Why Federer is not the GOAT
- Thread starter David_86
- Start date
luckyboy1300
Hall of Fame
amazing criteria for being the GOAT! wow you on to something?
maximo
Banned
To add to that, the easy draws he's had during this year's Wimbledon and FO...
This criteria is not fair. What you are saying is that in order to be the GOAT, you must be the GOAT for individual surface as well. If Nadal was the greatest clay court player ever, then removing that part of the H2H record would show that Federer is 5-4 against him on other surfaces.
I don't know about you, but I think it is reasonable for the greatest overall player ever to lose to the greatest claycourter ever when playing on clay.
The second criteria is just silly. One could be the worst volleyer in history and never lose a match if the rest of one's game is that good. GOAT means "Greatest of all time" not "perfect". Everyone has weakness in his game.
The first criteria is important though and is probably the biggest hole in Federer's career (maybe the only one?).
The first criteria is important though and is probably the biggest hole in Federer's career (maybe the only one?).
drakulie
Talk Tennis Guru
Lots of players with wooden racquet sucked at volleying. Wilander never came to net early in his career. Lendl wasn't much of a volleyer either. Borg preferred the baseline by far. Hell, Bill Tilden was a baseliner. He played in the 20s.
And Federer's not that poor at net. He out serve-and-volleyed Sampras in 2001 and serve-and-volleyed his way to the Wimbledon crown in 2003. But even if he were as bad as Gilles Simon at net, if he had a 500-0 career match record, it's kinda hard to argue against him as GOAT.
zagor
Bionic Poster
Thanks for sharing this with us.
Speranza
Hall of Fame
The GOAT conversation will never cease, and the debate of whoever it may be (if there is such a thing)........
Maximo, you really have learned nothing after your recent behaviour and attitude towards this forum, and I take back my apology for my comment in my first language.
Spero che te ne vai, subito, e per sempre.
Am sure someone else can translate that for you.
Maximo, you really have learned nothing after your recent behaviour and attitude towards this forum, and I take back my apology for my comment in my first language.
Spero che te ne vai, subito, e per sempre.
Am sure someone else can translate that for you.
I would guess the best volleyer in history has 1/10 the forehand that Federer has, because nobody from any previous era has his forehand.
vndesu
Hall of Fame
hes just mad bc murray was beaten by roddick.
Haas_is_GOAT
Rookie
I hope that you you go of it, immediately, and for always.
Polaris
Hall of Fame
Thanks. Next?
maximo
Banned
Nice one, child...:roll:
T1000
Legend
FedFan_2009
Banned
Another ridiculous thread FAIL. I guess the trolls need something to hang on to.
David_Is_Right
Semi-Pro
His GOAT status can no longer be defined by Nadal. This discussion will be well and truly ended in about two hours time...
BreakPoint
Bionic Poster
This is like saying that Laver, Nadal, and McEnroe could never be the GOAT because they play left-handed so therefore have an unfair advantage. And since Sampras did not have the best backhand ever, he also can never be the GOAT.
Just say no to drugs, dude.
Just say no to drugs, dude.
ambro
Professional
Laughable. His Wimbledon draw this year was damn near as tough as you could make it.
Terrible topic.
BreakPoint
Bionic Poster
Not really. Federer didn't have to play Sampras, Laver, Borg, Becker, Edberg nor McEnroe. :-?
Sampras, Laver, Borg, Becker, Edberg, and McEnroe didn't have to deal with Federer and Nadal. Lucky for them. :mrgreen:
iamgoat
Banned
Agree with this. Federer would crush them all love and love and love.
ambro
Professional
That's a whole different point. I never said he's playing in an all-star era with the best players ever in his draw. I said his draw was about as tough as you can make it, which implies, given the players available that are currently playing. You can't make a draw with guys that are not on the tour anymore...
BreakPoint
Bionic Poster
Yes, of course I know. I was just beating the *********s to the punch and saying what they were going to say anyway, i.e., I was being sarcastic.That's a whole different point. I never said he's playing in an all-star era with the best players ever in his draw. I said his draw was about as tough as you can make it, which implies, given the players available that are currently playing. You can't make a draw with guys that are not on the tour anymore...
ambro
Professional
Yes, of course I know. I was just beating the *********s to the punch and saying what they were going to say anyway, i.e., I was being sarcastic.
Ahh, my bad, didn't pick up on that. I'm usually pretty good at that, but I guess my radar was off for a bit. That is definitely a point they'd make though...
hes not on drugs, its just that denial is a hard thing to cope with
UnbiasedTennisFan
Banned
One word: Backhand.
It really, truly is the worst in the history of tennis. My God is it awful.
It really, truly is the worst in the history of tennis. My God is it awful.
S H O W S T O P P E R !
Hall of Fame
I dream of a day when there is no GOAT arguments, where people realize that you cannot name a single true greatest of all time because you cannot speak for ALL TIME because the future still has potential GOATs, and that we all agree that a group of GOATs is just as effective.
GasquetGOAT
Hall of Fame
bunch of sore losers creating sore loser threads trying to belittle Roger's achievements. Sampras ****s and Nadal ****s?
You'd have to accept the truth sooner than later, Roger Federer has won 15 slams (and counting).
You'd have to accept the truth sooner than later, Roger Federer has won 15 slams (and counting).
S H O W S T O P P E R !
Hall of Fame
Ok, but that doesn't make him the GOAT because what if someone else comes along and shatters his record? He's the greatest of his era but not the greatest of all time.
What player has a winning record against all other players? Nadal is 5 years younger than Federer...
BreakPoint
Bionic Poster
I'd bet you wish your backhand was so bad so that you could also win 15 Grand Slams and earn over $100 million dollars. :-?
safin is a ledgend
New User
Fd is not the GOAT for 1 reason: Competition. He has never consistently beaten the top players. Where as sampras did. Although the fact is that you can never pick a GOAT because nobody knows what would happen if the opposing players had played in there prime. Also nobody knows who is going to come after this era and even after that.
GasquetGOAT
Hall of Fame
hmm, lets now list all the things that he does have:
Since you stated their head to head, lets look at this a little more if 9 of Rafa's wins came on clay that would mean the other 4 came on all the other surfaces combined 13-9=4, which means that Federer only winning 2 on clay means he's won 5 on the others combined, and Federer is still leading 5-4 on all surfaces combined minus clay. I mean anyone can write those numbers to look good, it's these following things that you can't skew.
1. A record 237 consecutive weeks at number 1 (more then any man or woman)
2. A record 21 Straight Semifinals in a slam (No one has even made 1/2 of that)
3. Only 1 of 3 people to win The French and Wimbledon in the same year (Nadal and Borg being the others
4. The only person to win 4 consecutive Wimbledons and US Opens in the same year
5. Only 1 of 2 people to win 5 consecutive Wimbledons
6. The only player to reach 7 consecutive Wimbledon finals
7. 1 of 4 people to have won 5 consecutive US Open titles (we have to go back to 1920-1925 Bill Tilden for the first one, the others were William Larned 1906-1911 and Richard Sears who won the first 7 US Opens played 1881-1887)
8. 1 of 6 men to have won the career slam
9. Has made a record 10 Slam finals in a row, and he has now made 6 in a row, giving him both 1st and 2nd place on this list, the next highest in 3rd place is Agassi and Laver at 4 in a row.
10. 9 people have won 3 out of the 4 slams in the same year, and they've all done it only once while Federer has done it three times.
I mean I could go on, as the list is endless, but I think you've gotten the point how idiotic your statement is
Yes, but you being an idiot and just spewing garbage isn't defending other players. I mean if anything the sheer idiocy is proving the opposite of what you are trying to prove and can't.
Eviscerator
Banned
There are different criteria to determine an imaginary GOAT, but the ability/inability to execute one type of shot is certainly not one of them.
Roger is clearly in the running for the GOAT, but we will need to see his accomplishments once he retires. I can tell you this much, that without at least one Grand Slam, the debate will never be settled.
