The Prince Phantom 93P is a gift to us from TW - My Review/AMA

[Tommy Haas]

@ej28405 I have tried X-One Biphase 17g with the 93P and it was really powerful and spin generation was harder because the ball rockets off the stringbed very fast. I swing with a linear stroke applying spin at the very end of the swing similar to Federer. If you swing with a windshield wipe then spin would probably be ok, but I'd still string it at the top of the tension range to tame the power.

 

[Dartagnan64]

I think the 93P should be strung with a spin-oriented string bed to make up for its one area of need. Thinner gauges, smooth poly crosses and gut or shaped poly mains still seem to offer the best performance. That being said, for sensitive elbows and flat swings, full bed natural gut would still work in this frame. Not so much a Pure Drive.

 

[Boubi]

Tested it with revolve 17, it was OK.
Anyone with cyclone 16 ?

 

[aaron_h27]

Just bought mine and its coming on Wed! Going to string it up full bed of luxilon natural gut at 60 lbs.

 

[gvsbdisco]

How are people getting along with 16 gauge gut in the mains and a thin poly in crosses? My current 93p has 17 gauge gut in mains and 1.2 poly in crosses. Plays well; have a second 93p coming my way and have a bunch of 16 gauge gut kicking around but thinking it may be too thick. Thoughts?

 

[hurworld]

How are people getting along with 16 gauge gut in the mains and a thin poly in crosses? My current 93p has 17 gauge gut in mains and 1.2 poly in crosses. Plays well; have a second 93p coming my way and have a bunch of 16 gauge gut kicking around but thinking it may be too thick. Thoughts?

Trade those 16 gauges strings for thinner ones?

 

[aaron_h27]

I'm hoping mine comes in at spec or a bit over spec. I would prefer to not have to modify it. Looking for the SW to be around 340 with 16G natural gut full bed.

 

[Dartagnan64]

I'm hoping mine comes in at spec or a bit over spec. I would prefer to not have to modify it. Looking for the SW to be around 340 with 16G natural gut full bed.

Trying for that canoe paddle feel? I’d be interested to hear your thoughts after hitting with 16g gut at 60 in that racket. Seems awfully high tension for that racket but maybe in a full bed it will be ok. In a hybrid I string 17g gut at 50 lbs. But I have poly to tame the power.

 

[jonestim]

In a hybrid I string 17g gut at 50 lbs. But I have poly to tame the power.

I am doing the 17g gut at 47 and poly at 43. Can't imagine going 60, even full bed - especially 16g. Different stroke for different folks.

 

[Doaner]

I'm hoping mine comes in at spec or a bit over spec. I would prefer to not have to modify it. Looking for the SW to be around 340 with 16G natural gut full bed.

I'm pretty sure you are going to be pretty right on SW if using 16 gut. Really interested in how that plays for you. keep us posted.

 

[High Lama]

Have you guys tried the head Graphene Touch prestige mp? Would you say its a more forgiving version of the 93p? It has slightly bigger head, lower weight, thicker beam etc. I found it a bit light in the hoop so I added 5 grams and now I’m grooving with it. Do any of the 93p users have a 2 handed backhand? I find it much easier to slice backhands with these types of racquets.

 

[aaron_h27]

I'm pretty sure you are going to be pretty right on SW if using 16 gut. Really interested in how that plays for you. keep us posted.

For sure! I want 340 SW and 7-8 pts HL. According to RacquetTune I may have to add 4-6g of lead if my 93p comes in at spec, but i won't know until i get it

 

[Power Player]

Yeah but

Have you guys tried the head Graphene Touch prestige mp? Would you say its a more forgiving version of the 93p? It has slightly bigger head, lower weight, thicker beam etc. I found it a bit light in the hoop so I added 5 grams and now I’m grooving with it. Do any of the 93p users have a 2 handed backhand? I find it much easier to slice backhands with these types of racquets.

Yeah, I use a 2 hander and my forehand is an extreme SW grip. On paper this frame would not make much sense for me, but it works absolutely great for me.

 

[markwillplay]

Mine are 12.5 but way headlight. I measure like 11pts. Every time I put lead on them to make them less headlight I take it off. I added shock shields to my grips and they came out heavier than the prince leather did. I might add a smidge down the road but I feel like I have more touch and maneuverability. I do have a tad on one to match but no real lead to speak of. One was more headlight than the other. I have not noticed that they are lacking in stability yet but I have not played someone who was really ripping it at me. I will find out because I serve and volley a lot and come in every chance I get. I have no idea what my sw is but I am guessing it is around 335 or so.

 

[tomato123]

How are people getting along with 16 gauge gut in the mains and a thin poly in crosses? My current 93p has 17 gauge gut in mains and 1.2 poly in crosses. Plays well; have a second 93p coming my way and have a bunch of 16 gauge gut kicking around but thinking it may be too thick. Thoughts?

I use 16g natural gut with 18g(1.10) Luxilon timo and it has been fantastic. Also understand the comments about the boardy feel, but going with super thin crosses strikes a great balance for me.

 

[Dartagnan64]

I use 16g natural gut with 18g(1.10) Luxilon timo and it has been fantastic. Also understand the comments about the boardy feel, but going with super thin crosses strikes a great balance for me.

Yes I think since gut grabs the ball due to friction and not sharp edges, 16g is doable although I prefer 17g myself. As long as it’s got a thin smooth poly to glide against, everything works magically.

My concern with full bed gut is that along with a board feel, the launch angle will be so low, it will be impossible to clear the net cord lol. The hybrid with poly seems to set that angle right where I need it.

 

[markwillplay]

Really interesting about layups and where weight is. I have two prince graphite pros from the 80s and they both weigh almost 13 oz. I can swing them all day. Thjat is where I got my feel for the 14/18 pattern. These sticks are really flexible and you almost can't help but hit with big spin with them. The 93p, even in stock form, is not quite as easy to swing but hits a lower trajectory ball. I could understand folks wanting that 14/18 pattern but I would not want to restring it so often.

 

[aaron_h27]

Trying for that canoe paddle feel? I’d be interested to hear your thoughts after hitting with 16g gut at 60 in that racket. Seems awfully high tension for that racket but maybe in a full bed it will be ok. In a hybrid I string 17g gut at 50 lbs. But I have poly to tame the power.

Lol! Luxilon NG lasts a long time and after about 10-20 hours it'll drop to 52-53 lbs which will be right where i want it. I would do mid 60s in a DR 98. So im dropping the tension about 6 lbs. I don't know if tension maintenace will be better with 18x20, but im hoping with the 18x20 i won't be as sensitive to the tension dropping, cause in my DR 98 that launch angle would increase a bit sending a few balls long.

 

[Tommy Haas]

Really interesting about layups and where weight is. I have two prince graphite pros from the 80s and they both weigh almost 13 oz. I can swing them all day. Thjat is where I got my feel for the 14/18 pattern. These sticks are really flexible and you almost can't help but hit with big spin with them. The 93p, even in stock form, is not quite as easy to swing but hits a lower trajectory ball. I could understand folks wanting that 14/18 pattern but I would not want to restring it so often.

For the 93P to be more spin friendly, it would have to have at least one of these two attributes. An open string pattern to bite into the ball more or be more flexible so the ball stays on the strings longer. It's currently neither, so I can see why poly is so popular with this frame. I use full bed multi myself.

 

[morten]

For the 93P to be more spin friendly, it would have to have at least one of these two attributes. An open string pattern to bite into the ball more or be more flexible so the ball stays on the strings longer. It's currently neither, so I can see why poly is so popular with this frame. I use full bed multi myself.

How is full bed multi? 17g?

 

[Tommy Haas]

How is full bed multi? 17g?

Comfortable, but becomes unwieldy when it loses tension as it gets even more challenging to impart spin. I'd have to switch to full western and go windshield wiper to spin the ball with looser tensions. That's not my normal swing style. I use a semi-western and have a more linear stroke adding spin at near the end with wrist action. When the ball bounces off too fast from looser tensions, I can't hit that way because the ball leaves the stringbed too fast. As you know, multifilament's weakness is tension maintenance.

 

[hurworld]

Have you guys tried the head Graphene Touch prestige mp? Would you say its a more forgiving version of the 93p? It has slightly bigger head, lower weight, thicker beam etc. I found it a bit light in the hoop so I added 5 grams and now I’m grooving with it. Do any of the 93p users have a 2 handed backhand? I find it much easier to slice backhands with these types of racquets.

I'm former 1hbh switched to 2hbh. So I do 2hbh topspin / drive but 1hbh slice, SW-ish FH. I find the added heft and headlight balance of the 93P give superb slice swing on both wings.

 

[atelic]

That's not my normal swing style. I use a semi-western and have a more linear stroke adding spin at near the end with wrist action.

Hey Tommy- technical question, since I have a similar grip and stroke. My feel is that wrist imparts racket head speed, which helps generate more spin, but that the real generation of spin is more in the supination of the forearm in a flattened out stroke. Thoughts?

 

[Dartagnan64]

Lol! Luxilon NG lasts a long time and after about 10-20 hours it'll drop to 52-53 lbs which will be right where i want it. I would do mid 60s in a DR 98. So im dropping the tension about 6 lbs. I don't know if tension maintenace will be better with 18x20, but im hoping with the 18x20 i won't be as sensitive to the tension dropping, cause in my DR 98 that launch angle would increase a bit sending a few balls long.

I still think you can drop by 10lbs in the 93P. I used to play with a Pure Drive with gut/4G and had it strung at 60lbs gut and 55lb poly crosses. Wrecked my arm so I moved to Prince rackets. I string the 93p at 50/45 with gut/Cream. At lower gauges and way softer poly. So going from a DR98 you’d probably get similar power levels with full bed gut at 55 lbs. But start with 60 and see, I guess. You’ll know pretty quickly if its right.

 

[am1899]

UPS just came and delivered a 93p. Looks good. 327g unstrung. Will string it up in the next day or 2 and take it for a spin.

 

[aaron_h27]

I still think you can drop by 10lbs in the 93P. I used to play with a Pure Drive with gut/4G and had it strung at 60lbs gut and 55lb poly crosses. Wrecked my arm so I moved to Prince rackets. I string the 93p at 50/45 with gut/Cream. At lower gauges and way softer poly. So going from a DR98 you’d probably get similar power levels with full bed gut at 55 lbs. But start with 60 and see, I guess. You’ll know pretty quickly if its right.

If it's as low-powered as you guys say it is I may end up around 57-58 lbs after it's all said and done. But less than 24 hours until it's here! I'll be stringing it up and hitting tomorrow.

 

[Jannick]

Actually not low powered at all to me. 18g poly main, 17g cross.
Feels a bit too powerful for my liking and have to resort to a spin heavy game.

Will try switching up the strings

 

[Dartagnan64]

Actually not low powered at all to me. 18g poly main, 17g cross.
Feels a bit too powerful for my liking and have to resort to a spin heavy game.

Will try switching up the strings

It’s more a launch angle issue to me. The racket swings fast and easy for me, but it hits with lower launch. To get the angle more to what I’m used to, i had to lower string tensions.

I don’t use full poly so I’m not sure how the ball launches off a 93p with that set up. But with multi and gut/poly setups I needed about 5lbs lower tension compared to my Phantom to get similar results.

 

[aaron_h27]

Mine came in at 325 g unstrung, 5g under spec. A little upset about that, but nothing some lead tape can't fix.

 

[wassamara]

Same as mine. You probably add about 5g at 7” from the buttcap. Most likely the balance and sw are correct so u can add the remaining weight there to minimize variance in the sw and bp. I actually liked it was underweight. Because in the end it was easier when playing longer matches

 

[aaron_h27]

I'm mad at myself for purchasing this racket.

18x20's don't normally work for me, I don't like leather grips, and I like to use thick strings but I thought this racket would be different, I am a creative player who likes to use slices, dropshots, come to net often, but can hang on the baseline when needed. 5.0 player. I read so many things about this racket being arm friendly, spin friendly, great feel, etc...this racket isn't for me.

Strung it up with 1.30 Luxilon Gut at 60 lbs.

Extremely stiff feeling, which is to be expected fresh off the stringer, but my wrist was hurting horribly after about 15-20 minutes of hitting which never happened with my DR 98, and is still hurting as i type this

Didn't feel spin friendly at all, maybe if you compare it to other 18x20's but my DR 98 had much more spin. Struggled with kick serves.

Launch angle was super unpredictable, I was expecting a super low launch angle, nope. Super high launch, and balls flying out cause no topspin to bring them down.

Slice wasn't any better than with my DR 98

Racket didn't feel stable at all for it's weight class and played much stiffer than the specs would suggest

I guess if you play with 18-19 gauge strings you could make this racket work, I like natural gut I don't want to do that.

I'm going to send this back to TW, or if anyone would like to purchase a 93P with a 1/4 grip please message me.

I'm going to just lead up my DR 98's and call it a day. I really wanted to like this racket.

Extremely disappointed since everyone here likes this frame, and i really wanted to like it also. but i believe it's just my game & string choice that does not mesh well with 18x20 rackets

 

[atelic]

Sucks man. Sorry to hear it. Expensive chance you took to buy and string it w a full bed of lux gut. Probably not the best racquet if you're looking for spin friendly while playing all gut at 60lbs.

 

[ohiostate124]

Maybe try lowering the tension before giving up on it.

 

[aaron_h27]

Maybe try lowering the tension before giving up on it.

That's the thing, i don't think the tension was the problem because i had trouble controlling my shots right off the stringer. I had a lot of balls go long on me which normally only happens when the tension is too loose.

It was quite a weird experience, My racket was stiff but I was still sending balls 2-3 ft long that normally fall in.

This racket isn't for me, my game just doesn't like 18x20's.

I will give it one more shot as I have a hitting lesson with one of my students tomorrow on the way to Tennis Warehouse, but it's probably going back unless someone would like to buy it here.

 

[JOSHL]

As many others have said, this frame needs to be strung low, very low. Even with gut/syn/multi.

 

[aaron_h27]

Again I don't think tension is the issue here, probably thinner gauge strings would have helped, but the racket did not work for me and I don't want to spend money trying to figure out what tensions work in this racket when I already know what works on my DR 98's. I've strung at high tensions with gut before on my DR 98 with no arm problems whatsoever. I guess what im trying to say is my DR 98 played fine I just thought this racket would suite my game better and it doesn't, but anyways if anyone wants a 93p with full natty gut. Message me

61 RA with full natty gut should not feel stiff, but 18x20's have always felt blah to me. I'll stick with my 16x19 frames from here on out.

 

[jonestim]

I'm mad at myself for purchasing this racket.

18x20's don't normally work for me, I don't like leather grips, and I like to use thick strings but I thought this racket would be different, I am a creative player who likes to use slices, dropshots, come to net often, but can hang on the baseline when needed. 5.0 player. I read so many things about this racket being arm friendly, spin friendly, great feel, etc...this racket isn't for me.

Strung it up with 1.30 Luxilon Gut at 60 lbs.

Extremely stiff feeling, which is to be expected fresh off the stringer, but my wrist was hurting horribly after about 15-20 minutes of hitting which never happened with my DR 98, and is still hurting as i type this

Didn't feel spin friendly at all, maybe if you compare it to other 18x20's but my DR 98 had much more spin. Struggled with kick serves.

Launch angle was super unpredictable, I was expecting a super low launch angle, nope. Super high launch, and balls flying out cause no topspin to bring them down.

Slice wasn't any better than with my DR 98

Racket didn't feel stable at all for it's weight class and played much stiffer than the specs would suggest

I guess if you play with 18-19 gauge strings you could make this racket work, I like natural gut I don't want to do that.

I'm going to send this back to TW, or if anyone would like to purchase a 93P with a 1/4 grip please message me.

I'm going to just lead up my DR 98's and call it a day. I really wanted to like this racket.

Extremely disappointed since everyone here likes this frame, and i really wanted to like it also. but i believe it's just my game & string choice that does not mesh well with 18x20 rackets

Does not surprise me at all. It isn't a racquet that does well with 16g or high tensions - and you have both. Probably not worth hitting with tomorrow. It's not going to be any better.

And do the person you are selling it to a favor - cut that string out.

 

[atelic]

For what it's worth - my first session with this racquet, I hit the backdrop with like, at least 5 balls. It had been a long time since I had sailed anything that long.

It's worth spending the time on this frame if you can be flexible w strings and gauges. Unless it really hurts your arm. Which seems to be the case.

 

[aaron_h27]

Does not surprise me at all. It isn't a racquet that does well with 16g or high tensions - and you have both. Probably not worth hitting with tomorrow. It's not going to be any better.

And do the person you are selling it to a favor - cut that string out.

This poly craze has really got everyone thinking 60 lbs is high, but with full natural gut im telling you it's not a high tension at all for such a high powered string, but yes you're probably right and it will go back to TW tomorrow. But i had issues with a high launch angle on this racket so again im telling you it's not the tension. If the tension was too tight I would have sent more balls in the net, which was not the case here...

but regardless of the reason the racket did not work for me, thats all. Hope you guys enjoy the frame!

 

[aaron_h27]

Sucks man. Sorry to hear it. Expensive chance you took to buy and string it w a full bed of lux gut. Probably not the best racquet if you're looking for spin friendly while playing all gut at 60lbs.

My instinct told me this too, but I went against better judgement and saw how people were raving about how spin friendly it was, and it probably is with 18 or 19 gauge strings, but I'm just not a person who wants to use poly due to me not owning a stringing machine and I like to come to net often and use dropshots. My DR 98 had more than enough spin even with full natty gut

 

[markwillplay]

I can't imagine playing any string at 60 in this frame. I have klip legend at 50 and velocity at 45 and spin is fine. That pattern seems really tight to me. I am probably going to drift back to a larger frame for competition but that is not because of the feel or spin for sure. So far I play better with my 100's.

 

[Dartagnan64]

Is this where I get to say I told you so?

It’s a very string dependent frame. With lower tensions you’ll get more dwell time and this will lead to more spin. This will help. With smaller gauges you’ll get less string friction and more ball bite and thus more spin. This will help.

I said it would feel like a canoe paddle with gut at 60lbs. Then you try it and say it feels like a canoe paddle and I’m left scratching my head. Put in gut at 50 with a poly cross at 45 all at 17 g and then try it for a week. Can’t judge a racket with completely wrong strings.

 

[atelic]

My instinct told me this too, but I went against better judgement and saw how people were raving about how spin friendly it was, and it probably is with 18 or 19 gauge strings, but I'm just not a person who wants to use poly due to me not owning a stringing machine and I like to come to net often and use dropshots. My DR 98 had more than enough spin even with full natty gut

I play with hyper g until it breaks. I serve and volley a lot. It can be done. Give it a whirl. Gut mains. Poly crosses?!

 

[ohiostate124]

I play a pretty flat game but even with full 17g gut at 50 lbs, I can get spin when I want it.

This thread is 48 pages of people saying lower tensions and thin strings over and over. There’s a reason for that.

 

[Power Player]

I'm mad at myself for purchasing this racket.

18x20's don't normally work for me, I don't like leather grips, and I like to use thick strings but I thought this racket would be different, I am a creative player who likes to use slices, dropshots, come to net often, but can hang on the baseline when needed. 5.0 player. I read so many things about this racket being arm friendly, spin friendly, great feel, etc...this racket isn't for me.

Strung it up with 1.30 Luxilon Gut at 60 lbs.

Extremely stiff feeling, which is to be expected fresh off the stringer, but my wrist was hurting horribly after about 15-20 minutes of hitting which never happened with my DR 98, and is still hurting as i type this

Didn't feel spin friendly at all, maybe if you compare it to other 18x20's but my DR 98 had much more spin. Struggled with kick serves.

Launch angle was super unpredictable, I was expecting a super low launch angle, nope. Super high launch, and balls flying out cause no topspin to bring them down.

Slice wasn't any better than with my DR 98

Racket didn't feel stable at all for it's weight class and played much stiffer than the specs would suggest

I guess if you play with 18-19 gauge strings you could make this racket work, I like natural gut I don't want to do that.

I'm going to send this back to TW, or if anyone would like to purchase a 93P with a 1/4 grip please message me.

I'm going to just lead up my DR 98's and call it a day. I really wanted to like this racket.

Extremely disappointed since everyone here likes this frame, and i really wanted to like it also. but i believe it's just my game & string choice that does not mesh well with 18x20 rackets

I had a feeling when i saw the string and tension that you wouldn’t be happy. This is a low 40s full poly frame honestly. I wouldnt like it at 60 pounds with gut either.

 

[Power Player]

I play a pretty flat game but even with full 17g gut at 50 lbs, I can get spin when I want it.

This thread is 48 pages of people saying lower tensions and thin strings over and over. There’s a reason for that.

Lol. Exactly! Even 1.25 gauge is fine.

 

[wassamara]

I concur that you should try with the strings that the users are saying. After investing so much in a racquet, i think that you should try at least one or two strings setup. At least you can say that even with the suggestions the racquet is still not good. I have bought some racquets in the past that i did not like at all. But I figured after spending 180$ i should at least spend about 30$ with strings before saying nogo. If it was 3/8 i would take it. Really hoping that you give it another try.

 

[gvsbdisco]

Anyone having any hand discomfort with this racquet. Specifically, mild discomfort in the muscle between the ulnar side of the wrist and the pinky finger. I think I am getting this because of the extreme flare of the buttcap (relatively speaking compared to my other racquets). Playing a size 2. Just curious....about to buy a second 93p but this is bugging me a bit.

 

[Ultra 2]

My instinct told me this too, but I went against better judgement and saw how people were raving about how spin friendly it was, and it probably is with 18 or 19 gauge strings, but I'm just not a person who wants to use poly due to me not owning a stringing machine and I like to come to net often and use dropshots. My DR 98 had more than enough spin even with full natty gut

Wait a few weeks to see if they release a more open pattern. They brought back every feature on this frame to resemble the classic 93s except for the open 14x18 pattern. Time will tell.

 

[CiscoPC600]

Not as many responses to my question as I was expecting given the popularity of this thread but for the sake of being thorough, is anyone using this frame in 4.5 or higher competition (e.g. tournaments, league matches)?