MEP vs ET Players - Original TT Epic
- Thread starter AnyPUG
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S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
What!? They didn't stop at 5-0 for a suspenseful TBC in part 4 !?
No; part 4 is for the post-game interviews.
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
Topher admitted that he was getting great first-person intel watching MEP v Sean because he'll have to face the same thing.
I wouldn't come down too hard on Sean: I do the same thing in my matches occasionally but I'm not being filmed or mic'd up. It's rare to play someone who never does that.
Mixeddubskickserve
Rookie
Cam Williams is the man im watching him right now for the WTA final in Madrid he's great!
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
I'm not sure how I stumbled on his channel but now I'm hooked. He's so passionate, jumping out of his chair, pumping his fist, screaming "bang bang!", etc.
I remember "watching" the Djokovic v Federer final from 2019 being described by O'Shannessey and whoever his broadcast partner was and it was still gripping even though I couldn't see it.
Cam makes you feel like you're courtside.
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
IMO, it wasn't the physical part of the match that caused him to hyperventilate; it was nerves and tension.
Mixeddubskickserve
Rookie
Personally I enjoy the "double bang bang!!!!!" it's great. I actually watch the match on TV on mute and then have cam as the commentator for me it makes it so good
@tlm @S&V-not_dead_yet great debate between you two without cheap shots!
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
"The lob goes up...X hits an OH...it's a winner! Bang! Get that outta my face!"
"That's what champions do!"
"Shotmakers make shots."
"I like this format because I can say whatever the f#!$ I want."
Mixeddubskickserve
Rookie
He's after staying up until 04:30am his time just to commentate on that final and said he has work later.....the guy is committed!
Get that outta my face is classic...going to say that to an opponent some day!
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
How do you think you'd fare v MEP indoors [do you play indoors?]? Seems that your net game would do well.
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
You're gonna be a very popular guy...maybe even famous!
+1
If court surface didn't make a difference, Nadal would be at 56 grand slams (or 4 if all surfaces behaved like AO) by now.
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
My formative tennis years were played indoors on fast surface.
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
But I'm assuming you're not forming anymore.
So you think you'd do better than outdoors?
Mixeddubskickserve
Rookie
I might even upload the match highlights to YouTube
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
Only one way to find out!
Jack the Hack
Hall of Fame
I just want to point out that Orange Shirt Guy in this video is @TennisTroll, who played college tennis at a mid-major and has had a 5.0 rating for several years. My understanding from past posts is that he's tried unsuccessfully to appeal down to 4.5 before, but keeps getting denied. I think he wins around 50% of his USTA League matches in 5.0, but he can probably speak for himself if he chooses to.
That video is the one that started the MEP (@GSG) phenomenon. It showed that a 4.5 guy with unconventional strokes, but good athlecticism, mental toughness, and consistency can hang with an average 5.0 with a traditional game. Basically, it proved that it's not how pretty your strokes are if you can keep the ball coming back in the court over and over.
Internet keyboard warriors took tons of potshots at Ben's game, saying he's not a 4.5. But the bottom line is that he's had repeated winning seasons at 4.5 in at least two Sections (Georgia and I believe Virginia) and has won 4.5 tournaments. His rating is earned.
Are there 4.5 rated players, or even 4.0 players that could beat him? Of course! I think he would totally admit that. There are even matches on the Tennis Troll channel where he loses. And in this thread, Ben talked about how he lost a couple singles matches at the recent state tournament to high 4.5 level players. That isn't the point. The point is that you can win ugly at 4.5 and Ben's done it repeatedly. Criticisms be damned, it's a valid playstyle that a lot of people can't handle.
Ian got into the MEP game by doing an analysis of the Tennis Troll video and basically saying the same thing that I just wrote. I think it's cool that he was willing to back his talk up by playing Ben, and that Ben was willing to travel up to Milwaukie to play numerous ET guys. He's a competitor and willing to put himself out there, which I respect.
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
Well said.
Does everyone who beats MEP get bumped up to 5.0? Is Boss of Atlanta now 5.0? Maybe if tennis troll had released that video 7 months ago - we would be seeing that guy play Ian.. Since Boss of Atlanta beat him 6-1, 6-1 is he like a 5.5 now? Just asking..
BoA successfully appealed down from 5.0 at the end of 2019, then ratings didn't change at the end of 2020. If he's not bumped to 5.0 again soon I'd be surprised based on his 2020 results.
While Ben is undoubtedly mentally tough[1] and a good strategic player (and I'm not even sure why people are arguing about his rating - it's a 4.5C i.e confirmed/computer rating not a self-rate), I have to wonder if the mental toughness of a pusher/bunter is in any way remarkable. To me, mental toughness is about not letting the match situation affect your strokes, i.e, swinging without getting tight. But pushers are already muscling the ball more as opposed to swinging, so getting tight in the body in tense match situations doesn't affect them as much as people with full swings.
[1] basing this on something he said about army/marine training where mission is more important than feelings
Raul_SJ
G.O.A.T.
Okay Sean can be mad at himself and scream all he wants about being out of breath snd "exhausted". We will cut him slack
But Sean went over the line by calling the MEP transition to indoors a "bullsh!t excuse". Obviously it is a huge factor as MEP said himself.
Also, Sean is not able to wrap his head around the fact that a non USTA 4.5 league could be on a higher level than a USTA 4.5 league.
But Sean is babbling on about how his private league 4.5 would destroy MEP and insinuating that MEP is not a USTA 4.5.
MEP is a strong USTA 4.5 as his 14-1 record attests. There is no dispute on this.
heninfan99
Talk Tennis Guru
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
Yeah, the line about "a 4.5 is a 4.5" implies that all 4.5s are alike in skills, which is not at all correct. I don't think a weak 4.5 will do nearly as well vs Sean than a strong 4.5.
Then again, as @jmnk demonstrated, this league calls anyone a 4.5 who isn't currently playing college tennis. That could mean 5.0 & 5.5. If so, yes, those guys would crush Sean and any 4.5, strong or otherwise.
We could at least compare apples to apples if we knew the UTR of these club "4.5s".
FuzzyYellowBalls
Legend
Sort of, but it's the same 6-9 people commenting, I can't even keep up, well, definitely hit a nerve with a certain group, it's fascinating the back and forth.
Do you know how the NTRP system works?
Mixeddubskickserve
Rookie
Sorry guys slightly off topic here (I'm not based in USA) but I often go there on business and play tennis anyway is it possible to search by name on some site to check a players NTRP?
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
Tennis record dot com
Jack the Hack
Hall of Fame
To look up a player's official NTRP rating, you go to the following link and input their name into the "Find NTRP Rating Info" in the search box:
https://tennislink.usta.com/Leagues/Common/default.aspx
Tennis Record .com may import the NTRP rating from the USTA, but their dynamic rating estimate can be wildly off from reality.
If the official TennisLink site shows no rating for a player, it means they probably have an expired rating and membership, or they don't play USTA League or tournaments.
On that same TennisLink page, if you search a name in the "Stats and Standings" section and set the filters to show all years, you can also find a complete history of all official USTA League and tournament matches a person has played, which is useful in seeing how they might have progressed or regressed in ratings over the years, which can give you an idea about their skillset and experience a bit.
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70sStrokes
Rookie
Steve Kerr coach of the Warriors once said that the reason great players were not good coaches is that great players skipped steps. Jordon, Bird, etc went 1,4,6,9,10 so they are unable to explain steps 2,3,5,7,8 because they bypassed them. The same probably goes for some good great tennis players.
Dolgopolov85
G.O.A.T.
Again, that doesn't really work when comparing Ian with Top Tennis guys because by pro standards, neither Alex nor Simon are amazing players. If we're going to say Alex or Simon are too talented to teach tennis, that's some other logic universe that I do not understand.
LOL. Do you understand sarcasm?! Haha.
Steve Kerr seems to be kinda a moron - so there is that.. Steve Nash (as a coach) was pretty damn good - and he is doing fine on a team stocked with a-holes. Hell you could probably break one of Nash legs and he could still dribble around Kerr.
True. Since pushers don't have any "A game" attacking type shots - they don't have to worry as much about a "down" day. They are like the opposite of someone like Dustin Brown.. Who can beat anyone when hot - but can also lose to pretty mediocre pros.
4.5s don't usually lose sets to 4.0s. You might disagree with the guy but giving his opinion is hardly crossing any line. Ratings are dynamic maybe if MEP had to play indoors he wouldn't be rated as high. This is hardly controversial - many players are better on one surface then another.
StringSnapper
Hall of Fame
This was very entertaining. I loved how at the end of the 2nd video people were saying MEP isn't a 4.5, then he proceeds to bagel Sean in the 3rd
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
It’s called regression to the mean.This was very entertaining. I loved how at the end of the 2nd video people were saying MEP isn't a 4.5, then he proceeds to bagel Sean in the 3rd
Apparently MEP took him to places he didn't want to go in the first two sets.
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FiddlerDog
Hall of Fame
As MEP said, it is 10%.
The Youtube comments are overwhelmingly positive, and most everyone is loving this series.
Correct. Sean lost his breath on the first point, and did not regain it until the 3rd set. It was not fatigue.
I have experienced that at the start of a tournament, but it goes away within a few points. It was fascinating that it lasted as long as it did.
I like Sean, and he's invested a lot into his game, but I kind of felt bad for him out there.
I don't think it affected his strokes except he started pushing his serves in the 3rd set.
I wonder if he is one of those chronic headcases who is always yelling at himself or if it was an isolated event due to the very public nature of this match.
Knowing 20k people are going to be dissecting your match can probably mess with your head. More people watched this match than a typical ATP Grand Slam match.
FiddlerDog
Hall of Fame
Why are indoor courts faster than outdoor courts? Are they made from different materials ?
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
Because many owners are ok to vacuum but too cheap to resurface.
FiddlerDog
Hall of Fame
Surprised this Boss of Atlanta guy got bumped to 5.0
He does not seem on the same level as Mark Sansait who is 4.5
But, BofA at 4.5 to 5.0 is yet more evidence that 3.0 to 4.0 players who are focusing on pronation, ISR, and other techo-jargon are totally missing the point of what makes a good tennis player.
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S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
He commented during the match not to give away points with DFs. His logic was that MEP's returns couldn't hurt him and that sounded correct to me. So he chose to hit them more conservatively.
To be fair to Sean, he wasn't "always yelling at himself", although it increased in the latter half. His body language was poor.
However, I'm positive I do the same thing from time to time and that's with no reporting of the scores or video or people analyzing all of my myriad mistakes. So I'd give him the benefit of the doubt.
FiddlerDog
Hall of Fame
He started DF'ing more once he reduced racket speed. 2nd serve needs spin to stay in.
S&V-not_dead_yet
Talk Tennis Guru
I was commenting on his 1st serve. And Sean's self-talk was about his 1st serve also [ie "Just get it in! He can't hurt you. Underhand it if you have to."].
chazz
Rookie
Sean went in with the wrong attitude. He should have portrayed himself as the underdog and said he looked forward to the challenge of playing GSG who has a winning record in usta matches in an area known for quality tennis players. He should have been trying to take the pressure off himself. Easier said than done but he needed a much more positive attitude. He acted like it's so demeaning to lose to GSG.
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