant, Fedal would've taken care of him as usual.
4 top 20 players though and 2 top 10. Probably was Tsonga's last hurrah and last year he was in his prime, and he pushed Murray to 5. Raonic had McEnroe coaching him that tournament and it's the best he ever played on grass. Respectable imo. Of course, it wasn't a really hard draw and he got some luck he didn't have to face Federer or Djokovic but they have easier Slams as well so I guess he deserved one too.
I went back and watched a few Del Potro matches, a few Thiem matches and matches of them playing each other. One thing the numbers don't show is that Del Potro, especially on the forehand side, consistently hit much much deeper than Thiem. Thiem's forehand frequently landed 2-3 feet past the service line while Del Potro was within a foot of the baseline on nearly every shot. When you consider the fact that balls slow down considerably after hitting the ground, it's easy to see why Del Potro had a much more intimidating forehand.I think you might be talking just in terms of pace, which Del Potro might be ahead in. But I believe that's because Del Potro hits a significantly flatter ball than Thiem, not because he "hits harder", if that makes sense. Thiem aside from generating a lot of pace, generates very close to Nadal level of topspin, which I feel takes more power in your stroke than what Del Potro does. It's just my theory.
