WADA admits meldonium not performance enhancing

[SpinToWin]

Melt down

Meltdownium?

 

[PrinceMoron]

Meltdownium?

Sure over now

 

[SpinToWin]

Sure over now

 

[Chadillac]

I check whether my thories are right by the end result.

So, if Sharapova Dopingapova's lawyers don't sue WADA, your theory is ... ?

The drug maker is sueing, not sharapova. Wada will have to prove its a ped in court (only 1 study so far and they used 2-3x the recommended dosages), i dont think they can. The company will also bring in collusion with the usada.

Wada messed up by targetting russia, their intentions are pretty obvious.

 

[Tennis_Hands]

The drug maker is sueing, not sharapova. Wada will have to prove its a ped in court (only 1 study so far and they used 2-3x the recommended dosages), i dont think they can. The company will also bring in collusion with the usada.

Wada messed up by targetting russia, their intentions are pretty obvious.

We will get back to this in a couple of months.

Be patient.

In the meantime more athletes are getting caught despite of Dopingapova's positive.

 

[Chadillac]

We will get back to this in a couple of months.

Be patient.

In the meantime more athletes are getting caught despite of Dopingapova's positive.

More athletes or more russian athletes? They were targetted in an olympic year, its pretty obvious

 

[Tennis_Hands]

More athletes or more russian athletes? They were targetted in an olympic year, its pretty obvious

Does it matter what athletes are caught?

The point is, after the positive EVERYBODY should have taken notice by now.

After all, as the appologets of her actions said, she is not that stupid to continue taking it, if she knows that she will get caught.

So, are all those athletes stupid or there is something else going on?

 

[Jaitock1991]

So based on that statement, yhey have somehow admitted that it isn't performance enhancing.
Cool.

 

[Chadillac]

Does it matter what athletes are caught?

You dont find it odd that 100% of the people caught are all from a certain region? Some would call that targetting since there is no proof its a ped.

Its up to wada at this point, they have to prove its a ped, the company doesnt have to prove it isnt a ped. I think wada is going to lose this one because the only study preformed used 1g dosages daily, when the max recommened is 500mg in cycles.

 

[Bartelby]

WADA has certainly admitted that they have no evidence the drug is a PED. They merely have evidence that some athletes taking it think it is such.

It seems within its powers to decide to ban something on these grounds unless an individual or drug company takes that specific issue to a court.

 

[Bartelby]

Wikipedia (in an article very well referenced) suggests Meldonium is an East European drug made by an East European exporter:

Meldonium (INN), trade-named as Mildronate, Mildronāts also known as Quaterine, MET-88, and THP (for its chemical name, see below) is a limited-market pharmaceutical, developed in 1970 by Ivars Kalviņš, and manufactured primarily by Grindeks of Latvia and several generic manufacturers. It is distributed in Eastern European countries as an anti-ischemia medication.[1]

Since January 1, 2016, it has been on the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) list of substances banned from use by athletes.[2] However, there are debates over its use as an athletic performance enhancer. Some athletes are known to have been using it before it was banned.[3]


Meldonium ... is registered and prescribed in Latvia, Russia, Ukraine, Georgia, Kazakhstan, Azerbaijan, Belarus, Uzbekistan, Moldova and Kyrgyzstan


Meldonium is manufactured by Grindeks, a Latvian pharmaceutical company, with offices in thirteen Eastern European countries[75] as a treatment for heart conditions.[76][77] The company identifies it as one of their main products.[78]It had sales of 65 million euros in 2013.[66]

This of course makes it easy for WADA to attack specifically East European athletes, if one were a mind to think they would do such a thing.

 

[SpinToWin]

 

[Mainad]

WADA has certainly admitted that they have no evidence the drug is a PED. They merely have evidence that some athletes taking it think it is such.

It seems within its powers to decide to ban something on these grounds unless an individual or drug company takes that specific issue to a court.

Interesting all the same that some athletes think it is performance enhancing and that is why they take it!

 

[Bartelby]

Interesting, yes, but hardly convincing. They are people who've spent their life playing a game and not studying science. Athletes are also extremely prone to habitual behaviours, or perhaps noticeably prone.

Interesting all the same that some athletes think it is performance enhancing and that is why they take it!

 

[JSZ]

Ivar Kalvins, the Latvian chemist who invented Meldonium, says he started working on the drug for use by Soviet troops in Afghanistan.
It gave the soldiers extra endurance and oxygen-carrying capacity.
That is why the athletes who learnt about it thought it was worth taking.
WADA noticed that many athletes were using it and WADA thought it was quite likely that it was performance enhancing - they banned it from 2016 and warned all athletes that the ban was coming. That isn't "admitting they have no evidence" ... that is saying "this is suspect, we are banning it, stop taking it".

http://www.wired.com/2016/03/original-users-meldonium-sharapovas-banned-drug-soviet-super-soldiers/

I think it is more likely Sharapova took it to improve her endurance than because she had a heart condition.

 

[Bartelby]

What a drug salesman says to sell drugs is interesting but not definitive. They could have brought espresso coffee machines to do the same job for Soviet troops in Afghanistan in all probability.

Pills however weigh a lot less than Caggia Espresso machines and pills have that charming placebo effect that coffee seldom has.

WADA did one study via a third American party which showed intention to use it as a PED may be present and that's it.

 

[JSZ]

It is really sweet of you to defend Maria like this Bartleby.

Maybe it was a US conspiracy to set Russian athletes back ... maybe the Americans never landed on the moon? Buzz Aldrin might have made the video in the Arizona desert?

 

[Bartelby]

It's really kind of you to say so, but you really have nothing to contribute other than the usual crude defensive gestures when your beloved country is put under the microscope.

 

[Bartelby]

As we now know as a matter of public record, USADA lobbied to have Meldonium banned and it produced the one small report through a sister organisation that WADA relies on in order to ban the drug.

 

[Chadillac]

Ivar Kalvins, the Latvian chemist who invented Meldonium, says he started working on the drug for use by Soviet troops in Afghanistan.
It gave the soldiers extra endurance and oxygen-carrying capacity.
That is why the athletes who learnt about it thought it was worth taking.
WADA noticed that many athletes were using it and WADA thought it was quite likely that it was performance enhancing - they banned it from 2016 and warned all athletes that the ban was coming. That isn't "admitting they have no evidence" ... that is saying "this is suspect, we are banning it, stop taking it".

http://www.wired.com/2016/03/original-users-meldonium-sharapovas-banned-drug-soviet-super-soldiers/

I think it is more likely Sharapova took it to improve her endurance than because she had a heart condition.

Have you ever seen sharapova play? She maxes like 3 ball ralleys and is usually done in an hour. Her style of play doesnt need endurance suppliments. Look at her shoulders, she isnt on roids. Look at her head size, she isnt on hgh.

 

[JSZ]

Yes, I have seen her play. She plays plenty of points where rally length is over six shots. And plenty of three set matches.

Check her rally length stats here http://www.tennisabstract.com/charting/MariaSharapova.html

 

[nowhereman]

Are we still talking about this?

 

[West Coast Ace]

Have you ever seen sharapova play? She maxes like 3 ball ralleys and is usually done in an hour. Her style of play doesnt need endurance suppliments. Look at her shoulders, she isnt on roids. Look at her head size, she isnt on hgh.

And you know that there are many other drugs for heart issues. And if her heart issue were so bad, pro athlete probably wasn't a wise decision - or she should have retired now that she's got a nice bank balance. And just having a family history of diabetes doesn't mean you have to start taking drugs. And why didn't she list it on the form the players are given and the justification? If she didn't have anything to hide....

And what about the other Eastern Block athletes who were found to be taking it? Come on. I didn't want to believe it when the scandal 1st broke but there's just too much against her.

 

[Chadillac]

And you know that there are many other drugs for heart issues. And if her heart issue were so bad, pro athlete probably wasn't a wise decision - or she should have retired now that she's got a nice bank balance. And just having a family history of diabetes doesn't mean you have to start taking drugs. And why didn't she list it on the form the players are given and the justification? If she didn't have anything to hide....

And what about the other Eastern Block athletes who were found to be taking it? Come on. I didn't want to believe it when the scandal 1st broke but there's just too much against her.

I thought she applied for a medical exemption and it was denied at the AO. She has been declaring it for the past 10 years. Its common over there because of its price.

Jsz, nice site (she is over 50% in 1-3 shot ralleys), i just dont see her needing endurance ped's. The water retention aspect could be useful though in the AO heat.

 

[booson]

Are diuretics PEDs? No? Why are they banned then!?!?

 

[mightyrick]

Are diuretics PEDs? No? Why are they banned then!?!?

If you can drop five pounds of water in a very short time before you compete... that is an obvious advantage in sports where weight classes are involved. Not to mention that diuretics are used as masking agents for other drugs. They are banned for good reason.

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

As we now know as a matter of public record, USADA lobbied to have Meldonium banned and it produced the one small report through a sister organisation that WADA relies on in order to ban the drug.

All this is irrelevant.

WADA can ban whatever they please. If they put it in the list and you don't comply, it's your fault.

Poor Maria Sharapova. She has nothing left. Except her millions, her mansions, and her good looks.

 

[Bartelby]

You are very accepting and trusting of authority. Some might even say gullible and lacking in critical facility.

All this is irrelevant.

WADA can ban whatever they please. If they put it in the list and you don't comply, it's your fault.

Poor Maria Sharapova. She has nothing left. Except her millions, her mansions, and her good looks.

 

[moonballs]

What a drug salesman says to sell drugs is interesting but not definitive. They could have brought espresso coffee machines to do the same job for Soviet troops in Afghanistan in all probability.

Pills however weigh a lot less than Caggia Espresso machines and pills have that charming placebo effect that coffee seldom has.

WADA did one study via a third American party which showed intention to use it as a PED may be present and that's it.

Let's say, WADA banned a placebo, so what? A long term use of a PED placebo chemical can still have negative effects on the liver, kidney etc. the only dodgy part is WADA left out the most common trade name of the drug in the annoucement.

 

[Bartelby]

You'd have to worry about either their intelligence or integrity in leaving out the common trade name.

 

[Rusty Shackleford]

You are very accepting and trusting of authority. Some might even say gullible and lacking in critical facility.

Where do you get that notion? Whether WADA specifically targetted meldonium to screw with Eastern European countries is irrelevant. As a matter of fact, it is mathematically impossible for so many elite athletes to have heart conditions requiring the use of meldonium, so I think what WADA did makes a lot of sense on its own.

The real question is, are these people that are getting caught stupid, or just over-confident?

 

[YK]

Before moving to the States in '94, I practiced cardiology in Russian Federation. Mildronate was one of the most useless medications for its officially advertised purpose. If one looks at the quality of trials behind it, it would be plainly obvious. Despite the fact that it brings millions in sales annually, it is a crappy medication and I never found it to work. There is a US approved drug that works on the same pathway and, while it has an FDA approval, the efficacy of it was modest at best at the time of approval and has been questioned in professional literature lately. It would be interesting to see what kind of evidence WADA is going to produce to prove that it is a ped; it is barely a med, as far as I am concerned.

That's not to say that the statements that she took it for "health reasons" aren't an insult to intelligence.

 

[Tennis_Hands]

You dont find it odd that 100% of the people caught are all from a certain region? Some would call that targetting since there is no proof its a ped.

Its up to wada at this point, they have to prove its a ped, the company doesnt have to prove it isnt a ped. I think wada is going to lose this one because the only study preformed used 1g dosages daily, when the max recommened is 500mg in cycles.

Does it matter what athletes are caught?

Don't you find it odd that athletes continue to get caught after the huge doping scandal with Sharapova?

Or they don't watch television on top of not reading their E-mails?

 

[Bartelby]

Some one actually found a study and the finding was something along the lines that those over sixty with severe heart problems could exercise a few more seconds on it than not.

Before moving to the States in '94, I practiced cardiology in Russian Federation. Mildronate was one of the most useless medications for its officially advertised purpose. If one looks at the quality of trials behind it, it would be plainly obvious. Despite the fact that it brings millions in sales annually, it is a crappy medication and I never found it to work. There is a US approved drug that works on the same pathway and, while it has an FDA approval, the efficacy of it was modest at best at the time of approval and has been questioned in professional literature lately. It would be interesting to see what kind of evidence WADA is going to produce to prove that it is a ped; it is barely a med, as far as I am concerned.

That's not to say that the statements that she took it for "health reasons" aren't an insult to intelligence.

 

[JSZ]

Come off it Bartleby.

5-th BALTIC SPORT SCIENCE CONFERENCE CURRENT ISSUES AND NEW IDEAS IN SPORT SCIENCE

MILDRONATE INCREASES AEROBIC CAPABILITIES OF ATHLETES THROUGH
CARNITINE-LOWERING EFFECT
Maija Dzintare1,2, Ivars Kalvins

Latvian Institute of Organic Synthesis; 2
Latvian Academy of Sport Education
Mildronate (3-(2,2,2-trimethylhydrazine)propionate dihydrate, THP; MET-88) is an anti-ischemic
drug developed in the Latvian Institute of Organic Synthesis [1]. Actually Mildronate is used in several
countries in cardiology, neurology and other branches of medicine including the sport medicine [2].
...
Mildronate increases endurance properties and aerobic capabilities of athletes (freestyle and GrecoRoman
wrestlers, judokas, canoers, rowers and volleyball players). Mildronate improves functional
parameters of the heart activity, the drug increases physical work capabilities, increases the rate of the
organism rehabilitation after maximal and sub-maximal loads, hyper-loads, it activates CNS functions
and protects against stress [4].

Mildronate is usually administered to athletes perorally in dose 0.5-1.0 g twice a day before training,
as 14-21 day course during training period and 10-14 days before competitions [4].
Mildronate is recommended for use as pharmacological remedy that increases physical work
capabilities of athletes. Mildronate and its metabolites are not included in the doping list; it does not
provoke any undesired side effects.

Here is a link to the journal. http://www.lsu.lt/sites/default/fil...ent_issues_and_new_ideas_in_sport_science.pdf

Ivar Kalvins, the guy who invented it. Of course he is trying to sell it and perhaps it doesn't work. But I bet Maria thought it would increase her endurance.

 

[Bartelby]

Come off what? All you've done is quote claims from a blurb. The NYT reported research doctors arguing that carnitine-lowering is the last thing you want in a PED.

WADA has never claimed they were banning Meldonium because they have pharmacological proof that it is a PED.